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Old 07-06-2012, 10:01 PM   #1
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Do I need a dropped Pittman arm ?

Here's the run down, 1999 tj, just installed a 4.5 inch rubicon express super flex kit with all adjustable arms, rear trackbar as well as a front adjustable track bar , do I need to run a dropped Pittman arm and track bar bracket? Or leave it be?

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Old 07-06-2012, 10:44 PM   #2
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It is highly recommended that you change it when going with a 4-6'' susp.

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Old 07-06-2012, 10:44 PM   #3
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No to the dropped pitman arm until you get in the 6" lift range. As for the track bar it will depend if you care that the axle is not centered. Run it for awhile and see if it bothers you or not.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:55 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doclouie
No to the dropped pitman arm until you get in the 6" lift range. As for the track bar it will depend if you care that the axle is not centered. Run it for awhile and see if it bothers you or not.
So it looks like a split decision..lol...
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Old 07-07-2012, 08:01 AM   #5
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okay I ran the RE 4.5 on two of my TJ's.. you do not need a drop pitman arm in the front if you have the adj front trac bar. In the rear you can get away with the bracket but a full adj trac-bar in the rear is the better way to go.
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Old 07-07-2012, 08:21 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hums99 View Post
It is highly recommended that you change it when going with a 4-6'' susp.
Incorrect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doclouie View Post
No to the dropped pitman arm until you get in the 6" lift range.
Incorrect again.

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Originally Posted by 4Jeepn View Post
okay I ran the RE 4.5 on two of my TJ's.. you do not need a drop pitman arm in the front if you have the adj front trac bar. In the rear you can get away with the bracket but a full adj trac-bar in the rear is the better way to go.
Not necessarily incorrect, but certainly an incomplete statement.

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Originally Posted by brant View Post
So it looks like a split decision..lol...
Here's the deal.

You only run a drop pitman arm when you run a frame side drop track bar bracket. And realistically there is no sense in running a drop track bar bracket.

I would say cutting the stock single shear mount off and adding a custom fabricated double shear mount would be worthwhile anywhere above 2" of lift, although quite involved, but you still retain your stock pitman arm.

If you want a good setup, run the Currie steering with a Currie TJS or TJJ model track bar. Get them at Savvy Off-Road. You will NOT use a drop pitman arm.

In the rear you will run into issues with the stock bracket. You need a relocation bracket AND an adjustable track bar. Running the adjustable rear track bar alone causes the binding in the stock closed top bracket. Running the relocation bracket without the adjustable track bar causes binding in the stock track bar itself because it cannot rotate enough. All of this increases the stress on the stock bracket and can cause it to rip off the axle, taking the upper control arm mount with it. You can address this by adding reinforcement, either bolt on or weld on...easily fabricated from scrap.

A good option in the rear is the new Currie rear track bar, which is supposed to have a new bend to avoid gas tank interference issues, and comes with the relocation bracket. The relocation bracket even has a section to be welded to the axle housing for reinforcement. Again, this is available from Savvy Off-Road.
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Old 07-07-2012, 08:43 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UnlimitedLJ04 View Post
Incorrect.



Incorrect again.


Not necessarily incorrect, but certainly an incomplete statement.



Here's the deal.

You only run a drop pitman arm when you run a frame side drop track bar bracket. And realistically there is no sense in running a drop track bar bracket.

I would say cutting the stock single shear mount off and adding a custom fabricated double shear mount would be worthwhile anywhere above 2" of lift, although quite involved, but you still retain your stock pitman arm.

If you want a good setup, run the Currie steering with a Currie TJS or TJJ model track bar. Get them at Savvy Off-Road. You will NOT use a drop pitman arm.

In the rear you will run into issues with the stock bracket. You need a relocation bracket AND an adjustable track bar. Running the adjustable rear track bar alone causes the binding in the stock closed top bracket. Running the relocation bracket without the adjustable track bar causes binding in the stock track bar itself because it cannot rotate enough. All of this increases the stress on the stock bracket and can cause it to rip off the axle, taking the upper control arm mount with it. You can address this by adding reinforcement, either bolt on or weld on...easily fabricated from scrap.

A good option in the rear is the new Currie rear track bar, which is supposed to have a new bend to avoid gas tank interference issues, and comes with the relocation bracket. The relocation bracket even has a section to be welded to the axle housing for reinforcement. Again, this is available from Savvy Off-Road.
So this is all based on you running the RE 4.5 on your jeep then?
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Old 07-07-2012, 08:45 AM   #8
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At what height is a drop track bar bracket of some sort and a pitman needed to reduce the amount of lateral movement because of the steep Draglink and track bar angle. I would think over 4" would be getting pretty close regardless of Curries angled Drag link end and I understand that bumpstop extension is involved here too. Keeping those two components fairly horizontal has a lot to do with good on road characteristics also .I guess that after a certain height store bought steering is out the window in order to have any up travel any way. probably answered my own question
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Old 07-07-2012, 08:59 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Jeepn View Post
So this is all based on you running the RE 4.5 on your jeep then?
Lift brand does not matter, the stock short arm 4-link geometry is the same regardless.

Regarding the front:

The drop pitman arm is only too be used in conjunction with a drop track bar bracket, since the drag link and track bar must remain parallel. Many drop track bar brackets have the advantage of using a double shear style joint, but can also introduce significant complications.

here's a RE front drop track bar bracket smashing a tie-rod, with 5" long arm lift.



from here: RE Long Arm -> Front Track Bar Bracket hit Tie Rod? - JeepForum.com

You have to understand there isn't a whole lot of room between the diff cover, the axle tube and the tie-rod as the track bar comes down in full compression. Anything sitting below the stock mount, and in front of it, runs the risk of smashing into something...even at tall lift heights.

More good reading:
tj front adjustable track bars for 0-3.5", does yours hit or fit? - JeepForum.com

Regarding the rear:
Here's the closed top bracket binding I mentioned in the rear:


Here's an RE bar binding.


Any shocks longer than stock will have that problem, when used with an adjustable rear track bar alone.

Here's a bracket that's been reinforced, with a relocation bracket to prevent the above binding.



Without reinforcement, the bracket can be ripped off...


More info here:
Track bar extension bracket versus adjustable track bars? - JeepForum.com

Furthermore, I mentioned rear track bars hitting the gas tank, due to the raised location of the relocation bracket. here's an example of that:


To address this, Currie supposedly has a new bend design to avoid such interference....although I have yet to see pictures proving it so.

Again, this stuff isn't brand specific. It's basic geometry many seem to overlook...including many "trusted" companies. Which is why we as owners need to be aware, and address things accordingly.
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Old 07-07-2012, 11:37 AM   #10
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Thanks for all the info , I have a rear adjustable with bracket already and I have the front adjustable already too, I am just a newb at all this the jeep was stock two weeks ago..lol

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