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Old 05-06-2007, 03:35 PM   #1
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Headers?

Ok here is a question that will show my ignorace... what's the difference in between a "header" and a reagular exhaust manifold? My TJ is a daily driver and occasional off-road/beach cruiser. I have a crack in mine and nobody is willing to weld it. So, I shopping. I don't want to spend too much as the TJ will become a "third vehicle" soon. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance.

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Old 05-06-2007, 03:53 PM   #2
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Not sure the specifics, but headers are designed to move gases out faster increasing horsepower.

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Old 05-06-2007, 04:14 PM   #3
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For a jeep... Manifolds are crap, and headers are crap.

Omega is kinda right as a header is ment to be more free flowing, and are made of individual tubes, while a manifold is usually a single cast piece. A manifold will last just as long as a header really... and just about ever header made for the TJ are way overpriced.
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Old 05-06-2007, 04:17 PM   #4
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The TJ 4.0L comes standard with headers which is when each exhaust port has its own exhaust tube that joins the others at the collector. The 2.5L has an exhaust manifold which is a one-piece design made from cast iron.
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Old 05-06-2007, 04:22 PM   #5
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So my jeep with a 4.0 has a header? Is there any benefit from upgrading then?
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Old 05-06-2007, 04:31 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omega_TJ_06 View Post
So my jeep with a 4.0 has a header? Is there any benefit from upgrading then?
As stated earlier, yes. If you have an early '97-99 header, they are prone to cracking and replace them with a newer crack-resistant design. Borla not being one of the better ones, they crack and are overly expensive too. Performance-wise, none of the aftermarket headers offer enough additional performance to make me want one.
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Old 05-06-2007, 04:52 PM   #7
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what engine size do you have? like stated before the 4.0L has stock headers and the 2.5L does not, I always look at replacing my stock manifold and exhaust system when I get a new rig. not only do they make it sound good but they open the engine up for a little boost of HP. I bought a cheap pacesetter header for my 2.5, I figured that my manifold has a crack and is leaking and the pacesetter has a three year warrenty on it.
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Old 05-06-2007, 05:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
As stated earlier, yes. If you have an early '97-99 header, they are prone to cracking and replace them with a newer crack-resistant design. Borla not being one of the better ones, they crack and are overly expensive too. Performance-wise, none of the aftermarket headers offer enough additional performance to make me want one.
I ruled out Borla due to the price. So is this as good as anything else?


http://www.jeep4x4center.com/popup.asp?number=17660.01

Or is this design with the "flex tube" better?

http://www.1aauto.com/1A/ExhaustMani...EK00001/400489

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Old 05-06-2007, 07:31 PM   #9
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I have a 2006 with the 4.0. I am not looking to upgrade and doubt I will, I just didn't realize I had headers and not a manifold. I would rather put my money into other things. Actually I have only looked under the hood like 3 times.
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Old 05-06-2007, 09:13 PM   #10
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Basic difference

Header - made of bent pipe, usually steel



Manifold - made from a block of iron that gets cut little by little or liquid hot metal poured into a tamplet

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Old 05-06-2007, 09:28 PM   #11
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what year tj do you have.. hooker headers have a sexy header design
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Old 05-06-2007, 11:35 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omega_TJ_06 View Post
I have a 2006 with the 4.0. I am not looking to upgrade and doubt I will, I just didn't realize I had headers and not a manifold. I would rather put my money into other things. Actually I have only looked under the hood like 3 times.
Omega I'm not trying to rip on you just want to put this out there:
there can be lots of reasons to upgrade for example:

1. sound quality (if you care)
2. cooler engine (heatwise)
3. improved HP
4. stock manifold's crack and wear over time (faster than headers)
and
5. better flow efficiency

and if you have the money and want a really good system for the 4.0 look into the banks headers, they are very nice. put one in my dodge when I had it and was very impressed.
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Old 05-07-2007, 12:22 AM   #13
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foxinthemudd how durable are those headers? I'm still wondering why doenst any one make some other design than the regulars short 6-2-1 or 6-1 "flexible" designs.. perhaps 6-3-1 or 6-2-1 long or the 6-1 designs are much more durable and dont crack as easily.

My quick paint sketch
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Old 05-07-2007, 07:55 AM   #14
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Triple88a, so I guess since my '99 TJ has headers and not an iron manifold it COULD be welded. Maybe since I told the muffler shop I had a manifold and not headers he said it couldn't be welded? On the other hand... he could ave been trying to to sucker me into the $700 quote for a new one.

Thanks for the education.
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Old 05-07-2007, 08:09 AM   #15
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You should be able to weld it.. just remember before you give it to the welder shop make sure you use a little dremel or a hand drill with a grinder and clean up the metal first.. most welders dont even bother and just weld it on top of all the rust and gui and the weld only caches on the cracked place it self and falls off in couple of weeks and you gotta get it redone..
dremel grinding wheel ~ size is smaller than your pinter finger

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Old 05-07-2007, 09:05 AM   #16
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foxinthemudd how durable are those headers? I'm still wondering why doenst any one make some other design than the regulars short 6-2-1 or 6-1 "flexible" designs.. perhaps 6-3-1 or 6-2-1 long or the 6-1 designs are much more durable and dont crack as easily.

My quick paint sketch
The Gale Banks? they are very durable, however I don't know what you mean by flexable though. I don't think I've ever heard of a header being flexable. gale banks is a really good header system there are a few others that make good systems for the 4.0 I guess. I've used gibson and gale banks in my vehicles and have loved them. others I've heard of are hooker and borla, but from what friends have told me you want to get the ceramic coated ones because it will keep the engine cooler.
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Old 05-07-2007, 07:03 PM   #17
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flexible tj manifold...this manifolds flexible material looks like it has balls.. i've seen those things a lot thinner.
http://www.quadratec.com/products/27601_06_07.htm
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Old 05-07-2007, 07:15 PM   #18
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The headers sold without the flexible headers like in your "FLEX" example Triple88a and the above photo tend to crack.

And welding them where they crack is almost a certain guarantee it will just crack again right next to the crack. I would not waste my time welding a cracked header designed for a TJ where engine torque is the cause of the cracking.

I've sure seen a lot of happy installers of replacement headers sold on eBay that look identical to the above photo but at a much reduced price. I'd look on eBay for a set of headers with the flexible bellows before deciding, that is for sure.
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Old 05-07-2007, 07:32 PM   #19
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P.S. Check out the link discussing an eBay replacement header at http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=410212
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Old 05-07-2007, 08:10 PM   #20
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thats why the piping needs to be longer before it gets the first weld to the next pipe otherwise the weld gets most of the torquing while with longer piping the engine torquing is lowered where it wont crack the weld
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Old 05-07-2007, 09:07 PM   #21
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what is the point of "flex" manifolds? since they all connect to each other wouldn't one just follow the other? I would just rather have all my pipes connect up so I wouldn't have to worry about the slowing of the exhaust caused by the folds of the tubes.
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Old 05-07-2007, 09:09 PM   #22
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I just replaced mine with the Ebay header. I was surprised at the quality of it and the welds. Others using these have been very happy with it as well. Can't beat it for $70 and some change shipped.
I did the work and while I was at it I cleaned some stuff up.



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Old 05-07-2007, 10:35 PM   #23
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Wow what did you use to clean the intake manifold with? Thats probably the cleanest intake manifold i've ever seen in a TJ.

BTW any guide or write up you used to replace the exhaust manifold?
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Old 05-08-2007, 05:50 AM   #24
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That's high heat paint. No way I was able to get it that clean. LOL
Here's a link to a write up:
dailydriventj.com

I just followed the service manual. Just to make sure there was not anything out of the ordinary, and there isn't.
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Old 05-18-2007, 03:24 AM   #25
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The purpose of any exhaust manifold is to redirect the hot combustion products to a turbocharger or some other component of the engine, it is usually a single cast iron... While a Jeep Header work through giving every exhaust cylinder their own small version of exhaust piping to improve the air intake and exhaust operation. The piping pushes the exhaust pulsing away from the cylinder head and then off into the downstream exhaust collector. They also limit the backpressure to make the exhaust flow easier and faster exhaust of gases means more horsepower... Nice header pics by the way...
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Old 05-18-2007, 09:24 AM   #26
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After making a 200 mile trip to the coast of texas, my header ripped apart right below the collector and right above the flange. this was expected to happen, just not during the trip. But having several other cracks on the header already i had been planning to replace it any way. The best on i could find in my opinion was the one offered on quadratec.com by Rugged Ridge. You can find it all over but quadratec actually had it in stock and shipped in 3 days. Now i know that the pictures online don't always reflect the exact product but the pics on quadratecs website are seemed to be pretty accurate. Most of the headers out there for our model jeep are pieced together out of several smaller pipes. Look a Borla and Banks and on the individual tubes you can see some have been put together and welded. Not only does the rugged ridge have solid tubes for each pipe going to the collector but if you compare even the flange is thicker. Another big difference i the way the pipes are joined together. The origianl header on your jeep joins all 6 tubes at once. Then pray that they were able to weld really good in the middle of the tubes (This is were i found another hole about the size of a dime). Just by looking at the pics you can see that the rugged ridge first joins 3 tubes into a smaller collector. Then it joins the two smaller collectors into a larger one. This makes it easier to get around all the tubes to make sure that they were welded good. OH! AND........ the rugged ridge is way cheaper giving you three different prices and finishes.

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