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Old 12-20-2006, 11:15 AM   #1
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TJ seats- misaligned for safety?

I bought a 2004 TJ. I live in Sunnyvale, CA. The front seat in the car is tilted. A lot. It's tilted so that if you placed a tennis ball on the seat, it would roll out of the door. Sitting in that Jeep is literally like sitting in a chair where the legs on your right side are longer than those on the left. Great on the back. Not.

So, I reported it to the dealer as a warranty issue.

Listen. I'm dead serious -- I swear it -- here's what the service manager told me:

"I talked to Chrysler about your seat and they said that the seats in the Wrangler are intentionally tilted toward the doors. Jeep made them that way because the car is used off road. If you were to get into a difficult position, they don't want to make it hard for you to get out of the car. The seats are intentionally tilted to help you to get out."

This is my first Jeep and I love the car. Always wanted one going back to CJ days. Can anyone tell me if this statement is factual? My gut reaction and common sense tell me that this a stunning example of a lie that could void the warranty of a lie detector machine, but I seek the wisdon of this forum to confirm it. I could be wrong.

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Old 12-20-2006, 11:26 AM   #2
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Honestly, most people that work at jeep (atleast the phone opperators) don't know shit..... We had a guy that wasnt able to tell us the gear ratio and ring and pinion size on a stock 97 TJ, he could tell us the part number, but not what we needed, It was the biggest waste of an hour on the phone ever.

But then I posted the question up here and it was answer correctly within 5 mins of me posting it up.

Take a pic of the seats and post them up...

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Old 12-20-2006, 11:29 AM   #3
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The car is currently at the dealership, but I will post pics when I get it. BTW, the left side of the seat is about 1-2 inches lower than the right side.
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Old 12-20-2006, 11:30 AM   #4
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We have an 04, and I have not noticed any tilting of the seat. It sits perfectly level with the floor. Check your seat frames, where they bolt to the floor, and see if someone shimmed them that way. Sounds like some personal fabbing to me. I am guessing that you bought your Jeep used????
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Old 12-20-2006, 11:31 AM   #5
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Sounds like BS to me. My seat leans a little bit toward the door (not much at all) but it's because the cushion is showing some wear. I'm sure it wasn't made that way or people would be falling out of the d*mn things.
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Old 12-20-2006, 11:46 AM   #6
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sounds like BS to me also. I have a 04 and my seats are not like that.
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Old 12-20-2006, 11:58 AM   #7
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My '03 sahara seats are staright with the floor. Unless that was an upgrade on the '04 models i think i am gonna have to play the BS card as well
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Old 12-20-2006, 12:11 PM   #8
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Have you checked the seat mounts to see if maybe someone put seat risers on one side?
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Old 12-20-2006, 12:13 PM   #9
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You folks are great. I must say I was in awe of the service manager telling me tilting the seat helps driver to get out of the car in case there's a rollover. He said it with so much conviction and force that for a brief second I almost believed it.

But then it occurred to me - in a rollover, you're upside down, or sideways -- what the hell difference does the damn seat angle matter?!

And why would dropping the seat on one side matter a hill of beans toward getting out?

This dealer really makes me nervous. Anyone who would say something like that is either incompetant or dishonest.
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Old 12-20-2006, 12:14 PM   #10
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Have you checked the seat mounts to see if maybe someone put seat risers on one side?
The dealer checked it. No risers -- according tothem (whihc means I had better check it when i get the car back).
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Old 12-20-2006, 12:22 PM   #11
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Don't know which dealer that is, hope it's not Joe Kerley's.
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Old 12-20-2006, 02:15 PM   #12
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Sounds like BS to me. My seat leans a little bit toward the door (not much at all) but it's because the cushion is showing some wear. I'm sure it wasn't made that way or people would be falling out of the d*mn things.
I'm visualizing Wrangler owners "falling out of the d*am things"
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
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Old 12-20-2006, 02:19 PM   #13
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You can always unbolt the seat, take it out and put it on a level workbench to check it out. They come out easy.
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Old 12-20-2006, 02:43 PM   #14
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I'm visualizing Wrangler owners "falling out of the d*am things"
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Ha! Some of the stuff these "Service Managers" tell their customers just cracks me up. They should really think twice about what they're telling these customers. But then again, that's why the lawyers live in those big ol' houses.

Siggie - I want to add another BS just for grins. You should print this thread off and take it to the Service Manager. Make sure he knows that I think he's a moron.
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Old 12-20-2006, 02:46 PM   #15
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Yup, another big ol' "BS!" from me, too.
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:01 PM   #16
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I'm visualizing Wrangler owners "falling out of the d*am things"
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
LOL, I can just imagine it now. Crawl'n through the mall parking lot on a hot summer day, doors and top off, hit a speed bump, and then "d*am it, I fell out of the jeep again"
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:27 PM   #17
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Ha! Some of the stuff these "Service Managers" tell their customers just cracks me up. They should really think twice about what they're telling these customers. But then again, that's why the lawyers live in those big ol' houses.

Siggie - I want to add another BS just for grins. You should print this thread off and take it to the Service Manager. Make sure he knows that I think he's a moron.
Oh God -- I'm at work laughing out loud!
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:31 PM   #18
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LOL, I can just imagine it now. Crawl'n through the mall parking lot on a hot summer day, doors and top off, hit a speed bump, and then "d*am it, I fell out of the jeep again"
Oh **** -- you folks are going to get me fired! This is so funny! Or how about this -- the lawyer calls a jeep owner to the stand to testify how Jeep negligently installed level seats preventing them from exiting the car - causing them to be burned in the ensuing fireball!

Here's the serious part -- that service manager HAS MY JEEP right now and he's dead serious.
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:32 PM   #19
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Don't know which dealer that is, hope it's not Joe Kerley's.
Sunnyvale Jeep Chrysler.

I've been to Kerely's. They've got great advisors there. Not too sure about their mechanics though.
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:34 PM   #20
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Here's the serious part -- that service manager HAS MY JEEP right now and he's dead serious.
That's kinda scary. You will be going to pick it up today, right?
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:55 PM   #21
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That's kinda scary. You will be going to pick it up today, right?
No -- not even sure when it will be ready. And I am scared.
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Old 12-20-2006, 05:07 PM   #22
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have the service manager put it in writing on your receipt. that way when you find out otherwise he can not deny he lied to. it'll make him look like a real arss.
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Old 12-20-2006, 05:15 PM   #23
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Sorry I've been gone for awile. Went to the mall to do some Christmas shopping and fell right out of my Jeep! Gawd I hate those seats!

Don't worry, me and the Jeep are fine.
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Old 12-20-2006, 05:19 PM   #24
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have the service manager put it in writing on your receipt. that way when you find out otherwise he can not deny he lied to. it'll make him look like a real arss.
I'm not sure he would put it in writing. These guys are shrewd. We got into a fairly heated argument about it too. In the argument he threatened that if he went back to Chrysler to approve the seat repair that they would deny the claim.

I replied that I don't consider Chrysler the final arbitor -- that I would file a complaint with the California Bureau of Automotive Repair and would go to court if necessary.

He was pretty confident that I would lose because tilting the seat is a safety issue. You had to hear this. A long time ago, someone told me it's not WHAT you say, it's HOW you say it that matters. He said it with so much confidence I felt compelled to check with this forum to verify my own common sense. Honestly, I feel embarrassed.

Maybe I should start a campaign to shame other SUV makers who have failed to install crooked seats -- those cars are death traps!

Of course, if somehow magically they do fix the seat and if ever do roll my beloved Jeep, I will feel like a COMPLETE asshole if I die trying in vain to get out because the seat was too level!
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Old 12-20-2006, 05:19 PM   #25
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Sorry I've been gone for awile. Went to the mall to do some Christmas shopping and fell right out of my Jeep! Gawd I hate those seats!

Don't worry, me and the Jeep are fine.
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Old 12-20-2006, 05:46 PM   #26
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Sunnyvale Jeep Chrysler.

I've been to Kerely's. They've got great advisors there. Not too sure about their mechanics though.
The service advisors are great, the mechanics are hit and miss.
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Old 12-20-2006, 05:53 PM   #27
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The service advisors are great, the mechanics are hit and miss.
Totally agree. I was so appreciative of their advisors, I still have it on my To Do list to write the owner a letter telling him how great they are.
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Old 12-20-2006, 07:04 PM   #28
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I was just skimming thru this thread and I can't belive a service manager would do that. blows my mind. I recomend getting a small 2 fool long level from a hardware store that shows the angle, have them pull up another TJ, its a dealer they should have plenty, and find out the exact angle of your seat verses a random selection from the lot. If they want to tell you some crap like that make them show you. I'd be happy to provide my TJ for a tester to show that the seats a level from left to right.
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Old 12-20-2006, 07:16 PM   #29
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I was just skimming thru this thread and I can't belive a service manager would do that. blows my mind. I recomend getting a small 2 fool long level from a hardware store that shows the angle, have them pull up another TJ, its a dealer they should have plenty, and find out the exact angle of your seat verses a random selection from the lot. If they want to tell you some crap like that make them show you. I'd be happy to provide my TJ for a tester to show that the seats a level from left to right.
BINGO! Not only that, even if they ALL wrong -- if every 04 TJ owner is driving like they're in an airplane banked to make a left hand turn, the fact that they all are bad doesn't make it right. That's what recalls are for. Sitting in a canted seat is not good for my back.

Anyway, I have yet to find a TJ that is tilted like mine. What really makes me upset was the cock and bull story about needing a canted seat to exit the car. He might as well have told me he thinks I'm an idiot. Here's the thing -- a lot of people would accept that kind of BS and drive away constantly listing to port like they were driving in the villian's lair of an old batman episode. LOL!

One thing I did NOT mention -- I became so frustrated at the dealer's bullshit, I told him that I would fix the seat myself. When I get the car back, I'm going to pull the seat and add fender washers to shim it level. Honestly, it's this kind of behavior that shits on the efforts of the American autoworkers to put out a quality product. When the dealer is a pain in the ass to deal with, you start looking at other options like Japanese cars.
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Old 12-20-2006, 07:48 PM   #30
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BINGO! Not only that, even if they ALL wrong -- if every 04 TJ owner is driving like they're in an airplane banked to make a left hand turn, the fact that they all are bad doesn't make it right. That's what recalls are for. Sitting in a canted seat is not good for my back.

Anyway, I have yet to find a TJ that is tilted like mine. What really makes me upset was the cock and bull story about needing a canted seat to exit the car. He might as well have told me he thinks I'm an idiot. Here's the thing -- a lot of people would accept that kind of BS and drive away constantly listing to port like they were driving in the villian's lair of an old batman episode. LOL!

One thing I did NOT mention -- I became so frustrated at the dealer's bullshit, I told him that I would fix the seat myself. When I get the car back, I'm going to pull the seat and add fender washers to shim it level. Honestly, it's this kind of behavior that shits on the efforts of the American autoworkers to put out a quality product. When the dealer is a pain in the ass to deal with, you start looking at other options like Japanese cars.
I would shoot an email to Chrysler regarding that seat and the dealer's response.

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