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Topic Review (Newest First)
04-06-2011 04:51 PM
Ibuildembig Not true for a TJ either, my ole mans has wall to wall carpet, the better than standard stereo, etc etc
04-06-2011 12:14 PM
Cons_Table
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTH View Post
The design of the JK removed the need for slip yoke eliminators altogether, whether rubicon or sahara.
That must be nice
04-06-2011 11:59 AM
MTH
Quote:
Originally Posted by NHrubicon
Have to disagree with the posters that say the Rubi comes with all the bells and whistles...sorry. As far as 'underneath' the vehicle, the Rubicon comes with all the upgrades, lockers, axles, better suspension, etc.-but as far as the INTERIOR goes, that's what the Sahara is for. It has 'full' carpeting, complete tub is covered. Better sound system, more speakers, plusher interior...
Nope. That may have been true for the TJ, but not the JK. The interior is no better, the carpet is no plusher, the speakers are no different, etc. in a sahara than a rubicon. The lone exception is the "70th anniversary edition" sahara, but that's not what the OP has.

Quote:
Originally Posted by "NHrubicon
you already have the SYE for the tranny so you won't need to add that and a new driveshaft if you lift the Sahara...I didn't see that mentioned in the build up.
The design of the JK removed the need for slip yoke eliminators altogether, whether rubicon or sahara.
04-06-2011 10:55 AM
NHrubicon I have owned a 2000 sahara, traded up to a 2003 Rubicon. Have to disagree with the posters that say the Rubi comes with all the bells and whistles...sorry. As far as 'underneath' the vehicle, the Rubicon comes with all the upgrades, lockers, axles, better suspension, etc.-but as far as the INTERIOR goes, that's what the Sahara is for. It has 'full' carpeting, complete tub is covered. Better sound system, more speakers, plusher interior...the rubicon interior is more 'dirt and mud' oriented and not 'mall crawler' plush. At least that's the difference between the year vehicles I have/had.
If you want to do the offroading and really are going to get the 'bug' for it, I'd opt to give back the Sahara and get the Rubicon. You won't regret it-it will be 'trail ready' off the lot and then all you are going to need is a lift kit for bigger tires, steel bumpers and a winch...you already have the SYE for the tranny so you won't need to add that and a new driveshaft if you lift the Sahara...I didn't see that mentioned in the build up.
04-06-2011 10:38 AM
TheTJRod
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders View Post
Which is the purpose of me trading in my 07 unlimited manual trans for an auto trans. In a few weeks, I plan on getting a longarm 4" lift with 35" T's. Since I plan on doing that, the gear ratio in a rubi is better.
Auto's are more forgiving with the wrong gear ratios due to the torque converter. The 2010's have a 4-speed auto right? Meaning a 1st of 2.84 and the OD of .69, with that low of an OD you want to put in lower gearing to make use of it, also the slippage of the auto will need lower gears to get that "omph" back. I suggest the highest you can go with your d30 front at 5.13 especially if you ever think you want to go to 37's, plan to tow, or live in a hilly area. If you had that d44 front you could go higher That mini van engine needs the high RPM's to produce that torque. Here is a good read for you. JK's are badly under geared from the factory especially with that super low OD of the auto's.

Quote:
Like you said, there's better aftermarket parts than the stock rubi lockers. My recovery setup (armor, bumpers and winch) will be last.
By the time you get past the strength of the Rubi you will have spent much more than the Rubi would have cost you. Was about to make comments about tow points and armor needed sooner, but that loaded JK should have tow points front and rear and a "good" skid system in place. Man, I really come off as being bias towards the Rubi's. But that is because I really hated myself for not just waiting for the rubi, also I didn't know how much I was going to get into this stuff and the Rubi already came with over half of what I needed for less than what I would have to pay.
04-06-2011 10:08 AM
TheTJRod
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders View Post
When I had my 07 unlimited with 4" lift on 35's.. I didn't change the differentials. It lacked power, but still ran somewhat ok. What's a good gear ratio anyways with this kind of lift and tires? I think I'm gonna get the whole thing done at once besides the recovery stuff.. I have the $, just don't want to blow all the money. So, defo, I'll be doing the lift, lockers and gear ratio. Heck, I might be the first to do this on a new Sahara.. lol
MTH said what I would have said about your last question. About trading in. Also note that the Rubi already has lockers that you want to put in, had a D44 up front over the D30, the Rubi D44's have 32 splines, and the transfer case has a lower gear ratio and no slip yoke. It also depends on what tire size you want to go to. If your wanting 35's then the D30 could handle it. 37's and you would have to build up the d30 to take being locked with them and you would still be pushing it. The rubi axles how they are will handle 37's. I know a guy that ran 37's for 2 years without a problem and he drove to and from the trips. He wanted to go to 40's but sold the whole thing... From what I gather you would be happy with the Sahara.

Here he is.


$3000 with ARB's, and new gears is an "ok" price. without new gears they are ridiculous. Also tell them you only want the basic install kit for gears as your Jeep is so new you would be throwing away your money for all new bearings and seals. That should save you at least $100 just in parts. Also I went looking around and found a guy that bought a pair of JK rubi axles for 3k. If the rubi only costs you an extra 3k to get, you'll be getting your money's worth.
04-06-2011 07:37 AM
JeepJKRiders When I had my 07 unlimited with 4" lift on 35's.. I didn't change the differentials. It lacked power, but still ran somewhat ok. What's a good gear ratio anyways with this kind of lift and tires? I think I'm gonna get the whole thing done at once besides the recovery stuff.. I have the $, just don't want to blow all the money. So, defo, I'll be doing the lift, lockers and gear ratio. Heck, I might be the first to do this on a new Sahara.. lol
04-05-2011 11:56 PM
JeepJKRiders
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cons_Table
Something to consider with your lockers...when u upgrade to larger tires and decide to regear, consider regearing and getting lockers installed at the same time. This will save you money in the long run because when lockers are installed your gears need to be set back up...so If you do it all at the same time, you only have to pay for an install once rather than twice.
Thanks, I didn't think about that.
04-05-2011 11:50 PM
Cons_Table Something to consider with your lockers...when u upgrade to larger tires and decide to regear, consider regearing and getting lockers installed at the same time. This will save you money in the long run because when lockers are installed your gears need to be set back up...so If you do it all at the same time, you only have to pay for an install once rather than twice.
04-05-2011 11:42 PM
JeepJKRiders Ok thanks.. I've decided to keep the Sahara which it does looks good with matching paint. I do plan on off roading a lot. I did all the mud and sand, now i wanna do rock crawling. Which is the purpose of me trading in my 07 unlimited manual trans for an auto trans. I still will be using this new vehicle as a daily drive for work. In a few weeks, I plan on getting a longarm 4" lift with 35" T's. Since I plan on doing that, the gear ratio in a rubi is better. But, that's ok, I'll change that out also. In a few months after that, then I'll install lockers, which is something that I need to research more about. Like you said, there's better aftermarket parts than the stock rubi lockers. My recovery setup (armor, bumpers and winch) will be last.

If I buy the rubi instead, which would cost more. I would only need to install lift kit and recovery. It seems either way, it's gonna end up the same $ amount. Except that I only end up with matching paint. So I quess I'm gonna stick with the Sahara.

Also, if anyone is interested in the brand new wheels and tires, let me know.. Thanks.
04-05-2011 10:28 PM
MTH
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders
This Sahara isn't equipped with lockers and they are willing to take the jeep back, cancel all the papers and so forth.
Wow. Good for them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders
However, I did a little more digging about the cost of installing lockers. 4 wheel parts gave me a sample quote for $3000 ARB lockers.
I've never had lockers installed but that seems high. Aren't ARBs like $800 or so? So they want $700 per axle worth of labor? Wowzer. Somebody with personal experience may have a better grasp on the numbers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders
Keep in mind the Sahara I have now does have the matching paint top and fenders with skid plates all around underneath, upgraded from real axle 3.21 ratio to a 3.73, hill decent control, freedom top, remote starter, (in other words, loaded with absolutely everything except I don't have leather seats and are not heated).
Skid plates are standard on all models, hill descent is standard on all models, freedom top can be ordered with all models, remote start can be ordered with all models. The rear axle ratio on a rubicon is 4.10, which is actually better than the upgrade 3.73 available on the other models.

The only items listed that are actually "exclusive" to the sahara are the matching top and fenders. A rubicon's will be black, regardless of the color of the Jeep. You also didn't list the 18" sahara wheels and more "road friendly" tires. A rubicon will come with 17" wheels and mud tires.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders
Question is, what would you do? Trade back for a rubi? Keep it and install lockers? Or just give them the finger?
Does it really matter what we would do?

Based on what I've read so far, I think the decision should come down to (a) how much offroading do you really plan on doing and (b) whether you like the body color fenders/top and the sahara wheels.

Any wrangler is going to be a better out of the box offroader than just about anything else. A rubicon is the best of the wranglers, but you can add anything to your jeep aftermarket. There are plenty of modded up sports out there that are better offroaders than stock rubicons.

There's no right answer. Look at your budget and decide what you want to do.
04-05-2011 08:23 PM
JeepJKRiders Sorry for all delays.. I try to keep up with you all about this. I've been working graveyard shift and during my day been talking to the dealers. Everything you said is correct. This Sahara isn't equipped with lockers and they are willing to take the jeep back, cancel all the papers and so forth.

However, I did a little more digging about the cost of installing lockers. 4 wheel parts gave me a sample quote for $3000 ARB lockers. It's a debate issue if I should get the rubi or have them installed.

Keep in mind the Sahara I have now does have the matching paint top and fenders with skid plates all around underneath, upgraded from real axle 3.21 ratio to a 3.73, hill decent control, freedom top, remote starter, (in other words, loaded with absolutely everything except I don't have leather seats and are not heated).

Question is, what would you do? Trade back for a rubi? Keep it and install lockers? Or just give them the finger?
04-05-2011 12:17 PM
TheTJRod ... hmm I didn't even know we had flowers on here. I guess that is what the [more] button is for.

Dealers will say whatever they think will sell you the vehicle even if they don't know what they are talking about. Never trust what they say about the tow ratings of trucks. You always seem to hear the max the vehicle can be optioned for but not what the safe tow rating is for the options it has. I know that's off topic some but it is relevant. To show that Dealers can say you can get a jeep with lockers in the front and rear because there are Jeep's with them. Have them show you documents on what it has and preferably from the manufacturer not their own shop. They can put whatever they want on their papers. And get copies.
04-05-2011 11:57 AM
MTH
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTJRod View Post
I stopped reading right there... I'm just playing with ya . It's always good to hear the same information from more than one mouth as it rings more true.
Okay, fine. You get flowers this time. I'm sure you always wanted some dude to give you emoticon flowers on a Jeep forum.

No fist bump though . . . .

Seriously, it's alarming how little dealers know and what they'll tell you. When it comes to Wranglers, you've really got to educate yourself first.
04-05-2011 11:44 AM
TheTJRod
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTH View Post
You're right. I'm obviously an idiot.
I stopped reading right there... I'm just playing with ya . It's always good to hear the same information from more than one mouth as it rings more true.
04-05-2011 11:35 AM
MTH
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTJRod View Post
Someone is a little slow.. All that has already been addressed.
You're right. I'm obviously an idiot.

I read the whole thread. That data is stated, but it was spread throughout and not said as concisely. The OP's latter posts still appear uncertain, as if he is in part trying to reach out to the dealer to "confirm" that he didn't have lockers. He doesn't, period. Even if I'm wrong and the OP has got it down, why do you care?

Anyway
04-05-2011 11:11 AM
TheTJRod Someone is a little slow.. All that has already been addressed.
04-05-2011 10:24 AM
MTH A new Sahara, unless modified prior to sale, absolutely did not come with lockers. No debate.

"Dana" is the manufacturer of the axle, which has nothing to do with whether you have lockers. All new Wranglers--including the one you traded in--come with Dana axles. However, you can have a Dana axle with Detroit lockers. Or ARB lockers. Or Ox lockers. Etc.

The Rubicon, not the Sahara, is the "top of the line" Wrangler. It comes with e-lockers and e-sway bar disconnects among other things. The Sahara does not come with these items and cannot be "ordered" with these items. No Sahara, including yours, has these items unless they are added aftermarket.

As far as I know, there are no "bells and whistles" that are available on the Sahara that are not available on the Rubicon. What are you referring to? Aside from the Rubicon's enhanced offroading features (such as the lockers), the differences are cosmetic. For example, your Sahara came with body color fenders rather than black fenders, you may have gotten a body color hard top rather than just a black hard top, etc.
04-05-2011 10:08 AM
Cons_Table
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTJRod View Post
Yea just flash a lawsuit paper at them with the settlement being a Rubi
I like the way you think
04-05-2011 10:06 AM
TheTJRod Yea just flash a lawsuit paper at them with the settlement being a Rubi
04-05-2011 09:39 AM
Cons_Table
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders View Post
Wow, I left msg's and the dealer hasn't responded.. Looks like I'm gonna have to drive down there and raise hell! Otherwise, if they don't help me here, I'm gonna need a dame good lawyer!
Good luck!
04-05-2011 09:34 AM
JeepJKRiders Wow, I left msg's and the dealer hasn't responded.. Looks like I'm gonna have to drive down there and raise hell! Otherwise, if they don't help me here, I'm gonna need a dame good lawyer!
04-05-2011 08:28 AM
TheTJRod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cons_Table View Post
You are talking about the rubi right? I meant the 70th anniversary sahara. Sounds like we may have gotten mixed up
Yea, my last sentence was just in case you were talking about the 70th Sahara. I think it is just like the Islander and the whatever else "Special" editions they've made. Nothing special about it other than logos and decorations.
04-05-2011 12:58 AM
JeepJKRiders
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTJRod

The Rubicon is the top model. You can't get all the bells and whistles without getting the Rubicon. Unless you got the 70th anniversary Sahara which I don't know what is different about it.

Oh and if they really try to convince you still that you have lockers. Ask them for the build sheet and ask them to point out the locker switch. I don't know why you can't see those pictures. You on a phone? I'll try to find a pick of what you should see coming out of your axle if you have a locker.

Maybe you can see this.
I can see the locker pic but not the other in dash pics.. Yes I'm using a phone. Currently at work. lol
04-05-2011 12:18 AM
Cons_Table
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTJRod

There are two differences in the drive train. One is the D44 in the front. The other is the 241 transfercase that has a 4:1 low range and external slip yoke comparied to the 231's 2.73:1 and internal slip yoke that everyone is quick to upgrade(or should be, considering that is a contributor to vibs in the drive like after a lift in SWB wranglers)
You are talking about the rubi right? I meant the 70th anniversary sahara. Sounds like we may have gotten mixed up
04-05-2011 12:15 AM
TheTJRod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cons_Table View Post
I dont think there is a difference in drivetrain that I saw on the website.
There are two differences in the drive train. One is the D44 in the front. The other is the 241 transfercase that has a 4:1 low range and external slip yoke comparied to the 231's 2.73:1 and internal slip yoke that everyone is quick to upgrade(or should be, considering that is a contributor to vibs in the drive like after a lift in SWB wranglers)

... or are you talking about the 70th anniversary Jeep. I bet it is just crappy logos all over it. And nothing special. Jeep is getting lamer every year.
04-04-2011 11:57 PM
Cons_Table
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwheelz

Meant self, not sel.. Haha lol
When u put it that way...

I thought u just abbreviated selectable lol no worries
04-04-2011 11:52 PM
Schwheelz
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cons_Table

Selectable lockers are not cheaper...just about every selectable locker you will find will be more expensive than a Detroit locker.
Meant self, not sel.. Haha lol
04-04-2011 11:26 PM
Cons_Table
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTJRod View Post
The Rubicon is the top model. You can't get all the bells and whistles without getting the Rubicon. Unless you got the 70th anniversary Sahara which I don't know what is different about it.
I dont think there is a difference in drivetrain that I saw on the website.
04-04-2011 11:22 PM
TheTJRod
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepJKRiders View Post
Can you get the rubi with all the same bells and whistles as the sahara?
The Rubicon is the top model. You can't get all the bells and whistles without getting the Rubicon. Unless you got the 70th anniversary Sahara which I don't know what is different about it.

Oh and if they really try to convince you still that you have lockers. Ask them for the build sheet and ask them to point out the locker switch. I don't know why you can't see those pictures. You on a phone? I'll try to find a pick of what you should see coming out of your axle if you have a locker.

Maybe you can see this.
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