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Old 01-06-2013, 02:08 AM   #1
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I bit mad after muddin tonight

Went out 4 wheelin got stuck in some ruts that were to deep, and then it happend. My front driver side tire and rear pass side tire spining. ( in 4 low ) It never switched. I thought the 4wd systems in 05 unlimited are to transfer power to other wheels if starting to slip. I had it in 4 low let the clutch out in first gear wheels spinning me jumping wildly on bumpers. I think if power switched to other wheels I would have got out. In stead I had to be pulled out. Why would it do this.

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Old 01-06-2013, 02:16 AM   #2
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You need some lockers

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Old 01-06-2013, 02:22 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuruYaekob
You need some lockers
This.
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:25 AM   #4
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Old 01-06-2013, 05:40 AM   #5
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Without lockers, power will be transferred to the path of least resistance. Sucks, but that is reality.
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Old 01-06-2013, 06:31 AM   #6
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With open diffs, you can get deive to TWO wheels in the loose stuff. That is one more than a vehicle that drives one axle.

Seriously, though, you don't know how to drive offroad. I could tell by your description of getting stuck. Driving offroad is a different skill that has little in common with driving on pavement. It is not obvious and very few Jeep owners actually know how it is done unless they either take a 4WD driving course (the preferred way) or someone with years of experience is willing to spend a few days teaching them.
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Old 01-06-2013, 06:41 AM   #7
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Lockers would have done the trick, LJ Rubi! Did you try braking while the rear tire was spinning? This will force the engine to apply more torque to the system, to the free wheeling & stuck tires.
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Old 01-06-2013, 06:51 AM   #8
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+1 on apply brakes and send power to wheel with traction.
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Old 01-06-2013, 08:05 AM   #9
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With open diffs, you can get deive to TWO wheels in the loose stuff. That is one more than a vehicle that drives one axle.
It doesn't quite work that way. Open differentials in our rigs ALWAYS split the torque 50/50 no matter what and it's impossible if the differential is viable for it to be any other way.

The reason that folks incorrectly think that an axle is 1 wheel drive is that in order to have torque, you must have resistance and the wheel that takes the least amount of resistance to spin is the one that is determining the amount of torque being developed and delivered to the non spinning wheel.

Think about it this way. If you take a floor jack and lift one side of the rear axle so the tire is in the air, it takes very few foot pounds of torque to spin it and that very few is exactly how much the tire on the ground is getting. Make no mistake though, they are both getting the same amount which does in fact make it 2 wheel drive per axle.
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Old 01-06-2013, 08:05 AM   #10
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+1 on apply brakes and send power to wheel with traction.
You can't send power anywhere with an open diff.
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Old 01-06-2013, 08:30 AM   #11
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For the benefit of the ignorant (like me) who dont know the jargon. Let me seek clarification:

"Lockers" are the cute name for Locking Differentials, right?

Are thse in any way different from "Limited Slip" differentials which most twd light truck drivers are more familiar with.

My understanding (again, admitedly minimal) is that a
"normal" 2wd vehicle has power to both drive-axle wheels when driving do cornerwn the road. However, when you make a sharp turn, the outter wheel travels further than the inner wheel (geometry). When the inner wheel turns slower, the differential disengages that wheel. If both wheels continued to turn at the same rate while trying to turn....that would be harmful. Andother demonstration of this is "peeling out" on a slick street...only one wheel spins, and the car kinda fish-tails a little towards the spinning wheel since it has traction and power and the other side is along for the ride.

2wd with "Limited Slip Differential" works as above and disengages the inner wheel during a turn. But a special fluid in the differential engages a kind of clutch in the differential when it detects "slip or spin" in one wheel...sending power to and equalizing both drive wheels. When limited slip differential fluid gets old and its viscocity breaks down, you will hear a clanking from your differential during slow, sharp turns...replace the fluid with new Limited Slip Fluid. In this scenario, when you impersonate a 16 year old and "peel out" on a wet street, you get momentary slippage in one wheel but the other wheel locks in and minimizes "fish tailing".

Thats where my knowledge and experience...ends.

Lets "pretend" that I dont know diddly about 4wd. What are "Lockers" ?

I dont even want to talk about the difference between 4wd and Awd. I know they are very different critters...but my coffee hasnt kicked in yet, so I can only wrap my brain around so much right now.

THX all.
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:09 AM   #12
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Lockers are either automatic ( like a Detroit ) or manual ( ARB or OX ). They literally LOCK the differential for a 100% positive lock, applying power to both wheels of the axle with no built-in 'slip' as with a Limited Slip differential.

If one wheel is in the air, you still have power applied to the wheel on the ground.

Here is a good video that explains differences between open/LSD and locking diffs



Look up some locker videos on You Tube and let the illustrations help you better understand how they work other than the one I posted above
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:28 AM   #13
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Modern day traction control uses open diffs, what it does is use the antilock brake controller to actually apply the brake on the wheel the computer sees spinning much faster than the others. This is a mediocre and cheap way of doing it, as it also is like trying to drive with the brakes on, so if you other wheel has minimal traction, and the spinning wheel has the brakes on, it's not going to help much. I did not see how old your Jeep was, but more than likely it does not have traction control. Another issue is some manufactures disable the antilock braking system when in four wheel drive. Long and short of it, as others have said you need a limited slip (I've had a couple before, don't work all that great) or a locker (works better, but will change how you can steer sometimes)
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Old 01-06-2013, 10:11 AM   #14
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It happens... Good news for you that you have an LJ with a D44. I had to wait until I had enough money for a rear axle swap before I locked it.

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Old 01-06-2013, 10:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vroooom View Post

My understanding (again, admitedly minimal) is that a
"normal" 2wd vehicle has power to both drive-axle wheels when driving do cornerwn the road. However, when you make a sharp turn, the outter wheel travels further than the inner wheel (geometry). When the inner wheel turns slower, the differential disengages that wheel. If both wheels continued to turn at the same rate while trying to turn....that would be harmful. Andother demonstration of this is "peeling out" on a slick street...only one wheel spins, and the car kinda fish-tails a little towards the spinning wheel since it has traction and power and the other side is along for the ride.
No, the differential does NOT disengage that wheel. It allows differentiation of wheel rotations. What is happening in your case is you are trying to make a differential work by looking at the results of how it works instead of understanding that how it works produces the results you see.

On an equal traction surface trying to do a burn-out with an open diff, if you notice, the wheel that spins is almost always opposite the side with the most weight transfer from motor torque. If you watch drag race videos where the front lifts, they are rarely level and one side is much higher. The opposite corner from the high side has the most weight transfer, the other side of that axle would spin if the diff was open.

The other thing that is being overlooked is that the total rotation of the tires will always be equal to the input of the driveshaft. If the driveshaft were to do 4 revolutions and the wheels turned 1, if you stopped one tire, the other would have to do 2. Also why 1 spinning tire seems to be turning a fair bit faster.

[/QUOTE]
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:06 AM   #16
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Thanks for the info. The trail I was on was one of my old fishin trails. Someone had come through and dug the trails out pretty bad. My mess up was rolling down the trail like I normally do and not having 35in tires.

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