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Old 03-31-2013, 08:42 AM   #1
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Low COG help

What's up guys! Spring is in the air up here in New England, and I'm giddy like a school girl! Top is going down, and I can finally start all the work I've been planning for months. I digress......
My plan is a low COG on my '04. I'm 99% sure I'm going w/ a nice OME from Dirk @ DPGOFFROAD . My question, finally, is on the subject of an SYE/ tummy tuck. Can I drop a SYE and a new CV drive shaft @ my stock height, and still have it work when I eventually do my lift? I'd really love to do an SYE and drive shaft now, plus a nice tummy tuck, and do my lift next year...... Tax returns!! I really want to get rid of that "shovel", and I hate T-case drops.
I realize I'm going to have to do a BL to make the tummy tuck work, but my big question is will that drive shaft be compatible w/ stock, vs. the OME lift. I'm too poor to buy sh*t twice!
I'm planning on spitballing this w/ dirk, but I appreciate ideas from my fellow forum members, you guys are awesome!

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Old 03-31-2013, 08:52 AM   #2
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Until then, there will be a lot of fun W/ this! Love.

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Old 03-31-2013, 09:00 AM   #3
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Oh yeah, Happy Easter everyone.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:08 AM   #4
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Take back the dupli color and get rustoleum. You'll thank me later
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:08 AM   #5
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Crickets......
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:10 AM   #6
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I know, I have no patience. I'm waiting for Jerry or Unlimited to chime in.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:12 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaxon1023
Take back the dupli color and get rustoleum. You'll thank me later
I appreciate the advise! Everyone said rustoleum, but I figured I'd zig when everyone else zagged. Have you tried both??
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:16 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by cchartrand

I appreciate the advise! Everyone said rustoleum, but I figured I'd zig when everyone else zagged. Have you tried both??
This is getting a bit off topic, but I love feedback. The Rustoleum was a lot cheaper. No love for the Duplicolor??
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:26 AM   #9
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You could install a SYE & CV driveshaft on a stock height TJ or one with a short suspension lift but you'd need to have the new CV driveshaft lengthened later when a taller suspension lift is installed. There would be no benefit to installing them before the suspension lift is installed and it would cost more since you'd have to pay extra to get the driveshaft lengthened when the taller suspension lift was installed.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:35 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford
You could install a SYE & CV driveshaft on a stock height TJ but you'd need to have the new CV driveshaft lengthened later when a suspension lift is installed. There would be no benefit to installing them before the suspension lift is installed and it would cost more since you'd have to pay extra to get the driveshaft lengthened when the suspension lift was installed.
Thanks Jerry! I needed to pick your brain. My thought, the OME is only a modest 2" lift. I'm not against doing fender/ bump stop work. Is there really a huge difference between stock, and a 2" lift, as far as drive shaft is concerned? W/ that little lift, I was hoping to max the collapsed length on stock, and be good w/ my mild lift. Thoughts?
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:35 AM   #11
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Being one who has researched but not done my setup yet I cannot give you the golden answer, however I'm pretty sure you're going to want to sort out the spring setup and placement of the T-case prior to getting a driveshaft.

When you say low COG, how much lift are you thinking? I'm intending to run 2" max, tuck the belly flat with a custom skid without a BL(if I can get it there, which I think I can), and run 33" tires. The amount of work and money involved to set it up properly go beyond the installation of a "lift" so be sure to give the info on what exactly you mean by LCOG.

As for the duplicolor vs rustoleum I went with rustoleum simply because the majority of folks here state that it works out better. I'm going to use it for my flares which I might just do today since the weather is nice.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:36 AM   #12
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And you got your answer whilst I was typing.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:44 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cchartrand View Post
Thanks Jerry! I needed to pick your brain. My thought, the OME is only a modest 2" lift. I'm not against doing fender/ bump stop work. Is there really a huge difference between stock, and a 2" lift, as far as drive shaft is concerned? W/ that little lift, I was hoping to max the collapsed length on stock, and be good w/ my mild lift. Thoughts?
First, I slightly editted my prior response to include the slightly taller 2" OME suspension lift. For stock to 2" of suspension lift height, I just wouldn't spend the $$$ for a SYE kit & CV driveshaft. For a 2" lift, you could install a 1" motor mount lift to eliminate any possible vibrations. You could also just drop the transfer case skidplate 1/2" to 5/8" with washers around the skidplate bolts but the 1" MML would be better since it wouldn't cause a loss of ground clearance. You would only need to raise the fan shroud on the radiator an inch (drill new 1" lower mounting bolt holes in the shroud) to match the 1" taller engine fan height caused by the 1" MML.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:45 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UFOtestpilot
Being one who has researched but not done my setup yet I cannot give you the golden answer, however I'm pretty sure you're going to want to sort out the spring setup and placement of the T-case prior to getting a driveshaft.

When you say low COG, how much lift are you thinking? I'm intending to run 2" max, tuck the belly flat with a custom skid without a BL(if I can get it there, which I think I can), and run 33" tires. The amount of work and money involved to set it up properly go beyond the installation of a "lift" so be sure to give the info on what exactly you mean by LCOG.

As for the duplicolor vs rustoleum I went with rustoleum simply because the majority of folks here state that it works out better. I'm going to use it for my flares which I might just do today since the weather is nice.
Word brother! You're right in my wheelhouse! I'm looking for minimum lift/ maximum clearance. From my research, I've done a ton, you need to bump up your body to make room for the tummy tuck.
I'm looking @ 33's. A modest body lift, mainly for the tummy tuck, and a 2" <- stated , OME lift. Fender work, and bump stops won't be an issue...... I'll hack and slash! Thoughts?!??
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:48 AM   #15
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A 2" suspension lift doesn't provide enough clearance for 33" tires. At a minimum you need 3" of additional clearance but 4" is strongly recommended for offroading with 33" tires. You can add a 1" or 1.2" body lift to gain that minimum of 1" more clearance to work with the 2" OME suspension lift. I wouldn't go for a 2" body lift, they cause more problems during the installation than they are worth.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:54 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford
First, I slightly editted my prior response to include the slightly taller 2" OME suspension lift. For stock to 2" of suspension lift height, I just wouldn't spend the $$$ for a SYE kit & CV driveshaft. For a 2" lift, you could install a 1" motor mount lift to eliminate any possible vibrations. You could also just drop the transfer case skidplate 1/2" to 5/8" with washers around the skidplate bolts but the 1" MML would be better since it wouldn't cause a loss of ground clearance. You would only need to raise the fan shroud on the radiator an inch (drill new 1" lower mounting bolt holes in the shroud) to match the 1" taller engine fan height caused by the 1" MML.
Thanks Jerry! You're the s**t! That's kind of where I was at, but needed some input. In my opinion, which is worth s**t.... Do your research, and don't buy s**t you DONT need! Whats your thought on Brown Dog MML's? Worth the money? I love American made stuff, so I'll probably pop for them anyway. Just curious.
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Old 03-31-2013, 10:02 AM   #17
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Oh yeah. Zone,And probably others, sell cams to adjust rear pinion angle. worth it w/ my small lift???
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Old 03-31-2013, 10:10 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford
A 2" suspension lift doesn't provide enough clearance for 33" tires. At a minimum you need 3" of additional clearance but 4" is strongly recommended for offroading with 33" tires. You can add a 1" or 1.2" body lift to gain that minimum of 1" more clearance to work with the 2" OME suspension lift. I wouldn't go for a 2" body lift, they cause more problems during the installation than they are worth.
I totally agree Jerry. Big picture on my end..... OME lift, modest BL, hacking/ slashing of fenders, and steering stop adjustments= 33's. I do want to get rid of that shovel though. That skid just hangs so damn low. I'm actually more intent on getting rid of that skid, than I am of lifting.
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Old 03-31-2013, 10:12 AM   #19
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Whats your thought on Brown Dog MML's? Worth the money? I love American made stuff, so I'll probably pop for them anyway. Just curious.
There are only two brands of MMLs I would install which would be M.O.R.E.'s "Bombproof" or Brown Dog. Just make sure to stick with rubber, polyurethane mounts transmit engine vibrations into the passenger compartment. Both of those companies offer rubber versions which will outlast a Jeep.
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Old 03-31-2013, 10:19 AM   #20
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Sorry Jerry. I hate asking questions I already know the answers to, but I do a metric assload of research before I lay my money down. Thanks for your expertise.
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Old 03-31-2013, 10:20 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cchartrand View Post

Word brother! You're right in my wheelhouse! I'm looking for minimum lift/ maximum clearance. From my research, I've done a ton, you need to bump up your body to make room for the tummy tuck.
I'm looking @ 33's. A modest body lift, mainly for the tummy tuck, and a 2" <- stated , OME lift. Fender work, and bump stops won't be an issue...... I'll hack and slash! Thoughts?!??
I've measured mine and I think I can massage the tunnel a little to get the little extra room I need, if not I'll run a 1/2"-1" BL to get it. Novak cable is mandatory and the SYE/shaft will be necessary to get the T-case up there. I will run the Metal Cloak overline fenders prior to installing 33" tires, but you could DIY a high line if you want to cut stuff.

This is what I have based on researching how to do what I intend to do. As I stated earlier I have NOT done it, but I will get it to work. I could actually run 33" with stock suspension height but I'm going to use the extra 1.5" in spring compression.
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Old 03-31-2013, 10:42 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by UFOtestpilot

I've measured mine and I think I can massage the tunnel a little to get the little extra room I need, if not I'll run a 1/2"-1" BL to get it. Novak cable is mandatory and the SYE/shaft will be necessary to get the T-case up there. I will run the Metal Cloak overline fenders prior to installing 33" tires, but you could DIY a high line if you want to cut stuff.

This is what I have based on researching how to do what I intend to do. As I stated earlier I have NOT done it, but I will get it to work. I could actually run 33" with stock suspension height but I'm going to use the extra 1.5" in spring compression.
Love it brother! That's kind of where I'm at. Keep me posted. I'm thinking maybe Metacloaks? Research, research, research!!! I really appreciate your input. This goes back to my original question.... Tummy tuck, a priority. SYE is mandatory w/ 2" lift , modest BL , and tummy tuck. Is drive shaft length going to work w/ stock setup, vs. new setup?
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Old 03-31-2013, 10:54 AM   #23
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Keep any thoughts you guys have coming! That being said, I'm calling Tom woods. Between Tom and Dirk I'll get the answers I need. I'll keep you guys posted! Thanks for all your help. Just wanted to spitball it W/ my WF brothers.
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Old 03-31-2013, 11:16 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by cchartrand

Love it brother! That's kind of where I'm at. Keep me posted. I'm thinking maybe Metacloaks? Research, research, research!!! I really appreciate your input. This goes back to my original question.... Tummy tuck, a priority. SYE is mandatory w/ 2" lift , modest BL , and tummy tuck. Is drive shaft length going to work w/ stock setup, vs. new setup?
When are you going to pull the trigger? I'd love to hear how it all works out for you! You're doing what I'm thinking, and if the "wheels fall off the bus", I'd like to know why. You are my guinea pig!!!😝
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Old 03-31-2013, 11:19 AM   #25
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Sorry, that last post was meant for UFOtestpilot........my bad.
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Old 03-31-2013, 11:30 AM   #26
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Well, when I had my old TJ I had a 2.5" setup over stock and for all the essentials (I hadnt tucked my tcase yet) I spent $320 bucks.

Seriously look on the classifieds on here, Jeep Forum and Pirate 4x4 for some good deals on lightly used parts.

Also, youll thank me later if you run a 3" front coil and a nice progressive 2.5" coil in the rear, the added length up front will settle close to a 2.5, and give you that flat, no rake look. Theres a pretty good chunk of change to be saved here..
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Old 03-31-2013, 01:42 PM   #27
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Thanks my friend! Nice little piece of advice. Will do!
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Old 04-01-2013, 09:30 AM   #28
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cchartrand, here is my experience. I just recently installed the Ultra High clearance UCF skid on my 2004 wrangler on stock suspension, this included a brown dog 1in motor mount lift, JKS 1.25in body lift and lopro transmission mount. With the tuck I had driveline vibes. I ended up having to lower the skid an inch to get the vibes to go away while I save up for an SYE/Driveshaft. I plan to lift the Jeep (more than likely with OME as well) in the future. Some driveshaft companies, like Tom Woods, only charge a small fee to lengthen a drive shaft (something like $60-$70) so you could always have that done when your lift gets put on.

So depending on what tuck you go with, you may or may not need an SYE/shaft right away. If I had gone with the standard tuck skid fro UCF I more than likely would not have had vibes and could have waited to get an SYE when I lifted it. It still comes down to a Jeep by Jeep basis though. You may be able to run the same setup I am with no vibes. I'm hoping to have my driveshaft ordered by the end of the week so I can get rid of my 1in spacer and be fully tucked. GL!
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Old 04-01-2013, 10:28 AM   #29
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If I was you... I'd get the lift first. Then buy the sye/cv after you determine how much tummy tuck you want/need. And Dirk is a great guy btw! Bought his ultimate lift this past summer. Great stuff and have been more than happy with it.
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Old 04-07-2013, 12:09 PM   #30
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There are only two brands of MMLs I would install which would be M.O.R.E.'s "Bombproof" or Brown Dog. Just make sure to stick with rubber, polyurethane mounts transmit engine vibrations into the passenger compartment. Both of those companies offer rubber versions which will outlast a Jeep.
Thanks for the mention, Jerry

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