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Old 03-30-2011, 11:05 PM   #1
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Detailing help from the pros

I washed my jeep really good today for the first time since last Summer. I have a few problems.

All these cracks and crevices are a big pain! The previous owner used white paste wax all the time. I can tell because all the white in all cracks and torx! What is the best way to get all the residue out?? I will unscrew every hinge if I need to.

The other thing is what looks like water spots that dried. I don't remember those being there last summer. It looks like the paint has cracked in circles. Is there any way to rid these? Or even make them less noticeable?

It seems like I could use a black liquid wax or something and it would help out, right?

These pictures were taken after a wash- clay- polish- wax process. Maybe I did something wrong?

Any help or suggestions would be great.
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Old 03-30-2011, 11:29 PM   #2
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They make special detailing "razors". They are red and made out of plastic and are meant specifically for removing build up wax from cracks and seams. Toothpicks are also handy.

As far as those water stains, you need to using a more abrasive polish or they're just to engrained in the clearcoat.

EDIT: Looking at the last two pics, are you sure those are defects in the clearcoat? They almost look like "holes" in the clearcoat like something majorly corrosive got splashed on the paint.

What kind of polish and wax are you using?

I always recommend Príma brand, not the off the shelf stuff.

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Old 03-30-2011, 11:32 PM   #3
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IDK---might ask InfernoGirl she is VERY good at detailing and seems to really have a list of tricks for everything, when it comes to cleaning up Jeeps.
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Old 03-30-2011, 11:48 PM   #4
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For the most part, any wax you use and leave on the paint will turn white like that - no matter what color the wax started as. Some just won't turn quite as white.

Isopropyl Alcohol is your friend. And a toothbrush. And q-tips. And microfiber towels.

Dilute the IPA with water, preferably distilled, and place it into a spray bottle. Spritz the wax you want removed and use the toothbrush, q-tips, and microfiber towels to scrub and remove the wax. Warning: May require some elbow grease!

You can try to diluted IPA on the water spots, too. May or may not work. If not, then pick up a bottle of Optimum Polish or and All-In-One like Klasse AIO.


When you're done working on the paint, you'll need to apply new, fresh wax. Just work on removing all of the wax with the MF towel.
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Old 03-30-2011, 11:52 PM   #5
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The water marks are deeper than the clear. It looks like the black paint cracked underneath. It's wierd because there is still clear coat over it, they aren't holes in the paint, just raised cracks.

I did use off the shelf stuff, but I can get better quality if there is something that will work. I just don't know what to try next. I used a polish, then tried a buffing compound and it didn't get any better.

I added the alcohol to my list. Thank you for the suggestion.
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:04 AM   #6
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The water marks are deeper than the clear. It looks like the black paint cracked underneath. It's wierd because there is still clear coat over it, they aren't holes in the paint, just raised cracks.

I did use off the shelf stuff, but I can get better quality if there is something that will work. I just don't know what to try next. I used a polish, then tried a buffing compound and it didn't get any better.

I added the alcohol to my list. Thank you for the suggestion.
I'm thinking those "water marks" are deeper than the clearcoat and won't be solved with any polishing. However it's hard to tell by pics alone.

If you feel comfortable doing it, you can always wetsand the areas down and reapply a spray can clearcoat. It will be a lot cheaper than getting the panels re painted.
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:16 AM   #7
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If it looks cracked under the clear, then yeah...no amount of polishing is going to get rid of it. I have the same issue on the hood of my SE.

Basically, the paint is etched. I've tried everything except for wetsanding (which I don't think will work, either) and nothing.

Re-paint!

Or some waxes and glazes may help to hide the problem but this is only a temporary solution and you'll be maintaining the wax/glaze regimen.
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:20 AM   #8
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Dang that's no good. I guess I'll have to see if I can get the hood redone. What about residue in the screw heads? Just a toothpick and the alcohol? That will be fun.
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:23 AM   #9
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Pretty much. Rinse and repeat and you should see some good results.
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Old 03-31-2011, 12:27 AM   #10
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If your willing to get the hood redone I would wetsand the clearcoat off in those places, possibly getting a bit into the base coat, then reapply a rattle can clear coat. If you decide you don't like how it turns out then have the hood completely redone.
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Old 03-31-2011, 08:12 AM   #11
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Yeah I may as well try it before I get it redone. I am not familiar with wetsanding at all though, but I'll look into it. Thanks
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Old 03-31-2011, 08:34 AM   #12
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LOL! I prefer to start with the least invasive methods..... Try washing it with Dawn to cut the wax, then claybar it.... Claybar and diluted vinegar may take care of the water spots. The best investment you can make if you care about a vehicles finish is a Porter Cable 7424 Random orbit buffer.... And some good pads and polishes. Spend some time reading at autotopia.com and autogeek. There's a boatload of info out there and is a detailers mecca....
As far as the wax build up goes, what the Dawn and claybar leave behind can easily be removed with some toothpicks. It's not that hard, or time consuming really, if you have a nice bored hour or so... You'll love the results! I'd try the alcohol trick too, never heard of that one...
To help prevent future water spots, make sure you dry your vehicle either with a microfiber towel or a leaf blower after you wash it... It looks like your water source is pretty hard, and black/dark vehicles are the worst about showing spots.
You may not be able to remove all traces of the spots, but you can certainly diminish the appearance of them. Last resort, wet sand or refinish....
Once you've used Dawn or alcohol or a claybar on your paint, you have effectively removed all the wax on it, so you should rewax it to protect the paint from the elements...
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Old 03-31-2011, 09:39 AM   #13
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from mopar you can get a "fallout" bar, its like clay and you wet it and rub it all over to remove acid rain spots and so on.
next, never wax your vehicle. that is a death sentence for paint. it clogs up the paint and starts killing it. (i paint, so anything with wax or silicone is the devil imo)
a light buffing with non-abrasive polisher from 3m is plenty to brighten up paint. and if you keep it clean, it will last.
dont confuse spraying your vehicle at the car wash, with actually putting on a wash mit and washing it.
never use high pressure water on your paint, it promotes chipping. cut the metal end off of your home garden hose not only so you dont use a nozzle on it but if you drop it, there is no metal to damage your paint.
for compound left on a vehicle? patience. use q-tips, soft cloth rags, anything that will fit but dont use anything dry as it will put small scratch marks and swirl marks.
as infernogirl said, use dawn. its gentle and has degreaser built in which always helps. the soapy quality lubricates what you are rubbing with. i even put it in water when wet sanding.
i prefer microfiber towels when washing, and a good quality lambskin chamois for drying. read the instructions before using or you will f up your paint. (remember, nothing dry, not even when drying )

(yes i am a pro custom guy, i.e. i just sandblasted and gloss black powdercoated my wiper arms yesterday)
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Old 03-31-2011, 09:40 AM   #14
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i even wash my car in the winter with warm soapy water. you cant let salt and sediment collect for months at a time without a bad end result, this is the one time i will go to an automated car wash, just to get the bottom spray treatment.

[QUOTE=DerekM;1149074]I washed my jeep really good today for the first time since last Summer. I have a few problems.
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Old 03-31-2011, 09:43 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anomaly
For the most part, any wax you use and leave on the paint will turn white like that - no matter what color the wax started as. Some just won't turn quite as white.

Isopropyl Alcohol is your friend. And a toothbrush. And q-tips. And microfiber towels.

Dilute the IPA with water, preferably distilled, and place it into a spray bottle. Spritz the wax you want removed and use the toothbrush, q-tips, and microfiber towels to scrub and remove the wax. Warning: May require some elbow grease!
Will this work no matter how long its been caked on? PO of my Jeep did the same thing. I had to have scrubbed with a medium toothbrush for well over an hour, but all I was using was high quality H2O
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Old 03-31-2011, 10:57 AM   #16
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a toothbrush will scratch/scuff your paint. you might be ok with a soft one but unless in an inconspicuous area, i wouldnt do it. for the most part i only use soap and water to clean my vehicles but in this type of instance, you need something to soften the crap you are removing because anything strong enough to physically remove it will damage the paint also.
instead of alcohol, just use a simple wax and grease remover. you can buy it in bottles and either pour it into a rag or put it in a spray bottle to saturate your rag. bug and tar remover is the same stuff but more generic in a spray can.
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Old 03-31-2011, 11:14 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by InfernoGirl
LOL! I prefer to start with the least invasive methods..... Try washing it with Dawn to cut the wax, then claybar it.... Claybar and diluted vinegar may take care of the water spots. The best investment you can make if you care about a vehicles finish is a Porter Cable 7424 Random orbit buffer.... And some good pads and polishes. Spend some time reading at autotopia.com and autogeek. There's a boatload of info out there and is a detailers mecca....
As far as the wax build up goes, what the Dawn and claybar leave behind can easily be removed with some toothpicks. It's not that hard, or time consuming really, if you have a nice bored hour or so... You'll love the results! I'd try the alcohol trick too, never heard of that one...
To help prevent future water spots, make sure you dry your vehicle either with a microfiber towel or a leaf blower after you wash it... It looks like your water source is pretty hard, and black/dark vehicles are the worst about showing spots.
You may not be able to remove all traces of the spots, but you can certainly diminish the appearance of them. Last resort, wet sand or refinish....
Once you've used Dawn or alcohol or a claybar on your paint, you have effectively removed all the wax on it, so you should rewax it to protect the paint from the elements...
Lol, you pretty much outlined my detailing methods. I have leafblower with foam taped to the end specifically for washing cars.

By the way guys, I think we determined those aren't just simple water marks but paint defects.
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Old 03-31-2011, 11:15 AM   #18
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I would start by trying to clay bar it. With a little patience, that clay should get all the water marks out.
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Old 03-31-2011, 11:49 AM   #19
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I did the claybar and nothing worked. Those aren't water spots, The paint is cracked under the clear coat. I think the only thing I can do at this point is to remove paint.
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Old 03-31-2011, 01:23 PM   #20
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ouch. yep removing the paint is the only way to fix spiderwebbing type cracks. i have seen guys try to spot putty them and paint over to avoid stripping the old paint but it always recracks.
if the paint is cracked, then most likely the substrate beneath it was the culprit. most likely the primer was contaminated. the item that shows the flaw is the result of something bad beneath. if your clear coat peels, then your paint is bad, etc.
good luck.
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Old 03-31-2011, 02:35 PM   #21
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Will this work no matter how long its been caked on? PO of my Jeep did the same thing. I had to have scrubbed with a medium toothbrush for well over an hour, but all I was using was high quality H2O
That has been my experience. Water is good but a solvent like alcohol works better.

To clarify my suggestion on the use of a toothbrush: use the toothbrush/detailing brush between body panels and other recesses like the hinges pictured in this thread. Use a MF towel for the main, flat body panels.

Some marring can/will occur if you brush the panels but it should be light and easily removed with a polish. Using the PC7424 (recommended by InfernoGirl) will help tremendously. Harbor Freight sells a Chicago Electric 7" rotary polisher for about $35 but the take practice to not cause more paint problems.
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Old 03-31-2011, 03:11 PM   #22
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Yeah I figured thats what you meant. In my case, I was using a toothbrush on the crevices and grooves. Its like the PO got really sloppy around the bolts and grooves of the Jeep. Especially around the air intake for fresh air, under the windshield there.
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Old 03-31-2011, 03:43 PM   #23
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Turtle Wax Color Magic Car Polish, that's what I used to use on my Midnight Black 2000 SS Camaro.
Link

You want to Polish it like this..No Kidding, do not use Circular Motions. Wash it the same way.
On the top surfaces, Hood, top of Fenders, you want to polish the length of the jeep, Front to back motions.

For the side, doors, Side of the fenders, rear panels Rear Hatch, you want to use up and down motions.

I used to photograph a lot of car shows and my neighbor is a HUGE Custom Hot Rod guy. I know it sound silly but it does help the appearance of the Black and Red Cars.

I did the clay bar to my camaro when I first got it to remove the tree sap and water deposites. If you do that, make sure to read up, and if you drop the clay bar, throw it away.

About the best product out there for Polish and Wax is Zaino. That's what 80% of the car show groups use. It's EXPENSIVE though. Here's what they say about applying polish.

"Want an even higher level of optical light refraction and reflectivety. Here's how. When applying Show Car Polish do the following; On all Top surfaces of vehicle, use a back and forth motion (from front bumper towards windshield). On all Side surfaces (doors, fenders, etc.) use a vertical motion, up and down. This technique will increase the way light attracts and reflects off of Show Car Polish. The body lines and contours of your vehicle will seem to glow. This trick really works. Remember to use Z-6 "Gloss Enhancer" spray between every coat of Show Car Polish."

Good Luck, Nothing looks prettier than a clean black rig...and nothing looks dirtier than a dirty black rig..lol
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Old 03-31-2011, 04:15 PM   #24
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Turtle Wax Color Magic Car Polish, that's what I used to use on my Midnight Black 2000 SS Camaro.
Link

You want to Polish it like this..No Kidding, do not use Circular Motions. Wash it the same way.
On the top surfaces, Hood, top of Fenders, you want to polish the length of the jeep, Front to back motions.

For the side, doors, Side of the fenders, rear panels Rear Hatch, you want to use up and down motions.

I used to photograph a lot of car shows and my neighbor is a HUGE Custom Hot Rod guy. I know it sound silly but it does help the appearance of the Black and Red Cars.

I did the clay bar to my camaro when I first got it to remove the tree sap and water deposites. If you do that, make sure to read up, and if you drop the clay bar, throw it away.

About the best product out there for Polish and Wax is Zaino. That's what 80% of the car show groups use. It's EXPENSIVE though. Here's what they say about applying polish.

"Want an even higher level of optical light refraction and reflectivety. Here's how. When applying Show Car Polish do the following; On all Top surfaces of vehicle, use a back and forth motion (from front bumper towards windshield). On all Side surfaces (doors, fenders, etc.) use a vertical motion, up and down. This technique will increase the way light attracts and reflects off of Show Car Polish. The body lines and contours of your vehicle will seem to glow. This trick really works. Remember to use Z-6 "Gloss Enhancer" spray between every coat of Show Car Polish."

Good Luck, Nothing looks prettier than a clean black rig...and nothing looks dirtier than a dirty black rig..lol
Zaino is good, but like you said expensive. When I was detailing high end cars I used (still use) Príma brand. They are local in Denver. They make awesome stuff that cost about the same as the off the shelf stuff but is WAAAYYYY better.

Prima Car Care Home Page

Just my thoughts and preferences.
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Old 04-01-2011, 08:00 AM   #25
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as a painter with experience on boats, cars and motorcycles, i would never use anything but 3M. the buffer being the classic dewalt and the final polish of course by hand.
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Old 04-01-2011, 08:21 AM   #26
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I bought a 900 CBR and the guy I bought it from waxed it and it had white residue all over the gauges and in every single tiny crack! TOOTHBRUSH! will get the white off. Worked like a charm.
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Old 04-01-2011, 11:15 AM   #27
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Also try a paint brush with the bristles cut down to about 1-1 1/2 inch. It works pretty good.

My $.02
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Old 04-01-2011, 11:24 AM   #28
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Just give it a really, really good wash with some powerful dish soap (Dawn works well) and follow with a good 2-3 coatings of wax. If they still show, you will probably need to get it repainted/refinished. Good luck!
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Old 04-01-2011, 11:51 AM   #29
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guys, for the umpteenth time. if you rub bristles on paint, you will scratch/scuff/swirl the finish. unless you plan on buffing it all out after you do that, dont do that. factory clear coats are cheap and thin, any factory finish has a finite number of times it can be buffed before cutting through to the paint.
if it was just a matter of compound, its easy. soap and water, compound washes off. go to any paint shop. after the paint work is done, the vehicle gets cut and buffed, then washed.
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Old 04-01-2011, 12:01 PM   #30
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In my case, I would rather have swirls that you could hardly see vs bright white wax cake on the torx bolts and hinges of the hood and windshield of a black Jeep, it sticks out so bad, and makes me look like I don't know how to detail a car (which in a way I don't, I do alot of the dont's when washing and polishing, but meh, whatever) but sloppyness like what I have from the PO is such an eye sore. Its almost like its part of the paint now.

Gonna try the alcohol treatment tonight while I drink a cold Shiner Bock.

(That's right, I threw some subliminal advertising there, Prosit!)

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