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Old 02-17-2012, 01:56 PM   #1
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Abc7 news san francisco death wobble story

Check out this report on Death Wobble done by the ABC station in San Francisco Jeep "death wobble" leaves drivers shaken and looking for answers | abc7news.com

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Old 02-17-2012, 02:00 PM   #2
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Death Wobble is not TJ specific

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Old 02-17-2012, 02:01 PM   #3
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interesting
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:02 PM   #4
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I saw it on a lot of different trucks in my 40 years in the automotive business. It is not only TJ's.
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:08 PM   #5
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Interesting, guess I got lucky, I changed the tires and made sure they were balanced correctly and the wobble went away.
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:08 PM   #6
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someone tell that station to do a follow up and investigate the OPDA issue
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:14 PM   #7
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What an idiot. There is so much crappy information in that story it's ridiculous.
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:16 PM   #8
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I have already written its author, reporter Dan Noyes, let's see if he bothers to reply. I basically told him his article was hysterical in nature and without enough research which would have indicated to him that DW is not confined to Jeeps.
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:22 PM   #9
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That's a simple case of uneducated people and a lack of understanding. People nowadays don't use common sense and a simple cause and effect analysis. If they'd do that, they'd realize that DW doesn't care if the part came stock or aftermarket, what the tread pattern on the tires is like, or even if the tires are perfectly balanced or not. DW happens for a multitude of sensible, visible reasons. Fix the root cause and you won't have it anymore. Yes, one of those causes could very well be the track bar at one or both ends.

COMMON SENSE ISN'T SO COMMON.
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:52 PM   #10
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I didn't maintain my Ferrari and never changed the oil and the engine blew up on me. This is OBVIOUSLY a problem with the manufacturer

Or hey, I raised my Porche Cayenne up 12" with blocks and installed big tires on it. Why doesn't it handle the way it did from the factory? Surely nothing I did changed the geometry of anything right? Screw those Porche folks for not making something that accounted for modifications I make.
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Old 02-17-2012, 02:54 PM   #11
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Here is the author's reply just received...

"hysterical"? Hardly.


In a tv news format, you have to choose what info to include. Our story was much more in-depth than most. Of course, we know about the other models, but we found the NHTSA numbers on the jeep to be compelling.


Thanks for the critique,
Dan"

The worst thing is they knowingly left out that it's an industry-wide problem and instead made it appear to be confined to Jeeps.
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:01 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford
In a tv news format, you have to choose what info to include.
This means we report the facts as we see them and how we want the public to see them. Total media BS.
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:08 PM   #13
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One thing I found more funny than the rest "I think Jeep should be liable for at least some reimbursement costs." So should I also feel the need to be reimbursed if I never change my oil and my motor goes? Same thing happening there, lack of maintenance.
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Old 02-17-2012, 06:15 PM   #14
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ya they should reimburse me the axles since it is the root cause and give me D44 with 4.10 gearing please
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Old 02-17-2012, 06:25 PM   #15
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Stupid people will be stupid. Competent people won't have problems with DW.
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Old 02-17-2012, 06:33 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
I have already written its author, reporter Dan Noyes, let's see if he bothers to reply. I basically told him his article was hysterical in nature and without enough research which would have indicated to him that DW is not confined to Jeeps.
I hope he responds!
Edit: should have read a few more posts
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Old 02-17-2012, 06:38 PM   #17
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Bad track bar? How about tie rod ends, ball joints, control arm bushings? None of those people even said they took it anywhere to get fixed. It happened to me, and I fixed it. Problem solved.
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Old 02-17-2012, 06:44 PM   #18
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Yea that's pretty much what I said before but my post got deleted. People just need to use more common sense. Treat your jeep good and it will treat you good. Ya know?
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Old 02-17-2012, 06:58 PM   #19
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Yea that's pretty much what I said before but my post got deleted. People just need to use more common sense. Treat your jeep good and it will treat you good. Ya know?
Your post got deleted???
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Old 02-17-2012, 07:21 PM   #20
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Yup it had some bad words in it.
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Old 02-17-2012, 07:52 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
Here is the author's reply just received...

"hysterical"? Hardly.


In a tv news format, you have to choose what info to include. Our story was much more in-depth than most. Of course, we know about the other models, but we found the NHTSA numbers on the jeep to be compelling.


Thanks for the critique,
Dan"

The worst thing is they knowingly left out that it's an industry-wide problem and instead made it appear to be confined to Jeeps.
WOW. This guys is a troll to the max. The media itself is as well, but come on. Admitting it like that, and pretty much ignoring everything, and blaming Jeep?

This is why we have and need places like WF... to inform the uninformed and set the records straight. Nice try though Jerry.
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Old 02-17-2012, 09:23 PM   #22
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All media is biased to the a certain extent. They need stories to fill their stations 24/7. It is their cash cow. So they form stories around the truth to create a drama filled news report for ratings which in turn means money. If anyone is liable for anything it is the station for slander against Chrysler.
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Old 02-17-2012, 09:53 PM   #23
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Should we really be surprised that the Media doesn't tell the whole truth, holding some things back? Not really. As was mentioned earlier, some unlifted Jeeps have had Death Wobble. But so have a lot of other Vehicles. I remember as a teenager riding with my uncle in his 72 Econoline van. Hit a bump and Boom! He could barely hold on to the wheel. For him it turned out to be warn out Ball Joints. Death Wobble has been going on for a long time on all sorts of Vehicles. I even had it once driving a Volvo Semi Truck. That was fun!
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Old 02-17-2012, 10:09 PM   #24
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I hope they keep it up and drive the price of used ones down. The people that watch and believe the stuff on the news don't need a vehicle that requires as much maintenance as a well functioning Jeep needs. If all you do is drive your kid to school and yourself to work by an eco-box.
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Old 02-19-2012, 04:54 PM   #25
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I also emailed the writer and the reporter. I am curious as to how they will reply.

Here is the primary problem with JKs:

Chyrsler uses fully threaded, 14 mm trackbar bolts in brackets and bushing sleeves designed for 9/16" bolts:




They don't even used a shouldered bolt.

With the bolt loose in the bushing sleeves, there is looseness in the front end already.

If the torque specs of the front trackbar back off even a little from the 125 ft. lbs. recommended, the 14 mm bolts have way too much play in the stock bracket holes.

This wallows out the stock bracket holes when DW occurs.

It becomes so violent that it damages the lower ball joints, the axle side front upper control arm bushings, the drag link and tie rod ends, the trackbar bushings, and in some cases, cracks/rips the axle side front trackbar bracket from the frame.

Jeep needs to do at least a TSB on JKs and replace at least the front trackbar bolts with shouldered, 9/16" Grade 8, fine thread bolts that actually fit the trackbar bracket bolt holes and bushing sleeves.

Instead, their TSB instructs dealer techs to mask the problem with a larger steering stabilizer. As the story reports, they eventually fail as well when the true source(s) are not properly repaired.

Here is my JK write-up thread with and inspection checklist:

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/dia...les-78034.html

Here is my TJ write-up thread and inspection checklist:

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f5/diag...ion-78090.html
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Old 02-19-2012, 06:00 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planman View Post
I also emailed the writer and the reporter. I am curious as to how they will reply.

Here is the primary problem with JKs:

Chyrsler uses fully threaded, 14 mm trackbar bolts in brackets and bushing sleeves designed for 9/16" bolts:

They don't even used a shouldered bolt.

With the bolt loose in the bushing sleeves, there is looseness in the front end already.

If the torque specs of the front trackbar back off even a little from the 125 ft. lbs. recommended, the 14 mm bolts have way too much play in the stock bracket holes.

This wallows out the stock bracket holes when DW occurs.

It becomes so violent that it damages the lower ball joints, the axle side front upper control arm bushings, the drag link and tie rod ends, the trackbar bushings, and in some cases, cracks/rips the axle side front trackbar bracket from the frame.

Jeep needs to do at least a TSB on JKs and replace at least the front trackbar bolts with shouldered, 9/16" Grade 8, fine thread bolts that actually fit the trackbar bracket bolt holes and bushing sleeves.

Instead, their TSB instructs dealer techs to mask the problem with a larger steering stabilizer. As the story reports, they eventually fail as well when the true source(s) are not properly repaired.

Here is my JK write-up thread with and inspection checklist:

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/dia...les-78034.html

Here is my TJ write-up thread and inspection checklist:

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f5/diag...ion-78090.html
I guess I'll be another on the consumers side. The men & woman on the news clip aren't mechanics, have never crawled under their jeeps, they haven't lifted or modified their jeeps. Probably haven't even taken them off road. Solid axles or not, I don't think it should be acceptable for any late model vehicle with low miles on it to shake vehemently while operating at any speed, especially hiway speeds.
I own a jeep but do not feel I must defend Chrysler Motor Corporation.

Planman, nice write up about the trac bar bolts BTW. I drive a Jeep & am proud to do so. Is it the best handling hiway vehicle I've ever owned? No way. I paid 1000 bucks for a 66 Chevelle Malibu back in 79. It handeled 10 times better than any stock or modified 2 door jeep. It wasn't very good off road tho, lol.

There are countless testimonials of STOCK jeeps with very low miles that have full on death wobble at times. It's a simple fact. Heck, sold some wheels & tires to a couple with a new JK last year. She won't even drive it. She actually got pulled over for weaving. She wasn't drunk, just couldn't keep her new jeep centered in her lane.

The News anchor just happens to drive a jeep AND be on the news every night. Jeep should certainly recall all the jeeps with the wrong trac bar bolts. If enough people get after them or they have enough serious wrecks that are proved to be related to this they will.

Poor maintanance & crappy tires is on the owner of course. Please don't tell me to sell my jeep & buy another Chevelle, I love my Jeep & it drives pretty darn good for a lifted, short wheel base vehicle. Never have experienced DW. But many have.
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Old 02-19-2012, 06:31 PM   #27
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hmmmm we should all agree that the DW also caused our frames to rot too. the wicked vibrations are very stressful to the metal weakening it especially for people who live in the rust belt. we should all agree to something like that.we can all get some new frames and anyone with DW will get it fixed too. we should also say that it wears the brakes way too fast and that a 4 inch lift(minimum) fixes the DW.chrysler should bear most of if not all of this burden
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Old 02-19-2012, 06:43 PM   #28
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The solution for JKs is quite simple:

Replace the front trackbar bolts with 9/16" Grade 8, shouldered, fine thread bolts and use either a lock washer or a stover locknut on the back. This should be done whether or not Chyrsler/Jeep does a TSB or recall.

Then, re-torque the trackbar to 125 ft lbs at every oil change interval and after every major wheeling trip. This should be part of the regular factory recommended maintenance.
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Old 02-19-2012, 08:50 PM   #29
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hmmmm we should all agree that the DW also caused our frames to rot too. the wicked vibrations are very stressful to the metal weakening it especially for people who live in the rust belt. we should all agree to something like that.we can all get some new frames and anyone with DW will get it fixed too. we should also say that it wears the brakes way too fast and that a 4 inch lift(minimum) fixes the DW.chrysler should bear most of if not all of this burden
X2!!!!

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