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View Poll Results: BLACK DIAMOND OR 4WD HARDWARE
BLACK DIAMOND 3" COIL KIT 7 77.78%
4WD HARDWARE 3" COIL KIT 2 22.22%
Voters: 9. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-31-2009, 08:41 PM   #1
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suspension debating begins OPINIONS NEEDED!!

Ok so I came up with a budget of $600. And Im not settling for less than 3inch coil lift. The two kits I found that fall in that $$ range is the Black diamond 3" coil kit, and the 4WD Hardware 3" coil kit.

Has anyone had any experience with either of the two.

Heres a list of the product details.

BLACK DIAMOND-
4 AT SHOCKS W/BOOTS
4 EXTENDED LENGTH COIL SPRINGS
EXTENDED SWAY BAR LINKS
TRANSFER CASE LOWERING KIT
REAR TRACK BAR RELOCATION KIT
POLY BUMP STOPS
AND INSTALLATION HARDWARE

PRICE $594.99


4WD HARDWARE
4 COIL SPRINGS
4 SHOCKS WITH BOOTS
FRONT SWAY BAR DISCONNECTS
REAR SWAY BAR LINKS
REAR TRACK BAR RELOCATION KIT
BUMP STOP EXTENSIONS
DROP PITMAN ARM
TRANSFER CASE LOWERING KIT

PRICE $659.99


THE 4WD IS 60 OVER BUDGET, BUT IM WILLING TO CASH IN THE PIGGY BANK CHANGE IF ITS A BETTER KIT. AND ALSO THE 4WD KIT COMES WITH MORE STUFF...THE SWAY BAR DISCONNECTS, AND THE PITMAN ARM.

IM PLANNING ON BUYING THIS WITHIN THE WEEK SO ANY HELP WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.

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Old 03-31-2009, 09:04 PM   #2
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Old man Emu kit from DPG?


ok seriously I have no vote or experience with either. but i love my OME kit and would bet it's better and fits the same size tires then both of those.

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Old 03-31-2009, 09:12 PM   #3
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problem with that is its 1/2 smaller than what i want and 100 dollars over what my budget is.
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Old 03-31-2009, 09:20 PM   #4
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and a million times better, with eighthundred thousand times more flex.


like i said though, I can't offer a good opinion here.
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:55 AM   #5
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Um.. you know you have other picks right.. you may want to look at this link and see what else is there....

0-3.5" Lifts -
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:16 AM   #6
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I would look into the following before those...
Full Traction 3" Economy Kit
Terflex 3"
OME kit
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:50 AM   #7
that's what she said

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Jeepn View Post
Um.. you know you have other picks right.. you may want to look at this link and see what else is there....

0-3.5" Lifts -

if it helps at all, i have purchased from them before and they are a great company to deal with.



as for how i voted, i'd go w/ the 4WD kit. it is only $60 more but it seems like a more complete kit. you'll drop way more than $60 if you get discos and a drop pitman.
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Old 04-01-2009, 11:11 AM   #8
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Ive got a drop pitman for a 4 inch you can have. If thatll help. I am not sure if its compatible with a 3 inch lift.
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Old 04-01-2009, 11:15 AM   #9
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You typically do not need a Drop Pitman Arm for a 3" kit and sometimes don't need for the 4" kits.

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Old 04-01-2009, 11:18 AM   #10
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Save your money and get what you want.
When you start you don't stop. That is Jeep thing
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:23 PM   #11
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id never install a kit that makes me install a dropped pittman arm..

the 4wd kit is like the procomp kit.. research some on both of them.. i care for neither of them

dirk from DPG knows his stuff.. IMO save up the extra 100 bucks.. the kit does sit a tad bit higher than stated

from what EVERYONE has stated.. the OME 2.5'' coils give you over 3'' of lift..
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:24 PM   #12
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Rubicon Express has a nice setup too.
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:27 PM   #13
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Rubicon Express has a nice setup too.
yes they do..

OME nitrocharger and RE monotubes are great shocks too.. ive ridden in rigs with both and i run RE monotubes under mine

oh you forgot to add a neither option to your poll
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:30 PM   #14
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yes they do..

OME nitrocharger and RE monotubes are great shocks too.. ive ridden in rigs with both and i run RE monotubes under mine

oh you forgot to add a neither option to your poll
I love the RE SuperFlex and RE monotube shocks I have. Awesome setup!
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:30 PM   #15
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Ok so I came up with a budget of $600. And Im not settling for less than 3inch coil lift. The two kits I found that fall in that $$ range is the Black diamond 3" coil kit, and the 4WD Hardware 3" coil kit.

Has anyone had any experience with either of the two.

Heres a list of the product details.

BLACK DIAMOND-
4 AT SHOCKS W/BOOTS
4 EXTENDED LENGTH COIL SPRINGS
EXTENDED SWAY BAR LINKS
TRANSFER CASE LOWERING KIT
REAR TRACK BAR RELOCATION KIT
POLY BUMP STOPS
AND INSTALLATION HARDWARE

PRICE $594.99


4WD HARDWARE
4 COIL SPRINGS
4 SHOCKS WITH BOOTS
FRONT SWAY BAR DISCONNECTS
REAR SWAY BAR LINKS
REAR TRACK BAR RELOCATION KIT
BUMP STOP EXTENSIONS
DROP PITMAN ARM
TRANSFER CASE LOWERING KIT

PRICE $659.99


THE 4WD IS 60 OVER BUDGET, BUT IM WILLING TO CASH IN THE PIGGY BANK CHANGE IF ITS A BETTER KIT. AND ALSO THE 4WD KIT COMES WITH MORE STUFF...THE SWAY BAR DISCONNECTS, AND THE PITMAN ARM.

IM PLANNING ON BUYING THIS WITHIN THE WEEK SO ANY HELP WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.
Red Baron, no matter which of those kits you install, neither require a dropped Pitman arm. In fact, a dropped Pitman arm should NOT (!!!) be installed the way those kits are equipped. Doing so will, no exaggeration or rumor, simply cause bump steer which is where your steering is forced left/right as you drive over bumps/dips in the road. Believe me, you do not want bump steer.

The ONLY time a dropped Pitman arm should be installed on a Wrangler TJ is when there is a corresponding drop for the upper trackbar mount which neither of those kits have. If the Pitman arm is dropped, so must the trackbar be. If the trackbar is not dropped, neither can the Pitman arm... they must remain parallel to each other to prevent bump steer.

Older Jeeps like CJs and YJs generally always needed dropped Pitman arms but the TJ has an improved steering geometry design where a dropped Pitman arm is seldom needed. And unless it is specifically needed, a dropped Pitman arm should never be installed.

P.S. I voted for the Black Diamond simply because I believe the 4WD kit is only more expensive due to the unneeded dropped Pitman arm.
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:33 PM   #16
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Red Baron, no matter which of those kits you install, neither require a dropped Pitman arm. In fact, a dropped Pitman arm should NOT (!!!) be installed the way those kits are equipped. Doing so will, no exaggeration or rumor, simply cause bump steer which is where your steering is forced left/right as you drive over bumps/dips in the road. Believe me, you do not want bump steer.

The ONLY time a dropped Pitman arm should be installed on a Wrangler TJ is when there is a corresponding drop for the upper trackbar mount which neither of those kits have. If the Pitman arm is dropped, so must the trackbar be. If the trackbar is not dropped, neither can the Pitman arm... they must remain parallel to each other to prevent bump steer.

Older Jeeps like CJs and YJs generally always needed dropped Pitman arms but the TJ has an improved steering geometry design where a dropped Pitman arm is seldom needed. And unless it is specifically needed, a dropped Pitman arm should never be installed.

thanks again jerry for supporting my brief statement with far more detail
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:33 PM   #17
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Don't spend that kind of money on a subpar lift. Either save your money for something that will last and is more complete or throw some 2" pucks and a body lift on there for now until all of your funds come in.

I see more people replacing lift kits and wishing they had gone a different route or with a better kit. Save up and do it right the first time.
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:35 PM   #18
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Old 04-01-2009, 12:58 PM   #19
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x3.. some of us learned the hard way.. spent an initial 320 bucks on my 2'' lift.. since then im about the same height minus my bl.. added acos bc the front sagged.. leveled the rear out with acos after taking the 2'' coils from the rear.. they didnt sag at all..

i have about 1k in suspension parts since i bought the procomp coil/shocks.. which consist of a rear trackbar mount, jks trackbar, bl/mml (mml took my vibes away with no tc drop) extended swaybar endlinks, front discos, and new shocks bc the procomp ones blew
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:31 PM   #20
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Ok so first I would like to thank everyone with all the help and advice.
Now a few more questions....

1) If I decide to go to a 4in coil lift do you think my jeep will look like a rollerskate with 32" tires??

2) If I decide on going 4 inches will the SYE an CV shaft be a must, and what about brake lines??


Reason for asking is because I've been thinking this over for a while now and my eventual goal will be to run 35's. So Im thinking I could run the 4 in with my 32's until next spring/summer when Im ready to get the 35's, then I'll throw in a 1" or 2" BL for some extra clearance.

The more I think about it the more Im willing to do like some said and just wait a while more and save more for a better kit.
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:50 PM   #21
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I always vote for brake lines BEFORE they become an issue.

with a 4" SYE and Shaft are the best way to not have to drop the t case.

call Dirk at DPG. He's set up guys with a 2.5"OME kit, 1.25" BL 1" mml and they run 35" tires with long travel shocks and proper bump stops.

Also, if you do the BL MML combo you can get away without SYE or t case drop.
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:57 PM   #22
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1) If I decide to go to a 4in coil lift do you think my jeep will look like a rollerskate with 32" tires?? NO

2) If I decide on going 4 inches will the SYE an CV shaft be a must, and what about brake lines?? Depends


Reason for asking is because I've been thinking this over for a while now and my eventual goal will be to run 35's. So Im thinking I could run the 4 in with my 32's until next spring/summer when Im ready to get the 35's, then I'll throw in a 1" or 2" BL for some extra clearance.
I have an RE 3.5" lift and it came close to 4" and I'm running 32's. Looks just fine. As for the SYE, it depends. You can run a t-case drop, but you just lost the clearance you installed the lift for. A better option would be getting rear upper adjustable arms so as to be ready for that SYE in the future. In the mean time you could use the arms to set your rear pinion angle to rid yourself of the vibes or just do a small t-case drop.

I was pretty much in your situation and went the whole way at once so that I don't have to spend even more in the end. I bought my kit and the SYE as a package from 4x4groupbuy with the goal of 35's later on... plans changed and I'm wanting to jump to 37's next. So do what you WANT in as few steps as possible, because it's only going to cost you more in the long run.... Ask Scout how he knows.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:13 PM   #23
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what is MML?
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:14 PM   #24
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motor mount lift.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:16 PM   #25
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You can run a t-case drop, but you just lost the clearance you installed the lift for.
I'm not a fan of the T-case drop, but I have one. I keep hearing the above statement and don't buy it. I have a 4" lift. That means my frame is now 4" higher than it was stock. I have 33" tires that are 6" taller than stock, that equals 3" more lift. 4" + 3" = 7" right? Now put a t-case lowering kit on -1.5"

7" - 1.5" = 5.5" < higher than stock

For a 3" lift and 32" tires it would be 5.5" taller - 1.5" = still 4" higher than stock.
............and you gain clearance in many other valuable areas besides the t-case.
That said the SYE and DS are a very smart investment and I will be getting one.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:16 PM   #26
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my MML took place of ANY vibes from my lift.. i have NO tc drop or sye/ds
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:18 PM   #27
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what is MML?
That's a motor mount lift that lifts the engine with 1" taller mounts. That tilts the engine/tranny/t-case assembly up a bit which helps reduce the angle at the u-joint between the t-case and driveshaft. That u-joint angle gets increased by a suspension lift which causes vibrations, so a MML can sometimes reduce that angle enough to stop the vibes. However, it's not enough for a 4" suspension lift even, usually, when combined with a t-case drop which does pretty much the same thing as the MML. Their effects are additive when both are installed.

But for a 4" suspension lift, I can't recommend going that way. My thing is to do it right the first time and install a SYE kit and CV driveshaft which elminates the need for a MML or t-case drop.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:18 PM   #28
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I'm not a fan of the T-case drop, but I have one. I keep hearing the above statement and don't buy it. I have a 4" lift. That means my frame is now 4" higher than it was stock. I have 33" tires that are 6" taller than stock, that equals 3" more lift. 4" + 3" = 7" right? Now put a t-case lowering kit on -1.5"

7" - 1.5" = 5.5" < higher than stock

For a 3" lift and 32" tires it would be 5.5" taller - 1.5" = still 4" higher than stock.
............and you gain clearance in many other valuable areas besides the t-case.
That said the SYE and DS are a very smart investment and I will be getting one.
dang a 1.5'' tc drop? that must suck.. throw a MML/bl on there and lower the tc drop..

just think if you had a sye and a new ds.. you could do a tummy tuck and gain 2" plus the 1.5" back.. then thatd be 3.5'' of EXTRA clearance..
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:22 PM   #29
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dang a 1.5'' tc drop? that must suck.. throw a MML/bl on there and lower the tc drop..

just think if you had a sye and a new ds.. you could do a tummy tuck and gain 2" plus the 1.5" back.. then thatd be 3.5'' of EXTRA clearance..
Well its not been a problem for me so far. I agree with the SYE, BL, MML and tummy tuck though.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:32 PM   #30
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Well its not been a problem for me so far. I agree with the SYE, BL, MML and tummy tuck though.
i need a TT.. ive had too many problems with my skids getting banged around and getting me hung up this weekend.. if i had 2'' of clearance id of been fine on a lot of obstacles

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