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Topic Review (Newest First)
06-26-2013 01:00 PM
Silverton34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckamiller View Post
I had the warranty before. Paid more for it the first time (wasn't a forum member then) didn't know any better. So they refunded it and then charged me less so that was positive cash, got high blue book on the trade and that was positive cash. They rolled that back in to offset all the diff and I walked out with maybe a little less value in the jeep. Sticker on my original was just over $37k, this one was just over 36k but I got what I wanted and it didn't cost me the grand I was about to pay to get a soft top which I didn't get on my first one. I know they made money or they wouldn't do the deal and I got what I wanted and erased a years worth of wear and tear.

I had never heard of this approach from a dealer, so I wanted to share my experience. It seems that it is common in some areas and the more informed we all are about these things the better consumers we are...and we can get the best deal possible.
Something sounds strange, how many months is your new loan? Are you sure that is the number of monthly payments remaining on the old loan?
06-26-2013 12:53 PM
TranquilTurtle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noble View Post

I agree. If you have a good salesman and he or she gives you Great service and you can buy the car at invoice, the salesman usually earns a $100-$200 commission. Maybe $50.00 for the sales manager. The holdback is maybe $800.00. That means after they pay the comissions it leaves the dealerships with $550.00 profit on a $30,000.00 investment. After a free tank of gas, full detail, paying 3-4% floorplan interest and paying all the overhead, the dealer doesnt make nearly as much as people think.
I would love anybody to tell show me a business transaction that nets a $400 profit on a $30,000 sale.
If you have a great service oriented salesman they need to sell 8 cars a month to meet industry average. Thats $1600.00 a month.
You sure hit the nail right on the head bud. The car sales industry is a tough one to succeed in with today's market being so unbelievably competitive.
For every car sale there are a few people who need to be paid:
The dealership owner
The sales manager
The finance manager
The sales professional
The detailer
When a customer pays under or close to invoice that doesn't leave a whole lot of $$$ to pay all those nice people who are passionate about trying to help nice folks own new vehicles.
06-26-2013 11:54 AM
Chuckamiller I had the warranty before. Paid more for it the first time (wasn't a forum member then) didn't know any better. So they refunded it and then charged me less so that was positive cash, got high blue book on the trade and that was positive cash. They rolled that back in to offset all the diff and I walked out with maybe a little less value in the jeep. Sticker on my original was just over $37k, this one was just over 36k but I got what I wanted and it didn't cost me the grand I was about to pay to get a soft top which I didn't get on my first one. I know they made money or they wouldn't do the deal and I got what I wanted and erased a years worth of wear and tear.

I had never heard of this approach from a dealer, so I wanted to share my experience. It seems that it is common in some areas and the more informed we all are about these things the better consumers we are...and we can get the best deal possible.
06-26-2013 11:37 AM
Silverton34 So no money out of pocket, no higher payment and no extension for months of loan, and a warranty. They would have to give you more for your trade than the new Jeep costs and then charge for the warranty to zero out the trade difference. So the trade difference was truly ZERO?
06-26-2013 12:18 AM
st1264
Quote:
Originally Posted by HKSkook View Post
The problem is there isn't 3k in mark up in them.
Invoice is about 7-8% and people routinely get 3 or 4% more than that... so there is more room to move on the sticker price when you factor in the 'hold back' and the kickback from the bank if there is financing involved.

This sales tactic is a common practice. I didn't look at the OP's numbers, but the salesperson got a new sale and a premium used Wrangler to make money on. As long as both parties are happy, all is well. It seems the OP is happy with the deal.
06-26-2013 12:12 AM
coelement777 there has to be some sort of incentive out there on 2013 jk's right now. the offers i got ranged from $100 over invoice to $400 under
06-25-2013 11:39 PM
JeepCourtney3700 @Noble, I won't screw over an honest and legit car salesman if I get the impression that he's not a sleazeball and he's not playing games. The middle ground between invoice and MSRP is what I aim for because good sales people deserve to be thrown a bone every once and a while, especially if they put in their due dillegence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schocker65 View Post
Thank you for this. That is all.
You're welcome, did it make you feel better? Because honestly, I held back.

And @woansleftpeg, I said that ridiculous stuff in humor; I may negotiate useful goodies to be thrown in as part of the MSRP package, but I would never use my money in the purpose of resorting to belittling or degrading someone - anyone - for the purpose of my pleasure.

I would never put someone at my mercy in the interest of them gaining my dollar - that's disgusting. Funny to imagine but disgusting in real life. Everyone's entitled to being treated with kindness, dignity, courtesy and respect. I expect it and I give others it until they give me a reason not to.

I said what I said earlier only in clowning - I would never do it.
06-25-2013 10:16 PM
Schocker65
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepCourtney3700 View Post
Dude, you fell hook, line and sinker for typical dealer bs games but good for you for getting a new Wrangler in the process.

A strange deal would have been if you agreed to pay MSRP but then made basic requests, followed by off the wall requests to be included in the msrp and you put them all in bullet points and in writing.

Each point has to be met and in that order otherwise you walk.

Start by having the dealership add in a bunch of mopar goodies (lift, tires, wheels, bumpers), then ask for food and soda. Then ask for a cigar. Then an escort. Then the sales man run around the dealership without pants. And then ask for a pony who the finance manager will ride in his underwear and call her tonka while "my little pony" plays over the PA system. As the list goes on, make the requests more and more bizarre.

Let those be the points of negotiation.
Thank you for this. That is all.
06-25-2013 09:58 PM
coelement777 I take delivery of my new wrangler in just over 12 hours. The only face to face contact i will have is to sign the papers and get the keys, i did all the negotiating through email, and ended up paying $400 under invoice on a 2013 sport with 3.73's and a/c, no other options. They are even sending someone to pick me up as i am not trading anything in. It might be different if you finance. I am paying cash and already have the cashiers check so there will be no last minute price changes.
06-25-2013 08:36 PM
woansleftpeg
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepCourtney3700 View Post
Dude, you fell hook, line and sinker for typical dealer bs games but good for you for getting a new Wrangler in the process.

A strange deal would have been if you agreed to pay MSRP but then made basic requests, followed by off the wall requests to be included in the msrp and you put them all in bullet points and in writing.

Each point has to be met and in that order otherwise you walk.

Start by having the dealership add in a bunch of mopar goodies (lift, tires, wheels, bumpers), then ask for food and soda. Then ask for a cigar. Then an escort. Then the sales man run around the dealership without pants. And then ask for a pony who the finance manager will ride in his underwear and call her tonka while "my little pony" plays over the PA system. As the list goes on, make the requests more and more bizarre.

Let those be the points of negotiation.
It's a tactic called "chipping" in the sales world and it's one of the most effective things you can do. Figure out everything you want, then rank the from the biggest to the smallest and start at the top. Once you get agreement, move on to the next on the list. The way to counter it as a salesman is through isolation, effectively - "if I can do this for you, do we have a deal?" Agree to that, but then when he gives you the deal, move on to the the next one.

When he says "I thought we had a deal" tell him that you just need this one more thing, and if he says he can't do it, ask him if he's willing to lose a $30K deal (or whatever the price is) for the sake of a set of floor mats (or whatever your chip is). Be prepared to walk if he says he is. He'll call you back.

You won't get all the way through your list, and if you do your list wasn't big enough. The key is to make sure you start with the biggest thing first, and get progressively smaller/cheaper/less important. His ability/need to do the deal will decrease with your need/desire to have that next thing on your list, until you reach the point at which he has no money left in the deal that he can give away and you don't really care about the things you haven't got.
06-25-2013 08:25 PM
Noble
Quote:
Originally Posted by TranquilTurtle
Everyone has a right to hunt for the best deal possible, everyone has a right to question the dealership until they are satisfied they are not being ripped off. Please remember that sales associates have a right to feed their families as well
I agree. If you have a good salesman and he or she gives you Great service and you can buy the car at invoice, the salesman usually earns a $100-$200 commission. Maybe $50.00 for the sales manager. The holdback is maybe $800.00. That means after they pay the comissions it leaves the dealerships with $550.00 profit on a $30,000.00 investment. After a free tank of gas, full detail, paying 3-4% floorplan interest and paying all the overhead, the dealer doesnt make nearly as much as people think.
I would love anybody to tell show me a business transaction that nets a $400 profit on a $30,000 sale.
If you have a great service oriented salesman they need to sell 8 cars a month to meet industry average. Thats $1600.00 a month.
06-25-2013 08:13 PM
michiganadam
Quote:
Originally Posted by pat_smith1969 View Post
I don't seen this as being that bizzar. I get that it is a tactic to get you into the dealership.... but having said that. My wife is on her FOURTH Nissan Murano. Every two years they call her (or corner her when she is getting the oil change) and offer her a new Murano for the same payments (well each time they do it the payments go up 15 to 20 bucks). we are paying 70 more a month for our 2013 murano that we did for the 04 (I think that was the year) we purchased long ago. We always have a new car and always have the option of keeping it or trading it. Works great for us.
Doesn't sound like much of a deal to me. I always look forward to paying off my note...

i also drive my cars until they fall apart though.
06-25-2013 07:36 PM
TranquilTurtle Everyone has a right to hunt for the best deal possible, everyone has a right to question the dealership until they are satisfied they are not being ripped off. Please remember that sales associates have a right to feed their families as well
06-25-2013 07:33 PM
SmugglersBlues Sounds like you're happy with the deal you got. That's what matters. Personally the second the sales guy has to "go talk to someone" that's when I stop dealing with that sales guy and follow him to the manager and tell him I'll deal with him as he seems to be making the decisions why should I waste my time with a middle man.
06-25-2013 07:18 PM
pat_smith1969 I don't seen this as being that bizzar. I get that it is a tactic to get you into the dealership.... but having said that. My wife is on her FOURTH Nissan Murano. Every two years they call her (or corner her when she is getting the oil change) and offer her a new Murano for the same payments (well each time they do it the payments go up 15 to 20 bucks). we are paying 70 more a month for our 2013 murano that we did for the 04 (I think that was the year) we purchased long ago. We always have a new car and always have the option of keeping it or trading it. Works great for us.
06-25-2013 05:59 PM
Sixtyplus Hmmm...I am beginning to smell a rat with a dealer advertisement for a new Wrangler. He is showing a price that is $4K+ off MSRP for the unit. I immediately sent a request for confirmation of the price as I would lock it in a heartbeat if that is the real price!!! Got a quick response saying the rep was not at his computer and he would get back to me shortly. After about 2 hours, no further contact. Even called and left a voice mail. The dealer page on the web says that "every incentive" have been used to calculate the price in the ad, but when I go to the Jeep.com site and look for current Wrangler incentives, there are none!! Could this ~17% discount be even close to realistic?? As much as I am trying to believe it, my realistic side says NO WAY!

Anyone think it could be legit??
06-25-2013 03:26 PM
Tuggernuts
Quote:
My guess is the dealer needs to meet Chrysler quotas on clearing out the 2013's this time of year, or something similar, in order to receive incentives. They weren't concerned about profit as much as making a sale on paper.
^This

I'm curious if the dealer also asked you to fill out a survey or some such feedback tool -- they also rake in nice bonuses based on their customer satisfaction ratings. Between sales incentives and bonuses that means a lot more cash in their pockets than what they might make in your specific sale.

Again, if you're happy with it then good for you.
06-25-2013 11:01 AM
Scott-CJ8 Sweet ... way to play 'em.
I hate dealing with dealerships.
06-25-2013 10:52 AM
Chuckamiller Uploaded the new jeep as my profile pic.


2013 Sahara unlimited Billet Silver
Automatic
Connectivity group
Auto adjust a/c
Remote start (will never use but it was on it.)
Heated seats
Soft top
06-25-2013 10:47 AM
Scott2373 Yup, that's the latest tactic and it drives me bonkers when people fall for it. Send a letter saying that your Jeep is worth SO much money! Even though they've never seen it. They get you into the stealership and try to hijack you for a deal you never even wanted in the first place and call you crazy for wanting to save money. I hate dealers. Your vehicle isn't in high demand! IT'S A WRANGLER!!! THEY'RE EVERYWHERE!! Go on Craigslist and look at how many Wranglers are out there. Take a drive through town and see how many are on the side of the road with "For Sale" signs on them...No matter what, the dealer is making out. If you're happy with the deal however, then bon pur vous. I just can't stand dealer tricks and the way they treat people. Last night a coworker leased a new GMC 1500 Extended cab. He came up to me this morning and said "You're gonna love this one", and proceeds to tell me how the dealer (whom he has purchased/leased 4 new vehicles from in the last ten years or so) told him "We don't think you're serious about buying today. We think you're going to shop around, so therefore we aren't giving you an estimate on your trade"... I said, "Are you f^ck!ng kidding me???" Obviously he walked away and leased from another dealer. BTW, the Dealer who said this was Doan on West Ridge Rd. in Rochester, NY. He ended up getting a nice deal and a great value for his trade at Piehler on Ridge Rd. in Webster. You always gotta watch out for those dealers that use "old-school" car selling tactics!
06-25-2013 10:23 AM
JeepCourtney3700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sucker Punch View Post
Pictures or it didn't happen! LOL - that is funny right there!
Hahaha!

That would make paying MSRP all the worthwhile. After all, what's a few extra Washington's a month (it'll be more like Benjamin's)? Hahahaha!
06-25-2013 10:16 AM
Sucker Punch
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepCourtney3700 View Post
Dude, you fell hook, line and sinker for typical dealer bs games but good for you for getting a new Wrangler in the process.

A strange deal would have been if you agreed to pay MSRP but then made basic requests, followed by off the wall requests to be included in the msrp and you put them all in bullet points and in writing.

Each point has to be met and in that order otherwise you walk.

Start by having the dealership add in a bunch of mopar goodies (lift, tires, wheels, bumpers), then ask for food and soda. Then ask for a cigar. Then an escort. Then the sales man run around the dealership without pants. And then ask for a pony who the finance manager will ride in his underwear and call her tonka while "my little pony" plays over the PA system. As the list goes on, make the requests more and more bizarre.

Let those be the points of negotiation.
Pictures or it didn't happen! LOL - that is funny right there!
06-25-2013 10:08 AM
donmeca2020 OP you never did say what model you got for trading in your altitude special edition.
As for a good deal seems pretty good. after looking at 2013 models the last 2 months these guys look at you like your nuts when you make them a reasonable offer. for some reason just about all the dealers in the south florida area refuse to budge on pricing.... i've had quite a few call me trying to get me back at their stealership, the only thing is they think i "changed my mind" lol and will go and pay their ridiculous price.
06-25-2013 10:06 AM
JeepCourtney3700 Dude, you fell hook, line and sinker for typical dealer bs games but good for you for getting a new Wrangler in the process.

A strange deal would have been if you agreed to pay MSRP but then made basic requests, followed by off the wall requests to be included in the msrp and you put them all in bullet points and in writing.

Each point has to be met and in that order otherwise you walk.

Start by having the dealership add in a bunch of mopar goodies (lift, tires, wheels, bumpers), then ask for food and soda. Then ask for a cigar. Then an escort. Then the sales man run around the dealership without pants. And then ask for a pony who the finance manager will ride in his underwear and call her tonka while "my little pony" plays over the PA system. As the list goes on, make the requests more and more bizarre.

Let those be the points of negotiation.
06-25-2013 09:44 AM
thinkxingu I'm looking for the deal, so I might be missing something: you went from a 2012 Altitude hard top to a 2013 what, Sport S soft top, for the same payment? Seems like a downgrade?

S
06-25-2013 09:42 AM
legitposter This really is just a scam to get people into the dealership. Even then, it comes down to the question of paying a few thousand dollars to step into a brand new jeep. It's really not a bad deal at all. 16,000 miles are wiped away!

The $2295 for warranty is a ripoff. First, you can get it for cheaper but most importantly: They rarely agree to warranty anything under the extended agreement.

My guess is the dealer needs to meet Chrysler quotas on clearing out the 2013's this time of year, or something similar, in order to receive incentives. They weren't concerned about profit as much as making a sale on paper.

Congrats OP.
06-25-2013 09:25 AM
HKSkook
Quote:
Originally Posted by 64Chevy View Post

Yep, this. I got a similar call, and had my Dad take in our 2008 JKU. I was actually looking at getting just around wholesale book for my trade (very low miles at 18,000, excellent shape, always garaged, etc.) and 3K off sticker on a new one. They laughed, my Dad just walked out. Never even a follow up call.
The problem is there isn't 3k in mark up in them.
06-25-2013 09:19 AM
64Chevy
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerinS4 View Post
Congrats on the new Jeep but when will people realize this is nothing more than a sales tactic to get you into the dealership?
Yep, this. I got a similar call, and had my Dad take in our 2008 JKU. I was actually looking at getting just around wholesale book for my trade (very low miles at 18,000, excellent shape, always garaged, etc.) and 3K off sticker on a new one. They laughed, my Dad just walked out. Never even a follow up call.
06-25-2013 09:16 AM
zerinS4 Congrats on the new Jeep but when will people realize this is nothing more than a sales tactic to get you into the dealership?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckamiller View Post
I receive a call from the dealership I bought it from. My jeep is on a hot list of wanted vehicles and they want to know if I would be willing to trade it in for a new jeep and keep the same payments.
06-25-2013 08:50 AM
MacCTD [QUOTE=Chuckamiller;3897165]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtoast View Post

No extension and I got a brand new jeep. That is why I thought it was so odd. Of course dealers always make money or they don't do deals but works for me...
So you have the same number of payments left at the same amount? If so that is a great deal.
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