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Topic Review (Newest First)
12-02-2013 06:02 PM
ColoRubicon
Quote:
Originally Posted by COStrider View Post
agred, but still love it and I've had every one of the common problems except the head so far, mine had the waterfall and it too the dealer several bleeding sessions to fix it

Another thing you left out about Jeep is the shat dealer service: It's ALWAYS going to take multiple visits to fix stuff at the dealer. 1) One visit so they believe you and order the parts, 2) next to drop it off for the repair, 3) then another to bring it back for what they messed up and didn't put back right, and then 4) finally a follow up to complete the initial repair
Now I KNOW we use the same dealership! Sadly they have messed up something each time I have taken it in, however the service manager was great and made it right (even if it took a couple trips)....however now he is gone.
12-02-2013 10:53 AM
acf5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Breitling View Post
I hope Land Rover Defender is back to US, it would be something I will buy after JKU.
Official as a few months ago, the Defender is dead. Let us now our heads in a moment of silence...
However if you find a used one, ICON in Cali would love to do it up for a nice chunk of change
12-02-2013 10:21 AM
Strokerswild
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshuaTreeRocks View Post
Anybody hear about the new Bronco Ford is suppose to come out with? From what i've read it is being brought back to compete with the Wrangler. It looks really bad ass but I do not think a production date has been set.
Can't wait.....if it sees the light of day.
12-02-2013 10:03 AM
panthermark A Jeep thing: Learning to never keep ANYTHING of value in your vehicle. Or getting caught top down in the rain and laughing....or forgetting to put you top up one night and waking up to a puddle. You pull the carpet and the plugs...and laugh some more.

A Chrysler thing: Wondering how many times you will be at the dealership in the first year for recalls and other issues.
12-02-2013 09:58 AM
YAHAHA A Jeep thing is...

paying a lot of money for a very utilitarian vehicle that can go almost anywhere & is very customizable. Knowing this and still loving it despite all of its quirky mannerisms, squeaks & rattles.

I like our F150 for all its hauling abilities. I like our 2013 GT500 convertible for cruising. But I love our TJ best of all because..

well, it's a Jeep thing.
12-02-2013 09:46 AM
panthermark A "Jeep thing" and a "Chrysler thing" are not the same thing.
12-02-2013 08:46 AM
Triple_Black I wasn't a member of this, or any vehicle forum before I bought my 2013 jk. But I have to say, if I was a member before my purchase, I probably would of passed on buying mine, considering all the problems people reference. Luckily I'm just over 9k miles into mine with no issues, and it seems to run "smoother" the more I drive it. Although I feel I shouldn't have gotten suckered into purchasing the lifetime warranty, I feel a little better with myself knowing there is, albiet, a slim possibly that these issues will be covered if they start happening to me.
12-01-2013 05:41 PM
JTE "It's a Jeep thing, you wouldn't understand" is a phrase Jeep owners put on their vehicles starting in the early 90's to state their desire to climb the next mountain and ford the next stream. An automotive "live free or die".

More recently the internet morphed it into a phrase meaning complaint department.
12-01-2013 05:18 PM
Breitling
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Chrysler largely did not, with the exception of the GC.
I own GC 2011 right before JKU, it was almost same GC as current with minor differences and better transmission in current. It was not leaking as Wrangler and it is quiet, but it was some specific to only Jeep issues as well, like I have to return to the dealer for coolant leaks from Pentastar or reset my jerky tranny every 10K miles. And I also own GC 2009 before, same never been clean on issues.

Again, nothing so far is wrong with JKU besides leak from freedom panels. I am OK with all other Jeep thingy ...
12-01-2013 04:36 PM
NFRs2000NYC
Quote:
Originally Posted by WatchThis! View Post
Yes, Yes we get it... You get off on it

Just keep in mind you opinion is not the only one and just because the squeaky wheel gets greased does not mean that only the one greasing the wheel gets tired of hearing it.
Not bashing the bashing, just making a statement. I am sure we both understand each other.
Not really get off on it, more of a helping members that may have never encountered a vendor not playing nice. Unfortunately, I have been burned a number of times but various manufacturers,vendors, etc as well as close friends of mine (Optima being a prime example). I agree with you that bashing for the sake of bashing gets old and old quick, and I also agree with you that it has to be relevant. I also don't think bashing is the right word (more like draw attention) but we're splitting hairs here. A lot of times, it's not the product that gets the bashing since very often (like the HD Switchblade rear bumper) the product is actually fantastic, but the company/customer service is horrible. We have had people here get burned by sending money for LED bars, and never getting them, hearing excuses for months after months, etc. In the AEV thread, members bashed me all day long about how AEV is awesome this that and the other...finally the owner actually chimed in and agreed that something didn't look right. Sure I took the heat, but the OP in that thread was taken care of. Sometimes being unpopular helps others.

P.S. In this particular thread I was indeed venting at Chrysler for selling me a 2014 Rubicon with rattling doors and waterfalls in the dash, and on top of that, trying to screw me on my price protection.
12-01-2013 04:28 PM
WatchThis!
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Yup, usually gets results. I have personally gotten Dave Harrington of AEV to acknowledge a problem with a member's wheel, and had the wheel replaced, eventhough when the customer tried to deal with AEV himself, he was told he is out of luck. I assume your comment is aimed at my rant at Rock Crawler, and I stand by my rant. They are intentionally misleading their customers with a BS "bombproof" warranty which gives them 1001 ways to get out of honoring it. Some companies do the right thing on their own, some need to be shamed into it. Teraflex added gussets to their carrier because of a forum flaming. Bashing companies online works, and works well. I have been moderating forums for years, and have been a member on them for decades. I've also been modifying my vehicles forever. All it takes is one bad review of a product/customer service from a well respected member of a board, and your business tanks. I am also generally good at cutting through the trolling posts, where a member has a problem and just rants, as opposed to a member that had a legitimate problem, tried to rectify the situation through the company via email/phone/PMs, then being told to pound sand, at which point they turn to the forum for help. The great part about forum ranting is it keeps companies on their toes. It is in their best interest to keep customer happy, because like I said, a forum is a powerful place, and 20,000 voices are more powerful than one. You can hold it against me, and that's fine, but the members I have helped over the years sure appreciate my "bashing."

Yes, Yes we get it... You get off on it

Just keep in mind you opinion is not the only one and just because the squeaky wheel gets greased does not mean that only the one greasing the wheel gets tired of hearing it.
Not bashing the bashing, just making a statement. I am sure we both understand each other.
12-01-2013 03:57 PM
thinkxingu
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post

Yup, usually gets results. I have personally gotten Dave Harrington of AEV to acknowledge a problem with a member's wheel, and had the wheel replaced, eventhough when the customer tried to deal with AEV himself, he was told he is out of luck. I assume your comment is aimed at my rant at Rock Crawler, and I stand by my rant. They are intentionally misleading their customers with a BS "bombproof" warranty which gives them 1001 ways to get out of honoring it. Some companies do the right thing on their own, some need to be shamed into it. Teraflex added gussets to their carrier because of a forum flaming. Bashing companies online works, and works well. I have been moderating forums for years, and have been a member on them for decades. I've also been modifying my vehicles forever. All it takes is one bad review of a product/customer service from a well respected member of a board, and your business tanks. I am also generally good at cutting through the trolling posts, where a member has a problem and just rants, as opposed to a member that had a legitimate problem, tried to rectify the situation through the company via email/phone/PMs, then being told to pound sand, at which point they turn to the forum for help. The great part about forum ranting is it keeps companies on their toes. It is in their best interest to keep customer happy, because like I said, a forum is a powerful place, and 20,000 voices is more powerful than one. You can hold it against me, and that's fine, but the members I have helped over the years sure appreciate my "bashing."

I appreciate the criticism- there are simply two many things Chrysler gets away with under the "it's a Jeep thing" mantra and I hate-HATE-when people try to trivialize others' legit complaints with the saying.

That being said, I accept the Wrangler is designed to come apart and that, by nature, will mean creaks, squeaks, and leaks. BUT, that doesn't mean heater cores should need replacing because of casting sand- especially over so many years.
12-01-2013 03:51 PM
NFRs2000NYC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Breitling View Post
That is different, they are controlling quality. It is additional expensive step, without this step China will make crap parts worse than any place on planet. union workers are your co-citizens, who would like to get some gifts on Christmas and medical insurance to their kids. Same union workers made several generations of great american cars before. It is greed of reach people and global economy results, nothing else!
I would agree with you if chrysler products were cheaper than their counterparts, but the fact is, they are not. You are saying that QC is an expensive step, fine...but chrysler vehicles on average are more expensive, not to mention, less profit per vehicle...their recipe is all wrong. The Koreans got the recipe right. 15 years ago, everyone was laughing at the crappy hyundais with their 10 year warranties. They were toasters on wheels....but, they worked and didnt break. They lasted, and the 10 year warranty stuck. Now, they have earned the trust of the people, and make cars people want AND people buy. GM built nothing but garbage for decades. The people wrote them off. Now, even IF they make a quality product, people don't trust them enough to spend their hard earned money on it when they can get a Honda or a Toyota and not have headaches. Mercedes went through this rough lesson as well (thanks to Lexus) and they realized you can't just brush off customer complaints and QC issues. Ford is the first American company that I think tried to turn things around, and did a pretty good job. Chrysler largely did not, with the exception of the GC.
12-01-2013 03:46 PM
NFRs2000NYC
Quote:
Originally Posted by WatchThis! View Post
Pretty sure you do it because you like bashing companys on forums.
Yup, usually gets results. I have personally gotten Dave Harrington of AEV to acknowledge a problem with a member's wheel, and had the wheel replaced, eventhough when the customer tried to deal with AEV himself, he was told he is out of luck. I assume your comment is aimed at my rant at Rock Crawler, and I stand by my rant. They are intentionally misleading their customers with a BS "bombproof" warranty which gives them 1001 ways to get out of honoring it. Some companies do the right thing on their own, some need to be shamed into it. Teraflex added gussets to their carrier because of a forum flaming. Bashing companies online works, and works well. I have been moderating forums for years, and have been a member on them for decades. I've also been modifying my vehicles forever. All it takes is one bad review of a product/customer service from a well respected member of a board, and your business tanks. I am also generally good at cutting through the trolling posts, where a member has a problem and just rants, as opposed to a member that had a legitimate problem, tried to rectify the situation through the company via email/phone/PMs, then being told to pound sand, at which point they turn to the forum for help. The great part about forum ranting is it keeps companies on their toes. It is in their best interest to keep customer happy, because like I said, a forum is a powerful place, and 20,000 voices are more powerful than one. You can hold it against me, and that's fine, but the members I have helped over the years sure appreciate my "bashing."

12-01-2013 03:19 PM
MattK To me, "It's a Jeep thing" is two answers.

1) A "Chrysler thing". Bringing back my 2013 Jeep JKR to have the water pump fixed within the first week off the lot. (Most likely casting sand issue we all know about). Bringing back my Jeep because 3rd and 4th gear sound like they're going to eat their way out of the transmission housing after 1,000 miles and Chrysler saying "It's normal" ie. it's a "Chrsyler thing". I've had a 1967 VW Bug with a 4-speed tranny that sounded better than this. Taking my Jeep in to have these things looked at and bringing it back because simple things are missing off of it like the engine shroud. Really? I don't like being "that guy" but I park my Jeep now at the dealer after service and pop the hood and give it a once over before I leave...feel like such a dick but that's how I feel about the dealership and Chrysler.

2) Having a oove/hate relationship with my 2-door. Buying a Bestop Twill Supertop NX softop for it and checking the weather daily to see how I'll be driving. Reading the forum about everyone else troubles with soft tops and hard top leaks and wondering what their problem is? Neither tops leak for me. The Jeep wave. Looking at all the mods I'd like to do and tallying up the money. Yikes. Trying to figure out how to cram more stuff into it for my expeditions. Cramming my 8'6" long board into it.
12-01-2013 01:56 PM
Breitling
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Disagree. All other manufacturers including Honda or toyota use chinese parts. There is one common denominator in the American car production, and its unions. Toyota, Subaru, Honda, Hyundai, etc that build more cars in the US than Chrysler, Ford or GM don't have quality control problems like the big 3 do, and they don't use union labor. You will NEVER EVER find a honda or a toyota with casting sand left over in their cooling systems.
That is different, they are controlling quality. It is additional expensive step, without this step China will make crap parts worse than any place on planet. union workers are your co-citizens, who would like to get some gifts on Christmas and medical insurance to their kids. Same union workers made several generations of great american cars before. It is greed of reach people and global economy results, nothing else!
12-01-2013 01:36 PM
WatchThis!
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Oh, and one more thing, the reason why you will often see me bash chrysler on this board (and all boards) is pretty simple...Im a moderator on s2ki.com, which is an s2000 forum. At one point, it was the 75th largest forum on the net. I know for a fact that Honda monitors the forum, and I know that Chrysler monitors this forum. The more people b!tch about their problems, the more people that say they will buy another product if another one came to market (ie a Defender, a Bronco, etc), the more they would be inclined to listen and change.
Pretty sure you do it because you like bashing companys on forums.
12-01-2013 01:35 PM
Breitling
Quote:
Originally Posted by legitposter View Post
Of course Chrysler is sh*t, but its hard to get away from Jeep. My wife's '03 Liberty was awesome despite the many small problems. My '11 Compass was by far the best small SUV I drove in its class. Its peppy performance, MPG, and 4x4 capability are things you wouldn't expect to find in such an affordable package. And now my wrangler is, well, a wrangler which speaks for itself.

So yes, Chrysler sucks and when the chances arises I will gladly ditch Jeep but the other options just aren't out there yet.
They will never drop something as popular, they will most likely make it cheaper and drop all off road abilities leaving just look of Wrangler. I hope not, it is last really mechanically true machine, hate CVT/independent suspension/soccer mom SUV's. Land Rover Defender is one I like the most, but can't get one in US.
12-01-2013 01:32 PM
GermanShepherdJeeper Sad part is... if they do not fix the freedom panel problem soon, they will have a solid roof like all the other vehicles out there. The uniqueness will be gone
12-01-2013 01:29 PM
legitposter Of course Chrysler is sh*t, but its hard to get away from Jeep. My wife's '03 Liberty was awesome despite the many small problems. My '11 Compass was by far the best small SUV I drove in its class. Its peppy performance, MPG, and 4x4 capability are things you wouldn't expect to find in such an affordable package. And now my wrangler is, well, a wrangler which speaks for itself.

So yes, Chrysler sucks and when the chances arises I will gladly ditch Jeep but the other options just aren't out there yet.
12-01-2013 01:28 PM
Breitling
Quote:
Originally Posted by ramp4ge View Post
You can put bluetooth, GPS, power windows, door locks, a fancy touch-screen stereo in a Conestoga wagon and it'll still creek, whine and clunk like a Conestoga wagon..

Just because they're packing all kinds of technology into a Wrangler doesn't mean it's going to drive, sound or wear like a BMW, even if it costs as much as a BMW..

I do agree that Chrysler could have better customer support if so many people are having these issues, but as far as my Jeep being exactly the way it is now, I wouldn't change it.
So, are you saying water leaks can't be technically fixed on Wrangler until it become BMW? I use to have leak on my Infiniti coupe, but they fix it. Nobody asking to change anything besides fixing freedom panels to do not leak. That issue is not the same to noisy body or creeks.
12-01-2013 12:47 PM
ramp4ge
Quote:
Originally Posted by Breitling View Post
Absolutely, we are getting Bluetooth and GPS, computer and multiple other advanced parts and technologies in Wrangler.
You can put bluetooth, GPS, power windows, door locks, a fancy touch-screen stereo in a Conestoga wagon and it'll still creek, whine and clunk like a Conestoga wagon..

Just because they're packing all kinds of technology into a Wrangler doesn't mean it's going to drive, sound or wear like a BMW, even if it costs as much as a BMW..

I do agree that Chrysler could have better customer support if so many people are having these issues, but as far as my Jeep being exactly the way it is now, I wouldn't change it.
12-01-2013 12:06 PM
NFRs2000NYC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex Umbris Currus View Post
Buying a $33,000 vehicle and within a year replacing the entire suspension, wheels, tires, lights, bumpers, fenders, driveshafts, therefore increasing the price of said vehicle to well over $40,000, then taking said vehicle off-road and breaking stuff only to replace them with more expensive stuff, and having a huge ass goofy grin on your face the whole damn time.

It's a jeep thing.....you wouldn't understand
I don't know anyone on the forum that has a problem with anything you just mentioned.
12-01-2013 12:02 PM
Jdpatt12 I have a 2013 that I got last Nov. It has just over 13000 miles. I've not had 1 issue. I made a appointment for the N28 recall that has not been done yet and I'm on a list to have it done. Jeep will only let the parts dept at the dealer order the part once ever 2 weeks. So I may get it done before 2014.
12-01-2013 11:48 AM
Breitling
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
The only thing "not modern" on a Wrangler is the suspension. I would let a few creeks and squeaks slide but unfortunately, the problems on a wrangler have nothing to do with ruggedness. The motor is modern, the electrical system is extremely modern, the interior is modern, etc. There is simply no excuse for leaky tops, waterfalls in dashboards, casting sand in the cooling system, a bad clockspring (going on 8 years now), etc. All the wrangler problems have nothing to do with ruggedness.
Absolutely, we are getting Bluetooth and GPS, computer and multiple other advanced parts and technologies in Wrangler. Why if all we do with Jeep is crawling on rocks? it is just funny to listen all these die hard Wrangler lovers who use to drive Willys 60 years ago. It could be much better with exact drivetrain and ruggedness if Chrysler could care about customers.
12-01-2013 11:44 AM
Ex Umbris Currus Buying a $33,000 vehicle and within a year replacing the entire suspension, wheels, tires, lights, bumpers, fenders, driveshafts, therefore increasing the price of said vehicle to well over $40,000, then taking said vehicle off-road and breaking stuff only to replace them with more expensive stuff, and having a huge ass goofy grin on your face the whole damn time.

It's a jeep thing.....you wouldn't understand
12-01-2013 11:42 AM
NFRs2000NYC Oh, and one more thing, the reason why you will often see me bash chrysler on this board (and all boards) is pretty simple...Im a moderator on s2ki.com, which is an s2000 forum. At one point, it was the 75th largest forum on the net. I know for a fact that Honda monitors the forum, and I know that Chrysler monitors this forum. The more people b!tch about their problems, the more people that say they will buy another product if another one came to market (ie a Defender, a Bronco, etc), the more they would be inclined to listen and change.
12-01-2013 11:40 AM
NFRs2000NYC A huge reason many of us hate chrysler is their dealer network, and their general "blame the customer" policy.

Take a look at this thread, should give you a taste of the quality of their "service."
http://www.wranglerforum.com/f202/wa...ak-415138.html

They are a huge reason I never bought the maxcare plan for my 14, I just don't trust them. One guy actually had a dealer blame his headunit for a drivetrain problem. Every other manufacturer that I have owned have at least ONE guy at the service department that actually knows cars, so you can reason with them. My dealership decided to replace a $3000 rear axle on my 2012 for no reason (I complained I heard a noise that was coming from the front end, turned out to be nothing)....Wasted a week dealing with it, left the dealer, surprise surprise...noise still there. Told the service manager the tech just cost Chrysler $3000 for no reason.
12-01-2013 11:36 AM
ramp4ge I'm mixed about the Bronco. It'll case one of two things to happen.

They'll price it with the Rubicon or even more expensive and it'll drive Wrangler prices up, because they'll know they can get away with it.

They'll price it very low and cause Wrangler prices to drop thru the floor and take all of our resale value away.
12-01-2013 11:34 AM
NFRs2000NYC
Quote:
Originally Posted by ramp4ge View Post
Well, the dealership issues is one reason I purchased CarMax's 100,000 mile warranty when I purchased my JK. If Chrysler won't deal with it, I know CarMax will. So that brings me some comfort.

I kind of expected rattles, squeeks, clunks, etc with my JK before I even bought it, tho. It's not a super-refined street vehicle. It's not a Benz..tho for the price you could get a Benz...I bought it to be what it is. Rugged, impractical and fun.
The only thing "not modern" on a Wrangler is the suspension. I would let a few creeks and squeaks slide but unfortunately, the problems on a wrangler have nothing to do with ruggedness. The motor is modern, the electrical system is extremely modern, the interior is modern, etc. There is simply no excuse for leaky tops, waterfalls in dashboards, casting sand in the cooling system, a bad clockspring (going on 8 years now), etc. All the wrangler problems have nothing to do with ruggedness.
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