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Old 11-06-2008, 10:15 AM   #1
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.556 ... .762

i want to purchase an assault rifle here in the next few months what models and options are available to me, ammunition? i know nothing about weapons and this will be my second gun ( 12 gauge shotgun). i know there are alot of fun people on the forum so any heads up, whats good whats not whats leagal? i live in Va

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Old 11-06-2008, 11:00 AM   #2
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#1I don't know the laws in Va so I can't comment.

#2. unless your state allows full auto and you have $10,000 or more, you won't be getting an "assault rifle" It'll be a clone as an assault rifle, by definition is capable of full auto.
I know, nitpicking but damnit, I like nits...

#3. it would be much easier to answer your question if you told us a little about what you want to be able to do with it.
Hunting? Self defense? Fight off zombie hordes? Cheap plinker?

here's a few to consider.
AR 15
Basically the same thing our military is using now. Very customizable. They can be set up for serious target shooting to hunting to fighting off zombie hordes.
Usually chambered in .223/5.56 but can be had in all kinds of boutique calibers including 7.62x39, 6.5 grendel, 6.8 SPC, 9 mm, .308 and others.
Accuracy is generally very good.
Reliability can be a problem if you don't take good care of em.
Cost ranges from about $550 to over 2 grand.

AK47/AK74
Usually chambered in 7.62x39(AK47) or 5.45x39(AK74)
They can also be had in .223/5.56
Not quite as customizable but still fun to tinker with.
Not as accurate but capable of minute of bad guy out to about 300 yards.
Very reliable.
Cost between $350 $800 depending on builder.

Saiga.
Russian AK that's been sporterized. (no pistol grip or bayonet lug)
Otherwise same as above.
Can be had in 7.62x39, .223/5.56, .308, 30.06
Cost around $450

7.62x39 is going for about $180 per thousand rounds
.223/5.56 is going for around $350 per thousand

ETA: this is a good site for gun info.
www.ar15.com

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Old 11-06-2008, 11:03 AM   #3
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Looks like I'm not the only one who's read Max Brooks' books on zombies!!

Good reads, I recommend them both to anyone who wants a good chuckle...

In case anyone doesn't know what I'm talking about, check out these two books by Max Brooks. Both have been on the New York Times Bestseller List for a good while. They're good.

The Zombie Survival Guide
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Old 11-06-2008, 11:13 AM   #4
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I want one of these:






Quote:
The Bushmaster ACR (Adaptive Combat Rifle) is the most advanced modular Combat/Assault rifle ever devised. Originally developed by Magpul Military Industries as the Masada Adaptive Combat Weapon System, the Bushmaster ACR is on the cutting edge of weapon design. Initially chambered in 556 NATO the modular construction and tool-less quick change free-floating barrel system( utilizing M16/M4/AR15 barrels) allow for future caliber and barrel length combinations to meet the operators every need. The Modularity of the Bushmaster ACR means that the old axiom of "right tool for the job" is no longer applicable. With a variety of stock and barrel combinations available the Bushmaster ACR is adaptable to meet any combination of mission specific requirements from an Entry/ CQB (Close Quarters Battle) carbine, standard infantry carbine/rifle to a SPR (Special Purpose Rifle) for longer range engagements.
The Bushmaster ACR will initially be offered in 5.56 NATO, available for civilian purchase early 2009.
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:16 PM   #5
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Oooooo,ahhhhhhh. Now that would be something to have when the grid goes down, the oil runs out and we're all protecting ourselves from the bad guys. I could keep a few stocked at my base camp in the hills. Nice!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Unlimited View Post
I want one of these:








The Bushmaster ACR will initially be offered in 5.56 NATO, available for civilian purchase early 2009.
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:08 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skeeter View Post
#1I don't know the laws in Va so I can't comment.

#2. unless your state allows full auto and you have $10,000 or more, you won't be getting an "assault rifle" It'll be a clone as an assault rifle, by definition is capable of full auto.
I know, nitpicking but damnit, I like nits...

#3. it would be much easier to answer your question if you told us a little about what you want to be able to do with it.
Hunting? Self defense? Fight off zombie hordes? Cheap plinker?

here's a few to consider.
AR 15
Basically the same thing our military is using now. Very customizable. They can be set up for serious target shooting to hunting to fighting off zombie hordes.
Usually chambered in .223/5.56 but can be had in all kinds of boutique calibers including 7.62x39, 6.5 grendel, 6.8 SPC, 9 mm, .308 and others.
Accuracy is generally very good.
Reliability can be a problem if you don't take good care of em.
Cost ranges from about $550 to over 2 grand.

AK47/AK74
Usually chambered in 7.62x39(AK47) or 5.45x39(AK74)
They can also be had in .223/5.56
Not quite as customizable but still fun to tinker with.
Not as accurate but capable of minute of bad guy out to about 300 yards.
Very reliable.
Cost between $350 $800 depending on builder.

Saiga.
Russian AK that's been sporterized. (no pistol grip or bayonet lug)
Otherwise same as above.
Can be had in 7.62x39, .223/5.56, .308, 30.06
Cost around $450

7.62x39 is going for about $180 per thousand rounds
.223/5.56 is going for around $350 per thousand

ETA: this is a good site for gun info.
AR15.COM

well skeet its a mix of self defence and just a fun build i know the m4 has so many options and builds. and i know what everone says " why do you need an assault rifle for self defence" well does anyone need a .45 or some monster pistol! if someone broke into my house and there i was holding an m4 i think they would run away. wouldn't you ????
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:25 PM   #7
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Here you go, get one of these....


The H&K MP5

There are several trigger groups available for it. My favorite one goes....Safe, Single, 3 Round Burst, and Rock N Roll!!!!

Someday, I will own one.
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:32 PM   #8
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Wolverines!!!!!
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Old 11-06-2008, 02:46 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coyote_94yj View Post
Here you go, get one of these....


The H&K MP5

There are several trigger groups available for it. My favorite one goes....Safe, Single, 3 Round Burst, and Rock N Roll!!!!

Someday, I will own one.
Badass. Especially since you can get them in bigger calibers now!! Get the .45 ACP and it would be just like owning a Thompson!!!
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Old 11-06-2008, 03:40 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yjwrangler View Post
well skeet its a mix of self defence and just a fun build i know the m4 has so many options and builds. and i know what everone says " why do you need an assault rifle for self defence" well does anyone need a .45 or some monster pistol! if someone broke into my house and there i was holding an m4 i think they would run away. wouldn't you ????
I am more comfortable with an M4 than with a handgun, but I like shooting both. Good luck with your choice, so many to choose from if you're limited to one purchase.
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Old 11-06-2008, 03:45 PM   #11
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As stated it depends what you want it for: now the two most common are the AK47 and AR15.

AK ammo, 7.62x39 is running about $125 500 rounds or $200-250 for 1000 rds.

223 and 5.56 are different rounds. Please note that while all guns made for 5.56 can fire .223 the reverse is not true. Also with the AR-15 for target shooting the cheaper stuff is okay, but for when your life is on the line, get the better stuff, and keep the gun clean. 1000 rds of cheap stuff: $250 nice stuff, $250-$500

I like the mp5 but I want something with some knock down power vs the9mm version.

I would go the ak route as you can abuse the hell out of it and it will keep going. Rounds are cheaper too.

If I had the money however I would get one of these:

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Old 11-06-2008, 04:21 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cavediverjc View Post
Badass. Especially since you can get them in bigger calibers now!! Get the .45 ACP and it would be just like owning a Thompson!!!
Can you now??? Are you talking about the UMP or ??? Because I haven't heard this and I can find no information about it on their website. That would be cool. Do you have a link perhaps???

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Jeepn View Post
I like the mp5 but I want something with some knock down power vs the9mm version.
See, I agree and disagree at the same time. I would love to have one in 40 S&W or 45ACP for more punch per round but come on the thing fires, depending on the variant, up to 900 rpm. The variant I'm after only fires 800 rpm. That's 13.3 rounds into the chest of a would be assailant in the time it takes you to say "one thousand one". Or put another way that's cumulatively 120mm of open space in your target in 2 shakes of a lambs tail.
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:36 PM   #13
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I know there is an MP5/10 and an MP5/40 that are chambered for 10mm and .40S&W respectively, but I was not aware of a 45ACP MP5.
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:48 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coyote_94yj View Post
See, I agree and disagree at the same time. I would love to have one in 40 S&W or 45ACP for more punch per round but come on the thing fires, depending on the variant, up to 900 rpm. The variant I'm after only fires 800 rpm. That's 13.3 rounds into the chest of a would be assailant in the time it takes you to say "one thousand one". Or put another way that's cumulatively 120mm of open space in your target in 2 shakes of a lambs tail.
Valid points.. I was coming from the side of, if I had to have an all around weapon, that did a bit of everything well, then the 9mm version does not cut it for me. Close in no issue, but if I need to reach out and touch somebody I like a round that can hit harder further away than the 9mm.. Granted if somebody feels the need to give me a 9mm mp5 I will be happy to take it!
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Old 11-06-2008, 05:54 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chezuki View Post
I know there is an MP5/10 and an MP5/40 that are chambered for 10mm and .40S&W respectively, but I was not aware of a 45ACP MP5.
Well I guess I have been out of the loop for a bit and haven't kept up on things. I was only aware of them coming in 9mm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Jeepn View Post
Valid points.. I was coming from the side of, if I had to have an all around weapon, that did a bit of everything well, then the 9mm version does not cut it for me. Close in no issue, but if I need to reach out and touch somebody I like a round that can hit harder further away than the 9mm.. Granted if somebody feels the need to give me a 9mm mp5 I will be happy to take it!
Yes that is a valid point too. An all around weapon would need to be bigger than 9mm. I wasn't taking distance into consideration. I think the MP5 is more of a urban tactical assault tool "close quarters". If I need to reach out and touch someone I would lean more towards my .308. I guess my thought on this is I don't see myself having to shoot a person in self defense from 500 yards out. It would be for someone breaking into my home. Unless WWIII starts up. What am I talking about. Assault rifles aren't for self defense anyways their for assaulting and shocking your friends when they come over and you say "Hey, check out my new toy".
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Old 11-06-2008, 05:57 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chezuki View Post
I know there is an MP5/10 and an MP5/40 that are chambered for 10mm and .40S&W respectively, but I was not aware of a 45ACP MP5.
You know what? I think you're right. I was thinking .40 and I wrote .45 ACP. I guess the old memory isn't what it used to be!!!
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Old 11-06-2008, 06:06 PM   #17
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Still I wouldn't mind a 40 S&W. Do the 40 S&W versions come from H&K or is that a aftermarket upgrade?
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Old 11-06-2008, 06:34 PM   #18
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Old 11-06-2008, 06:38 PM   #19
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Ah, I just read the "Discontinued" part. Back to the UMP idea. That comes in 45ACP, 40S&W, or 9mm.
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Old 11-06-2008, 06:43 PM   #20
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For .40S&W (or 9mm or 45acp for that matter) there is always the Beretta CX4


and the Beretta PX4 to go with it (same mags if you get the right CX4, some are built for 96/92f mags)



I already have a PX4 in .40, love it. Money is too tight for a CX4 before SHTF though I think. I dropped what little I had saved up for a Saiga in 7.62x39 not too long ago. Might try and grab a .308, but I doubt its gonna happen.
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Old 11-06-2008, 10:35 PM   #21
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the beowulf 50 cal. adapter to the AR just the upper reseaver is all you need heres a link to show you
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Old 11-07-2008, 08:12 AM   #22
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Nice weapon. Can't stand that show. I don't know if that's Mack's real personality, or if they tell him to be uber dramatic, but I can't watch that show for more than 5 minutes without wanting to throttle the guy. I have been known to watch the show on mute, though, just so I don't have to listen to the guy. Back to the Beowulf...........YES, PLEASE!!!! I'll take one!!!
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Old 11-07-2008, 10:06 AM   #23
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Beo wolf upper 900 bucks.
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Old 11-07-2008, 10:09 AM   #24
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its worth it any thing in 200 yards is screwd
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Old 11-07-2008, 01:01 PM   #25
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M1A. Real 30cal semi-auto goodness.
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Old 11-07-2008, 01:17 PM   #26
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I want one of these:








The Bushmaster ACR will initially be offered in 5.56 NATO, available for civilian purchase early 2009.
Give it time, the USI will probably issue you one soon enuf.
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Old 11-27-2008, 02:00 AM   #27
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.308 is the choice i decided to go with. assualt and long range.

HK21 and a PSG-1 both .308

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Old 11-27-2008, 06:31 AM   #28
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well skeet its a mix of self defence and just a fun build i know the m4 has so many options and builds. and i know what everone says " why do you need an assault rifle for self defence" well does anyone need a .45 or some monster pistol! if someone broke into my house and there i was holding an m4 i think they would run away. wouldn't you ????
You know, there is a saying that goes something like this:

"My .22LR is for target practice. My Shotgun is for huntin'. My Bolt action is for competition. My AR15/AK47 is for when people like YOU try to take the others away..."

Everyone has pretty much said all you can say. AR15s are a semi-automatic version of the rifle our military uses. Extremely accurate, very little recoil. The downsides to the AR15 are its lack of reliability if you don't take really good care of it and keep it really clean, and the bullet it uses. .223 is kind of like a .22 on crack. It will do the job, but you may need to use a couple more rounds than say a .308.

AK47s and SKS(predecessor to the AK, CHEAP to buy) are 7.62x39. The ammo is dirt cheap if you buy military surplus ammo from over seas, just clean the gun with some water or windex, and than your normal cleaning routine as some of that ammo is corrosive. 7.62x39 is basically a .308 bullet with a much smaller case and powder charge. More recoil than a .223, but not anywhere near enough to bother you. Putting hundreds of rounds downrange with a 7.62x39 and you will want to keep going. AK47s are stupid reliable, and are arguably the toughest rifle made. The cons to an AK47/SKS/Saiga etc. are the lack of accuracy and ... ugh... I guess that's it! An AR15 will remove the bullseye from your target all day long if you do your part, and AK47 will be "minute of man." It is accurate enough to hit a torso, but your not going to win any accuracy contests. My Saiga hits about 4" groups at 100 yards. My buddies AR15 (granted, he spent a LOT of money on it) hits .5 inch groups at 100 yards.


7.62x39 is good for about 300 yards. .223/5.56 is good for over 500 supposedly, I have never used one that far. I am an AK person

Then there are the .308 semi's. Saiga's can be had in .308, as well as an AR style rifle (called an AR10), and a few others I am sure I am missing. Saigas run ~$400 with a mote carlo stock, and about $600 with a pistol grip. AR10s run about $1000 and up. Everyone knows about .308. The only thing bad you can really say about .308 is the recoil, but in a semi-auto its nothing to be scared of. I think a .308 is probably the best rifle for you. You have a 12ga for the home, a .308 will give you something to play with on the range and will let you reach out and touch someone faaaar away if the need arises. .308 can be had military surplus as well for not tooo much. I think its around $400 for 10000 rounds right now? Not too positive.

Anyway, let us know what you decide on!
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Old 11-27-2008, 07:53 AM   #29
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sure will! unfortunatly i have to make it through the holiday, no wait i mean christmas (everyone get over it)before i can buy one, got presents to buy you know.
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Old 11-27-2008, 09:46 AM   #30
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I know what you mean. Just make sure you start the paperwork before January. You know who has already said he is going to re-enact the Clinton bans, as well as a few more of his own, so you never know what you will or won't be able to buy. Never know how soon he will do it either. If you wait to long, you may be SOL.

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1997 Wrangler Sport - 5 spd. Retired
2005 Wrangler Rubicon - 6spd|KC 55watt fogs, IPF H4s with fatboys,Uniden CB radio/Teraflex mount
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