|Today 03:13 AM|
This isn't exactly true though. The AB head has unknown/unconfirmed production dates. Generally it's been said there was a 6 week period of time from mid June 2012 to when they shut down for retooling in July that the AB head was made. Theory has it that someone may have either rebooted the machine or changed a spec somewhere causing the AB head to happen. Of course, they may have just rewritten the programming code as well.
|Today 03:00 AM|
I have been having some bad back issues again this weekend off and on, so bear with me. I was able to get more photos downloaded again and have a little info to add.
I have uploaded them to my Photobucket here - Jeep Engine Photos Photos by Lusus_Naturae | Photobucket
Late this past week Bob sent me a text. He's replacing the head on a 2012 Grand Cherokee, 36k miles, left head, 3.6 engine. Head number 2951A.
On Saturday we made a quick stop at another dealer, my wife wanted to take a quick look at the cargo space in a few things and price them out. So we were browsing and I went to take a peek at a few Wranglers on the lot and took some photos too. These are 'good' heads as far as we know, earlier there was a post asking if there are newer heads coming out since we have been discussing 2011 and 2012 heads.
In summary, what looked at - all are left head numbers -
2014 Wrangler JKU - Dragon Edition - (dealer can't seem to sell it) - 2853B
2014 Wrangler - 2dr - Sahara - 1454B
2015 Wrangler JKU - Sahara - 2184A
I don't want to read much into these numbers at this point, especially since I haven't looked at a lot of vehicles, but the 2015 would have been one of the first off the line after they did the annual re-tooling check before starting the new model year - remember that's when the AC head began being produced on day 206 of 2012.
Pat quoted this on another thread, "Last day 2014 Wranglers will be built is July 11th. 2015s will start production by the 18th at the latest." Julian dates would begin for 'new' heads on day 199 if production starts July 18. If Pat is wrong, and it falls back into the older way Jeep shuts down and retools, the date to begin the next model year is usually July 25th, or 206. The head from the 2015 was made on day 218, 2014 or August 6th.
If you look at the number stamped on the 2015 I listed, it ends with an 'A' again. The others I've seen have been ending in 'B' for the left side. Now I may just be reading more into this then I need to, but I figured I'd put it out there.
|Today 02:31 AM|
|Lusus_Naturae||^This we can't answer, just don't know, but you are thinking what I'm thinking.|
|08-30-2014 10:27 AM|
Then that would mean the 2014 Durango mentioned in this thread has an engine that was made prior to July 27, 2012? A reconditioned head? Or Chrysler has some lousy stock rotation practices.
|08-29-2014 02:22 PM|
|Xena1||Build dates before July 27, 2012 have the AA head. Good news for those who have the defective head, should also have the extended 150,000 warranty that Chrysler is honoring on these vehicles.|
|08-29-2014 02:10 PM|
Wow! A few things come to mind. 1. Chrysler produced a ton of these heads and their stock rotation sucks. 2. They're reusing the old heads after they re-manufacture them, not good. OTOH for warranty work they might be able to install a re-manufactured part and get away with it.
Either way I'm not feeling good about this at all.
Are the AC heads really the fix? Or will they eventually fail too?
I was almost willing to bet the faulty AA heads were being melted and recycled that way.
We'll never get a straight answer from them. That's the only fact we know about this problem.
|08-27-2014 12:49 AM|
The theory that Bob and I had discussed was that the inside channels in the AA were too small, and the coolant flows from the right head to the left head, making the left head receive warmed coolant. The left head's narrow channels can't cool the head fast enough, which leads to the issues, and eventual replacement of the head. This has been proven by either of us, it's simply what we are seeing and determining from what's seen.
So, going by this theory, the defective left head, if not warped or otherwise damaged, could possibly be remanned to remove more of the inside channel and open up the coolant flow. The thing is, we do CNC and milling in my family - this isn't a small task to do and the engine channels are cast throughout I believe - I honestly haven't looked closer at it, maybe next time. If they are cast throughout - the amount of work needed to measure and machine it out would probably be more than scrapping the metal and replacing it with a new designed head.
I pulled these from another post awhile back, I don't have a credit for who took them, sorry, but these show a AA head that was pulled (the dirty one) and a AC head that was replacing it. Link to my Photobucket as I'm out of bandwidth again here.
I did have the photos noted, the used one is AA head Julian date 1321A, and the new one is AC RL Head Julian date 0613B. Which brings back the mention above of RL being a remanned head.
|08-27-2014 12:38 AM|
|08-26-2014 11:59 AM|
Well, way back when they were replacing heads in 2012, this issue of part re-use came up. I was assured mine was "absolutely not a re-manufactured part" at the time it was replaced.
The heads part numbers that we got as replacements are prefixed with "RL", which means the dealer must send the head back to Chrysler so they can create a re-manufactured head from the core. From those two cases posted above, it seems like they are using the re-manufactured heads in new production vehicles. That assumption relies on the julian date being the <NNN> day of the year followed by the <Y> year.
Unless the trailing number on the julian date does not indicate the year, it kinda looks like they are reusing heads. Need more evidence from 2013 and 2014 owners to see if they have 3 and 4 for 13 and 14...
|08-26-2014 07:54 AM|
At this point I would classify Chrysler Fiat as scum bags.
|08-26-2014 05:37 AM|
If you take a look at the other pentastar head thread, a member just got her head changed under warranty. The tech left out some bolts and she took a pic. The julian date is 3041a, so chrysler is definitely using up the old heads. Possibly reworked??
It's possible they stopped selling the old castings until they came up with a fix to put them back in service.
|08-26-2014 05:36 AM|
|bbtj||My first question would be, when did the Durango come off the assembly line? Vehicles can sit on the lot for months, before being sold, so the mileage has little to no bearing in the issue.|
|08-25-2014 10:56 PM|
Especially since a new 2014 vehicle is having both replaced at 7,000 miles under warranty.
This sounds like a class action waiting to happen.
Damn... This may be jail time worthy - misrepresenting and selling a new vehicle with used or reworked parts?
Any consumer product lawyers in the house?
|08-25-2014 10:02 PM|
|Old Dogger||^^^This is not good..........|
|08-25-2014 09:40 PM|
Yes, or you work too many years on graveyard shift and can't sleep like a "normal" person anymore.
So, I talked to my tech at the dealer this afternoon, I'll call him Bob. I told him a bit about this thread and asked if he would take a look at the Julian dates on 'problem vehicles' coming in and take a few notes if he could. He said he would try to help out.
So today he showed me a 2014 Durango with a 3.6 engine. The vehicle had about 7,000 miles on it, and both heads were being replaced under warranty. So he showed me the heads, both were out already, and I took some photos.
Both heads are early manufacturing dates. So the question becomes - are they remanning the heads they are pulled off as defective and sending them out again on new vehicles? Or are they using up a stockpile of defective heads for some reason, like hoping to keep production up and figuring they'll fix them later if they have issues.
In any case here are the photos for the 2014 Durango today. Both from January 14, 2012 - AA heads.
|08-25-2014 04:15 AM|
This is what happens when you have insomnia...
|08-25-2014 04:10 AM|
|08-25-2014 04:10 AM|
Raising this from the dead to add some new info. I was working on my Jeep last week in the driveway, and I live near a dealer, and one of the tech's stopped over to see if everything was ok after work. Nice guy, eh?
So, we start chatting a bit about stuff and he's 'the' guy that does engine work there. So I ask about the head issues, trying to make light talk. He then tells me he's seen an uptick in 2014's with head issues coming in. I have heard of a few, including seeing a few posts on this forum, but I didn't think it was becoming a known issue like the 2012's.
I didn't have the brainpower to process some of what he said at the time, but he was telling me about how it's across the models using the 3.6 engine, not just Wrangler. I showed him the julian date system this post explains, and he said they use that often for parts - but he hadn't heard about using it for the heads before (makes me wonder).
Anyhow, if there are people out there with a 2014 and it's having a head problem, or lifters, etc. would you please add your info to this list?
JK or JKU
left or right side or both
dealer diagnosis and/or fix for the issue
|08-25-2014 04:06 AM|
Wow... ancient thread brought to life.
|08-25-2014 04:00 AM|
255 - the day - Sept 12 /// the following 2 is for 2012. The B means nothing.
Should be an AC head.
|11-09-2013 06:59 PM|
Oh, finally I found my #.
2013 JKUS. Bought it in Dec 2012.
Built date: Sept 12 (does it mean Sept 12th or Sept 2012?)
Looks like I have an AC head.
|11-09-2013 02:43 AM|
|AGNP2013||Can anyone upload a video in YouTube how to check the part number of the head and let me know?|
|11-09-2013 12:44 AM|
|Lusus_Naturae||I'd lean towards AA, just because the rumor has been the AB lasted about 6 weeks before the AC started, which would place the AB head starting about June 13 or so. There's no way to tell for sure at this point though.|
|11-08-2013 09:29 AM|
|11-07-2013 11:36 PM|
|11-07-2013 11:32 PM|
The close date though would say you are more likely to have an AB head, which is said to be less likely to have issues.
|11-07-2013 09:20 AM|
|11-06-2013 07:43 PM|
|11-06-2013 10:51 AM|
|monte417||I guess im screwed 0762B is the build date of my head. Not sure if its AA or AB but definately not an AC according to this thread. How do you guys find out your build date. I checked around on the door I didnt see anything|
|09-23-2013 12:51 PM|
|back in the game||So I am assuming all of the COD MW3s will have this issue!|
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