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Topic Review (Newest First)
12-03-2008 10:07 PM
stevens243 I'll try it out. Thanks Jerry!
12-03-2008 07:46 PM
Jerry Bransford It's really hard to tell from the photo but I think you're right, that going back to the OE Pitman arm may help restore the proper angle. If you reinstall the OE Pitman arm, check the drag link connection to it afterwards for any possible binding.
12-03-2008 07:31 PM
stevens243

Sorry CF:

Jerry, here's a pic of my hunk...The drag and sway are not parallel...It appears that a stock pitman would make it close, if not perfect. The way to go?

Thanks, I try to learn something everyday

Attachment 5437
12-03-2008 04:45 PM
charliefoxtrot
Quote:
Originally Posted by distortedtj View Post
Wait a minute.....It's 0736L eastern time.....

I know your not on a vehicle forum using a government computer. Correct Sir?




Being OPS I'm going to have to confiscate that computer now.




good thing im not in work today, haha, go guard!
=)
12-03-2008 03:54 PM
Jerry Bransford The Currie HD steering kit doesn't affect steering geometry at all so it won't affect the need or lack of need for a dropped Pitman arm.
12-03-2008 03:51 PM
stevens243 Yeah, I've had bump steer before, but with this TJ, I get a "relaxed" bump. I guess, I'd say I get a very mild turning of the wheel when one of my tires climbs, but it doesn't keep the wheel over or cause any control problems... of course, I could put the stocker pitman back on and be upset at myself, so I won't say that now.

I'll snap a pic when I get home (huh, I don't have any here with it sitting on level ground, who'd a figgered?) and see what you think. My next two projects are gears and then a currie link and tie-rod. Gears first, but I'll also want to know if the currie would tend to drive me toward or away from a dropped pitman.
12-03-2008 03:40 PM
Jerry Bransford
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevens243 View Post
Just for my clarity, I'm wondering why you would say very rarely? I have and 3 of my jeep buddies all have drop pitman arms. I've seen/heard that anything over 4-5" of lift makes one practically required. My kit came with a drop pitman (Fabtech 6" long arm).

I never tried to reconnect the steering with the stock pitman arm, so I can't compare post lift steering characteristics, so any feedback appreciated.
First, pretty much all CJs and YJs require dropped Pitman arms once a suspension lift is installed and it doesn't have to be a tall lift for them to need one. With TJs, a lot of people just assume they also need dropped Pitman arms but that isn't usually the case where a TJ is concerned.

The TJ's inverted-Y steering design uses greatly improved geometry so dropped Pitman arms are rarely needed. It really depends on the geometry between the drag link and trackbar and their requirement they be parallel to each other in order to avoid bump steer. If they are parallel, no bump steer. The less they are parallel, the more bump steer that will be present.

For example, if the upper end of the trackbar has been dropped via a dropped mounting bracket, as is the case with my RE 1610/1611 trackbar and dropped trackbar mount, then I need a dropped Pitman arm to drop the drag link a corresponding amount. That's with my RE 4.5" lift. But with my older 5.5" RockKrawler lift, I could not have installed a dropped Pitman arm with that lift without causing bump steer because that kit did not drop the upper end of the trackbar.

One big problem with those who installed dropped Pitman arms is they have no idea what bump steer is and they think its symptoms are normal for a lifted TJ. Bump steer is not normal and isn't just part of owning a lifted Jeep. Many have bump steer but they don't know they do. They just accept it without having a clue what to call it or how to fix it.

With a 6" lift, it's hard to know if you need a dropped Pitman arm or not without seeing the relationship between the drag link (which connects to the Pitman arm) and trackbar.

Are you familiar with what the symptoms of bump steer are?
12-03-2008 02:57 PM
stevens243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
VERY rarely should a dropped Pitman arm be installed on a TJ.
Just for my clarity, I'm wondering why you would say very rarely? I have and 3 of my jeep buddies all have drop pitman arms. I've seen/heard that anything over 4-5" of lift makes one practically required. My kit came with a drop pitman (Fabtech 6" long arm).

I never tried to reconnect the steering with the stock pitman arm, so I can't compare post lift steering characteristics, so any feedback appreciated.
12-03-2008 11:49 AM
Jerry Bransford Is that dropped Pitman arm still on? For your setup, I definitely would not have installed it. When you drive over a bump or dip in the road, do you notice any left-right steering as the front axle moves up and down? If so, that is bump steer which is being caused by the dropped Pitman arm you installed.

VERY rarely should a dropped Pitman arm be installed on a TJ.
12-03-2008 10:53 AM
4point Looks good glad you got it done.
12-03-2008 10:27 AM
stevens243 That looks great! Glad you finally got it done.

Hey, what's all that white stuff??
12-03-2008 08:47 AM
distortedtj ^^^^^ Thats a joke for everyone else. This is a safe forum so far.
12-03-2008 08:36 AM
distortedtj Wait a minute.....It's 0736L eastern time.....

I know your not on a vehicle forum using a government computer. Correct Sir?




Being OPS I'm going to have to confiscate that computer now.



12-03-2008 08:24 AM
charliefoxtrot
Quote:
Originally Posted by distortedtj View Post
Lima,Golf "looks good"<-- for none mil.

Now go get some snow wheelin video's
wilco

haha
yea, might head out this afternoon if i can get some guys to go with
12-03-2008 08:15 AM
distortedtj Lima,Golf "looks good"<-- for none mil.

Now go get some snow wheelin video's
12-03-2008 05:52 AM
charliefoxtrot hey guys, thanks for all the help. Finally got my beloved jeep back, after a long two weeks and not getting a chance to see my family for thanksgiving.

i think it looks pretty damn good
11-21-2008 08:49 PM
Triple88a
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4point View Post
Installing these two items together "will" cause bump steer. That is what did it on mine.
the drop bracket at the axle not the frame?

I have the drop bracket at the axle and it's not too bad but i still get bump steer.
11-21-2008 08:03 PM
4point
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple88a View Post
Anyhow installing the drop bracket and not the dropped pitman arm will cause bump steer,
Installing these two items together "will" cause bump steer. That is what did it on mine.
11-21-2008 05:35 PM
Triple88a Look down for the track bar.. $206 and free shipping

JKS MFG. Components
11-21-2008 05:26 PM
Triple88a
Quote:
Originally Posted by charliefoxtrot View Post
Why do they give you a drop pitman arm and the bracket if it will cause all these problems? bastards... lol
Its cheaper for them than a new high quality track bar
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4point View Post
I hate Rough Country! <they made my lift.
hehe
Quote:
Originally Posted by charliefoxtrot View Post
they made my lift too.... damn...
okay looks like we are all in the same boat here.

Did you get a drop bracket? (axle side)
Install that to get you home and until you can get your new track bar (Look at JKS, they have the best trackbars that i am aware off for few pennies more)

I have the drop bracket installed but the drop pitman arm is somewhere in my closet along with my new 2nd sets of RC springs and control arm bushings.

Anyhow installing the drop bracket and not the dropped pitman arm will cause bump steer, trying to use the stock hole for the trackbar axle side might not work either. When i did mine, it was way too much of an angle so the trackbar was hitting the top of the original bracket..

I'm surprised you are having problems, i installed mine alone with no problems (besides stripping the rear trackbar torx and using vicegrips to save my life).
11-21-2008 12:05 PM
charliefoxtrot they made my lift too.... damn...
11-21-2008 12:04 PM
4point I don't know, but it caused all kinds of problems with my jeep. I hate Rough Country! <they made my lift.
11-21-2008 12:02 PM
charliefoxtrot Why do they give you a drop pitman arm and the bracket if it will cause all these problems? bastards... lol
11-21-2008 11:59 AM
4point
Quote:
Originally Posted by charliefoxtrot View Post
Yes, but if you use it you will probably want to put stock pitman arm back on. You want to keep your drag link and your trackbar as close to parallel as possible.

EDIT: Credit to Mr. C for giving me this info.
11-21-2008 11:43 AM
charliefoxtrot Ok, thanks for the help. would this be a suitable track bar?
Full Traction Suspension 50-750504 - Full-Traction Front Adjustable Trac Bar for 97-06 Jeep® Wrangler TJ & Unlimited with 3"-4" Lift - Quadratec
11-21-2008 11:34 AM
4point Right, and don't throw away your old pitman arm. You may want to put it back on later.
11-21-2008 11:19 AM
charliefoxtrot Sorry for all the back and forth, im really new to this still. So, best course of action is:

Drop pitman arm already on,
drill hole until i
buy adjustable track bar.


But dont use the bracket it came with and the drop pitman arm? think im getting it.
11-21-2008 11:12 AM
4point
Quote:
Originally Posted by charliefoxtrot View Post
or use the pitman arm and drill a hole until i can get an adjustable track bar?
^^That is what I did,
But I had to buy the frame side drop track bar bracket along with the adj track bar because I used the drop pitman arm. I was having severe bump steer issues.

The way most do it is,
Don't install the drop pitman arm.
Buy an adjustable trackbar
11-21-2008 11:10 AM
charliefoxtrot
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4point View Post
Well the unwritten rule is "do not use the drop pitman arm" when installing a lift of 4" or less and "NEVER use the drop pitman arm in conjunction with the drop track bar bracket at the axle".
what will this do? poor handling? will it die out on me?
11-21-2008 11:04 AM
charliefoxtrot should i put the old pitman arm back on and use the bracket? or use the pitman arm and drill a hole until i can get an adjustable track bar?
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