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Topic Review (Newest First)
12-25-2013 09:06 PM
nvkid Interested to know if a larger throttlebody would help the manuals with the hesitation issue. Wish you could try mine.
12-25-2013 08:45 PM
jmr40 I'm convinced there is something about the drive by wire instead of a direct linkage from the gas pedal. My Jeep has a "different feel" than any older vehicles I've ever driven. Not a deal killer, but it is different.

It has nothing to do with hill start assist.
12-25-2013 07:38 PM
Originally Posted by nvkid View Post
My throttle response is immediate after installing a viper throttlebody. Should work the same for a manual. yes?
12-24-2013 10:20 PM
nvkid My throttle response is immediate after installing a viper throttlebody. Should work the same for a manual. yes?
12-24-2013 09:29 PM
JKWrangler2012 Is there a trick besides holding the button for 20 seconds? I can't seem to get ESP to fully disable. Does the ebrake gotta be on? I'm doing something wrong
12-24-2013 07:25 PM
20 second TCS off works!

I was very frustrated by the throttle response and removed one of the springs from the gas pedal (helped with the stiff feel). I still got the hesitation in first and second gear most of the time made worse by the low gearing of the Rubicon. Took away much of the joy of a manual, made heel and toe all but impossible.

I happened on this thread and tried the "hold the TCS button 20 second" fix mentioned above. Much, much better!! It feels like a normal manual geared car now. Thank you, Cousin Eddy!

If you have not tried this fix, you are missing out. It is like a sprint booster for free.

2013 JKUR manual HSA always off
12-24-2013 01:06 PM
kballard72 Thought it was just me. Bought an 09 and have killed it a few times and also got it in the lurchy idle state described in another post. Thought well shite got me a crapper.

Have since figured out, stay off the gas, and when shifting there is a need for minor delay with the gas pedal let off and shift timing. I was not aware until recently its acceleration by wire instead of cable. Makes sense that I need to relearn my manual style.
12-24-2013 12:39 PM
Travrsx Ok, I tried the ESP trick (hold down button about 15 seconds until light goes out).

Could be placebo effect, but it certainly feels a lot better! What gives???
12-23-2013 06:37 PM
Travrsx I noticed this weird throttle response as well. 2014 sport, 3.21s 6 speed. I turned off hill start assist, which was annoying on hills... But this lag happens even on level ground, so it's not the HSA causing it.

It's not a huge deal, but it's annoying. I was hoping it was just my 3.21s, but apparently not.
12-23-2013 06:08 PM
Michel347 I don't even touch the throttle when going from a dead stop in first or reverse, only once moving.
12-23-2013 12:40 AM
Originally Posted by gnarlyswine View Post
Ummm. No. We are talking about standard (manual) transmission.
To be fair, the autos have HSA too. I have no idea why they do, but I can see it causing similar problems as what we experience.
12-23-2013 12:13 AM
gnarlyswine Ummm. No.
We are talking about standard (manual) transmission.
12-22-2013 09:33 AM
FedMed Just bought my 2012 wrangler unlimited, altitude edition with auto trans last week and have been having the same hesitation problem (first time jeep owner =). Glad to hear that it's not just me that's experiencing it, but it's frustrating, nonetheless...
04-02-2013 10:59 PM
JSwift I've also been timing the hsa... just move slowly to the gas instead of jumping straight to it and u won't even notice it anymore
04-02-2013 10:55 PM
JSwift Well I'm not sure if its already been said but the HSA is directly related to YOUR brake pressure... so if your pressing hard on the brake, the hsa will hold it still much stronger than if your were just barely keeping yourself from rolling... Took me about a week to figure that out on my new jeep.. I come to a stop then release as much as I think I possibly can, and no longer have the very tough starts. Hope this helps.
Edit: Spelling ugh..
04-02-2013 10:43 PM
Originally Posted by Scott2373 View Post
Keep in mind this transmission was sourced from Mercedes. Ya'll are trying to drive it like a Jeep, not an expensive German sedan...
Meaning what? LOL
04-02-2013 08:09 PM
Originally Posted by JKWrangler2012 View Post
i don't know.. but i caught myself doing it with a conscious mind lol
For me, a conscious mind is the worst thing to have while shifting! My timing has always been poor if I actually think about it and time it by looking at the rpm.
04-02-2013 07:47 PM
axhoaxho Very information thread, thanks folks for sharing.

I just ordered my first Jeep, a Rubicon 10A, couple weeks ago. I have been driving stick shift for almost thirty years, yet I was scared by this hesitation you folks were talking about.

While I plan to have some off-roading in the weekends, I would be using the JK to commute to work in weekdays.

Is there any sure way to start the JK without stalling?

- From stand, shift into 1st, let out the clutch without touching throttle, once the clutch fully disengaged and JK goes forward, step on the throttle?

- What about starting with 2nd gear? Would it bypass the hesitation problem?

- On slopes, does it mean the HSA will keep the brake engaged for full 3 seconds even if I manage to get the JK going in less than 3 seconds?

- Any other tips on having a stall-free daily driving?

Thanks in advance, your inputs will help me decide if I would want to change my order from manual to auto.

04-02-2013 06:06 PM
Originally Posted by njskater59 View Post

If you wish to turn off the HSA system, follow this procedure:
1. Start with the engine off and vehicle in PARK (auto- matic transmission) or NEUTRAL with clutch out (manual transmission) with wheels straight. Apply park- ing brake on manual transmission vehicle.
2. Start the engine.
3. With the engine running, the brake applied, and the clutch out, rotate the steering wheel 180° counterclock- wise from center.
4. Press the ESC OFF switch four times within twenty seconds.
5. Rotate the steering wheel 360° clockwise (180° clock- wise from center).
6. Cycle ignition switch OFF then ON.
7. If the sequence was completed properly, the “ESC Activation/Malfunction Indicator Light” will blink sev- eral times to confirm HSA is off.
Steps 1-7 must be completed within 90 seconds to turn off HSA. Repeat steps 1-7 to re-enable HSA functionality.
Where did you get this information from?
Is there any way to fully disable ESC?
03-20-2013 04:25 PM
Scott2373 Keep in mind this transmission was sourced from Mercedes. Ya'll are trying to drive it like a Jeep, not an expensive German sedan...
03-20-2013 01:37 PM
JEEPDON Now for another little trick for you boys and girls that have learned to shift your transfer case while the JEEP is standing still( so you can pay attention to your tach with out having to watch where you are going). Watch your tach and slip the JEEP into 4L without muscling it and notice that the engine will pick up about 250 to 300 RPM. This is where the 4:1 TC and deep gearing( I have 5.38's) comes in to play when crawling thru technical stuff. Just figure out which gear you need for optimum power and wheel speed ( this comes from experience), slip the tranny into that gear and ease the clutch out and about all you need to do is watch your spotter and let the JEEP do the hard stuff!! Drive by wire rocks!!!!!
03-20-2013 01:20 PM
Hokieneer I finally tried the trick stated above about just letting the clutch out on flat ground and not touching the throttle and it is absolutely true, the computer keeps it from stalling and the engine will rev's on its own without hesitation.
03-20-2013 01:08 PM
Olysouthpaw24 The most difficult part of the drive by wire system is the timing. There is a slight delay from when you hit the gas, to the engine response. Practice getting this down by sitting idle in neutral and revving your engine to different RPMs. I have found it is near impossible to rev to 1800 rpms and hold it steady as once the drive by wire engages it is very sensitive. However, doing this made me a much better driver of this particular manual transmission. I hit the gas and wait a split second for the engine to rev to 1200+ before engaging the clutch slowly. The clutch pedal does engage quick, so having feel for that is also important.

Just keep in mind the throttle delay you are getting from the electronic system. This also applies to upshifting as it takes slightly longer than you'd expect for the engine to drop into the sweet spot for the next gear. Pay attention to the tachometer response relative to your gas pedal inputs--it helped me to learn this Jeep fairly quickly.

At this point, I drive the Jeep as well as any other manual I have owned.
03-20-2013 10:59 AM
tae73 I am glad that I am not the only one having trouble with the newer 6 speed. I upgraded from a 06 TJ with a six speed and never had the troubles that I am having now.
03-20-2013 12:34 AM
Funny enough...

Originally Posted by GuruYaekob View Post
I don't get what your saying?

Push clutch to floor
let it all the way out? (this would kill it)
then press gas?

I'm lost
Like others here I have found the six speed a challenge. I ride a Harley 30,000 miles a year and never stall it. I've driven stick all my life and have maybe stalled a hard dozen times in my life prior to the Rubi.

I've stalled it six times this week! Mostly playing in deep snow over the door sills in 4 lo! The clutch throttle interface is definitely an issue trying to crawl through crap.

I tried something yesterday that I used to do teaching our kids to drive my previous Jett'as when they were having gas-clutch synch issues.

If you keep your foot off the gas and feather the clutch out gently,there is enough torque to get moving without slipping the clutch. I can go all the way to sixth gear in mine without touching the gas pedal. It's not as good as a diesel for this, but almost!

I notice the lag when I use the gas with the clutch. Am going to try the TC trick earlier in the thread tomorrow. There's definitely a computer involved somewhere and if this was an airplane I'd say the fly by wire is not anticipating the pilot's control inputs properly.
03-20-2013 12:28 AM
It's one of the settings on the EVIC

Originally Posted by dirtybiketrash View Post
If you play with it you can get a feel for the timing of when it will disengage the brake. Is there an easy way to shut-off the hill assist?
It's one of the settings on the EVIC. You can turn it off with the steering wheel menu. You have to be stopped to adjust this setting. I think the prompt is "Hill Assist".

I like it personally. Noticed it the first time today while waiting for a red light on a steep hill. You don't get that rolling back into the guy behind you sensation!

03-19-2013 10:52 PM
Gort Interesting. Right after I got my 2012 (Auto, 3.73), I experienced the hesitation issue. It went away after a couple thousand miles were on the odometer so I wrote it off as something weird during break-in. It was fine all through the winter, but now that it's started to warm up a bit (for the past couple weeks), I've noticed it again happening again. It seems to disappear after the first few stop sights/traffic lights that I stop at.

I was thinking that it was perhaps because the transmission wasn't warmed up, because it only seems to happen in the mornings when I'm heading out for the day after the Jeep has been sitting all night. I don't notice it when I'm heading home in the afternoon after the Jeep has been sitting all day. I also can't explain why it didn't do it during the coldest part of the winter.

But since the folks with manual transmissions are also experiencing this problem, it's likely not the transmission. And my HSA has been turned off for months. I'm going to have to try the ESC button 20-second-hold to see if it actually changes anything.
03-19-2013 06:05 PM
Originally Posted by JKWrangler2012 View Post
I can honestly state.. After my ring and pinion regear I have zero lag..hesitation.. None. All gone. Much better
What gears did you install?
03-19-2013 05:02 PM
DV993 After driving it back to back to lunch and trying it with and without the TC hold setting there does seem to be a definite difference... especially in power delivery lag between 1st and 2nd gear shift and overall power delivery. I wonder if there is some sort of Sport setting left over from the Grand Cherokee Pentastar Programming that is somehow accesed via this?
03-19-2013 02:51 PM
Great Thread..............

But why can't our dealers lead us out of these wildernesses????? Jees!
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