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Old 01-06-2013, 06:20 AM   #31
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FYI. I have the 9000's on my JK and love them. On setting 1 there're way to soft.
3 is a about perfect.
Whoever said they are too stiff is crazy.

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Old 01-06-2013, 04:11 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by wmdavis007 View Post
Nice looking Sahara. Not sure if anyone else covered this, but being the very most important thing to me...make damn sure the shop you take it to is a 4x4/Jeep specialist shop. Not every shop is the right shop to take it to. Just because they have mechanics and fab workers doesn't mean they know the rights and wrongs about Jeep and 4x4 suspensions. (My small town is full of shops that "work" on cars but I wouldn't take my leaf blower to them. But I do have one Jeep/4x4 shop locally and another within 45 mins.) Like some of the others said, learn as much as you can and take it to several shops for quotes.
As for a lift kit...I started with (and currently run) a 2" BB Teraflex kit just to fit my 31x10.5 tires but plan on upgrading to a 2" Old Man Emu light load kit after I've finished paying it off.
Good luck and welcome to the forum...keep us updated...and remember no question is a dumb question.
Thank you. I appreciate the warm welcome. The guy I talked to owns a local lift and custom fab shop. I think he usually does bigger truck stuff, but he said he has done a countless amount of jeeps as well. There is a local jeep place I'm going to get a second opinion and quote from, but I haven't heard the greatest things about them. And rumor has it they are pretty stuck up if your not a regular, so we'll see how it goes. I would definitely prefer to have a jeep shop do it since they specialize in jeeps.

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Originally Posted by cntryboy232 View Post
It dont look that bad. It must ride like a dream. Only thing offroading prob would suck
It rides good, its hard to tell though because before I bought it I only drove 1 other jeep, it was lifted quite a bit and had 35" tires. It rode pretty terrible and was impossible to keep straight. When I run the bags in the middle range, 40 psi or so, it does soak up quite a bit of the bumps. I would love to ride in a stock jeep for side by side comparison though, because then I would really know how big of a difference it makes.

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Originally Posted by UnlimitedLJ04 View Post
some kits include bumpstop extensions, most do not. bumpstop extensions are part #4 of a 4 part system. you're missing the other 3 parts.



basically the spring perches and bumpstops have been hacked up - both front and rear, top and bottom.

the front uppers can be repaired with some skilled work, as shown above. But you're better off cutting the rest off and totally replacing them.

Like I said in the beginning, you're starting over. You need to get back to bare frame and bare axle tube and weld all new perches on. It's the same type of work as you'd do for a full axle swap front and rear.

The fabrication necessary is very similar to those build threads I linked in the beginning.



Now, I'll respond to this, because I think you're starting to get a feel for the work needed. By the time you weld all these spring perches on and get the fab work done to bring this close to stock, you'll literally be half way to a suspension like Imped's build, or CB3's rig done by mudb8.
Wow, I didn't realize how much I was starting over. Now I am starting to understand what you are saying. I thought I still had most of the original mounts intact. Now the parts I need to get back to stock, do they all have to be recreated from scratch, or is there a place I can order the parts from and just have them welded back on? Or do I need to cut them off a jeep in a wrecking yard or something?

The problem with doing the type of stuff in those builds is, well, I don't really have enough skills to do that type of stuff myself and even though I'm half way, that would increase my costs quite a bit to have someone else do it. lol I don't know if I could even relay to the shop what I am wanting. My funds are limited. When I originally thought I had most of the mounts left, I thought I would spend enough to get me a really nice lift/shock set up. Now after seeing all the fab work I need, I'm not sure where I stand now. I don't think the guy I talked to realized how much these were hacked up. If I had people like you and the guys who did those builds close enough to help me out, it would be a whole 'nother story. I just don't know how I would even begin a project like that, especially considering this s my daily driver.

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Originally Posted by Goobs63 View Post
First off I wish you lived close to me so I could take a ride in that with the bags. Personally I think it's kinda cool. I spose that has to do with working on trucks Does it have them on all 4 corners? How high will it go if you pump them up? Maybe the po was looking for like an air powered lift kit kinda like on a land rover. Enjoy your new toy they are awesome.
haha, I'm glad someone is intrigued by them. Most people I show are just like "WTF?!" and laugh. It does have them on all 4 corners. The front and back are controlled separately, but not each corner. Just front and back adjustment. If I pump them to 80 psi it gets kinda high, maybe about to a 2.5" lift but at that point the ride is so rough its not even doable. I would also question whether they would pop if I hit too big of a pot hole. 40-50 psi is about the only spot I run them at to keep the ride quality at its best. It looks about stock at that level, so I couldn't run more than a 31" tire. Considering it has a 30" now, I don't think the po was going for a air lift like the rovers. I think it was done for either ride quality or as some kind of sick joke lol.

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Originally Posted by 97flexy View Post
I have Rancho 9000's on my TJ and run them on the lowest setting and they ride like a dream, I run 35s on roughly 3" of lift, with a cut body and other goodies, its my DD as well. I like my Rancho 9000XL shocks. but why not leave the bags and run some really nice shocks? people use bags to off road. and they perform well, just find a shop or better yet someone who knows 4x4s in your area and swap your jeep to a long arm and run a bit taller bags, you already have the expensive stuff. if you going to swap in jeep coils and spend all the money to ditch the bags why not make the bags work well for off road and give you a good ride on road. Read this link, one of the threads on Pirate4x4 I found about bags on Jeeps and other trucks and how much people like them, tells about why they are like off road, but complains about upfront price. the PO already paid the up front price now u can build it.


air bag suspension - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum


-you need to read about all the different type of suspensions and find out what works for you. I personally spent the money, and time building a Long Arm(LA) suspension with the other goodies that have been already mentioned(Tummy tuck, high line,). You should read about all the different options b4 you start dumping money into your jeep. For instance you can buy a AEV high line fender kit for about $2000 to give you roughly 3.5" of addition room for bigger tires, or you could read up on the Jeep Forums and convert your jeep fenders and hood to a high line for maybe $50 in bolts and nuts and some more time working on your jeep.
That link is an interesting read. Those systems are quite different from mine. The reason I want to get ride of the system is because these are so temperamental. They leak and I've already had them looked at. Its hard to get them to not leak. Every morning the tank is empty, the front to dumped all the way, and the back only has a little bit of air. So I have to run the compressor and fill the tank to start driving again. Also, I think there is condensation in the lines and tank. The other morning it was freezing temps and I had to let the car run for a while cause the tank wouldn't take air, assuming there was a block in the line from frozen condensation. Once everything warmed up it finally took air. Another morning the front wouldn't take air, which I again assume was some frozen water blocking it. Once I let the vehicle run and warm up for a bit it finally took air. Moral of the story, these things are a pain in the ass. While it would be much easier to get bigger bags and run the lift that way, I don't want to have to worry about it. It seems too unreliable. If one pops I'm screwed. Too much can go wrong for me to feel secure in that. I love to go snowboarding and I don't want to have to worry that when I get to my car, are the bags gonna fill with air? Also I can't just hop in my jeep and go. I have to fill the tank and the bags before I can drive. PITA for sure.

A lot of people say LA isn't necessary for a 4". Does a LA make the ride any better? Like I previously said, I'm not too keen on crawling or doing much 4x4'ing, so I'm not necessarily looking for a set up thats gonna get me over rocks. I just want a solid ride.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kjeeper10 View Post
FYI. I have the 9000's on my JK and love them. On setting 1 there're way to soft.
3 is a about perfect.
Whoever said they are too stiff is crazy.
Thats what I want to hear. Do you run the front and back the same or different? Does the weight of a hard top help? Also, do you have the my ride setup or just use the knobs?

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Old 01-06-2013, 04:35 PM   #33
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Wow, I didn't realize how much I was starting over. Now I am starting to understand what you are saying. I thought I still had most of the original mounts intact. Now the parts I need to get back to stock, do they all have to be recreated from scratch, or is there a place I can order the parts from and just have them welded back on? Or do I need to cut them off a jeep in a wrecking yard or something?
Front lower spring perches, and rear upper and lower springs perches are readily available.

Here's just one example of front and rear sets:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/REX-RE9968-NT
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/rex-re9969

Other companies like Teraflex, Artec, and others make more. Use google and search the vendor forums...you'll find plenty.

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Originally Posted by GlocksandJeeps View Post
The problem with doing the type of stuff in those builds is, well, I don't really have enough skills to do that type of stuff myself
so? learn. spend the money on tools, and read the forums on how to do this. How do you think most of us came to be on here giving you advice?

When i bought my Jeep I didn't know jack squat. I spent countless hours reading on forums over many years, took a machining and welding class, started buying tools as necessary and started playing around building stuff.

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Originally Posted by GlocksandJeeps View Post
lol I don't know if I could even relay to the shop what I am wanting. My funds are limited.
and thats a problem. the other problem is if they actually have a reasonable level of understanding of suspension mechanics. you'd be surprised what so called professionals get away with.

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Originally Posted by GlocksandJeeps View Post
When I originally thought I had most of the mounts left, I thought I would spend enough to get me a really nice lift/shock set up. Now after seeing all the fab work I need, I'm not sure where I stand now. I don't think the guy I talked to realized how much these were hacked up. If I had people like you and the guys who did those builds close enough to help me out, it would be a whole 'nother story.
You do. California has some of the best off-road fab guys in the country. Mr. Blaine (Black Magic Brakes on here) and Savvy Off-Road are pretty far south of you. Call up BMB and he may know someone closer to you...otherwise maybe drive your jeep down to him and discuss options.

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Originally Posted by GlocksandJeeps View Post
I just don't know how I would even begin a project like that, especially considering this s my daily driver.
Read, learn, buy tools. Research & read some more. Learn to weld proficiently. Repeat.

Gather the necessary parts. Then do one axle at a time on long weekends.

I built my HP D30 over a few months (reinforced control arm mounts, a truss and big brake setup), piled parts in my living room and small garage. Took off work one Friday and had a buddy help me do the axle swap in the driveway. It was back on all fours by 3:30pm.
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Old 01-06-2013, 04:39 PM   #34
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I would say to run on the bags for now. If you want lift, put a spacer on the bottom of the bag. No need to worry about them getting a hole. I have driven a lot of big trucks off highway in the oil patch, and only had one get a hole. They are extremely tough. If it's freezing, put a little methanol in your air system. Air bags have a phenomenal amount of travel, ore than you would ever get from a spring. I think the air ride would be a nice compared to stock. Just my .02.
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Old 01-06-2013, 04:42 PM   #35
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Most time you can order parts for springs or strip it off other jeeps
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Old 01-06-2013, 04:46 PM   #36
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If you want lift, put a spacer on the bottom of the bag.
huh? they are welded to the Jeep. it's not like he can slide on a poly BB spacer...
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Old 01-06-2013, 05:01 PM   #37
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huh? they are welded to the Jeep. it's not like he can slide on a poly BB spacer...
Cut the weld and use a fabbed steel spacer. Easier than rebuilding every mount for springs.
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Old 01-06-2013, 05:32 PM   #38
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Cut the weld and use a fabbed steel spacer. Easier than rebuilding every mount for springs.
the same travel with an even more hacked up job, and greater leverage to potentially damage more stuff....not going to help....
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Old 01-06-2013, 05:39 PM   #39
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There is a really good one in Clovis Ca. Extreme Off Road here is a link
eXtreme-offroad.com
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Old 01-06-2013, 08:51 PM   #40
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[/QUOTE]so? learn. spend the money on tools, and read the forums on how to do this. How do you think most of us came to be on here giving you advice?

When i bought my Jeep I didn't know jack squat. I spent countless hours reading on forums over many years, took a machining and welding class, started buying tools as necessary and started playing around building stuff.


and thats a problem. the other problem is if they actually have a reasonable level of understanding of suspension mechanics. you'd be surprised what so called professionals get away with.


You do. California has some of the best off-road fab guys in the country. Mr. Blaine (Black Magic Brakes on here) and Savvy Off-Road are pretty far south of you. Call up BMB and he may know someone closer to you...otherwise maybe drive your jeep down to him and discuss options.



Read, learn, buy tools. Research & read some more. Learn to weld proficiently. Repeat.

Gather the necessary parts. Then do one axle at a time on long weekends.

I built my HP D30 over a few months (reinforced control arm mounts, a truss and big brake setup), piled parts in my living room and small garage. Took off work one Friday and had a buddy help me do the axle swap in the driveway. It was back on all fours by 3:30pm.[/QUOTE]


I agree with Unlimited, start reading and build it your self, you will learn a lot and save A LOT of money.
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:18 PM   #41
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Cut the weld and use a fabbed steel spacer. Easier than rebuilding every mount for springs.
that sounds like a horrible Idea. if the op is going to cut the bags apart to ad some shady spacers, he should just rebuild his air bags so they don't leak, run new lines and do it him self, save money and learn about his jeep. I've always thought it would be a cool skill to know how to set up airbags. If the OP knew how to build an airbag system(or rebuild one). He would always be able find work in cali working on low riders, custom cars or trucks, anything with bags. I bet it would work great and be a reliable system if the OP just rebuilt his jeep, who knows how old that air bag system is. those lines on his jeep might be very brittle and cracked.

- My advise(and many other people on the forum will agree) READ, READ, READ, and buy the tools you need as you start building.
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Old 01-08-2013, 06:53 PM   #42
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So I took my Wrangler to Kyle's Jeep located in Modesto. I talked to the main guy, the owners son. Super nice and super helpful. He explained to me how the suspension systems work on these jeeps and answered pretty much all of my questions about lifts and shocks. Its been awhile since I've had customer service like that. He was pretty impressed with the condition of the jeep and said it wouldn't be a problem getting coils back on it. He said he's dealt with a lot worse. So thats the route I'm gonna take. I definitely want these bags off and I don't want to do it myself. I personally am the type of guy where if I can pay someone to do it right, versus me learning on my own vehicle, I would rather pay. If this was something else I'd probably do it, but I'm not going to experiment on my frame and suspension, cutting stuff off and welding stuff. Just not something I feel comfortable with. Unfortunately he couldn't give me a quote, but said he'd help me out, if it takes him 6 hours he'll charge me for 3. I had him quote me on lifts and shocks and stuff as well. He said he would do a Superlift 4" with shocks for $850 and if I don't want the shocks he'll take a couple hundred bucks off. He works straight with Superlift so thats the best deal he can get me versus other brands he goes through a distributor. His prices for Rancho and other brands were above $1,000. So I'm thinking I am gonna do the Superlift 4" with Rancho 9000XL shocks, what do you guys think of that? I've read some reviews on Superlift and they all seem to be good. Some people say they are kind of stiff, but thats usually when they are using the Superlift shocks.

What will effect my ride quality? The shocks or the springs? If I get good shocks like the 9000s will I notice a difference between each brands coil springs?

He also recommended I replace the front and rear track bars, about $100 each and do a SYE kit which he said would cost $1,100 installed. All of that sounds fine, but I don't know about that SYE kit, that seems pricey to me. What about you guys? He showed me the kit and its a really solid kit, very durable, but that jumps my cost up a lot. I'm already out quite a bit with the lift, shocks, and labor.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:50 PM   #43
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Anything over a 2 in lift and you'll probably need an SYE. You could get a 2 inch suspension lift and. 1 inch body lift and only come out 1 inch shorter without having to get the SYE (probably. Every jeep is different). Oh, and I'd read up on the lift brand you mentioned. Idk if they're any good or not. If not, why not ask if you can get a lift online and how much it'd cost to install it, might be cheaper.
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:14 PM   #44
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I thought about doing that to get a rancho, but if the super lift is essentially the same then I'd rather get it through them. That way its them doing the warranty work, not me dealing with a website.
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:15 PM   #45
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And because I like to support the local mom and pop type places.
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:31 PM   #46
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And because I like to support the local mom and pop type places.
Yea I agree with that, just make sure the lift is a good one, I hear of guys getting a sub par lift for whatever reason, getting feed up with it sagging and other junk, and eventually getting the more expensive lift they originally considered. And the auto shop still gets the business from the labor. Don't forget about that. But who knows, maybe the kit is actually really good. I just haven't really heard much about that brand, and would want to double check it before I bought it. I'm not trying to tell you to get this or that, just to double check you're choice enjoy the jeep.
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:22 AM   #47
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My good friend has a 4" superlift on his TJ he runs 34x10.5s on it. he is looking for a springs for his jeep. The ride quality isn't the greatest(but it is a cheap A$$ lift) so you can't expect much. He doesn't have a SYE kit on his Jeep cause the 4" superlift sags pretty quickly to a 3 inch lift. for the cost of all the work that shop wants to do for you. you should consider buying a Old Man Emu 2.5" lift for $782 bought as a kit from Rocky Road(Old Man Emu TJ: Old Man Emu TJ*Components and Kits at the lowest price). Then buy a 1.25" BL from Zone for $94.95 (1-1/4" Body Lift J9120) everything is included in the kit. With those two lifts you will be able to stay away from the $1100 SYE and still run 33s no problem plus the OME lift won't sag in a year. spend the money right the first time don't cheap out on a lift.
You should ask the shop how much to install a lift and body lift if you bring in the parts. labor shouldn't be anymore than if he bought the lift and installed an SYE.
Just a heads up a 4" superlift lift kit for a TJ is $713 with out shocks if you buy it yourself and $803 if you want super lift shocks with that kit. (Jeep Lift Kits - Acme Jeep Parts)
That $300 extra that he a charging you to have him order the kit could be some nice Bilstein or Rancho shocks.
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:29 AM   #48
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two other Great kits for a cheap price(Zone lifts are made by BDS) if you go with a cheaper shock a nitro will always ride better than a hydro for coil springs.
4.25" TJ Combo Lift J25/J26 out the video at the bottom of the page)
This lift includes the 1"MML so when your ready to do a TT it's one less thing you will need to buy. neither kit requires a SYE.
3" TJ Suspension System J2/J3
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Old 01-10-2013, 12:49 PM   #49
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Thanks for all the info. So is it just the springs that suck? I wouldn't mind if I had to buy only springs a couple years down the road if the rest of the parts are all good. I was definitely not gonna run the superlift shocks either way, going to run Rancho 9000xl's.

I also want to stay away from body lifts and stuff. Just heard to many bad things about them.

How is the Rancho lift kits, would I be better off running all Rancho?
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Old 01-10-2013, 01:02 PM   #50
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Thanks for all the info. So is it just the springs that suck? I wouldn't mind if I had to buy only springs a couple years down the road if the rest of the parts are all good. I was definitely not gonna run the superlift shocks either way, going to run Rancho 9000xl's.

I also want to stay away from body lifts and stuff. Just heard to many bad things about them.

How is the Rancho lift kits, would I be better off running all Rancho?
Body lifts are only bad if you go bigger than 1.25" I you run 2inch or 3" body lift issues come quickly after the install. with a 1.25" BL you almost can't even tell. The POly bushing in the super lift CAs suck they are rock hard and wear quick. you will be replacing those to. it ultimately your choice what lift you run cause its your jeep we're just try'n to save you some money and not have to spend more money a year from now.
Body lift example:
No body lift-

1.25" Body lift-

You would never know my jeep ran one unless you asked. I've wheel'd with guys on 2" and 3" BLs and I've watched their body bolts bend when they rock their rigs too hard. Too big of a BL is a bad thing but many Good aftermarket companies(Under Cover Fabworks, LLC - The Original "Extra-Clearance" Skids) is one that comes to mind, requires a 1" or 1.25" BL to run a flat belly skid plate or Tummy Tuck(TT)
Notice no transfer case skid.
http://www.southernjeeps.org/phpbb/files/tt3.jpg
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Old 01-10-2013, 01:27 PM   #51
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He also recommended I replace the front and rear track bars, about $100 each
any adjustable track bar that costs $100 each isn't worth getting...

try parts from Currie, Old Man Emu, Savvy Off-Road...
Savvy Offroad
dpgoffroad.com |
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Old 01-10-2013, 02:33 PM   #52
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any adjustable track bar that costs $100 each isn't worth getting...
agree'd
I must have missed that.
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Old 01-10-2013, 06:53 PM   #53
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I agree about the track bar, an OEM front replacement from NAPA runs about $125 after tax so a quality adjustable track bar will be a bit more.
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:46 PM   #54
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Would I be better off going with the Rubicon Express super flex? Comes with a lot more and includes a front adjustable track bar. More expensive, but is that a good brand? Reviews seem good with the occasional complaint. He said he'd do a RE 4.5 Superflex for $1436
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Old 01-10-2013, 08:49 PM   #55
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Would I be better off going with the Rubicon Express super flex? Comes with a lot more and includes a front adjustable track bar. More expensive, but is that a good brand? Reviews seem good with the occasional complaint. He said he'd do a RE 4.5 Superflex for $1436
do a little research about RE going bankrupt a few years back because they couldn't make a bushing that lasted more than a few months...
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Old 01-10-2013, 09:13 PM   #56
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So does that mean now they've fixed the problem since they're back in business? Haha
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Old 01-10-2013, 09:35 PM   #57
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RE is now owned by the parent company TransAmerica. They also own 4WD, 4 Wheel Parts, SmittyBilt, and several others. From What I understand the bushing issues have been solved. The 4.5 RE SuperFlex is a decent off the shelf kit that will do fine for what you want (according to what you have posted). It comes with a lot of the smaller parts needed to complete the job. You'll need the SYE/CV driveline though (his $1100 quote seems really high for this). I would recommend upgrading the shock choice though...your Rancho 9000s would be a good choice.

Good Luck..
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98 TJ 5.7 Hemi, 545RFE, G2 D44, HP30, 4.10s & ARBs, RE 4.5 LA, 35 in MTRs on 15x10 alloys, Gen Right G3 Aluminum fenders/rear flares, Warn 9.5 CTi w/ Amsteel Blue, Premier Welder, Savvy rockers, Rampage top, a few other goodies..
Link to build thread..http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f22/s...rsion-1277803/
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Old 01-10-2013, 10:23 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GlocksandJeeps View Post
So does that mean now they've fixed the problem since they're back in business? Haha
not necessarily...just means TransAmerica bought them. in addition to the brands mentioned above, they also own Procomp...

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Originally Posted by sduncan View Post
From What I understand the bushing issues have been solved.
RE Daystar poly bushings splitting - JeepForum.com
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Old 01-11-2013, 07:09 AM   #59
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op- do you have a problem with OME or BDS? RE is a better lift then superlift yes. If you want to save some money and not run an SYE yet do a 1.25" BL.

Can any yal back me up on the fact that a 1 or 1.25 inch bl is not a dangerous lift to run.
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Old 01-11-2013, 09:24 AM   #60
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Can any yal back me up on the fact that a 1 or 1.25 inch bl is not a dangerous lift to run.
a 1.25 BL + 1" MML is good stuff...

been running a BL/MML setup myself for quite some time and no baby seals have been harmed yet.


OP, here's my crap if you care to read more tech...

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