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Old 07-24-2010, 09:12 PM   #1
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Texas border issues....is the word getting out?

Just curious....people frequenting this forum are scattered and are hearing varying amounts of news about the seriousness of the border problems. I have been following this news item which for some reason doesn't seem to be getting national attention. I'm a frequenter on a Texas hunting forum and a lot of attention on that forum lately has centered around dangers on the US and Mexican sides of the border because of hunting leases and such.

Has anyone heard about this?
Los Zetas drug cartel seizes 2 U.S. ranches in Texas

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Old 07-24-2010, 09:33 PM   #2
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I've been following it.

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Old 07-25-2010, 10:42 AM   #3
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yeah it is a pretty big deal here
heard about them firing shots into El Paso
We recently had an American rancher killed by drug smugglers, and have stepped up security
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Old 07-25-2010, 11:33 AM   #4
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rtread,
here is a bothersome video I saw on a different thread.
Even if you only believe 10% of the statistics they spout...its too much.
Its tiresom to hear all the "activists" crying about the cruelty of our descriminatory policies towards immigrants.
Its not about immigration...immigrants are LEGAL. its about invasion....the ILLeagals who wander over and dont play by the rules.
It'll get worse. And then, it'll get BAD.
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Old 07-25-2010, 02:25 PM   #5
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these criminals continue this type of behavior because there is no punishment so in a way our government allows this to happen and it is disgusting.
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Old 07-25-2010, 02:34 PM   #6
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I hope Texas (or rick perry for that matter) sacks up and actually proposes similar legislation as AZ to control the influx here. Feds don't do their job, all they are concerned about is peddling votes. If it isn't popluar with the voting class (more over Democrats), well......it just cannot happen. I've been following it though......
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Old 07-25-2010, 06:39 PM   #7
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Remember.... The Governor.... like the President.... Cant actually "DO" anything but talk. They are prohibited by law from introducing legislation.

Its the legislature that has the power. And the back-lash against AZ has virtually guaranteed that our candy-a$$ reps in Austin/Washington wont do a (darn) thing with any meaning.

But they will talk about it until the next season of "American Idol" comes on and our microscopic attention span get distracted by something sparkly.

Same-ole....Same-ole....Smoke and mirrors...slight of hand....throw em a bone...

Cant really blame them.....no matter what they do, their constituents will just keep bitching. So its safest for them to do nothing at all. But talking gets votes.
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Old 07-25-2010, 07:26 PM   #8
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What I don't understand here is that my 75 year old mother has to remove her shoes to get on a plane because she could be the oldest terrorist in history and yet they are doing nothing about the terrorists who are literally walking across our borders. These acts of violence to me constitute terrorism. We are not allowed to move around within the borders of our homeland without being scrutinized and yet we open the doors to those whose only intent is to harm us. What gives?
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Old 07-25-2010, 07:42 PM   #9
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crazy isn't it. The government putting out a fire with a cup of gasoline. It seems today we are the bad guys while our govt. gives away our country. We are taxed and held accountable to obey our laws while non americans pay no taxes and obey no laws while reaping the benefits of our taxes. I vote in every election but it doesn't seem to make a difference. Somethings got to give.
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Old 07-25-2010, 08:56 PM   #10
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Going back to my original post, I'm concerned about a particular story that seems to be unfolding down near Laredo. A handful of small South Texas newspapers and some bloggers have picked up on the story but for some reason the national media hasn't. Seems like there are a lot of inquiries to the Laredo PD and Webb County SO and it is being stifled. Either this is one hell of a hoax or is on the verge of being one hell of a big story.

What is being reported is the drug cartel Los Zetas have taken over two ranches on the US side of the border and the ranch owners and hands have fled. Supposedly our federal, state and local police down there are huddling this weekend trying to come up with a plan.....and have imposed a news blackout.

This could be a product of the internet media....bloggers and such. Some sources I have that stay in close touch with border issues seem to think it's for real. If so, it could be a Waco/Branch Davidian type situation brewing down there. I was just wondering if others around the country have heard anything about this story.

As far as immigration issues in general.....I was raised in West Texas and grew up spending a great deal of time on ranches....either working or hunting or both. Mexicans were a part of the culture. Now they prefer other names but back then they were Mexicans. "Wetbacks" or "wets" were generally thought of as a resource for the farms and ranches. I worked side by side with these people building fences, working cattle, whatever needed to be done. I grew very fond of some of them. I could write a book about Jesus Salazar....one of the neatest guys I have ever known. Back then they were laborers. They worked hard, lived cheaply, and sent as much as they could back to Mexico to their family. They would always whip out their tattered wallets and show you their family and you just knew how it was killing them they were seperated so much of the time. But they were living an honorable life and were basically very good people.

Now, the situation is much different..... because of drugs. The hunger for drugs and the lack of two governments to effectively deal with it has created a real monster. The Mexican government is finally trying to crack down on the cartels and the cartels are fighting back. They are coming into this country with a whole different reason and a whole different attitude than they did back when I was a kid. Instead of appreciating them and even loving them, now we fear them. It is a sad, sad situation. Sorry about my rambling on.
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Old 07-25-2010, 08:58 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by JDsDream View Post
What I don't understand here is that my 75 year old mother has to remove her shoes to get on a plane because she could be the oldest terrorist in history and yet they are doing nothing about the terrorists who are literally walking across our borders. These acts of violence to me constitute terrorism. We are not allowed to move around within the borders of our homeland without being scrutinized and yet we open the doors to those whose only intent is to harm us. What gives?
couldn't have said it better
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Old 07-25-2010, 09:10 PM   #12
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See people like us and others out there that fight the fight and are out there for good makes this saying true.

I hate my goverment, but I love my country
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Old 07-25-2010, 10:38 PM   #13
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I second that statement: I hate my government, but I love my country!!
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Old 07-25-2010, 11:05 PM   #14
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I hate to point it out but it's not exactly as if there isn't anything being done or patrolled on the border. I think that episode of Dangerous Drives proves that. I'd actually probably go as far to say it's probably one of the top most patrolled boarders outside the DPRK or Israel. You're talking about 1969 miles of area (not including water) that the government has to patrol, and there isn't any real feasible way to go about this. Sorry Republicans, you can't actually build a giant wall that would actually keep anyone from coming into the county. So instead of bitching and moaning on a Jeep forum and posting unconfirmed stories (yea, at this point it's still unconfirmed and reeks of horseshit anyway), get off your ass and figure out a solution. How do you seriously protect these borders, which are simply vast stretches of desert without overburdening financial policy. Because seriously, drug cartels are a problem for southwestern communities.

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the ILLeagals who wander over and dont play by the rules.
Play by what rules? It's impossible to come here from Mexico unless you're well off (and the way to being well off in Mexico is...). Most come with no intention to stay, but to work in jobs that no Americans will take (I can tell you this from experience).

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I hate my goverment, but I love my country
It's a government you allowed to get into power. And yes, you are 1 out of roughly 200 million eligible voters, and you have every other person who thinks they're right.

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Back then they were laborers. They worked hard, lived cheaply, and sent as much as they could back to Mexico to their family. They would always whip out their tattered wallets and show you their family and you just knew how it was killing them they were seperated so much of the time. But they were living an honorable life and were basically very good people
And a majority still are. Don't lump all Mexicans as gun-toting drug-cartel scumbags because that's what's in the news everyday. Many that still come to work still face the same hardships of being away from home, I still work with many of them.

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here is a bothersome video I saw on a different thread.
I had to stop when she goes, "likely the snack packages will become litter," like illegal aliens food provisions are causing the troublesome problems of litter in the United States. Get this troll fodder out of here
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Old 07-26-2010, 01:07 AM   #15
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Spoken like someone who does NOT have a green card! Yeah, I am one of many who DO vote and because I DO vote, I CAN voice my opinion. Just because you watch a TV show "Dangerous Drives" that makes you an expert on border patrol?

I personally would rather believe the eyewitness account of someone who actually LIVES in Texas. You have been too much. Of course, if my food stamps, welfare and general free ride was being threatened, I'd be upset too, so I can see where your drivel comes from.
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Old 07-26-2010, 01:40 AM   #16
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Here's the problem with our border patrol...

What We Have
A bunch of guys driving pickup trucks with handguns that are rarely ever fired...they cruise the border and when they approach groups of illegals, they panic and bolt in all different directions. Occasionally the officers manage to capture and deport a few back to Mexico, who just try again (and succeed) with another group the following week. This isn't necessarily the fault of the border patrol...but rather the government. They are understaffed, underarmed, and aren't allowed to shoot illegals just because they're crossing the border illegally.





What We Need


Enough said.

The problem won't be solved overnight...but it sure will do more than the guys currently cruising around in pickup trucks.
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Old 07-27-2010, 07:59 AM   #17
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Spoken like someone who does NOT have a green card! Yeah, I am one of many who DO vote and because I DO vote, I CAN voice my opinion. Just because you watch a TV show "Dangerous Drives" that makes you an expert on border patrol?

I personally would rather believe the eyewitness account of someone who actually LIVES in Texas. You have been too much. Of course, if my food stamps, welfare and general free ride was being threatened, I'd be upset too, so I can see where your drivel comes from.
You replied to absolutely nothing I stated, and instead chose the route to insult me. The typical strategy of the modern Republican, all rhetoric no actual solution. I saw it when I saw McCain (who by the way used my beer pong table to campaign in PA ) and I'll continue to not vote Republican until they start coming up with actual solutions rather then insulting the other guy.

I'm very happily a citizen of the US, a Polak, but a citizen of the US. And I referenced Dangerous Drives because the show actually showed how capable the US border patrol is and how many different types of vehicles are utilized, including Jeeps and Humvees (which are tame considering some other ones). Plus, they have boats, aircraft, cameras, electronic proxy sensors. Underarmed? Everyone is issued a H&K P2000, plus they have 12 gauge Remington Model 870s, and access to submachine guns. Thanks for spewing nonsense. Underfunded? So is every other protection agency in the United States. So no, enjoy the "eye witness" anecdote accounts of nut-jobs who saw some brown-people in their local convenience store and will call it an illegal Mexican gang. Again, the fact still stands, the border is almost 2,000 miles long there is no possible way to stop everyone from coming over. And no, sniping them isn't really a politically viable solution, I think you'd have more then a few governments and NGOs upset over that one. So instead of again getting sucked into the typical Us against Them rhetoric, think of a realistic possible solution to illegal immigrants coming in from Mexico, a majority who are simply coming for work and are taking jobs that you would never even touch.

Oh and I'm a Polack from NJ... and before you say that I don't have to deal with illegal immigrants - we have 8th highest est. population of illegal immigrants and a higher per capital pop. then Texas and California (and actually possibly the highest, but I don't have time to calculate all of them).
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Old 07-27-2010, 09:55 AM   #18
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Most come with no intention to stay, but to work in jobs that no Americans will take (I can tell you this from experience).
From your experience maybe but what I see are illegal aliens taking jobs for half the pay that others would work for because they can't ask for more or they go back home.
If the ceo's pay didn't go up exponentially every year and the workers pay decrease legal workers would be doing the work.
Harley is talking about closing the plants here in WI because it cost to much to pay workers here but look at this poor guy Harley CEO received $6.4 million pay package for 2009 - JSOnline
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Harley-Davidson CEO Keith Wandell received a pay package valued at $6.4 million during his first eight months on the job, according to a Securities and Exchange Commission filing.

Wandell received a base salary of $650,025 from his start date of May 1, 2009, through the end of the year, according to the recent filing. He received a bonus of $780,030 and stock and option awards valued at $4.9 million at the time they were issued.

Wandell also received other compensation worth $22,515, which included a cash payment of $19,733.

Wandell, 60, replaced James Ziemer, who retired last year after 40 years with Harley-Davidson and four years as its chief executive. Previously, Wandell was chief operating officer of Johnson Controls Inc.

Ziemer received a pay package valued at $2.9 million during his final four months at Harley. That included a base salary of $455,144, a bonus of the same amount, and stock and options valued at $1.9 million when they were granted.
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Old 07-27-2010, 09:56 AM   #19
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This is one of those topics that will soon enough be locked.

I live in Texas, I have an opinion. But Its been expressed already by others, so I won't bother. Okay I will. Illegals are called illegal for a reason. they are breaking a law coming in. Some break many laws while coming in. Personally I am of the opinion that shooting them on sight is a very good plan. They have legal means to get into our country, and if they choose to take the illegal route, then there should be a real punishment for this (rather than simple deportation - see revolving door)

Our Border Patrol is a very good group of guys/gals, doing the job to the best that they are allowed to.(Vietnam anyone) If we were more like the rest of the world we'd have more control over our borders. (no not absolute control, but it'd be closer to that). YOu cannot win a war when your hands are tied.
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Old 07-27-2010, 10:32 AM   #20
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The border patrol are like our soldiers doing a peace keeping mission, They are not allowed to use force ,their hands are tied to try and stop the deluge of illigals. I have no problem if they come over and work on becoming legal citizens and contribute to our society, pay your taxes, get off the welfare system and at least attempt to learn english. That is my soap box, learn the language of the country you want to live in, why should we cater to them and put everything in both languages so they do not have to learn it, why do we provide spanish speaking teachers in school? I would never go to mexico,spain or germany and expect everyone to learn or have everything in english
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Old 07-27-2010, 01:05 PM   #21
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i say when we "finish up" over in afghan, we send our troops down to arizona and texas and see what 40,000 troops on the border do... even if we deported innocents and shot those carrying weapons and intended harm. it would be even harder for them to invade our country.

and the jobs they get paid to do because we wouldnt dare do is all because of money.... and mostly because of the corporations that hire them... i work for a relatively small company and its sad to see that they are heading down a road of bankruptsy because the "heads" that cause more problems than they fix have to be paid and the lower people get pay cuts and somehow we can bearly pay the bills... but the company cars and company houses and company execs get paid too much for what they do.....hmmmmmm


and as for the original post, if this is the case, i hope the media gets a hold of it. im thinking a story like this might wake up the people that dont deal with it on a daily basis or even concern themselves with whats going on down there... only way to get something done in the US through the government is to have enough people and some in the right positions to scream out in protest to our governements inaction
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Old 07-27-2010, 01:23 PM   #22
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I think this country is going to the crapper! We need tougher immigration laws period but they are looking at potiential voters. I say Arizona is on the right track but maybe on the wrong road. The legal immigrats are allowed to vote and the politicans are chomping at the bit to get them votes and get them taxes. I think the government need to get with the program and put a stop to this blood letting of illegals. The U.S. has law for this, now the government needs to enforce them.
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Old 07-27-2010, 01:33 PM   #23
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stupid idea clicking on this post, knew i would lose a ton of respect for some of you. oh well back to what matters, jeep talk
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Old 07-27-2010, 01:33 PM   #24
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Don't be surprised to hear Obama wants to open the borders completely.Look what he is doing in Zona.I see it coming.If they were really concerned about this problem,the guard would be in full force down there.They aren't.Any that have been sent there is just a bandage to appease the people.Just no money to be made with military opposition there.The really big cartels are just laughing at us and making coin off our dopeheads and the greedy.Be the first one on your block to bag a cartel member and mexico will cry and our government will stuff your ass off in prison somewheres.
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Old 07-27-2010, 01:43 PM   #25
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wonder why Mexico doesnt have the same problem as us....hmmm....

what do they do on the borders in eastern Europe? poverty on one side, hope on the other? how do they keep control of their borders?
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Old 07-27-2010, 01:45 PM   #26
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Ask a Bosnian.
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Old 07-27-2010, 02:36 PM   #27
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When I sit here and read these posts,I think of Imagine by Lennon.I want change,but not from a puppet.Not from a controlling interest in whats best for me.I'll decide that myself thank you.I happen to find different cultures stimulating and exciting.When we stop learning we become stifled in our progression.If a problem arises due to conflict of ideas,be open minded enough to learn the differences and move on from there.Just because you don't agree,doesn't mean you can't help someone.Remember our children are watching everything we do and how we react.Thats where the real change has to come from-how our kids look at things.Don't you think?
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Old 07-27-2010, 04:28 PM   #28
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wonder why Mexico doesnt have the same problem as us....hmmm....

what do they do on the borders in eastern Europe? poverty on one side, hope on the other? how do they keep control of their borders?
Actually, many eastern EU countries face the same problem as we do with Russians coming into the EU. And you know what they do? Work with Russia through EU-Russia Consiliums to actually propose REALISTIC ways to allow Russians to come into the EU to work and attend school. With Africans coming into Italy and Malta, typically they're similarly they're rounded up and deported back, and those who make it cause the same crime problems they do here (often they serve as the frontlines for Mafia counterfeiting operations in Italy and abroad in Europe). And Igrok, while I don't claim to be an expert, the European Union is my area of study in college and I actually got to mock the role of the PM of Malta and deal with these immigration issues And if you ask a Bosnian, it wouldn't matter since pretty soon they'll have an EU citizenship and will be able to travel all over the EU to work and live. The EU is very sensitive to conflict in that area (and to be honest, it's mostly over resources) But even now, traveling from Bosnia into Croatia is little more then border checks, and you could get a temporary working visa.

Ugh, and again, as interesting as a plan as it would be, you can't shoot people on sight. It would simply spark snipers from the other side of the border to snipe at and shoot Americans, and then you have a fun border conflict.

And baja, hearing any politician say they want to completely open the borders would be political suicide. What Obama wants to do is take a group that are currently illegal and not looking to leave anytime soon and offer them a chance to assimilate and become legal migrants to this country. What that means is they're registered and pay taxes, supporting the same thing that Igrok complained about before. That's not saying I fully support a move like that, but the idea is that if we expect those who come here from Mexico to register as migrants with visas - then the half pay that yote talked about would be a moot benefit.


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stupid idea clicking on this post, knew i would lose a ton of respect for some of you. oh well back to what matters, jeep talk
aww c'mon, it's a political thread, I've gotta bite. The rules are simple, you leave this thread and all the baggage within it and continue the Jeeping in the others.
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Old 07-27-2010, 05:06 PM   #29
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I hate to point it out but it's not exactly as if there isn't anything being done or patrolled on the border. I think that episode of Dangerous Drives proves that. I'd actually probably go as far to say it's probably one of the top most patrolled boarders outside the DPRK or Israel. You're talking about 1969 miles of area (not including water) that the government has to patrol, and there isn't any real feasible way to go about this.
Nonsense. Nobody is saying nothing is being done, people are saying not enough is being done. Our border patrol have had their hands tied by bleeding heart liberals who whine and cry every time some ILLEGAL alien is inconvenienced.

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Sorry Republicans, you can't actually build a giant wall that would actually keep anyone from coming into the county.
Again, nonsense. We have had the technology for some time to detect and track anything larger than a rat crossing the border, implementing that technology wouldn't cost anywhere near what illegal aliens costs us now in law enforcement, medical care, education and social services.
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Originally Posted by burton160w View Post
So instead of bitching and moaning on a Jeep forum and posting unconfirmed stories (yea, at this point it's still unconfirmed and reeks of horseshit anyway), get off your ass and figure out a solution. How do you seriously protect these borders, which are simply vast stretches of desert without overburdening financial policy. Because seriously, drug cartels are a problem for southwestern communities.
The solutions have been proposed. The fight to get them implemented requires combating the massive disinformation put out by both sides of the isle that perceive a benefit from maintaining the situation as it stands for cheap labor, or granting amnesty in hopes of gaining a large voting block.



Quote:
Originally Posted by burton160w View Post
Play by what rules? It's impossible to come here from Mexico unless you're well off (and the way to being well off in Mexico is...).
Nonsense, when I worked in California I worked with several Mexicans that lived in Mexico and worked in America, they were hardly well off. They also tended to dislike the criminals that took the easy way out and snuck across the border.
Quote:
Originally Posted by burton160w View Post
Most come with no intention to stay, but to work in jobs that no Americans will take (I can tell you this from experience).
Jobs Americans won't take? And which jobs would those be? I grew up picking fruit and veggies alongside immigrant workers. I've worked scraping shit in a chicken ranch, I've spent time shoveling shit on a cattle ranch. My dad worked construction in Nevada until illegals and those that hire them drove wages so low that it was no longer reasonable. Jobs Americans won't do is nonsense, just watch a couple episodes of Dirty Jobs. Jobs Americans won't do for shit wages is a lot closer to the truth.

This shouldn't exist in America. Actual enforcement is the only way to stop it.

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