Jeep Wrangler Forum - Reply to Topic
Jeep Wrangler Forum

Go Back   Jeep Wrangler Forum > TJ Jeep Wrangler Forum > TJ Tech Forum > Clutch help before I burn my TJ to the ground

Join Wrangler Forum Today


Thread: Clutch help before I burn my TJ to the ground Reply to Thread
Title:
  
Message:
Post Icons
You may choose an icon for your message from the following list:
 

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Jeep Wrangler Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Additional Options
Miscellaneous Options

Topic Review (Newest First)
12-03-2012 12:09 AM
kodiakjoe1978
Quote:
Originally Posted by Black Magic Brakes View Post

That part bothers me a bit. The throw-out bearing rides on a sleeve that is around the input shaft. If it is not correct, it is possible that the throw-out bearing is not being allowed to travel back completely and is still holding the fingers on the pressure plate slightly compressed which could cause the slippage you are experiencing.

Do the starter test outlined above that has you start it in gear with the clutch slave cylinder removed, (very easy to do, just two bolts to deal with) and see what happens.
Will, do. I've gotta work the next 4 days straight so it'll be later this week before I'll have time to.
12-02-2012 10:30 PM
Black Magic Brakes
Quote:
Originally Posted by kodiakjoe1978 View Post
Ok, I spoke to the old man to figure out a couple things. Basically its got a new clutch(rebuilt), pressure plate(rebuilt, no missing or broken fingers), throw out bearing, slave cylinder, and had the flywheel resurfaced. He also said something was repaired on the shaft but I forgot exactly what he said it was.

That part bothers me a bit. The throw-out bearing rides on a sleeve that is around the input shaft. If it is not correct, it is possible that the throw-out bearing is not being allowed to travel back completely and is still holding the fingers on the pressure plate slightly compressed which could cause the slippage you are experiencing.

Do the starter test outlined above that has you start it in gear with the clutch slave cylinder removed, (very easy to do, just two bolts to deal with) and see what happens.
12-02-2012 10:21 PM
kodiakjoe1978 Ok, I spoke to the old man to figure out a couple things. Basically its got a new clutch(rebuilt), pressure plate(rebuilt, no missing or broken fingers), throw out bearing, slave cylinder, and had the flywheel resurfaced. He also said something was repaired on the shaft but I forgot exactly what he said it was.
12-02-2012 04:27 PM
Derp
Quote:
Originally Posted by Black Magic Brakes

The clutch slave and master don't work that way. If there was air in the system, it would not allow total disengagement. The default with the clutch slave removed is full engagement of the pressure plate against the clutch disc and then flywheel.

If I was dealing with a slipping clutch in a TJ, I'd make sure I had the right clutch disc and pressure plate first. Then I would make sure no one machined too much off the flywheel that should not have been machined to begin with.

I'd also do the test with the starter to make sure the clutch slave is out of the equation and the clutch fork is allowing total disengagement.
Blaine you're quite the master.
12-02-2012 09:56 AM
Black Magic Brakes
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slater451 View Post
Have you bled the clutch there could be air on the system and no allowing it to engage properly...
The clutch slave and master don't work that way. If there was air in the system, it would not allow total disengagement. The default with the clutch slave removed is full engagement of the pressure plate against the clutch disc and then flywheel.

If I was dealing with a slipping clutch in a TJ, I'd make sure I had the right clutch disc and pressure plate first. Then I would make sure no one machined too much off the flywheel that should not have been machined to begin with.

I'd also do the test with the starter to make sure the clutch slave is out of the equation and the clutch fork is allowing total disengagement.
12-02-2012 05:35 AM
kodiakjoe1978 I'm not sure if it was bleed at all the pedal feels better than it did when we first had to pull the motor out. I'm not sure if it had any broken fingers on it at all, dad had said it looked worn so that's why he had it rebuilt, I know he replaced the throw out bearing cause he also had to replace something else with it I'm not sure what he told me it was right now I'd have to get with him and see. Guys thanks for all the help I'm gonna try out these suggestions and see what happens I'll keep ya'll posted as soon as I find out.
12-02-2012 12:20 AM
C.L. You mentioned that the clutch plate was replaced sort of when you weren't looking...

1.) Are you positive it was the same diameter and thickness as stock? It is theoretically possible to get a plate installed where the connection points line up, but the friction zone does not.
2.) Were the pressure plate and throwout bearing replaced at the same time? If the plate has broken fingers, or the throwout bearing is sticking on the shaft, the clutch plate may not be making solid contact with your flywheel.
3.) How does the clutch pedal feel? Where in its travel does the Jeep start to pull? Right off the floor or not until it is almost all the way up?


One last diagnostic i can think of, but it won't be pretty. Use at your own risk, etc, etc...

Put a spare 20A fuse in the "transmission override" slot, i think it's slot #20. This will let you start the Jeep without pressing the clutch in. Find yourself a large empty parking lot or stretch of unused road and:

1.) Put the transmission in first gear, then start it without touching the clutch. It will probably buck some until it catches and you take off. Drag the brakes a little and give it enough gas to make the clutch slip. Turn the key off to stop.
2.) Unbolt the slave cylinder from your transmission and repeat the test. You may want to slap a piece of duct tape over the hole to prevent any little stones from getting kicked up into it, and to minimize splashing of the transmission oil; i'm not sure if that's baffled or not.

If it slips the same in test #2, the problem is with the friction zone area around the pressure plate or throwout bearing area. If it doesn't slip in test #2, the problem is in your hydraulics. Either a jammed master/slave cylinder, or a clog in the fluid return path.

Good Luck!
12-01-2012 11:56 PM
Slater451 Have you bled the clutch there could be air on the system and no allowing it to engage properly...
12-01-2012 11:17 PM
kodiakjoe1978 Rubi, by slippage if I take off very easy it will pull but when I give it a lot of gas(no not floor boarding it) it slips enough that I wouldn't be able to stay at the same speed going uphill. Not even a big hill at all on the interstate. I checked and it slips in 1-5 gear the same way. When I feel it slip the tach jumps from 2k to 3-3.5k almost instantly. It's an 03 with about 51k on it. I know it was abused before I bought it because of all the stuff I've replaced on it. Also I know there's no oil leaking its a brand new motor that's not even got 500 miles on it yet. Plus we checked the rear main and around the back of the head when it was out to make sure it wasn't leaking.
12-01-2012 10:19 PM
harleydragon from what I understand jeep flywheels are not flat and resurfacing is not recommended..i read that on posts on this site..it was recommended to replace them..I have had to replace a few in about those same number of years that you mentioned from either being warped or having a hot spot,but they were not on jeeps..oil is a possibility but from other posts I have read the jeep flywheel does often need replacing
12-01-2012 10:03 PM
Rubicondon53 That slippage may also be occurring because of an oil leak up above, that is slowly dripping down through and onto the clutch assembly or flywheel..
12-01-2012 09:57 PM
Rubicondon53 I don't understand the inclination to blame the flywheel. I see that a lot on these forums.. I've been driving since 1970, everything from pick ups, to old beaters, to really nice euro sedans, and of course, jeeps.. I've only ever owned 1 automatic, the rest were stick shifts. I've replaced many a clutch, and many thro out bearings, etc etc, I have never ever, not once, ever had to replace, or resurface a flywheel.. Are the jeep flywheels that crappy from the factory? Not possible.. My first inclination would be to advise the o p that the clutch has become contaminated with a drop of oil, or a small dab of grease. It doesn't take much for slippage to occur.. How bad does it slip? Will it pull up a hill in 2nd or 3rd without slipping? Or is it slipping all the time ? Detailed info is necessary to diagnose anything, but I certainly would not be concerned with resurfacing the fly wheel. That's probably the worst thing to do ..
12-01-2012 08:20 PM
harleydragon if clutch and pressure plate were new and the throw out bearing was completely releasing the pressure plate,then that leaves nothing but the flywheel
12-01-2012 08:10 PM
kodiakjoe1978 Yeah I understand that, I didn't have a chance to dad had that done before I had a choice and the motor was already in by the time he had told me.
12-01-2012 08:05 PM
Derp
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohioviper
If I was to go through the trouble of pulling trans you can bet there would be a new clutch ,throw out bearing and all hardware and a freshly turned flywheel. Man thats a lot of work to not do right.Sorry your having bad luck.
x2
12-01-2012 06:11 PM
ohioviper If I was to go through the trouble of pulling trans you can bet there would be a new clutch ,throw out bearing and all hardware and a freshly turned flywheel. Man thats a lot of work to not do right.Sorry your having bad luck.
12-01-2012 05:45 PM
kodiakjoe1978 It doesn't chatter at all no noises at all. It's a rebuilt factory not a Luk.
12-01-2012 05:39 PM
Derp LUK clutch and the flywheels on tj's are extremly picky.

"Que jerry bransford" lol
12-01-2012 05:38 PM
jeep-creep Does it chatter at all?
12-01-2012 05:21 PM
kodiakjoe1978 Ok, I just went and picked up my TJ from dads shop and the clutch is still slipping. We just got the tranny back into it after pulling it out because the clutch was slipping. When we pulled it out the clutch looked brand new, no burn marks or any damage at all. I didn't have a choice in the clutch when we installed the new motor dad had it rebuilt before I knew it I was planning on just buying a new one but he did that on his own. He's had his rebuilt before and never had a problem with it, it was in a ford though. I had a new synchronize installed in the tranny while it was out by Aamco. While it was down there I asked them why it would be slipping and all they could guess was the flywheel might need to be shimed. I'm at my wits end with it. The only thing left to do is save up and buy another new one. Any help or advise everyone has told me just get a Luk and be done with it but if I buy another one and it does the same thing I'm gonna blow a gasket.

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:52 PM.



Jeep®, Wrangler, Liberty, Wagoneer, Cherokee, and Grand Cherokee are copyrighted and trademarked to Chrysler Motors LLC.
Wranglerforum.com is not in any way associated with the Chrysler Motors LLC