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Topic Review (Newest First)
03-10-2012 05:53 AM
jims319
Agree w/JDsDream

Own a BMW 2003 530i sport, loved it until I drove my friends TJ. Bought one a week later, no regrets. Soon to be ex can have the BMW.



Quote:
Originally Posted by JDsDream View Post
You asked for opinions so here ya go.

It all comes down to what you really want. If you want a "car" buy the WRX, if you want a vehicle like no other than make it the Wrangler.

I went from a 5 series to a Wrangler myself. I still own both. Which one do you think I drive? The Wrangler! My poor Beamer hasn't seen pavement since I bought the Jeep 6 years ago.

Just like you, with my BMW, a spec of dirt was immediately removed. I would walk 3 city blocks to keep from having to park it where someone might open a door and hit it. She sparkled and shined and she was a big pita to keep the way I wanted her. Now with my Wrangler, I circle for the closest spot or a spot next to another Wrangler. If the weather is nice I MIGHT spray it down with the hose otherwise I let Mother Nature handle it.

As far as handling and performance, No you won't be hitting the turns in the same manner as you would in your Beamer or a WRX but then again, you won't be in a hurry to get anywhere either.

Reliability? The Wrangler is as reliable as any vehicle on the road today and a lot more reliable than most. I'm not sure about your BMW but mine has the Inline 6 and is still running strong at the ripe old age of 25. That is one of the many reasons that I bought my Wrangler.

You might also want to consider the re-sale value. Take a look at the re-sale on a 5 yr old WRX compared to a 5 yr old Wrangler. They really hold their value. I'm just throwing that in there. Most Wrangler owners couldn't care less about re-sale because they don't ever intend on parting with them. Myself included.

To sum it up...A Wrangler is the most fun you will ever have driving a vehicle but if you want a car, then a Wrangler isn't right for you.

Oh and the reason that CR never ranks the Wrangler highly is because there is no other vehicle to compare it to. It is in a class all it's own.
03-08-2012 04:00 PM
DasfieldmarshelsYJ
Quote:
Originally Posted by mal1110
Haha Pete, I may be moving up to Boston, and was thinking that I would want a wrangler so that I wouldn't have to worry about dings and whatever else in the city.

I just don't know if I would be better off with the wrangler or not. I seem to be getting a tepid response so far (which I appreciate if it's an honest perspective).

Wranger Pros
Cool, drop the top, handles any weather, wouldn't have to worry about it in daily driving

Wrangler Cons
Mpg, reliability?, death wobble? (WTF), does not go fast or go around corners well

WRX pros
Fun to drive, fast, hatchback holds stuff, japanese reliability

WRX cons
Possible repairs on the turbo down the line/ more expensive repairs in general, I would probably obsess over the car like I do with my BMW, premium gas
I'd get a newer yj that's efi
03-08-2012 02:40 PM
needforspeed150 As someone said... Get the air conditioning !!! and the 4.0 I-6 Decide if you want full doors, my 2003 had both the hardtop and soft top.. The hardtop is beautiful for winter and off in the spring. I'm a old dog but my insurance on it is $300 a year full coverage.. I cant touch that with anything else I own. Enjoy looking for your perfect purchase.
03-08-2012 01:35 PM
lolpetewtf I love driving 335s lol!!!!!!!
03-08-2012 11:16 AM
silvrevo Your all over the place,,,,,,,,,

As far as asking strangers what you might like and be better for you??????

Really???

With that said,,, I came from a "tooned" BMW 335i,, to a 2010 wrangler.. didnt look back.

Now Im in a 2012 JK,,, and loving the added kick in the pants with the skinney pedal !
03-06-2012 08:00 AM
Jonny15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lithium Lotus
For college, I would probably pick a Cherokee over a Wrangler, for a couple reasons.

You will find Cherokee's a lot easier and most of the time cheaper then a Wrangler. A lot of Cherokee's weren't beat on like Wranglers, so you will find them in good condition. They have more interior space and cargo room then a Wrangler.
Its also not nearly as fun and you cant take the top off

I had a wrangler in college and it got me quite a few rides with girls who wanted to see what it was like to go "topless" haha
03-05-2012 10:50 PM
Lithium Lotus For college, I would probably pick a Cherokee over a Wrangler, for a couple reasons.

You will find Cherokee's a lot easier and most of the time cheaper then a Wrangler. A lot of Cherokee's weren't beat on like Wranglers, so you will find them in good condition. They have more interior space and cargo room then a Wrangler.
03-05-2012 06:46 PM
cavsvet74 And there are those who, if nearby, will put themselves elbow deep in your Jeep also.
03-05-2012 06:13 PM
Celtic There is quite a bit on You Tube also.

You might find that if you do the how-to research before you start a maintenance or repair project that you won't need too much help once you are elbow deep in gear oil.

The folks on the WF really know their stuff. Take a look at some of the project and build threads, especially the ones with start to finish pictures. You will see a lot of knowledge and expertise being shared here.
03-05-2012 04:43 PM
InvertChaos
Quote:
Originally Posted by mal1110

Yeah I mean I'm sure there are manuals available. What I'm getting at is, when I'm elbows-deep into the engine bay fixing something, or I'm under the car and not knowing what the hell is going on, is the online wrangler community helpful at trouble shooting?

I know in BMW circles/forums everything has been done a thousand times and there are tons of people who are happy to help instruct a newb.

Hoping the wrangler folks are just as cool!
They're pretty darn helpful and most will provide instructions with pictures and such.
03-05-2012 04:32 PM
Jonny15 Take a look around the forum and see for yourself. There is an incredible amount of information available here and a bunch of friendly knowledgable people to help you out. Jeep owners have a great, strong community and im sure you'll run into some fellow jeep owners where you live who would be more than happy to help you out if you need it.

Good luck searching for your future jeep!
03-05-2012 04:25 PM
mal1110
Quote:
Originally Posted by cavsvet74 View Post
The Chilton's or Hayne's repair manuals are a great resource.

They're like Cliff's notes for auto repair.

Yeah I mean I'm sure there are manuals available. What I'm getting at is, when I'm elbows-deep into the engine bay fixing something, or I'm under the car and not knowing what the hell is going on, is the online wrangler community helpful at trouble shooting?

I know in BMW circles/forums everything has been done a thousand times and there are tons of people who are happy to help instruct a newb.

Hoping the wrangler folks are just as cool!
03-05-2012 04:05 PM
cavsvet74
Quote:
Originally Posted by mal1110 View Post
Thanks!

So are there a lot of DIY guides for common repairs?
The Chilton's or Hayne's repair manuals are a great resource.

They're like Cliff's notes for auto repair.
03-05-2012 03:00 PM
lolpetewtf
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celtic View Post
Very cool. I went to Suffolk, but did MBA not JD. Parking on Beacon Hill is not too awfully bad. Cambridge and the Back Bay are a real challenge.

Good luck and keep us posted!
I was walking through the streets of Beacon Hill a few weeks ago. I said to myself, "the only auto I would considering owning whilst living here would be a Wrangler".

Short wheelbase, 4X4 for getting out of your spot in winter.
03-05-2012 02:19 PM
Celtic I would venture to say yes, and in addition there are lots of pictures and videos here on the WF for common and not-so-common repairs. A wrangler is a relatively simple machine. Patience and understanding go a long way.

Also, "e-How" has some good pictures, video and step-by-step instructions which usually include a list of needed tools for quite a few common Wrangler fixes and maintenance items.

P.S. You might want to add A/C to your option list. I was sitting on the Tobin Bridge in a Camaro with the T-Tops out in rush hour traffic one Friday afternoon and was really glad to have the freezer cranking.
03-05-2012 01:34 PM
mal1110 Thanks!

So are there a lot of DIY guides for common repairs?
03-05-2012 01:27 PM
Celtic
Quote:
Originally Posted by mal1110 View Post
Not undergrad. Law school. I would be getting a place with parking. Would get a soft top too for the nice weather probably. I totally forgot about insurance costs. Wrangler is looking better and better...
Very cool. I went to Suffolk, but did MBA not JD. Parking on Beacon Hill is not too awfully bad. Cambridge and the Back Bay are a real challenge.

Good luck and keep us posted!
03-05-2012 01:09 PM
mal1110
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celtic View Post
mal1110,
If you are going to undergraduate school IN Boston, and don't have a place to park a vehicle this whole post may be an exercise in futility. A lot of the schools don't allow undergrads to have vehicles, let alone give them parking permits. Even if you could get a permit, all bets are off on snow emergency days.

Having had three kids go to school in NYC, Amherst, MA and Providence (College Hill), RI, each says that having a vehicle at school is more hassle than it's worth unless you are an upperclassman living off campus with a designated parking space.

And I seem to remember you saying that you want a hard top. Where are you going to put it when you take it off and want to drive around without it? Also it is not easy to get the HT off and on solo.
Not undergrad. Law school. I would be getting a place with parking. Would get a soft top too for the nice weather probably. I totally forgot about insurance costs. Wrangler is looking better and better...
03-05-2012 12:00 PM
Celtic mal1110,
If you are going to undergraduate school IN Boston, and don't have a place to park a vehicle this whole post may be an exercise in futility. A lot of the schools don't allow undergrads to have vehicles, let alone give them parking permits. Even if you could get a permit, all bets are off on snow emergency days.

Having had three kids go to school in NYC, Amherst, MA and Providence (College Hill), RI, each says that having a vehicle at school is more hassle than it's worth unless you are an upperclassman living off campus with a designated parking space.

And I seem to remember you saying that you want a hard top. Where are you going to put it when you take it off and want to drive around without it? Also it is not easy to get the HT off and on solo.
03-05-2012 11:55 AM
TrueNorth One important thing nobody has mentioned yet is the insurance cost.

We seriously considered buying my wife a 2010 WRX wagon. Test drove it almost pulled the trigger on it.

Thankfully we called our insurance agent to get a quote before we traded her car in the next morning. Just for refrence she's 35, perfect driving record, high credit score and no tickets.

$235 a MONTH!!!! Sorry but WRX is cool but not that cool. Same agent same phone call 2011 Wrangler Sahara, $118 a month for full coverage with 500k BO and PP limits.

Do yourself a huge favor and have your insurance agent give a you a quote on every vehicle you are considering before you buy it. Could easily save you $10,000 by the time you pay that shiney new car off.
03-05-2012 11:38 AM
Jonny15
Quote:
Originally Posted by mal1110
The second I buy one am I going to need to change the timing belt/chain and water pump?:
Haha i see you're used to the nightmare of buying a used german car . Dont need to do that with a jeep as long as you get a 2.5 four cylinder or 4.0 six cylinder.

The later model years had the 2.4 four cylinder neon engine as a replacement for the amc 2.5...you may have to change the timing belt on that one but i HIGHLY recomend you skip the 4 banger all together and get the 4.0 inline 6...much more power and its a bulletproof engine
03-05-2012 11:01 AM
mal1110 I'm from NY and have lived (and driven) in other major cities. I'm sure I will do fine in Boston traffic or wherever I end up at school.

I am going to start shopping for wranglers this week. I doubt I'll pull the trigger on one until late April, which should give me plenty of time. I want a TJ with no options at all except the auto and a hard top. Probably somewhere between 01-05 with milage as low as possible (less than 85k). Damn wranglers hold their value too well...

The second I buy one am I going to need to change the timing belt/chain and water pump?

Are there good DIYs around for typical wrangler repairs?



Where I can usually be found:
03-05-2012 10:53 AM
lolpetewtf
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celtic View Post
And, in case you have not experienced it yet, there is the inner loop (Route 128) around Boston. Here is the deal after 14 years driving in and around Beantown:

1) Boston drivers are very fast but are generally very skillful.

2) There is very little horn blowing, because it is not needed.

3) The breakdown lane on the Route 128 Inner Loop is open to regular traffic in certain places during Rush Hour. The "Skillful" Boston drivers will not cut you a break or even acknowledge your existence when you are trying to get on the highway from the entrance ramp. The bottom line is that you need to be driving something that can do a hole shot from zero to seventy or better quite quickly when the breakdown lane is open.

All that being said, if you do decide on a Wrangler vs a wrx you might want to look for something with a V8 swapped in. "There is no substitute for cubic inches." And, go with one that has an automatic with a high stall speed torque converter. Pumping a clutch a couple of hundred times an hour in rush traffic can get annoying.
I am on 128/Pike all the time ( on/off Rt. 20 exit). Pretty much correct in what you wrote. I am one of those aggressive drivers merging onto 128 from the Pike (lil scary sometimes). But I know what my BMW can do and never have a problem. Going to have to bring back my old driving style, shouldn't have a problem.
03-05-2012 10:33 AM
Celtic And, in case you have not experienced it yet, there is the inner loop (Route 128) around Boston. Here is the deal after 14 years driving in and around Beantown:

1) Boston drivers are very fast but are generally very skillful.

2) There is very little horn blowing, because it is not needed.

3) The breakdown lane on the Route 128 Inner Loop is open to regular traffic in certain places during Rush Hour. The "Skillful" Boston drivers will not cut you a break or even acknowledge your existence when you are trying to get on the highway from the entrance ramp. The bottom line is that you need to be driving something that can do a hole shot from zero to seventy or better quite quickly when the breakdown lane is open.

All that being said, if you do decide on a Wrangler vs a wrx you might want to look for something with a V8 swapped in. "There is no substitute for cubic inches." And, go with one that has an automatic with a high stall speed torque converter. Pumping a clutch a couple of hundred times an hour in rush traffic can get annoying.
03-05-2012 10:12 AM
AKYJ [QUOTE=Jonny15;2104927]I had a 99 tj for 3 years that i sold for an 01 Audi A4 1.8t. Biggest mistake i ever made. Not that the Audi was a bad car, but once the "fast car" factor wore off, it was just another boring car. It had no personality, and all i could do was go fast and get tickets. Mods were expensive and limited and so were repairs. I almost imediately regretted that decision.

You hit it right on Had my 92 yj bought a 01 c class benz for some stupid reason I guess i wanted to go fast again but once the "fast car" factor wore off, it was just another boring car, That car cost me thousands to keep it on the road just from simple repairs, then when I rolled and totaled that car out I couldn't be happier to be back driving my old beat up jeep.

You should find a 2000 or newer TJ with the stronger NV3550 manual transmission, automatics tend to get boring.
03-05-2012 10:08 AM
PaulRevere1991 If I were you, I would pick up a 92-95 yj for a about 4 grand, less electronics, cheaper parts, 4.0, no death wobble. That way your not spending 8-9k on something, you may hate. Its old style suspention will rider rougher compared to the tj though.
03-05-2012 09:48 AM
N39-W120 Just to throw another in the mix.... As my commuter I bought a Ford Fusion, 6sp manual.... It was cheap to buy, cheap to run as with a light foot I am getting 38mpg highway.... in one year and 45000 miles the only thing I have had to do is change the oil....and when I choose to stand on it it is a blast on a twisting country road. Granted, it is no WRX, but would be quite friendly on a student's wallet.
03-05-2012 09:35 AM
Jonny15 I had a 99 tj for 3 years that i sold for an 01 Audi A4 1.8t. Biggest mistake i ever made. Not that the Audi was a bad car, but once the "fast car" factor wore off, it was just another boring car. It had no personality, and all i could do was go fast and get tickets. Mods were expensive and limited and so were repairs. I almost imediately regretted that decision.

I sold it shortly after that and now i have another tj, an 06 rubicon. Its not fast, has power nothing, rides rough, its noisey...and i love it to death. Seriously there is nothing like owning a jeep, i drive mine 600-800 miles a week and i wouldnt have it any other way. Its reliable, it can go anywhere, its tons of fun to drive, cheap and easy to repair, looks badass, its perfect for me.

My words of wisdom from someone whos had both a jeep and a nice fast german car...i regretted selling my first jeep for the audi almost instantly, but i havent thought twice about that boring audi since i sold it and bought another jeep. Buy one man you wont regret it.
03-05-2012 09:25 AM
sparky
Quote:
Originally Posted by mal1110 View Post
Apple and Orange in my mind. I want a car with a damn drain hole. I want something tough and reliable. I'm tired of prissy and refined. It's too much effort.
With the above comment, then you are ready for a Jeep. Glad you see what you are getting into.

Manual vs auto - both reliable. Really depends on where you drive. Manuals are a lot more fun, hard rock crawlers seem to prefer auto. I think for you, if any of your driving involves sitting in heavy trafic, get the auto. Working the clutch in bumber to bumber traffic can get tiring.
03-05-2012 09:22 AM
Jonny15 Double post phone was acting up
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