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Topic Review (Newest First)
Today 01:24 AM
busbreath Don't forget overinflated tires too! Those tire and alignment shops will fill your tires to the posted max. 33's should be about 25-28 lbs. Filling to 35 psi will also agravate a dw situation.
Yesterday 09:43 PM
2004TJLucas Any ideas guys?
09-14-2014 08:26 PM
2004TJLucas
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
Have a helper turn your steering wheel repeatedly back & forth, back & forth, while you lay in front and look the steering system over for things that are moving that shouldn't be moving. Like the passenger-side mount of the track bar shouldn't moving at all....if it has any side-to-side movement while the steering is being worked back & forth, that can allow DW to develop when triggered by something else like a bump in the road or an out of balance tire. Look for things that are bolted together that have slop in them that allow things to move as you do the steering test. Tires must be fully on the ground for this test, the engine can be running to make it easier for the person turning the steering wheel.

What is probably the #1 cause of Death Wobble? A bad tire or an out of balance tire.
Jeep tj DW - YouTube
09-14-2014 02:44 PM
Jerry Bransford
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004TJLucas View Post
If it wasn't that what's ur next recommendation.
Have a helper turn your steering wheel repeatedly back & forth, back & forth, while you lay in front and look the steering system over for things that are moving that shouldn't be moving. Like the passenger-side mount of the track bar shouldn't moving at all....if it has any side-to-side movement while the steering is being worked back & forth, that can allow DW to develop when triggered by something else like a bump in the road or an out of balance tire. Look for things that are bolted together that have slop in them that allow things to move as you do the steering test. Tires must be fully on the ground for this test, the engine can be running to make it easier for the person turning the steering wheel.

What is probably the #1 cause of Death Wobble? A bad tire or an out of balance tire.
09-14-2014 02:05 PM
2004TJLucas
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
I didn't make that suggestion of getting the tires perfectly balanced lightly... which is specifically why I said not all tire shops will take the time to get them balanced well enough to prevent or cure this problem. I already assumed you had gotten them balanced at some point. I thought I had emphasized that perfect balance point enough but I guess not.

I have had to return to a tire shop twice in the same day after their initial balance wasn't good enough... that meant three trips to the same tire shop in the same day until they got the tires balanced well enough... which is why I said the bigger the tire (your 33's for example), the more important that perfect tire balance becomes.
If it wasn't that what's ur next recommendation.
09-14-2014 11:39 AM
Jerry Bransford
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004TJLucas View Post
I just spent 200+ dollars on life time alignment balancing and rotations the jeep is steering fine and balanced properly. Any other ideas Jerry
I didn't make that suggestion of getting the tires perfectly balanced lightly... which is specifically why I said not all tire shops will take the time to get them balanced well enough to prevent or cure this problem. I already assumed you had gotten them balanced at some point. I thought I had emphasized that perfect balance point enough but I guess not.

I have had to return to a tire shop twice in the same day after their initial balance wasn't good enough... that meant three trips to the same tire shop in the same day until they got the tires balanced well enough... which is why I said the bigger the tire (your 33's for example), the more important that perfect tire balance becomes.
09-14-2014 11:34 AM
2004TJLucas
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
Do NOT install a dropped Pitman arm... pay no attention to whoever gave you that totally bad advice. Many lifted vehicles require a dropped Pitman arm, but a Wrangler TJ has a much better front-end design so a dropped Pitman arm is seldom needed. Installing one when not required by other aftermarket modifications will just cause an additional problem called bump steer.

This problem is very commonly caused by nothing more than imperfectly balanced tires or even a bad tire. Most tire shops won't take the effort to get the tire balanced perfectly... and the bigger the tire on a TJ, the more important perfect tire balance becomes. A big tire that is out of balance can easily cause Death Wobble where a small factory size tire with the same imbalance may not.
I just spent 200+ dollars on life time alignment balancing and rotations the jeep is steering fine and balanced properly. Any other ideas Jerry
09-14-2014 11:32 AM
2004TJLucas
Quote:
Originally Posted by barnaclebob View Post
You may not need the 4". Sorry for the prev message. Autocorrect...
Thank you for the advice I have been recommended to do that by the mechanic as well. I feel as if that might be the next step but would only wanna make sure before I go ahead and do that
09-14-2014 11:25 AM
Jerry Bransford Do NOT install a dropped Pitman arm... pay no attention to whoever gave you that totally bad advice. Many lifted vehicles require a dropped Pitman arm, but a Wrangler TJ has a much better front-end design so a dropped Pitman arm is seldom needed. Installing one when not required by other aftermarket modifications will just cause an additional problem called bump steer.

This problem is very commonly caused by nothing more than imperfectly balanced tires or even a bad tire. Most tire shops won't take the effort to get the tire balanced perfectly... and the bigger the tire on a TJ, the more important perfect tire balance becomes. A big tire that is out of balance can easily cause Death Wobble where a small factory size tire with the same imbalance may not.
09-14-2014 10:55 AM
barnaclebob
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004TJLucas View Post
Hey everyone please help me solve my DW problem! I have only had my jeep about a month and my parents are about to force me to sell it because of problems. I have a 2004 TJ with a 2 inch spacer lift sitting on metric tires that equal about 33s i just got my jeep aligned, rotated, and balanced, still have the DW i replaced my steering stabilizer and still have it! My DW starts at what says 47 mph but really is about 50-55 due to the tires throwing it off. i have checked for loose and warn parts as well as the 2 mechanics I’ve had do work on it and we haven’t found anything showing wear tear or anything like that. I was told getting a dropped pitman arm could fix the problem but i would love to stop spending money on things that rant completely needed, i would only like to spend the money to fix the DW, key word being fix not patch! Thank you everyone.
You may not need the 4". Sorry for the prev message. Autocorrect...
09-14-2014 10:46 AM
barnaclebob
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004TJLucas View Post
Hey everyone please help me solve my DW problem! I have only had my jeep about a month and my parents are about to force me to sell it because of problems. I have a 2004 TJ with a 2 inch spacer lift sitting on metric tires that equal about 33s i just got my jeep aligned, rotated, and balanced, still have the DW i replaced my steering stabilizer and still have it! My DW starts at what says 47 mph but really is about 50-55 due to the tires throwing it off. i have checked for loose and warn parts as well as the 2 mechanics I’ve had do work on it and we haven’t found anything showing wear tear or anything like that. I was told getting a dropped pitman arm could fix the problem but i would love to stop spending money on things that rant completely needed, i would only like to spend the money to fix the DW, key word being fix not patch! Thank you everyone.
i had same issues with my 2003 when I put a 4" lift. Replaced most of the linkage and the let was a dropped pitman arm. A 4" drop put everything back into then right angle and spec. Bought on Amazon .
09-14-2014 10:00 AM
2004TJLucas Hey everyone please help me solve my DW problem! I have only had my jeep about a month and my parents are about to force me to sell it because of problems. I have a 2004 TJ with a 2 inch spacer lift sitting on metric tires that equal about 33s i just got my jeep aligned, rotated, and balanced, still have the DW i replaced my steering stabilizer and still have it! My DW starts at what says 47 mph but really is about 50-55 due to the tires throwing it off. i have checked for loose and warn parts as well as the 2 mechanics Iíve had do work on it and we havenít found anything showing wear tear or anything like that. I was told getting a dropped pitman arm could fix the problem but i would love to stop spending money on things that rant completely needed, i would only like to spend the money to fix the DW, key word being fix not patch! Thank you everyone.
09-12-2014 12:22 PM
Hewillfly
Quote:
Originally Posted by planman View Post
Yes.
Thanks man! I'll get those on order! I appreciate the help!
09-09-2014 08:12 AM
planman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hewillfly View Post
Can the control arms be saved by changing out the bushings?
Yes.
09-07-2014 09:18 PM
Hewillfly Can the control arms be saved by changing out the bushings?
08-19-2014 06:24 PM
Whiskerfish That bracket (axle end) for the Track bar on my Wife's 05 is junk. I think the door panels are made from heavier gauge that that thing is (being factious). Anyway I welded a small plate on it and line reamed it up to the next size and things have been good for me for a good long while now. The most challenging part was Drilling out the bushing on the track bar to the next size. That was no joke, those bushings are some seriously hard stuff.
08-19-2014 02:01 PM
BirminghamTJ
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnukes View Post
I have read a lot of forums about the Death Wobble. I experienced it a couple times after placing a 2 in budget boost. I hear this quite frequently in the forums. I believe that it is also prevalent in the higher lifts, however not as many of those are on the road. Prior to placing the BB on my '05 LJ I had a slight shimmy right at 55mph. I have been chasing this issue for a couple of years now. I have new upper and lower ball joints, steering ball joints, control arm bushings, new tires, steering stabilizer, and probably something else I forgot. I have not gotten the true DW since the stabilizer, but continue to get the shimmy at 55 mph. Next on my list is to try a new adjustable track bar. I will report the results.
I would be willing to bet that the frame or axle side track bar bolt has worn out its bracket. I'd check it and if it is drill it out to 1/2" grade 8 minimum or weld new brackets on.
08-19-2014 01:22 PM
jnukes
DW continued

I have read a lot of forums about the Death Wobble. I experienced it a couple times after placing a 2 in budget boost. I hear this quite frequently in the forums. I believe that it is also prevalent in the higher lifts, however not as many of those are on the road. Prior to placing the BB on my '05 LJ I had a slight shimmy right at 55mph. I have been chasing this issue for a couple of years now. I have new upper and lower ball joints, steering ball joints, control arm bushings, new tires, steering stabilizer, and probably something else I forgot. I have not gotten the true DW since the stabilizer, but continue to get the shimmy at 55 mph. Next on my list is to try a new adjustable track bar. I will report the results.
07-25-2014 08:39 PM
Majnoon ^^ cool post!
07-25-2014 08:35 PM
44 Echo Death Wobble, for anyone who cares, is technically Harmonic Resonance. Everything that moves, hence rotates, resonates or vibrates as it moves. For this many vehicles, of a certain brand and type, including my TJ recently, this is an inherent design flaw. The total system was designed at or near its Harmonic Frequency, a point at which the vibration moves throughout the system, repeating itself at the exact same time the next vibration occurs, thus building on itself. As each vibration occurs it leaves a little bit of itself behind. Just one vibration eventually dissipates, getting fainter in time until ends. Normally, the vibration, or frequency, is offset so by the time the "leftover" shock of the initial wave starts to return, the next wave of energy slams into it from the opposite direction, thus canceling it. If, however, the first wave matches exactly the first, again they build on one another, growing in intensity. Engineers know this, and so they are supposed to test their designs so they know where the nodal point is, that point where the frequencies exactly match one another. Changing the mass, size, or shape of just one component can alter that frequency nodal point. One other point, as most point out, changing out a steering damper most likely is only masking the problem. With this much vibration, if you don't address the issue immediately, you're just wearing out parts. It is quite conceivable that if continued to drive, something could literally fail. Google the Tacoma Narrows Bridge, if you want to see Harmonic Resonance to the point of total failure. Imagine that being your front end.
02-23-2014 07:30 AM
BusinessRogue
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleOught View Post
A lot of things can contribute to DW but the track bar is the single most important item to prevent it. Also check your unit bearings and make sure they have no play. If a new stablilizer "fixed" it, you probably have other problems that you are not aware of.
Read back a few posts. I've replaced everything except the drag link, although I replaced its tie rod.

I know for a fact tires without any weights (completely unbalanced) will cause the vehicle to start DW at extremely low MPH.
02-23-2014 07:24 AM
DoubleOught A lot of things can contribute to DW but the track bar is the single most important item to prevent it. Also check your unit bearings and make sure they have no play. If a new stablilizer "fixed" it, you probably have other problems that you are not aware of.
02-23-2014 07:17 AM
BusinessRogue Update! Got my tires balanced. Death wobble gone. Now, I didn't have any weights in the tires because the idiot who flipped them (even out the wear) took out the weights. This can make a vehicle DW at 15MPH in 2WD with the right bump.

Waiting on my alignment until my new rear adjustable track bar comes in to center the axles.
02-18-2014 07:19 PM
BusinessRogue
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hewillfly View Post
no worries mate - keep us updated... I'm curious to see if that stuff actually works! I plan to be buried in this jeep, anything helps to keep it running !
I'll know more tomorrow, going to get my tires re-balanced and have an alignment done. I'll update then. I just want it to be 100% before I take it on a trip and get 300 miles away from home.
02-18-2014 07:16 PM
Hewillfly
Quote:
Originally Posted by BusinessRogue View Post
Thanks for the advice I greatly appreciate it my man.
no worries mate - keep us updated... I'm curious to see if that stuff actually works! I plan to be buried in this jeep, anything helps to keep it running !
02-18-2014 05:28 PM
BusinessRogue
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hewillfly View Post
Check the condition of your transmission.... I thought I had DW too. I got had to replace my torque converter because it tc lock up issues... Anywho no more DW afterwards. I later found out about a friction modifier that fixes that sort of shudder problem, it's called Dr. Tranny - google : " dr tranny jeep tj" you'll see what other people are saying. I don't know if it's snake oil but it's worth a shot before spending 1500 to have ur tc replaced. IMHO
Thanks for the advice I greatly appreciate it my man.
02-18-2014 05:23 PM
Hewillfly Check the condition of your transmission.... I thought I had DW too. I got had to replace my torque converter because it tc lock up issues... Anywho no more DW afterwards. I later found out about a friction modifier that fixes that sort of shudder problem, it's called Dr. Tranny - google : " dr tranny jeep tj" you'll see what other people are saying. I don't know if it's snake oil but it's worth a shot before spending 1500 to have ur tc replaced. IMHO
02-18-2014 03:39 PM
BusinessRogue
Quote:
Originally Posted by rubiconvict05 View Post
By the way replacing your steering stabilizer will only mask any problem. I'm not saying that it wasn't a bad choice but a S.S. won't correct the problem at hand.
The strut no longer had pressure so I replaced it. About page 14 I noticed the trend. Lol

Although I could have 6 and mine would probably get worse.
02-18-2014 03:09 PM
rubiconvict05 By the way replacing your steering stabilizer will only mask any problem. I'm not saying that it wasn't a bad choice but a S.S. won't correct the problem at hand.
02-18-2014 03:07 PM
rubiconvict05 I have finially tracked down the source of my death wobble. Now I know there are 92 pages to this thread so forgive me if this has been covered.
I needed to replace my front u joints, during the disassembly I removed the front hubs both had a dried mud ring that disallowed me to feel wheel bearing wobble with the standard shake test. I replaced the wheelbearings and boom wobble completely gone. Prior to this discovery I had replaced all steering linkage, all ball joints, track bar, pitman arm, tires, had the rims checked for trueness, checked all bolts and nuts for tightness from steering wheel to steering box for tightness, and controll arm bushings and bolts for correctness. I then had two alignments. After replacing the wheelbearings I then had another alignment. This was a long fought battle where I didn't throw parts at it but replaced everything that had even the slightest amount or wear.
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