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FRS, CB or Ham?

11K views 30 replies 15 participants last post by  arpstorm 
#1 ·
Been decades since I've used a radio off-road. What are clubs using these days? If you're in Moab or Ouray, what are other Jeeps likely to have?

I presume CB still rules but with the performance of FRS and the easy-entry into 2m I wonder why.
 
#2 ·
FRS is fine for communicating between family members at Disneyland but you won't find it used among Jeepers on the trail. 2m ham is great, I have one in my TJ, but not many Jeepers have it so it's not going to work in most offroad settings if it's the only radio in your Jeep.

You're better off going with a CB. Virtually all offroad events primarily run on CB radios so if you don't have a CB, you would miss out on 99% of the chatter. For every time I use my 2m ham radio on the trail, I use my CB 100 times. My 2m ham radio doesn't even get turned on for probably 80-90% of the offroad trails I do.

The reason CB is so popular is because you can buy an excellent quality CB like from Uniden for $40 and get a good antenna, mount, and cable for around another $20-30. 2m ham radios require you pass a ham test to use legally and they're too expensive enough to buy to make it a widespread choice among typical Jeepers who aren't into radios like hams are.

N6TAY
 
#3 ·
The reason CB is so popular is because you can buy an excellent quality CB like from Uniden for $40 and get a good antenna, mount, and cable for around another $20-30. 2m ham radios require you pass a ham test to use legally and they're too expensive enough to buy to make it a widespread choice among typical Jeepers who aren't into radios like hams are.
N6TAY
I had wondered with the no-code license path if maybe it would catch on more. Back when I was in a Jeep club we always ran CB. A few of us were hams but didn't use them on club runs - no need. But that was the days before FRS. Sheesh, that was the days before the internet :)

These days I'm thinking FRS would be a great thing on the trail for short-distance comms between vehicles. $25 per radio. No external antenna needed. But again, I suppose it just hasn't caught on because ... it just hasn't?
 
#4 · (Edited)
FRS just hasn't caught on since there are cheaper (CB) and more powerful (ham) radios available. You're probably just shouting into the wind how FRS seems to make sense for offroading too.

If I wanted a radio to stay in touch with my family at a resort, I'd use either my cellphone possibly FRS. I wouldn't even consider FRS for the trail unless it was being run by members of an FRS club. :)
 
#5 ·
I'd like to be able to use ham, I even bought a ham radio. My problem is finding a way to take the exam in my area, Toronto.... Can't find an examiner without joining some ham club and taking their courses that span a few months. I learned for the exam and tested myself. I am good to go. But I don't care for joining any club just to be able to use ham.
So for me... ham is not a real option because of that.
 
#6 ·
That is sad that you don't have a simple path to getting tested. Have you approached your nearest club to see if they could help you without making you join or take classes?

I remember way back in the day before the Volunteer Exam program you had to find a local ham to give you the Novice test. It was a pain. If you wanted to get a higher class license you had to go to the FCC. It was more of a pain. I did both.
 
#10 ·
A couple local clubs are going Ham. One usually has an annual session for people to challenge for Tech liscence. Myself and five others have got our licenses recently, I challenged for General so I can play with HF on vacation trips to the hinterlands.
 
#11 ·
Here is an expanded comparison I wrote up a while back that compares and contrasts various Jeep-to-Jeep communication options:


CB (Citizen's Band) benefits:
1) very inexpensive; new radio/antenna/cable/mount setup can be had for ~ $75
2) no license required, so everybody can use one
3) due to #1 and #2, CB radios are very common among Jeepers

CB downsides:
1) because everyone can use one, there are thousands of a**holes out there actively trying to ruin your experience
2) 4 watt maximum output limits legal users, keeping range very short
3) CB uses scratchy, static-filled AM operation

FRS (Family Radio Service) benefits:
1) uses handheld radios which are tiny, cheap, and widely available
2) no license required, so everybody can use one
3) FM operation for clearer sound and little interference

FRS drawbacks:
1) limited to .5 watt output, which keeps range extremely short
2) handheld radios must have fixed antennas, also keeping range extremely short
3) only 14 channels available

MURS (Multi-Use Radio Service) benefits:
1) no license required, so everybody can use one
2) FM operation for clearer sound and little interference
3) 2 watt maximum output provides slightly further range than FRS

MURS drawbacks:
1) even though external antennas are allowed, range is still very short
2) repeaters are not allowed, also keeping range very short
3) only 5 channels available

GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) benefits:
1) FM operation for clearer sound and little interference
2) allows up to 50 watts of power output, increasing range (but most handhelds only put out 4-5 watts max)
3) can use repeaters to increase range even further

GMRS drawbacks:
1) requires a license for use (no exam; just a fee)
2) range for a handheld radio without a repeater isn't much better than MURS
3) repeaters are very scarce (Utah has only 6, for example)
4) only 15 channels available (22 on hybrid FRS/GMRS radios)

Ham radio benefits:
1) has far better range than all the above options (50 watt output is common for mobiles; some have 75+ watts)
2) handheld ham radios can use upgraded antennas, further increasing their range.
3) thanks to repeaters, the range gets even better (especially with linked repeaters)
4) repeaters are very common (Utah has 129 on 2m and 179 on 70cm)
5) ham operators tend to be much better behaved than CB operators
6) ham uses FM operation for clear sound

Ham radio drawbacks:
1) you must earn a license by passing a 35-question test
2) equipment costs more; a quality 50w 2m radio/antenna/cable setup runs ~ $225
3) because of #1 and #2, many Jeepers don't have a ham radio

Once you've had a taste of ham radio, you will forever look down on CBs due to their significant shortcomings. But does that mean CBs are entirely worthless? Of course not. If all you want to do is talk to other vehicles in your caravan and you'll always be very close to each other, CBs would be a simple, cheap way to achieve your goals. On the other hand, if you're really thinking you may be in a remote area with no phone service and you might need to make an emergency communication with the outside world, CB will very likely be completely useless in such a situation... and if you're counting on it to save you, you are setting yourself up for disappointment.


In summary: ham is the best method for Jeep-to-Jeep communication. If for some reason that just isn't an option for you, CB is likely to be your next-best choice.
 
#15 ·
On the other hand, if you're really thinking you may be in a remote area with no phone service and you might need to make an emergency communication with the outside world, CB will very likely be completely useless in such a situation... and if you're counting on it to save you, you are setting yourself up for disappointment.
The safety aspect is what made my decision. Taking the wife and kids out into the forest to explore is great until there is some kind of emergency. I use the HAM radio and a GPS so I can give my exact coordinates. The test is not that hard (all the questions and answers are given, you just need to study them). It's comforting to know if you need emergency service, you have a way to contact the appropriate people.

Also, living in California with potential earthquakes and the loss of cellular service, HAM radio is the go to for emergency services. There are a lot of good people that are prepared that have their HAM license, and that is a good club to be in.
 
#16 ·
I realize I'm both late to the conversation and new but I use all three. I've got a CB and HAM installed in the Jeep and I just throw two of our FRS/GMRS radios and my HT (a Baofeng UV-5R with FRS/GMRS channels programmed in so I can monitor) in the back when we go out.

This was I can cover all the bands if necessary. I've considered picking up a MURS radio just because that's what we use at the range I manage though I can't really justify the limited use for the cost.
 
#18 ·
I found that most clubs of any kind suck.

As for a radio, some if not most have a CB. Others do HAM (I prefer Bacon myself). The FRS/GMRS are on the cheap now days. pick up a 2 or 4 pack. That said, if you are going out and no one has a radio you can let some one us your spare. I have been on trail rides where both CB and FRS/GMRS were being used because one or the other had it. Having comms. is better than nothing in a group ride. but at the same time.. the radio chatter can get crazy, so the peace and quiet of no radio or turning it off is nice also.

That's all I have. Carry on.
 
#19 ·
@Sherpa great right up.

My local amateur radio club is very friendly. We offer exams at least once a month at March Air Reserve Base in Riverside CA. Many times more often. Email with Bruce to make arrangements to get through security if you're interested. Let me know and I'll come and VE for your exam.

K6AFN.NET - K6AFN Amateur Radio Group

Paul
Amateur Extra and VE
 
#20 ·
OK, I have a couple of FRS rigs now. Audio quality is sub-par considering they're FM. Also, range between cars was less than impressive. I guess the best use I can see would be for a spotter to talk to the driver.

Still, I could easily see a dash mount combined with a headset making these things easier to use and install than a CB with hand mic and the hassles of an external antenna

The problem is CB has such huge momentum that it just isn't gonna be dethroned anytime soon.
 
#23 ·
Handheld 2m radios are poor communicators for anything other than short distance line-of-sight communications. Their stubby antennas are too small and inadequate for anything other than short distance 'easy' communications unless there is a repeater within line-of-sight that is close enough for the handheld to reach.

For your difficult Idaho mountainous conditions, a good 50-75 watt fixed mount radio with a larger antenna like a 5/8 would be your best bet.

My Hustler SF-2 5/8 antenna combined with my 75 watt Yaesu FT-2900R radio works well but even it is no match for mountainous non line-of-sight communications if there's no repeater in the area.
 
#24 ·
In the terrain around here a 1/4wave does better on 2m because its nothing but close in hills and valleys. The steeper take off angle helps working people who are close but at vastly different elevations. Out west where the land might be flatter or mountains farther away the gain of a 5/8wave would be of greater benefit.

There are a few affordable duel band mobiles out now with built in "cross band repeat" . That would give you the best of both worlds if you want to have a small handheld radio for working outside around your ride.. You could use the little potable radio that talks on 70cm back to your jeep and your jeep repeats out at 50-75watts on 2m with a fullsized antenna.

I plan on just putting a CB in my rig because it seems thats what everyone has around here. I am going to use an NMO antenna mount so I could switch out to something easily if need be.
 
#25 ·
No need to go with an NMO mount which makes CB and 2m ham antenna selection more difficult. A standard SO-239 with a 3/8-24 thread on the top works fine for both ham and CB antennas. That's what I'm using for all of my TJ's ham and CB antenna mounts. Antennas with 3/8-24 threads on the bottom are everywhere.

N6TAY
 
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