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Topic Review (Newest First)
02-25-2008 08:34 AM
BillD Triple88, what's this foam you mentioned above? can you give me more details about where exactly to look and what i'm looking for? would that cause the grinding in just second gear?
02-24-2008 09:14 PM
Triple88a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeghead View Post
I also found that pulling away in first then like 2 seconds later changing to second gear is fine too. 2nd has plenty enough torque to get going at 10mph
hhhaha yeah now with them 35s first is actually useful
02-24-2008 09:08 PM
BillD sorry about the post above, i didn't notice there was a second page to this thread. i'll try the 10W30 next time i change the fluid. Marc1Kim mentioned the worn synchros above but wouldn't that make the gear grind all the time, not just when the weather's cold? is it really expensive to replace a synchro? probably a ton of work (and therefor a hefty labor charge) to replace a pretty small, simple part, huh?
02-24-2008 09:02 PM
BillD i started having the same problem with my '97 4 cylinder. when i try to put it in second gear during cold weather, it grinds unless i let the RPMs drop to around 1,500. i bought it in September with about 88,000 miles and didn't notice the problem until it got cold. don't know how long it's been doing this isnce i drove it the most while it was still warm out. i noticed some of you guys saying it's like -10 degrees where you live but i'm in GA and 40 degrees is cold here. i get the grinding at any temp below about 55. If i drive around for about 10 mins, it goes away.

i put Redline MT-90 in it today and it didn't make any difference. exact same symptoms. you are supposed to put that in the trany and not the diffs, right? i don't know a whole lot about cars yet but is that the synchro that i'm hearing grind? could it be going bad?
12-19-2007 10:05 PM
Smeghead I also found that pulling away in first then like 2 seconds later changing to second gear is fine too. 2nd has plenty enough torque to get going at 10mph
12-19-2007 03:22 PM
rpxr400 I imagine this will work, too?

http://www.amsoil.com/StoreFront/mtg.aspx
12-18-2007 11:39 PM
Triple88a yep seing if its the foam thats getting in the way is the easiest and fastest option (about 15 seconds to be exact).. Its also free.
12-18-2007 11:37 PM
marc1kim
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeghead View Post
So for all of us having the tough 2nd gear problem use synthetic 10W30 ?

Not everybody, there's also posibility of worn synchros. or that foam sleeve on the shifter.
12-18-2007 11:30 PM
GrnTJ It will certainly help!
12-18-2007 11:26 PM
Smeghead So for all of us having the tough 2nd gear problem use synthetic 10W30 ?
12-18-2007 07:16 PM
marc1kim
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc1kim View Post
But all we know right now is that Chrysler superceded their ax-5/ax-15 fluid with 10W30. I'm going to make a few phone calls tomorrow to some dealers to verify the changes. I wish there was a way to contact Jeep to verify that 10W30 is OK. If everything checks out, then my heep is getting some fresh Synthetic 10W30.
Well I finally bit the bullet and changed the oil in my trans. It was getting too hard to shift. I decided to be the guinea pig and use synthetic 10W30 (which is what Chrysler is recommending now).
once I pulled the fill plug my heart sank when I got a strong sulfer smell, and again after draining slightly glittery oil. I guess the Original owner had replaced the fluid and used GL-5
I got about three quarts out of the tranny, and it took almost all of four to fill it. And after test driving, man it sure felt good to shift!

BTW, I emailed Jeep about the whole fluid change over, and the person that responded recommended consulting the appropriate manual...duh! But apparently the whole ax-5/ax-15 fluid supersesion to 10W30 is old news:
http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=935886

http://www.naxja.org/forum/archive/i...hp/t-2811.html


I did find a website that classfied 10W30 and GL-3 the same..can't find the dang link...But it makes sense since GL-3 has no addatives.

A concern, was the fact GL-4 has half the Sulfer based addatives that GL-5 has. So I wonder if GL-4 is bad for the trans as well.
12-18-2007 05:26 PM
matt69vdub My 3rd gear used to do that in my 99 4.0ltr. Then my clutch went out about 75k so when I put in a new clutch I replaced the syncros 1-4 gears.

problem fixed.
12-18-2007 01:46 PM
Smeghead ++ mines the same way, second is fine if you let the revs drop but you have to give it some help if not
12-18-2007 01:14 PM
hpipe Same problem here with my 97 4cyl...

Goes right in when low RPM, hard to put in gear at higher RPMs
12-10-2007 08:26 PM
Triple88a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tee View Post
Do you have a body lift? I developed this problem after installing a 1.25" BL.
It's because the shifter is hitting the tunnel if you have a BL.
No he does not...
12-10-2007 07:50 PM
Tee Do you have a body lift? I developed this problem after installing a 1.25" BL.
It's because the shifter is hitting the tunnel if you have a BL.
12-09-2007 11:40 PM
marc1kim Rich, I know where your coming from. Here's a quote taken from Jerry Bransford (a moderator at another jeep forum):

"10W-30 engine oil is roughly equivilent in viscosity to 75W-90 gear lube. Gear lube and engine oil use different viscosity scales so even if they are similar in consistency, their viscosity numbers will be different."

Of course if your using the 75W90 for rear end there may be addatives for the Hypoid Spider Gears, and posi-trac clutches.

But all we know right now is that Chrysler superceded their ax-5/ax-15 fluid with 10W30. I'm going to make a few phone calls tomorrow to some dealers to verify the changes. I wish there was a way to contact Jeep to verify that 10W30 is OK. If everything checks out, then my heep is getting some fresh Synthetic 10W30.
12-09-2007 09:49 PM
richp I have a case of MT-90 sitting right here and I'm looking at a bottle, SAE 75W90 API GL-4 Gear oil, I also have a bottle of Mobil-1 10W30 High Milage out of a six pack I use to add the extra quart from the 5 quart containers I get a walmart.
The question is, can a 10W30 weight oil provide the correct lubrication as a 75W90. One member on naxja said 'would you run a 10W30 in your differential'. Put that way I would say no, would it be safe to run in an AX tranny, I don't know. It could be a very expensive mistake.
12-09-2007 09:39 PM
marc1kim The NV1500 and NSG370 also take synchomesh (or synchomax) fluid.
12-09-2007 09:28 PM
marc1kim Well, I was checking out the Transmission Lube chart on the Royal purple website and they recommend 10W40 for all 98 and newer Jeep manual transmissions, except for the NV3550.

For the NV3550 Transmission they recommend the Royal Purple Synchromax...which is probably equivalent to the Pennzoil Synchromesh.

Even further proof is the Redline GL-4 descriptions I found online:

Red Line MTLĀ® Manual Transmission Lubricant
A70W80 GL-4 gear oil (SAE 5W30/10W30 engine oil viscosity) designed for use in manual transmissions and transaxles.

So....I'm thinking that GL-3/ GL-4 is just rebadged 10w30 motor oil.
12-09-2007 09:15 PM
richp
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrnTJ View Post
Hey White93, you can trust Petersons and throw the 10W30 into the tcase but Id really like to know for the tranny. That would save some $$ for sure. What do you think rich?
I dunno, I've been running Mobil-1 ATF in my 98XJ 231 for the past 340,000mi and the chain is still tight and it shifts like butter. I'm sticking with that.
The tranny change does interest me, alot. Note that I'm not willing to be the guinea pig in either my AX15 or AX5's.... They all got their redline a couple of months ago so I'll sit on the sidelines and watch for a while to see what happens.
12-09-2007 09:10 PM
GrnTJ Hey White93, you can trust Petersons and throw the 10W30 into the tcase but Id really like to know for the tranny. That would save some $$ for sure. What do you think rich?
12-09-2007 07:54 PM
White93ARB
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrnTJ View Post
I read in Petersons a while back that when changing t-case fluid, 10W30 is the best stuff to use. So before the weekend rolls around, should I just get some 10W30 for the trans instead? Synthetic of course.
+1. I need to know, I drained my T Case and my tranny when trying to disgnose my Jeep making strange noises but don't know what to fill it back up with.
12-09-2007 03:57 PM
GrnTJ I read in Petersons a while back that when changing t-case fluid, 10W30 is the best stuff to use. So before the weekend rolls around, should I just get some 10W30 for the trans instead? Synthetic of course.
12-09-2007 03:17 PM
richp
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc1kim View Post
I was over at Stu Olson's site to get the mopar/ chrysler part numbers for the ax-5/ax-15 fluid (04897622AA / MS-9684) to compare prices at http://www.mopar-parts-dealer.com/parts.htm

and this is what I got:


Part number 4897622aa was superceded by part number 4761839AC.

4761839AC is 10W30 Oil!!!!

In another forum Jerry Bransford said that 10W-30 engine oil is roughly equivilent in viscosity to 75W-90 gear lube. So....Does that mean Chrysler is recommending 10W30 for the AX-5 / AX-15 Trannies?
I don't know but it sure would solve the GL5 sulphur issue. The lube used in both trannys and transfer cases like a game of expensive musical chairs.
12-09-2007 02:02 PM
marc1kim
Quote:
Originally Posted by richp View Post
Correction, it has to be driven till the oil warms up, synthetic will solve this in about 2 minutes, just make sure it's GL3/4 NOT GL5 or GL6 or any combination that says GL5/6 as in 'meets GL2 GL3 GL4 GL5 GL 6 requirements' that GL5/6 means it has sulfur in it for high pressure lube like is commonly needed on ring and pinion gears. The only one I know besides the dealer stuff you have in there is Redline MT that meets the requirements. Royal Purple *may* have one, I don't know. What I do know is the techs at Redline recommend this.

I was over at Stu Olson's site to get the mopar/ chrysler part numbers for the ax-5/ax-15 fluid (04897622AA / MS-9684) to compare prices at http://www.mopar-parts-dealer.com/parts.htm

and this is what I got:


Part number 4897622aa was superceded by part number 4761839AC.

4761839AC is 10W30 Oil!!!!

In another forum Jerry Bransford said that 10W-30 engine oil is roughly equivilent in viscosity to 75W-90 gear lube. So....Does that mean Chrysler is recommending 10W30 for the AX-5 / AX-15 Trannies?
12-09-2007 09:36 AM
richp
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrnTJ View Post
Mine is not hard to find its jsut kinda tough to throw it into second. I have to pull kinda hard to get it to go into second. I'll get some redline next weekend then and change it up. Anyone know how much it takes?
The tranny has to warm up, it does not warm up if you start it and let it sit for an hour except by maybe some heat being transferred from the hot engine and the exhaust system going under it. The tranny has to turn and heat the gear oil up, that stuff is THICK normally, it's molasses once it gets cold. Heck, at 32F it barely will even pour out of the can, take it down to 10F and it's as thick as toothpaste and you have to squeeze it out of the bottle.
Even your engine oil takes much longer to heat up than the coolant and temperature gauge, start it cold and run it till the temp gauge goes up a ways, then pull the dipstick, the oil will still be COLD, engine oil usually takes about 20 minutes to get warm and 30 to get hot enough to cook off the moisture from condensation in the cold motor.
Synthetic is pretty much pour able at any temp we would run into below the arctic circle, I know my 10W30 Mobil-1 is pour able at 5F as I have changed my oil after it has sat out overnite in one of the other jeeps.
12-09-2007 08:37 AM
parrot head
Quote:
Originally Posted by WSU Tony View Post
What exactly needs to be warmed up. Like you said I can let it warm up for 10 minutes and it still doesn't help 2nd gear "loosen" up. What needs to warm up this much? Is it the fact that the oil doesn't really get less paste (and more liquid like) like until your actually running the engine at a higher RPM?

Warming the engine up doesn't help because the transmission is not getting warmed up just sitting there. It would take a long long time for the heat from the engine to warm up the trans, especially in below freezing weather. When you actually start driving and using the trans. it starts to warm up. Warm oil is thinner and therefore flows better, and the trans will shift easier. Changing the oil in the trans to a thinner viscosity, especially in the winter months would make shifting easier.
12-09-2007 04:40 AM
GrnTJ Thanks Trip, I'll give it a shot and see what happens. Specially since I got my first Michigan winter starting with the TJ. My old ZJ was an auto.
12-09-2007 02:51 AM
Triple88a
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrnTJ View Post
I have to pull kinda hard to get it to go into second.
Thats the syncros working....
For getting it into 2nd when cold.. try shifting from 1st to 2nd when in very low rpm at about 1300-1500rpm.. see if that helps a bit.
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