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Old 05-17-2013, 04:18 PM   #31
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I would agree on that Benelli M4 as well for recoil reduction. However they are pretty pricey. Very nice guns though.

As far as bang for the buck, mossberg 500. That thing is hard to break. And they have almost as big of an aftermarket selection as a jeep. Exaggerating a bit, but you can get damn near anything for a mossberg. It's decent on the recoil too.

When you say it hurts to shoot the pump, do you mean actually firing it or it hurts when you pump it? If the issue is not with the pumping action then pumps are a much cheaper and generally more reliable option.

My personal gun is a Winchester 1200 skeet gun. I love it, but it seems to have a bit more kick than other shotty's I have used.

I have never shot a Rem 1187 so I can't offer any opinions on that one.

Whatever you get though, just make sure you keep it cleaned and lubed properly and you will have far less jams/breakages. A 12 guage, especially pump, is a simple machine. Maintain it well and it will always be there for you when you need it.
My left hand hurts the most when shouldering it. My left hand is holding the gun while right hand is triggering. Also pain after multiple times pumping and lack of strength. Firing it does not hurt except the kickback into shoulder.
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Old 05-17-2013, 04:30 PM   #32
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You can outfit the pump on just about any shotgun with a vertical grip. That might place your left wrist in a less stressed position.
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Old 05-17-2013, 06:04 PM   #33
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Yeah, vert grip could help out both those problems. It will keep your hand and wrist in a more aligned and natural position at the very least.
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Old 05-17-2013, 06:35 PM   #34
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I have a rig similiar to this (without the grip). The collapseable stock might also be a good feature for those who are a bit vertically challenged..
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Old 05-17-2013, 09:43 PM   #35
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Can't go wrong with the 870 either, nice rig.

I want to outfit my Win 1200 with a pistol grip stock. But it's still got the original wood on it and it's still all pretty looking after all these years. I would hate to ruin that, so I will probably get a mossberg or something and deck it out like that instead for a second shotty.
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Old 05-17-2013, 11:10 PM   #36
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You can outfit the pump on just about any shotgun with a vertical grip. That might place your left wrist in a less stressed position.
I never thought of the vertical grip!!! Thank you so much!!!!
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Old 05-17-2013, 11:12 PM   #37
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Doesn't the semi auto help lessen the kick back when compared to pump?

Isn't a semi auto easier to keep on target than compared to a pump?
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Old 05-17-2013, 11:25 PM   #38
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If it's a gas operated one it will lessen the recoil some. Won't be a huge difference though. you can acheive similar results with aftermarket stocks though. Some have shock absorbers built in. Also the pistol grip and foregrip will distribute some of that recoil energy into your arms.

Drawback is, harder to take apart for cleaning and such, and more expensive.

you can acheive similar recoil reduction with aftermarket stocks though. Some have shock absorbers built in. Also the pistol grip and foregrip will distribute some of that recoil energy into your arms.
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Old 05-17-2013, 11:36 PM   #39
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I have a remington 870 pump and 1187 auto. love them both but the auto has much less recoil. if you are on a budget and want a semi auto shotgun look into Raptor shotguns. I bought two youth models for my boys and these things while low cost are great. They have put probably 500 rounds through each with no issues at all.
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Old 05-17-2013, 11:54 PM   #40
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actually i misspoke, i apologize. Some models show less recoil than others. But on some semi/autos the recoil reduction is minimal.

On a pump, the bolt doesn't move untill you move it, so the motion of the bolt is taken out of the equation.

but on a semi auto the motion of the bolt also adds some energy to the recoil, however you have a buffer that acts as sort of a shock absorber for the bolt. So effectively you gain some recoil with the bolt, and you lose some recoil with the buffer. A gas system like the Benelli's smooths out the motion of the bolt lessening the rearward energy even more.

So it kind of depends on the model/manufacturer and how their cycling system is set up how much recoil reduction you get.

My dad had a remington semi auto, i can't remember the model, but that thing kicked just as much as the win 1200 i usually hunted with.

Not trying to talk you out of a semi/auto by any means. Just saying less recoil isn't true with all of them. If you have shot the 1187 before and are comfortable with it, then go with what YOU are comfortable with. You have far better control over a gun you are comfortable with, and this just makes using it that much safer.
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Old 05-18-2013, 12:03 AM   #41
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No I haven't tried it. That is the problem, I can't find one to try. My hubby has 870 and it hurts my left hand just holding it for 3 seconds before any shot fired. The rest of my friends have different types of 12 gauges. I usually get a few shots off than I become a bystander. That's when I started doing research and all signs pointed to 20 vs 12, and semi auto vs pump. I love the vertical grip idea and no pistol grip. The only gun I can shoot pain-free is the AR 15 and AK 47.
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Old 05-18-2013, 12:14 AM   #42
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Well the AR vs. the AK is a good example of how much the gas system reduces the recoil. That AR kicks a lot less. The AK has a gas/piston so you feel the motion of that bolt a lot more.

Anyways, see if there is a clay/skeet range nearby. The one near us has a variety of shotguns you can rent. Maybe you could try a few out and see what they are like, and have fun shooting a round of skeet while you are at it.
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Old 05-18-2013, 12:29 AM   #43
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Well the AR vs. the AK is a good example of how much the gas system reduces the recoil. That AR kicks a lot less. The AK has a gas/piston so you feel the motion of that bolt a lot more.

Anyways, see if there is a clay/skeet range nearby. The one near us has a variety of shotguns you can rent. Maybe you could try a few out and see what they are like, and have fun shooting a round of skeet while you are at it.
I am going to call the range in the morning and see what I can rent!
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Old 05-18-2013, 12:55 AM   #44
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A semi auto uses recoil to cycle the next round therefore reducing kick. Thats partially why you are able to get on target faster. I said this before hands down for price/ function/ reliability the 870 is the winner. I also own a remmy 1100 semi auto 12 gauge trap gun with a 28" barrel. It is a pleasure to shoot. Barrel length also plays a big role in recoil. I will shoot my 28" 870 over my 18" Mossberg anyday. Another decent brand is H&R. My son has a H&R turkey gun short barrel. Bang for the buck it was hard to beat but it kicks like a donkey punched mule on steroids, the downfalls of a pump and a short barrel. Another help is the choke, if you can get a screw in choke with a compensator it makes a huge difference
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Old 05-18-2013, 12:58 AM   #45
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A semi auto uses recoil to cycle the next round therefore reducing kick. Thats partially why you are able to get on target faster. I said this before hands down for price/ function/ reliability the 870 is the winner. I also own a remmy 1100 semi auto 12 gauge trap gun with a 28" barrel. It is a pleasure to shoot. Barrel length also plays a big role in recoil. I will shoot my 28" 870 over my 18" Mossberg anyday. Another decent brand is H&R. My son has a H&R turkey gun short barrel. Bang for the buck it was hard to beat but it kicks like a donkey punched mule on steroids, the downfalls of a pump and a short barrel. Another help is the choke, if you can get a screw in choke with a compensator it makes a huge difference
The 870 is pump only and 12 gauge only though
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:08 AM   #46
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I like the 870 but something about the position of the pump release button just feels weird for me. That's my only complaint about it. Otherwise solid reliable shotty, lots of aftermarket for it. Reasonable price.

if you are set on semi auto, check out some browning's also. They can get a bit pricey too but pretty nice smooth operating guns.
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:16 AM   #47
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I guess after all the feed back from both the OP and all the posts personally i would have to lean towards a remington 1100 20 gauge. Had one of those also. The perfect quail gun in my book. Slim, great LOP and minimal recoil. Find a used one off gun broker for a good price. I paid less than $375 for my sons 1100 12 gauge
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:17 AM   #48
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And another one I've been wanting to check out myself, Weatherby SA-08. Semi/auto, comes in 12 or 20 gauge. It's more of a hunting setup and you probably won't find much aftermarket for it. But i have one of their rifles, and if their shotgun craftsmanship is anything like this rifle, I want to try one out.
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:19 AM   #49
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$375 is a good price for that. Dang sure won't find the weatherby or the browning for that price.
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:23 AM   #50
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Looks nice. And a decent price but i will take the proven 1100 over it. Im a remmy guy. I like the 11-87 but it is rich for my blood and i think the 1100 looks and feels better
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:26 AM   #51
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It was used and has minor nicks in the wood but itsa hella trap gun. Full choke, bluing is great and hes never lost a match with it
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:38 AM   #52
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A few nicks in the wood never hurt anything. It's the feel and function that matter.

I wish they still made guns with those wood stocks. My winchester has that really nice checkering and some flouer de lis looking patterns etched in. Just a really nice looking gun. Now it seems they are all that boring black synthetic stuff.

at least some of em come with a camo pattern on them. I'm a sucker for camo.
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:46 AM   #53
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A few nicks in the wood never hurt anything. It's the feel and function that matter.

I wish they still made guns with those wood stocks. My winchester has that really nice checkering and some flouer de lis looking patterns etched in. Just a really nice looking gun. Now it seems they are all that boring black synthetic stuff.

at least some of em come with a camo pattern on them. I'm a sucker for camo.
I like the " loose it if you set it next to a tree" look also but wood is warm, its the way a shotgun is meant to be. Now gimme a varmint rifle with a sympathetic stock and ive got a raging ..., and i mean a quality glass pillar bedded stock.
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:49 AM   #54
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Why not both. My M1 has a refurbished wood stock, but it's glass bedded. Heavy freakin thing but it shoots so nice.
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:55 AM   #55
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Why not both. My M1 has a refurbished wood stock, but it's glass bedded. Heavy freakin thing but it shoots so nice.
Yeah, even bedded with glass wood swells and shrinks.
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:04 AM   #56
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Yeah, even bedded with glass wood swells and shrinks.
And most wood stocks are not made of very stable wood. I love the look and feel. My 300 win mag is set in a claro walnut stock. Its walnut, i know its stable yet i hate to take it in the weather.
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:06 AM   #57
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Wouldn't be able to shoot it in "as issued" service rifle class with a synthetic stock though. Don't know if anybody even makes em for the M1 anyway. Either way, no point making changes to a work of art.
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:08 AM   #58
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Wouldn't be able to shoot it in "as issued" service rifle class with a synthetic stock though. Don't know if anybody even makes em for the M1 anyway. Either way, no point making changes to a work of art.
This is true
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:14 AM   #59
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Only thing I would change is that clumsy ammo feeding system. But they fixed that when they made the M14 anyway, so i will just have to find one of those.
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:36 AM   #60
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Only thing I would change is that clumsy ammo feeding system. But they fixed that when they made the M14 anyway, so i will just have to find one of those.
Im not a huge semi auto center fire rifle fan. The M-14 is undoubtedly a great service rifle. The AR-15 is the benchmark for a black rifle. The M-16 had serious issues when it first came out. When they got it all figured out all of them proved themselves. I would love to have a heavy barrel AR chambered in 223 wylde so i could shoot both. But there is nothing better than layin a single round in, closing the bolt, settling down and squeezing the trigger on a 2oz trigger break. I will take a remington 700 chambered in 6.5x284.
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