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Old 05-09-2012, 09:09 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTH

Fellas, jannikt has all the clue in the world. Go look at his prior posts.

This is what he does--he trolls for threads questioning Chrysler, Jeep, or especially the Wrangler, and he interjects to trash the brand and plug Toyota along with some other vehicles you can't really get in the US.

He doesn't own a jeep. He's not here to talk about jeeps beyond trashing them.

I can't tell if he's actually pursuing a commercial interest (eg, he has a business interest in ensuring any threads here comparing jeeps to other brands alway have one guy saying jeeps suck and bragging about Toyota), or if he's just mentally ill. Either way, it's always the same thing.

Seriously, read over his posts and you'll see. This is what he does.
Oh, I've read previous rantings and crazy talk.....

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Old 05-09-2012, 09:28 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Ballandchain

Oh, I've read previous rantings and crazy talk.....
And this was one of his kinder ones to our poor, decrepit, incompetent, boy toy Wrangler.

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Old 05-09-2012, 09:35 PM   #33
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What the heck is an overland vehicle suppose to be? What defines it?
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:47 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by ICTJKU
What the heck is an overland vehicle suppose to be? What defines it?
Vehicles built for safaris and expeditions, this kind offroading: http://www.overlandjournal.com/, rather than rock crawling or mudding. According to jannikt, Wranglers suck at it because they're little more than over-priced Tonka toys and must bow in the presence of proud yoters everywhere.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:50 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTH

Vehicles built for safaris and expeditions, this kind offroading: http://www.overlandjournal.com/, rather than rock crawling or mudding.
Pansy dirt road garbage.
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:01 PM   #36
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What the heck is an overland vehicle suppose to be? What defines it?
In simple terms.. It's a 4x4 that is used to transport a person or people across unpaved public land for more then a days time.. Some times it's set points to drive to in advance and other times it's lets stop here cause (fill in reason here) then primative camp at those spots via the stuff you have packed with you for camping/living purposes.
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:30 PM   #37
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What the heck is an overland vehicle suppose to be? What defines it?
It's a fairly new term that sounds so much more impressive than "driving on dirt roads".
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:32 PM   #38
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It's a fairly new term that sounds so much more impressive than "driving on dirt roads".
yeah, like oh my gosh. It's like driving a vehicle, OVER the LAND. how creative. Only the british, could come up with that...
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:33 PM   #39
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I think GC3 called it a fancy word for "car camping"
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:53 PM   #40
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This is correct.. Did run out of gas. The I think 79 blazer did just fine as well, nothing to laugh about with that
Old Blazers are very capable 4x4's. Been "partial" to them since I bought my first car/71 Blazer back in 76'. Have had 3 different Blazer since that first one.
3-71's and 1-72'.
I kinda like the full size truck convertible.
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Old 05-10-2012, 12:04 AM   #41
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Well I have just purchased a JK and I must say I love it for what I got it for. If I was taking off on an around Australia 6 month tour I would probably prefer a :high end" 4WD like a Rangie, Porsche etc but for what I do [weekends away, medium length trips] then the Wrangler will do me nicely.

I have owned a Landcruiser, Dodge Nitro, Mitsubishi Pajero, Nissan patrol and even a 1964 Landrover! They are all different and to say one is better than another is to miss the point, they all have strengths and weaknesses.
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:06 AM   #42
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Hi

You in Australia looks to have a nice overland vehicle, the landcrusier 70 series. But JK Wrangler looks nicer.

Diesel (turbo?) V8, torque 430nm, Rpm for maximum torque 1200.

Snorkel, twin batteries, twin fuel tank.

Different kinds here

Toyota LandCruiser 70 Troop Carrier GXL specifications





At this expeditions 7 they will use a Landcruser 70 series

http://www.expeditionportal.com/adve...beginning.html

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Old 05-10-2012, 01:09 AM   #43
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I also saw that Top Gear with the Jeep Renegade. Pretty comical when they were dragging their trailers over obstacles. Then had to build some funky thing out of branches to get across pavement because they weren't allowed to drive across it.

I think that's the only full episode I've watched of that show and watched it before I bought my Jeep. At first when I tried to find it again, I actually found the british show and thought I had gotten the title wrong.

Regarding Jannikt. That dude really needs to get a life. If he doesn't like Jeeps, wtf is he doing on this board? All I can think of is, as mentioned, he has some financial interest in Toyota or some other competitor.

Regarding the Raptor: I did go on a trail run with one. Those things are impressive! However, he had problems because it was just too wide for the trail we were doing. Not really in the same class as a Wrangler. I would say a Raptor to an F150 is like comparing a Sport and a Rubi.
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:32 AM   #44
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My only other non-Jeep passion has not been mentioned. I have had 4 H1's and really like them for what they are. They are relatives to the Jeep as well

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Old 05-10-2012, 03:12 AM   #45
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Some of you guys are pretty off base with what "overland" is. I am from Crawlerado and I am no stranger to mountains, and it is my intent to build my JKU to be a pretty stout rock crawler/DD as that is my hobby but I have also had the opportunity to drive some of these "high end" machines in the environments they were build to succeed in and it is a totally different world. A little more then just "driving off pavement for a long time". A few of my favorites I have driven;
Defender 90
Defender 110
Land Cruiser 70s
Land Cruiser 100s w/ ARBs front and rear
Toyota Hilux Pickups ARBs front and rear

I have put these all through the ringer. 110+ degrees on average, hundreds of miles, sand, clay, rock, you name it. That being said, "off the shelf" a JKUR would be a fantastic overland platform especially the diesel version.

A vehicle that is built to crawl will be completely different from a vehicle built for overland.
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Old 05-10-2012, 03:35 AM   #46
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You have the gall to compare the reliability of Jeep Wrangler's to the overall reliability rating of Chrysler - and then say they're less reliable then Land Rover or Mercedes? Are you HIGH? Land Rover CONSISTENTLY ranks at the bottom of the list every year. And Mercedes fairs no better! And Nissan has turned its Land Cruiser into an $80k soccer club transporter!
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Old 05-10-2012, 03:55 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jannikt View Post
Given that my name has reached certain level of notoriety I feel compelled to answer.

And yes, there are many old, high mileage Jeeps out there, but you need to consider how much money their owners have invested in upgrades, mods and maintenance.

A Rubicon maybe better when it comes to rock climbing, but on an extended off-road trip odds are that a Toyota, Mercedes or Land Rover will outlast a Jeep many times over and will keep going (and most importantly, bring you back home safely) long time after a Jeep has died with a broken transmission, an electric problem or busted steering.

It's no coincidence that 4 out of the top 6 vehicles in this rating are Toyotas.
Top 10 Used Overland Vehicles
Or look here:
5 Best Overland Vehicles Ever | Pangaea Expeditions

Jeeps are designed for a different market, with different objectives and priorities. But they are not built to be an ultimate long-range expedition vehicle - unless you invest $15k in mods and upgrades.
God you're too funny, I don't usually get sucked into trolling but here we go.

You said "unless you invest $15k in mods and upgrades." Alright, I'll bite directly from your first link.

- LC100 - Needs strengthening in the differential and suspension components,
- Tacoma - Stock suspension is unacceptable, factor in OME lift, and seats
- LC80 - Eats headgaskets and axle seals? Recommends engine swap Some reliability
- MB G500 - Absolutely unreliable, front shaft/bearings weak, expensive and difficulty in sourcing to repair
- 4Runner - Poor angles!
- LR3 - Expensive to maintain, carry extra air suspension parts, UNRELIABLE?

The Wrangler JK? "class-leading capability!" the downsides? Difficult to to mount roof rack. And produces a bumpier ride offroad - oh really?

You're own link blew your argument out of the water. The LC100 is infamous for IFS failure. The 200 is now a luxury brand, offroad capable - sure, but it has terrible breakover angles. Have fun with your G500 on your expedition - don't bother calling when your electronic TC module fails, you've run out of gas (they require a petrol station to be transported on a trailer), and your door actuator has locked you inside the vehicle.
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Old 05-10-2012, 04:52 AM   #48
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Hi

Interesting article, mostly because i choosed between Landrover Defender 90 and a 2012 Wrangler Sahara 2 door, got the Sahara after 11 months of wait

"Why the Jeep Wrangler is the New Land Rover Defender"

Why the Jeep Wrangler is the New Land Rover Defender
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Old 05-10-2012, 06:44 AM   #49
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Top gear is for rich people.. Just sayin.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:53 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omar Brannstrom
Hi

Interesting article, mostly because i choosed between Landrover Defender 90 and a 2012 Wrangler Sahara 2 door, got the Sahara after 11 months of wait

"Why the Jeep Wrangler is the New Land Rover Defender"

Why the Jeep Wrangler is the New Land Rover Defender
Wow. Great article.

Alas, jannikt won't be persuaded--everybody is wrong, only yotas (and some other vehicles you can't get in the US or that are no longer being produced) are worth driving; nobody will "bet their life" on a jeep, but everybody will gladly do so on a Toyota; blah blah blah--but the rest of us can read it, satisfied in our delusions . . .
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:56 PM   #51
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Old Blazers are very capable 4x4's. Been "partial" to them since I bought my first car/71 Blazer back in 76'. Have had 3 different Blazer since that first one.
3-71's and 1-72'.
I kinda like the full size truck convertible.
The first vehichle I owned with 4 wheels was a '71 Jimmy that was fantastic. Durable, fun, practical, & could go topless - had the 307 short block that just kept going & going - lots of fond memories but I sold it for a '79 CJ which was even more fun
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:12 PM   #52
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Ive had a 69 Bronco, 79 Bronco, 81 Bronco, 85 K5, 77 CJ, 92 YJ, 03 TJ, 10 JK. I admit there all more then capable. I miss my 69 the most, as rust prematurely took her from me. My K5 was BA also, but im into the Jeeps now. The available aftermarket and customization hooked me. As far as comparing, there all great topless rigs. I would own any of them again, but my dailey driver is my heep with no exceptions.
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:15 PM   #53
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I was watching the newest TG on BBCA the other night and during the news segment, Clarkson was talking about this new Land Rover, their smallest one, whatever its called, and he was talking about them making one with a removable top next year. He goes, "This new Rover will be the only 4x4 IN THE WHURLD, with a removable top. Here, let me show you a picture and Ill cut out around the body and show you what it will look like with no roof". Hammond, the closeted American gives him the and goes, "You colossal buffoon. Are you forgetting about the other vehicle that is the genesis of the whole segment that also has a removable top". Clarkson just and says, "I did not just say that, did I?"

PS: I do not recognize this turd of a show that is on the History Channel that coincidentally has the same name as the above show. It is rubbish and should in no way be confused or compared with Top Gear
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:17 PM   #54
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I was watching the newest TG on BBCA the other night and during the news segment, Clarkson was talking about this new Land Rover, their smallest one, whatever its called, and he was talking about them making one with a removable top next year. He goes, "This new Rover will be the only 4x4 IN THE WHURLD, with a removable top. Here, let me show you a picture and Ill cut out around the body and show you what it will look like with no roof". Hammond, the closeted American gives him the and goes, "You colossal buffoon. Are you forgetting about the other vehicle that is the genesis of the whole segment that also has a removable top". Clarkson just and says, "I did not just say that, did I?"

PS: I do not recognize this turd of a show that is on the History Channel that coincidentally has the same name as the above show. It is rubbish and should in no way be confused or compared with Top Gear
They did a review of the Evoque last season, but the latest episode talked about them possibly making a convertible one

I agree, the Top Gear US is terrible, I've watched 1 or 2 full episodes and it's intolerable
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:20 PM   #55
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I am a Top Gear fan as well...they generally do not go for off road performance though. They might touch on it as it relates to the vehicles over all performance for day to day use, but that's not really their gig. Unless, of course, they are giving tatoos in the back seat or engaging in a competition of some kind.

I have never seen them test a Land Rover Defender either (save the 350hp Race Spec variant...or the one they pimped out to drive across a lake...I think that was a Defender, anyway). The Defender and the Wrangler are cousins, probably more so than any other two vehicles. Relatively compact, solid axles, lockers, decent clearance and approach/departure angles, etc. Of course, the Defender gets a diesel, but the Jeep is faster with the 3.6 (the Diesel, with it's 2.5 L of displacement roundly trounces the 3.8).

I'd say as soon a Jeep starts pulling more than .8 g on the skid pad and runs a 0-60 time of less than five seconds you'll see it on there =).

Quote:
Originally Posted by snikt View Post
I watch Top Gear a lot, and I'm curious. They are always going on about Range Rovers, Land Cruisers, Mercedes G class wagon, etc... I don't think I've ever seen them test anything Jeep.

Is this just British bias? I'm curious how like a JKUR would shape up vs these expensive vehicles in a purely off-road sense
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:32 PM   #56
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Land Rover Defender 90:
Approach - 47
Departure - 47
Clearance - 12.5 inches
Break Over - (180 - 147) 33

Solid Axles - Check
Coil Springs - Check
Factory skid plating - Check
2-sp Transfer case - Check
Locking diff - Check

7700 lb towing capacity
Full time 4WD

I get it, we love Wranglers, but credit where it's due.

Quote:
Originally Posted by XJ Knight View Post
I disagree.. I've seen both series and think the US version is better.. OP the UK version ooozes with euro bias.. Stock vs Stock Right now their is nothing in the class of the Wrangler JK(U). It's in it's own little awesome world. Thats not opinion thats fact.
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:42 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJL2
Land Rover Defender 90:
Approach - 47
Departure - 47
Clearance - 12.5 inches
Break Over - (180 - 147) 33

Solid Axles - Check
Coil Springs - Check
Factory skid plating - Check
2-sp Transfer case - Check
Locking diff - Check

7700 lb towing capacity
Full time 4WD

I get it, we love Wranglers, but credit where it's due.
Toss the numbers out the window. I just dont see enough companies that offer aftermarket support for the defenders, stock sucks, its the forever building process that wranglers have that keeps me loyal.
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:57 PM   #58
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I love Top Gear, but they can be far from objective at times.
Remember the 2010 Camaro SS vs. Mercedes E63 AMG test?
Or the Corvette C6/Z06/ZR-1 tests, where they say they're excellent track cars, but unlivable on a daily basis, yet say their mothers could drive a Ferrari or Lambo to church on Sunday? And COMPLETELY ignore the Corvette and the Viper's success on race day, over much more high end rivals.

But they're not there for objectivity, and you're fooling yourself looking for it. They're there to make us laugh, bomb around in exotics, take on ridiculous challenges, and instill the classic British sense of humor into automotive programming. For better or worse, Top Gear UK is the best auto-related show in the world, and their number of viewers is proof.

You also need to look at your Jeep without your rose colored glasses. They are cheaply made, they do have their own sets of issues. They are horribly uncomfortable for the vast majority of the motoring public, and they're totally impractical as day to day transportation, particularly or people with a family. Jeep knew this, too, that's why they are continually refining the Wrangler, to have a nicer ride, better interior, more power, smoother transmission, etc.
But people like us don't care, because we know that nothing else comes close on capability per dollar. I'll deal with the bumpy ride and iffy gas mileage for the capability, and riding with the top down and doors off.
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Old 05-10-2012, 03:07 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by Mr. Sinister View Post
I love Top Gear, but they can be far from objective at times.
Remember the 2010 Camaro SS vs. Mercedes E63 AMG test?
Or the Corvette C6/Z06/ZR-1 tests, where they say they're excellent track cars, but unlivable on a daily basis, yet say their mothers could drive a Ferrari or Lambo to church on Sunday? And COMPLETELY ignore the Corvette and the Viper's success on race day, over much more high end rivals.

But they're not there for objectivity, and you're fooling yourself looking for it. They're there to make us laugh, bomb around in exotics, take on ridiculous challenges, and instill the classic British sense of humor into automotive programming. For better or worse, Top Gear UK is the best auto-related show in the world, and their number of viewers is proof.

You also need to look at your Jeep without your rose colored glasses. They are cheaply made, they do have their own sets of issues. They are horribly uncomfortable for the vast majority of the motoring public, and they're totally impractical as day to day transportation, particularly or people with a family. Jeep knew this, too, that's why they are continually refining the Wrangler, to have a nicer ride, better interior, more power, smoother transmission, etc.
But people like us don't care, because we know that nothing else comes close on capability per dollar. I'll deal with the bumpy ride and iffy gas mileage for the capability, and riding with the top down and doors off.
I kinda like , Chasing classic Cars (Wayne Carini),and I DVR the Mecum auction on a regular basis also. I love those shows!

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Old 05-10-2012, 03:10 PM   #60
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you have the gall to compare the reliability of jeep wrangler's to the overall reliability rating of chrysler - and then say they're less reliable then land rover or mercedes? Are you high? Land rover consistently ranks at the bottom of the list every year. And mercedes fairs no better! And **toyota** has turned its land cruiser into an $80k soccer club transporter!
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