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Topic Review (Newest First)
03-14-2012 08:12 PM
dentguy I am very impressed with everyone willing to take the time to help others out! As for the HEI, im thinking that the pick up could have been bad since i tested everything else. Nothing else could really be the problem so im sending it back and exchanging for another new one
03-14-2012 07:09 PM
Always Stuck [QUOTE=dentguy;2137250]So i just finished wiring all the old stuff back in and BAM...started up as easily as it used to. Set the timing but i still need to adjust (running rich..eyes burning) but, its running...until i forgot to put the vacuum hose back on the advance and eventually flooded it again while revving up from idle. So long story short, i think i may have gotten a bad HEI dizzy since its runnung now with the old dizzy. I do have to point out that i got more help and suggestions from everyone here than i did from anywhere else so THANKS EVERYONE. That was my 2nd HEI i have put in before and i never had so much trouble. Jeeps are definately like women...lol[/QUOTE

Your ABSOLUTELY right this forum has the best people. There always willing to jump in and help.

Glad to here you got it running and I'm sure you'll get the HEI in and working well.
03-14-2012 11:51 AM
darkproximity
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2xs
I will never understand why you guys call a distributor a dizzy....
The professional in me flinches every time i see it....

So, you have stock timing components in it again? are you going to try the GM HEI again at a later date?
The english call it a dizzy.. makes sense, distributor that spins in circles...
03-14-2012 08:09 AM
dentguy Yes all my old oem components are back in. I haven't given up on the HEI and going to go at it again once I get the new exchange. I haven't heard much about the upgrade kits for the old distributors so I may look into that
03-14-2012 04:51 AM
2xs I will never understand why you guys call a distributor a dizzy....
The professional in me flinches every time i see it....

So, you have stock timing components in it again? are you going to try the GM HEI again at a later date?
03-13-2012 08:55 PM
dentguy So i just finished wiring all the old stuff back in and BAM...started up as easily as it used to. Set the timing but i still need to adjust (running rich..eyes burning) but, its running...until i forgot to put the vacuum hose back on the advance and eventually flooded it again while revving up from idle. So long story short, i think i may have gotten a bad HEI dizzy since its runnung now with the old dizzy. I do have to point out that i got more help and suggestions from everyone here than i did from anywhere else so THANKS EVERYONE. That was my 2nd HEI i have put in before and i never had so much trouble. Jeeps are definately like women...lol
03-13-2012 07:56 PM
dentguy Im 100% certain of TDC. Im using a pressure gauge in the #1 plug hole. I havent had much time to do a whole lot but i do have everthing old back in and wired. I just went and got a starter switch so i can crank it over while moving the distributor until it catches. I did get new plugs with the HEI as well as 8.5 mm wires. I just got the new capaciter/condenser i ordered friday for the old dizzy since the other broke. Im getting ready to start so wish me luck!!!
03-13-2012 04:03 PM
aelwero
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master4th View Post
As far as I know when setting a distributer the vacuum advance position doesn't dictate anything. I could be wrong, however [Always Stuck] is dead on. Cylinder 1 at TDC - Then with the Cap off, point the rotor to #1 Cylinder.
absolutely NOTHING

it absolutely positively does not matter which way the vacuum can points, which way the rotor points, which port you hook up as the #1 cyl...

1. line up at TDC (not just align the timing mark, it passes twice per cyl., but all that's been covered already. finger over the plug port works perfectly). Anyone saying you are "180 off" is referring to the issue you have if you line up the timing mark at the TDC mark and just assume that it's on the compression stroke when it isn't. make sure you're checking compression on the #1 cylinder too... (you laugh, but I've seen it, even on an inline engine).

2. drop the rotor in. alignment doesn't matter...

3. line up the vacuum can wherever you want. alignment STILL doesn't matter.

4. note where the rotor is pointing, and put the cap on. the point that is sitting on top of the rotor location is your #1 cyl. Alignment now matters, and will until you're running.

5. put the plug wires on in the right order based on the #1 you figured out.

6. crank the engine while rotating the cap slightly in either direction, and you'll find a "sweet spot" area where it fires, and adjust timing from there, by sound or by light.


I know all this has been covered by multiple folks here and there, but this is step by step, and any of these guys that have done timing will tell you that if you do have spark, (BTW, put a plug into a wire and lay it on the block to check, you may have low voltage, bad wire ends, etc. etc...) and you go through those 6 steps, step by step, it HAS TO fire.

also, haven't seen it mentioned yet, but HEI doesn't like the older plug wires... did you upgrade to 8mm or better when you swapped?
03-13-2012 03:03 PM
Always Stuck
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2xs View Post
^ agreed, however someone above is convinced it will huff and backfire, so instead of arguing and polluting this guys thread, I decided to:


His logic might be the reason he is Always Stuck
LMAO

But keep in mind, when I'm stuck I always have spark.
03-13-2012 02:07 PM
2xs
Quote:
Originally Posted by tchoberg View Post
(I am assuming your TOP DEAD CENTER of #1 cylinder is set on the COMPRESSION stroke. Once you have your #1 cylinder set at TDC, then you can drop in your dizzy. Per DrZ above)

Double check the timing and setup per the previous post by DrZ keeping in mind that TDC and the crankshaft timing mark will align both on the compression stroke AND the exhaust stroke.

MAKE SURE THAT THAT YOU ARE SETTING THE TIMING ON THE COMPRESSION STROKE TDC AND NOT THE EXHAUST STROKE TDC.

If the old setup does not work I believe 99.99% you are timing to the exhaust stroke rather than the compression stroke. My 2 cents. Ted
^ agreed, however someone above is convinced it will huff and backfire, so instead of arguing and polluting this guys thread, I decided to:


His logic might be the reason he is Always Stuck
03-13-2012 12:26 PM
tchoberg (I am assuming your TOP DEAD CENTER of #1 cylinder is set on the COMPRESSION stroke. Once you have your #1 cylinder set at TDC, then you can drop in your dizzy. Per DrZ above)

Double check the timing and setup per the previous post by DrZ keeping in mind that TDC and the crankshaft timing mark will align both on the compression stroke AND the exhaust stroke.

MAKE SURE THAT THAT YOU ARE SETTING THE TIMING ON THE COMPRESSION STROKE TDC AND NOT THE EXHAUST STROKE TDC.

If the old setup does not work I believe 99.99% you are timing to the exhaust stroke rather than the compression stroke. My 2 cents. Ted
03-12-2012 04:50 PM
dentguy UPDATE>>> Im at once TDC. Put in the old dizzy, coil etc and guess what??? I still have nothing. Im tracing wires as i get time to do so but so far still no luck. The new dizzy is being returned and exchanged just to rule it out. As im writing this im currently waiting for a new condenser/capaciter to come in since the original broke. Once i get the old wiring back where it should be then i suppose im going to check the ignition switch. Not sure what else to do. On a good note, my jeep looks pretty good taking up my entire garage and i figure if i have time i can atleast change my ball joints and exhaust that i got months ago...haha
03-11-2012 08:15 PM
DrZ ok,ok,ok..........let's stop all the nonsense in guess work. my bruddah.......let's start from the BEGINNING. since you are certain your dizzi is GOOD; you have good voltage to it; wiring is correct (duh, only 2 wires, right?)......now let's go into TDC issue.

I am assuming your TOP DEAD CENTER of #1 cylinder is set on the COMPRESSION stroke. Once you have your #1 cylinder set at TDC, then you can drop in your dizzy. IT DOES NOT MATTER WHICH TERMINAL YOU CHOOSE TO POINT THE ROTOR TO when you select your #1 cylinder location on the distributor, just make sure you mark it #1 and follow the firing order from that point on, when you connect the plug wires. (firing order on 4.2 I6 is 1-5-3-6-2-4). Again, I recommend that the vaccum advance faces forward towards the fron of the vehicle, and the rotor for #1 cylinder is set to the first couple terminal positions right of the vacuum advance.
Once the rotor is marked to the #1 cylinder location which you chose to be on the distributor, follow the firing order by connecting your sparkplug wires accordingly. When you are ready to fire the vehicle, it may not start right away. If it does not, then advance the dizzy by turning it counter clockwise a bit and then try again to fire it. Continue incrimentaly advancing the dizzy and turning the engine over until the engine fires up, then from that point on just set your timing according to what shows on the dizzy calibration. Good Luck.
03-10-2012 01:19 AM
Redrider94
Quote:
Originally Posted by dentguy
Im getting my TDC by removing the plugs, rotating the engine clockwise by wrench and until the mark on the dampener is at 0 then im double checking by inspecting the piston itself is at the top of the cylinder and then checking again by looking into the oil cap hole and looking to see if the rocker for cylinder 1 is level
Are you removing #1 plug and making sure you are on the compression stroke when you set the the timing mark at 0 ?

With #1 plug removed turn the engine with your wrench while you hold your finger over the #1 plug opening when you feel compression set your timing marks to "0".
This is " TDC". Now look at your rotor, it should be on #1 plug wire, if not remove the distributor and reinstall so rotor is lined up with #1 on the cap.
If rotor is correct after you set TDC then one of two things could be wrong,
"1" you have a bad distributor or
"2" you have wiring errors
If the engine was running proper when you did your distributor swap then these are about the only things that could be wrong. Hope this helps and good luck, make sure you let us know when you get it running, even if it turns out that the problem was something that you did or did not due correct other people can learn from our mistakes and save someone else the headaches you've had. Good luck!!
03-09-2012 11:48 PM
dentguy I am beginning to think its time to start back tracking. I put the old dizzy and coil back in and its still doing the same. Im almost positive i didnt jack the wiring up and i reconnected all the old wiring and its still not starting. Hmm...looks like i may be tracing things tomorrow.
03-09-2012 08:54 PM
Nubby55 If you have tryed to start this engine that much you may have washed all the oil off the rings and have no compression left to start the engine just drag it the cylinders pull the plugs and give it a squirt or two of oil in each hole to regain some lub, roll it over a few times and then try to figger out your timing.
03-09-2012 08:20 PM
darkproximity
Quote:
Originally Posted by dentguy
Im getting my TDC by removing the plugs, rotating the engine clockwise by wrench and until the mark on the dampener is at 0 then im double checking by inspecting the piston itself is at the top of the cylinder and then checking again by looking into the oil cap hole and looking to see if the rocker for cylinder 1 is level
The way I've always set TDC.. remove plug one (no need to remove all).. have someone else turn the motor over clockwise, put your finger over the hole for spark plug 1 and have them turn until you feel air rushing out past your finger, once you feel it then cylinder one has begun its compression stroke. All thats left is turning it until your timing mark notch is on 0
03-09-2012 07:05 PM
Always Stuck
Quote:
Originally Posted by dentguy View Post
Im getting my TDC by removing the plugs, rotating the engine clockwise by wrench and until the mark on the dampener is at 0 then im double checking by inspecting the piston itself is at the top of the cylinder and then checking again by looking into the oil cap hole and looking to see if the rocker for cylinder 1 is level
And after doing all that you are at #1 on the distributor cap and still have nothing.

Did you try spinning it over while turning the cap.
03-09-2012 06:23 PM
dentguy Im getting my TDC by removing the plugs, rotating the engine clockwise by wrench and until the mark on the dampener is at 0 then im double checking by inspecting the piston itself is at the top of the cylinder and then checking again by looking into the oil cap hole and looking to see if the rocker for cylinder 1 is level
03-09-2012 01:54 PM
Redrider94 I have a question, would you tell us how you are setting the engine to top dead center, I know this sounds like a stupid question but just want to make sure you are doing it the proper way. I've seen people that say they set it correct, then when they explained how they did it it was improper. I'm not saying anything bad about you just want to help you figure this out!! If it ran fine before and now not at all you've got something set wrong.
03-09-2012 10:08 AM
Always Stuck If it didn't backfire it would at least huff threw the carb from the residual gas trying to fire. He would hear it and know something was wrong at that point. But he's getting nothing.

As far as the position of the vacuum advance, don't concern yourself with that right now.

Have someone turn the motor over while you spin the distributor. It's not going to hurt anything and will tell you allot. Turn it both ways to see if you get anything. If you have spark, it will either fire up or kick but not start. Do this so we have some answers.
03-08-2012 09:47 PM
2xs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Always Stuck View Post
If the distributor was 180* off you would backfiring. You haven't mentioned that and I'm under the impression it just turns over with no indication of trying to start.
Uuum, no it tries to fire on the opposite cylinders exhaust TDC, just before the intake valve opens, this is the same theroy used in DIS, and why DIS systems on 4.0L Jeeps dont backfire on the waste spark side....
03-08-2012 09:07 PM
Master4th As far as I know when setting a distributer the vacuum advance position doesn't dictate anything. I could be wrong, however [Always Stuck] is dead on. Cylinder 1 at TDC - Then with the Cap off, point the rotor to #1 Cylinder.
03-08-2012 08:23 PM
dentguy I wish it would backfire or something but it just turns over. I have had it at TDC numerous times and still nothing. I dont know if it really matters a whole lot but one problem i have been having is the manual is saying to have the vacuum advance pointing to the passenger side but does that mean it needs to point in the general direction facing the passenger side towards the front of the vehicle or facing the passenger side to the rear. I posted a pic of it and someone said it looks like the vacumm advance is 90 degrees clockwise too far and the i had someone say the opposite
03-08-2012 06:49 PM
Always Stuck Something is probably wrong with the timing because you said it ran fine before you took it apart. Statically time the engine. Remove the 12v wire to the distributor and take out the #1 spark plug. Get the #1 piston to the top with the starter or by turning the engine over with a wrench. Remove the distributor cap to make sure the rotor is pointed to #1 wire on the distributor cap. Replace the #1 spark plug and 12v lead to the distributor. At this point the engine is showing you were #1 wire should be. This way your not just matching it up to the old distributor and you know it's properly timed.

If the distributor was 180* off you would backfiring. You haven't mentioned that and I'm under the impression it just turns over with no indication of trying to start.

If you do this you you'll know two thing.
It's correctly timed to #1 on the cap and TDC and you know you have spark.

I haven't done an HEI swap in a 4.2 Jeep but I be leave you need to time it when your get it running, unlike my 4.0 that only sits in one way, you can turn your distributor for timing purposes. Did you try turning the cap while spinning the motor to see if there was any change. Turn it as far as you can in both directions. It's either going to start or backfire if it's in the timing. If you get nothing, were looking in the wrong place for answers.
03-07-2012 11:21 PM
dentguy Im definately getting fuel. I just had someone ask me if after i set the engine at TDC and the new dizzy installed if i manually turned the engine to advanced the timing to 8 degrees on the timing marks before i started it the first time. Does that sound right? Am i supposed to set the timing up to 8 degrees after i have everything done before i start it cause i was understanding that the timing could only be set while the engine is running? It makes sense
03-07-2012 11:03 PM
2xs
Quote:
Originally Posted by dentguy View Post
I do have spark and do you mean 180 out as far as trying to position the new dizzy 180 degrees from where it should be after TDC
Yes. BUT, check for fuel first, not fuel pressure, but fuel delivery....

Spray a little carb cleaner in the intake and then try to start it.
03-07-2012 10:31 PM
Master4th I don't recall if said it or not, did you make sure your getting fuel?
I was fixing something on my 89 and broke the wire to the fuel pump. Took me all night and finally my uncles friend figured it out.
03-07-2012 10:06 PM
dentguy I do have spark and do you mean 180 out as far as trying to position the new dizzy 180 degrees from where it should be after TDC
03-07-2012 10:04 PM
dentguy Yes I did run a wire from the battery directly to the new dizzy and still wouldnt start. Im definately puzzled still so first thing in the morning im unplugging the wire from the ballast resistor and trying that. I will go through the whole process and start fresh again and see if i get something different. If not then i will send the dizzy back and either instal new stock or try another brand
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