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Topic Review (Newest First)
07-11-2011 08:37 PM
MTH Nice honest review. Keep us posted and good luck!
07-11-2011 07:04 PM
mlambert890
Update!

Well I did the drives! Here it is: the good, the bad, and the ugly

First, the good and bad blended together...

I was lucky enough to test drive *both* manual and auto versions of the Mojave! We actually found two tan specimens at local dealers, one in each trans.

I took both out and around town and across the lot. After driving each for about 20 minutes, I think I can say with confidence that...

I "get" both sides of the argument. I immediately noticed that you need to be harder on both pedals vs the FJ. It takes more gas to get her moving and more brake application to get her to stop. The brakes are a bit soft. That said, it took all of two pedal pushes to figure this out and adjust. Once adjusted, the vehicle, IMO, is fine around town and on and off the highway.

I do, however, see where people complain. The 3.8 definitely likes to rev. The power is up pretty high, so I just kept it reving pretty high I'm used to driving pretty high wound sports cars (my toy car is a supercharged, lightened, NSX) so I really dont mind driving that way. Folks who prefer to feather the exhaust and fly off the line, or want big V8 torque delivery down low, will be put off. Which brings me to the tranny...

The manual is fine, although first feels really short. The auto is definitely long in the tooth and you need to beat it into down shifting most of the time in order to get going.

My conclusion though, is that it's all fine. The Wrangler Unlimited rides great, and while its clear to me that a powerplant/trans upgrade would serve it well, I wouldnt consider it anywhere near "broken" as is.

Now, the UGLY... Unfortunately the dealer and I couldn't come to terms. I used the TL tactic but this caused them to low ball my trade. Basically, we just stayed too far apart. They wanted to value my FJ at 17 or 18k tops and want 32-33k for the Mojave. IMO, thats just too much of a gap for me to justify.

I may attempt to move my FJ privately, or I may just hang back and see how they feel if those Mojaves are still collecting dust when the lot is filled with 012s I'd buy one, but not at nearly $35k

In the meantime, I shall lurk!

Thanks all for the guidance and advice!
07-10-2011 09:17 PM
gleek
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlambert890 View Post
Ill see what they're willing to do and try the TL route as well (Im pretty sure the hump dealers near me will be like "huh? whats that?")
No worries. Interested to see how tomorrow goes.

As for the TL discount, it really is the Chrysler/Jeep Affiliate discount. Some employers give this as well. I would refer to it as the Chrysler/Jeep Affiliate discount. Some dealers will go >1% that the affiliate program mandates.
07-10-2011 09:03 PM
mlambert890
Quote:
Originally Posted by gleek View Post
Mlambert890-

I am in the same boat as you (deciding between the 11 and 12) and in my experience, I haven't been able to bridge the cost gap with any dealer on 11's sitting on their lot vs. a 12.

Right now, I have found a few dealers who will honor the Affiliate pricing (1% below invoice) for a 12. For a 11 on their lot, they will add another few % off, plus the Jeep $1,000 rebate.

By my math, all in, it's only a few thousand dollars cheaper to get an 11 than to order a 12 exactly to your liking. If they can get it a little more, I'd probably get a 11.

My only concern about the 12 is that there may be additional QC issues for the first batch of new engine/transmission builds.

Hope this helps and please let us all know how the test drive goes and which way you go.
Thanks man, this is VERY helpful. My gut tells me my experience is going to be similar to yours. The 011s will prob need to sit until PAST 012 inventory arrives before they move on them. For now they are probably relying on the mothership incentives to help move them.

Ill see what they're willing to do and try the TL route as well (Im pretty sure the hump dealers near me will be like "huh? whats that?")

If I test drive the 011 and it doesnt work for me the point will be moot, but if I love it the decision will be tough. I really like the special edition (yes, Im a sucker! LOL)
07-10-2011 08:51 PM
gleek Mlambert890-

I am in the same boat as you (deciding between the 11 and 12) and in my experience, I haven't been able to bridge the cost gap with any dealer on 11's sitting on their lot vs. a 12.

Right now, I have found a few dealers who will honor the Affiliate pricing (1% below invoice) for a 12. For a 11 on their lot, they will add another few % off, plus the Jeep $1,000 rebate.

By my math, all in, it's only a few thousand dollars cheaper to get an 11 than to order a 12 exactly to your liking. If they can get it a little more, I'd probably get a 11.

My only concern about the 12 is that there may be additional QC issues for the first batch of new engine/transmission builds.

Hope this helps and please let us all know how the test drive goes and which way you go.
07-10-2011 08:10 PM
Up Hill Bill
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlambert890 View Post
Interesting! I never heard of TL until I started looking at these forums. Do dealers tend to be aware of it, or do you have to "educate" them?

Also, I noticed that one of the dealers near me is very aggressive on pricing and is coming out of the gate at invoice - a little bit, but they have a white Mojave. The other dealer seems nowhere near as good to work with, but they have the tan that we love.

I wonder if its possible to have the one dealer attempt to get that tan from the other one? I know sometimes dealers do horsetrade cars to each other.
With TL membership = Chrysler Affiliate Rewards program, Chrysler gives the dealer 2% of invoice on top of holdback (3% of MSRP-destination charge)... on top of any other discounts/deals the dealer wants to make!

With TL membership letter and Chrysler control number in hand, you should be able to work a sweet deal for yourself!

Good luck!
07-10-2011 06:07 PM
mlambert890 Interesting! I never heard of TL until I started looking at these forums. Do dealers tend to be aware of it, or do you have to "educate" them?

Also, I noticed that one of the dealers near me is very aggressive on pricing and is coming out of the gate at invoice - a little bit, but they have a white Mojave. The other dealer seems nowhere near as good to work with, but they have the tan that we love.

I wonder if its possible to have the one dealer attempt to get that tan from the other one? I know sometimes dealers do horsetrade cars to each other.
07-10-2011 04:24 PM
Up Hill Bill
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChasmCrawler View Post
If if wasn't for Wrangler Forum I'd probably be haggling with Dealer also.
Ditto! Best (of many) new car buying experiences I've ever had. NO hassles, NO haggling!
07-10-2011 04:16 PM
ChasmCrawler
Quote:
Originally Posted by Up Hill Bill View Post
Search the forum for TL discount or tread lightly and go shopping armed with the knowledge of what you can buy the Jeep your looking at for with a no hassle, guaranteed at least 1% below invoice price. Better place to start negotiations from than MSRP! Good luck!
Tread Lightly - Home

Tread Lightly - Tread Lightly! Discount on Jeep, Dodge, Ram, Chrysler Vehicles

mlambert890, see above link and it'll explain the procedure to get the 1% below invoice as Up Hill Bill mentioned.

If if wasn't for Wrangler Forum I'd probably be haggling with Dealer also.
Follow the instructions to join and the discount will be honored on your new Jeep or other Chrysler vehicle.
07-10-2011 04:07 PM
Up Hill Bill
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlambert890 View Post
I really do like the idea of maybe arm wrestling the dealer a bit and getting the kind of great terms they tend to give when they *really* need to unload stuff (esp when buying new, which I only do on "keepers") and I really do like what they did with the Mojave!
Search the forum for TL discount or tread lightly and go shopping armed with the knowledge of what you can buy the Jeep your looking at for with a no hassle, guaranteed at least 1% below invoice price. Better place to start negotiations from than MSRP! Good luck!
07-10-2011 04:02 PM
mlambert890 Thanks guys for the responses so far and feedback on both sides. I am going to go out tomorrow and check out this 011 and I will come back and give my fair and balanced review.

I really do like the idea of maybe arm wrestling the dealer a bit and getting the kind of great terms they tend to give when they *really* need to unload stuff (esp when buying new, which I only do on "keepers") and I really do like what they did with the Mojave!


That said, if the 3.8 puts the fear of God in me merging from the dealer lot onto the local state route its on (AKA "college kid testosterone speedway"), then I may have to hold out for the 12s.
07-10-2011 03:10 PM
Up Hill Bill
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlambert890 View Post
First... Want to introduce myself and say ... the 012s may cure world hunger...


You're going to get along great here! Buy a Jeep, already! The one YOU want!
07-10-2011 03:02 PM
MTH
Quote:
Originally Posted by carnut08

Yup. Better to wait until the 2012s come out if you want an unlimited. Current V6 is adequate for a 2 door, but pretty weak for the heavier unlimited.
3.6 will no doubt be better, especially for the auto transmissions.

However, the current 4 doors do work great with a manual transmission (like mine), and the autos can be pretty darn good if they're chipped and regeared right off the showroom floor. Couple the cost of the regearing and a chip with the money saved on 0% for 60 months, it might be worth it to go with a 2011.

I'd wait though.
07-10-2011 02:51 PM
carnut08
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lithium Lotus View Post
The FJ has a 55 horsepower advantage over the Wrangler. You will notice the difference.
Yup. Better to wait until the 2012s come out if you want an unlimited. Current V6 is adequate for a 2 door, but pretty weak for the heavier unlimited. The 5 speed auto, assuming you want an auto, combined with the much more powerful engine should be a pretty dramatic improvement.
07-10-2011 02:51 PM
MTH I think it's 0% for 60 months right now. Check Edmunds.com, which keeps a list of current incentives.
07-10-2011 02:13 PM
Lithium Lotus The FJ has a 55 horsepower advantage over the Wrangler. You will notice the difference.
07-10-2011 01:22 PM
mlambert890
Hello from new member and request for advice...

First... Want to introduce myself and say a big hello to the forum Ive been lurking for the past few days and have to say that this is a fantastic community. Community is a big deal for me, so that counts for a lot!

Current situation is I have a 2007 TRD Limited FJ Cruiser (booo... hiss! ) that I *love* but my wife *despises*. Of course wife, despise, endless indigestion... Not good.

Her main issue is the huge collection of blind spots in the FJ (I admit this is rough) and that its just a bit of a big beast to drive.

So enter the Wrangler... We have a good friend with a 1997 and we always thought it was a lot of fun. We recently went and checked out the 2011s and we saw a tan colored Mojave that we both *really* like. I think the color combo works perfectly, I like "special editions", and the unlimited has great proportions.

I've read a bunch on here... Understand that the 2011s are going sayonara , that many hate the Mojave (which is cool because we love it ), and that the 012s may cure world hunger...

What I'd love to hear some advice on, though, is if anyone has had any recent experience buying these 011s and what dealers have been willing to do in terms of dealing.

For us, the Jeep is mainly going to be used the way the FJ was. Which means of course mainly on road as a daily driver for me (long highway trips), pretty hard core snow in the winter (trips up north a lot), drips down to the beach/shore in the summer, and some occasional *light* "off roading" (like camping basically... LOL)

Ive read a lot about the power plant and trans changes and Im not sure they will matter. Im going to drive the Unlimited Monday and see if I can live with it. As long as its not *too* far off the FJ for cruising around, I think it will be fine.

Since we really like the Mojave a *lot*, I think I'd rather get a great deal on that, then wait and pay top dollar for a regular 012, but I'm not sure dealers are actually willing to give great deals.

Anyway, thanks for reading and thanks for a great forum!

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