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Old 09-12-2013, 08:24 PM   #1
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Black Magic Brakes?

Sometime I'm going to get new brakes. So, since I'm running 33s, and have upgraded to a Currie suspension, I should look into upgrading my brakes, instead of going thru NAPA.

Now, I know that the guys in the know recommend Black Magic Brakes. I can't find EXACTLY why they are better than "normal" brakes, but, I trust these guys in the know.

Since the front brakes are most important, are these what I'd want?
Jeep Wranger (TJ) 1997 - 1999 Front Brake Package

As for the rear drum brakes, what should I get? This one? Jeep Wrangler (TJ/LJ) 2003 - 2006 Rear Drum Brake Package

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Old 09-12-2013, 08:42 PM   #2
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Try a set of napa brakes, then swap to BM. Then you will understand.

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Old 09-12-2013, 08:46 PM   #3
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They work really well and I will never buy a different pad again. Remember that the rear doesn't do much of the braking. Get the package for the front and throw anything on the rear. You will not be disappointed with the new pads.
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Old 09-12-2013, 08:48 PM   #4
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I have some random $60 brakes in the rear and black magic brakes with centric premium rotors in the front. I thought my stock brakes were fine until I ran these. They stop way better and grip much better at high heat, unlike my previous stock ones. Easy install and good value. All I will use from now on.
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:09 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by lovemachine View Post
Sometime I'm going to get new brakes. So, since I'm running 33s, and have upgraded to a Currie suspension, I should look into upgrading my brakes, instead of going thru NAPA.

Now, I know that the guys in the know recommend Black Magic Brakes. I can't find EXACTLY why they are better than "normal" brakes, but, I trust these guys in the know.

Since the front brakes are most important, are these what I'd want?
Jeep Wranger (TJ) 1997 - 1999 Front Brake Package

As for the rear drum brakes, what should I get? This one? Jeep Wrangler (TJ/LJ) 2003 - 2006 Rear Drum Brake Package
No pad is worth paying over $100 bucks for. Especially an off the shelf item that can be had for a lot less money. For $125 you can get a good quality set of rotors and fresh set of pads for that kind of coin.

Nothing is "magic"..........when you install a new set of pads, properly break them in. Most people don't do that. It will make a difference in how your pads perform. Even the cheap pads bought at the chain parts store.
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:13 PM   #6
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No pad is worth paying over $100 bucks for. Especially an off the shelf item that can be had for a lot less money.
Why do you keep saying this? You make it sound like Blaine's pads are a standard pad just re badged and over priced which none of that is true. Neither re badged nor over priced. Ok I get it, you won't spend $125 for the pads. Doesn't mean that they are not far superior to anything out there including whatever you are running
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:14 PM   #7
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Just listen to the people who have run normal pads and then switched to Black Magic Pads.
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:15 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by doclouie View Post
Just listen to the people who have run normal pads and then switched to Black Magic Pads.
X2
I sense mod envy with some people. LOL
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:16 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by jeepwayoflife View Post
I have some random $60 brakes in the rear and black magic brakes with centric premium rotors in the front. I thought my stock brakes were fine until I ran these. They stop way better and grip much better at high heat, unlike my previous stock ones. Easy install and good value. All I will use from now on.
Did you break your "stock" brakes in the same way you did your new BM pads originally? Did you compare fresh brand new stock pads and rotors with new BM pads and rotors? Or are you comparing the feel of a worn set of pads/rotors with something new and fresh? A good thread if you read it all the way through: Black Magic Brake pads vs EBC Yellowstuffs - the results - JeepForum.com
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:22 PM   #10
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Why do you keep saying this? You make it sound like Blaine's pads are a standard pad just re badged and over priced which none of that is true. Neither re badged nor over priced. Ok I get it, you won't spend $125 for the pads. Doesn't mean that they are not far superior to anything out there including whatever you are running
Blaine's pad IS a standard "off the shelf" pad. If you do some research from JF, you will get that information right from his own mouth years back when he first started reselling them.

Far superior to anything else? NOT AT ALL. I wheel with people who run BM pads. They don't brake any better than what I run. Its all in the COMPOUND SELECTION and proper BREAK IN PROCEDURE. There is no magic in those pads.

Do you happen to know what type of pads the BM's are? Let me know when you find out the answer.

Did you happen to run similar compound pads in the past? Did you break them in PROPERLY? In the link above, out of Blaine's own mouth:
Quote:
If you don't break them in you should take them off and toss them. They are not any better than OEM stock pads unless you follow directions.
That goes for ANY set of fresh pads and rotors folks. And most people don't properly break in ANY pads period.
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:23 PM   #11
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X2
I sense mod envy with some people. LOL
I think you may be right.
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Old 09-12-2013, 09:57 PM   #12
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Today while driving, me and a mercedes kompressor were going the same speed down the street. We were going above the speed limit but not racing or anything. The light turned and we hit the brakes at the same time but I stopped before he did. he actually went over into the cross walk. Might have just been nothing but a coincidence but I personally think it was my centric rotors and bmb brake pads. I run 33s

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Old 09-12-2013, 10:55 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by NJO View Post
Did you break your "stock" brakes in the same way you did your new BM pads originally? Did you compare fresh brand new stock pads and rotors with new BM pads and rotors? Or are you comparing the feel of a worn set of pads/rotors with something new and fresh? A good thread if you read it all the way through: Black Magic Brake pads vs EBC Yellowstuffs - the results - JeepForum.com
When I switched out my brakes the first time, I put on new stock rotors and brakes. OEM parts from dealership. I was not happy with the performance once they warmed up a bit and after a few weeks I went with the Black Magic brakes and centric premium rotors. Much better. I don't think there's an argument over whether black magic or stock brakes are better...

Secondly, I would rather give my money to a really nice jeep guy who is very active on countless forums and always has time to chat about any questions I have. Customer service is better than anything else you will come across.

Why do so many people run Black Magic instead of other popular pads? Are they all stupid or misinformed? I've read Blaine's thread on his experimentation with different pads and why the brake compound he sells works best for jeeps. My view is I pay a little more for all his research on the subject and the reassurance that they will work.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:26 PM   #14
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When I switched out my brakes the first time, I put on new stock rotors and brakes. OEM parts from dealership. I was not happy with the performance once they warmed up a bit and after a few weeks I went with the Black Magic brakes and centric premium rotors. Much better. I don't think there's an argument over whether black magic or stock brakes are better...

Secondly, I would rather give my money to a really nice jeep guy who is very active on countless forums and always has time to chat about any questions I have. Customer service is better than anything else you will come across.

Why do so many people run Black Magic instead of other popular pads? Are they all stupid or misinformed? I've read Blaine's thread on his experimentation with different pads and why the brake compound he sells works best for jeeps. My view is I pay a little more for all his research on the subject and the reassurance that they will work.
Not stating stock OEM brake pads are better, again that is all on the compound used. Just don't think you need to spend $125 on a set of pads to get it. I also feel the same way on EBC pads. Overpriced as well.

On your second paragraph, lets just say different people have different experiences.

On your third paragraph. I personally think there is a combination of factors involved on a lot of fronts. I will say that the Jeep crowd overall is not an "advanced" crowd when it comes to overall vehicle performance. For every 100 Jeep owners, you are lucky if you find one who is really in tune with the function and performance of his vehicle. Certain people DO take advantage of that fact. I mean, how many Jeep members know how to properly bed in their pads? Or season their rotors? Or that specific compound pads need to be rebed on occasion if they aren't used regularly under heavy use?

Regardless $125 is ridiculous for standard sized Jeep off the shelf Jeep pads. I'd expect to pay that on a TRUE high performance brake setup like something Brembo/AEM based. But for a standard Jeep caliper? No. Im all for a high quality pad. But there are PLENTY of those out there for a quarter to third of the price. Raybestos AT series as just one example. Follow the proper break in procedures and you will be rewarded with solid braking performance. If you need better braking, that's when a kit that features a larger rotor/caliper combo should be considered, like what Vanco offers.
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Old 09-12-2013, 11:54 PM   #15
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X2
I sense mod envy with some people. LOL
You are correct. He and I have gone round and round over a few things under his various aliases, he still resents it and tends to try and follow me around with ill intent.

We've not been 100% successful solving brake issues for folks, but we're really close to it and we do the best we can for everyone.
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Old 09-13-2013, 01:29 AM   #16
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Bashing a product because you don't feel like spending the money is a pretty good reason for the "defensive" state... Its really like arguing the $200 LED light bars shipped from china are just as good as the $1,000 LED bars sold by major companies like Rigid. Just rebranded, right?

You seem to take every disagreement, blow it up, and take some sort of jab at the company or person. Obviously you and Blaine don't get along. What did Currie do to you that seems to get you offensive towards the antirock?


I'm sure this thread will be going down shortly...
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Old 09-13-2013, 04:43 AM   #17
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Sometime I'm going to get new brakes. So, since I'm running 33s, and have upgraded to a Currie suspension, I should look into upgrading my brakes, instead of going thru NAPA.

Now, I know that the guys in the know recommend Black Magic Brakes. I can't find EXACTLY why they are better than "normal" brakes, but, I trust these guys in the know.

Since the front brakes are most important, are these what I'd want?
Jeep Wranger (TJ) 1997 - 1999 Front Brake Package

As for the rear drum brakes, what should I get? This one? Jeep Wrangler (TJ/LJ) 2003 - 2006 Rear Drum Brake Package
Ok.....not what I had intended when I made the thread.

I am not questioning these brakes. I admit I don't know WHY these are good, only that they are recommended. That's what I'm going by.

I know that they are better for braking with larger wheels and tires, just don't know why they are better than my Napa gold brand.

So the links I quoted in the OP, are these the brakes I want? Or did I choose the wrong ones?
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Old 09-13-2013, 04:53 AM   #18
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So the links I quoted in the OP, are these the brakes I want? Or did I choose the wrong ones?
What year is your Wrangler? What is the condition of your rotors/drums?
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Old 09-13-2013, 05:38 AM   #19
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2005.

I'm not sure of the condition yet. I plan to look the next time I have the jeep up on my lift.

Right now I'm just planning ahead. I have a feeling I'll be needing to get brakes soon though.
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Old 09-13-2013, 05:48 AM   #20
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Ok.....not what I had intended when I made the thread.

I am not questioning these brakes. I admit I don't know WHY these are good, only that they are recommended. That's what I'm going by.

I know that they are better for braking with larger wheels and tires, just don't know why they are better than my Napa gold brand.

So the links I quoted in the OP, are these the brakes I want? Or did I choose the wrong ones?
There is no one who has put more time and effort into bringing better brakes to the jeep community than Blaine. And he has done everything he can to get objective feedback on them. Can't ask for much more. But Blaine gives a lot more than even that.
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Old 09-13-2013, 05:49 AM   #21
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2005.

I'm not sure of the condition yet. I plan to look the next time I have the jeep up on my lift.

Right now I'm just planning ahead. I have a feeling I'll be needing to get brakes soon though.
Make sure you check your pad sliders for worn grooves.
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Old 09-13-2013, 06:03 AM   #22
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NJO,
I post very little in this forum because I come here to learn from others with way more experience and knowledge than me. You have almost 900 posts in 4 months and the majority of the ones I remember seem to be really confrontational. There's gotta be a way to share your knowledge without going some places and getting too personal.
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Old 09-13-2013, 06:30 AM   #23
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Bashing a product because you don't feel like spending the money is a pretty good reason for the "defensive" state... Its really like arguing the $200 LED light bars shipped from china are just as good as the $1,000 LED bars sold by major companies like Rigid. Just rebranded, right?

You seem to take every disagreement, blow it up, and take some sort of jab at the company or person. Obviously you and Blaine don't get along. What did Currie do to you that seems to get you offensive towards the antirock?

I'm sure this thread will be going down shortly...
I have no problem with the anti rock..or Currie.....huh? I just recommended a few Currie products in another thread......but when people state that the rig is a DD then i recommend the ORO swayloc over the Antirock as its better for onroad use.
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Old 09-13-2013, 06:46 AM   #24
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OP, I would PM Blaine to get your answer. It seems, unfortunately, that this thread can not get back on track. I would answer the question if I could. Sorry. To my fellow forum members, please remember why we are all here. To help each other.
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Old 09-13-2013, 07:14 AM   #25
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The pads are worth the cost. I compared them head to head with EBC Yellows and the BM's won outright. If there's a better performing pad for the TJ, I don't know of it.
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Old 09-13-2013, 07:28 AM   #26
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I know that they are better for braking with larger wheels and tires, just don't know why they are better than my Napa gold brand.

So the links I quoted in the OP, are these the brakes I want? Or did I choose the wrong ones?
First you have to ask yourself this: What basic compound are the NAPA gold brake pads? What basic compound are the Black Magic brake pads

Second, find out the differences in performance (like hot and cold bite, and at what temp range you specifically want your pads to best perform. For instance if you have a Jeep that you only go out on the weekends with for a mild jaunt around town, a pad with max cold bite might be key for you) and wear characteristics on different types of brake pads. You will also learn why some compounds are better for the street than others.

Third, find out why specifically bedding in your brake pads and seasoning your rotors is important (even though most people NEVER do it properly) and why it can make a difference in brake feel and performance.

Did you choose the wrong ones? No one can answer that but you.

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Old 09-13-2013, 07:37 AM   #27
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You are correct. He and I have gone round and round over a few things under his various aliases, he still resents it and tends to try and follow me around with ill intent.

We've not been 100% successful solving brake issues for folks, but we're really close to it and we do the best we can for everyone.
x2. I can vouch for Black Magic Brakes customer service...if you have a problem, give him a call and he'll bend over backwards to help you out.

I run Black Magic Pads on my 48mm dual piston caliper Vanco kit and they're awesome. He even sent me a different pad for me to test, a more expensive premium pad in fact....they didn't work as good as the BM's. That review is someplace in the thread linked above.
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Old 09-13-2013, 07:42 AM   #28
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The pads are worth the cost. I compared them head to head with EBC Yellows and the BM's won outright. If there's a better performing pad for the TJ, I don't know of it.
Did you compare a fresh set of BM pads with a fresh set of EBC's under identical conditions? Or were the pads already half worn down?

Problem with brake pad "testing" is there is no factual data to back up if one pad brakes better than another. Just a slight difference in bleeding the system will make a dramatic difference in feel and perceived pad bite. Especially if its not an apples to apples comparison. And there are so many variables to this. Not that Im doubting the BM's were superior to EBC yellows, I wouldn't be surprised if they are. EBC's are highly overpriced for what they are. Too many pads on the market for a fraction of the price that outperform EBC color pads.
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Old 09-13-2013, 07:46 AM   #29
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Did you compare a fresh set of BM pads with a fresh set of EBC's under identical conditions? Or were the pads already half worn down?

Problem with brake pad "testing" is there is no factual data to back up if one pad brakes better than another. Just a slight difference in bleeding the system will make a dramatic difference in feel and perceived pad bite. Especially if its not an apples to apples comparison. And there are so many variables to this. Not that Im doubting the BM's were superior to EBC yellows, I wouldn't be surprised if they are. EBC's are highly overpriced for what they are. Too many pads on the market for a fraction of the price that outperform EBC color pads.
Did you compare a fresh set of your Raybestos pads to a fresh set of BM pads under identical conditions? Or are you just using your vast "knowledge" to form your opinion?
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Old 09-13-2013, 07:48 AM   #30
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WOW, I don't run BMB but don't begrudge anyone ^^ who want's to. It's your coin brother spend as you see fit. They seem popular on here so they must be a good product.

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