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Topic Review (Newest First)
01-26-2013 05:44 PM
viperx6x9x Speaking of lighter issue, Anybody ever brew beer before?

I am working on a 90 minute I.P.A. right now. I am scared of the result because I have never tried this complicated of a recipe before, but can't wait to see how it turns out.

Last batch was an Irish Red and it turned out really good.
01-26-2013 05:36 PM
viperx6x9x So, just throwing this out there. If my views made anybody mad or something I apologize. But like many others on this thread, it probably isn't going to change because of somebody else's opinion.

Unfortunately guns are a subject that mankind will never 100% agree upon.

So like Vroom said, we might as well agree to disagree and leave it at that. Talk about a happier subject, and move one.
01-26-2013 11:24 AM
BlueRidgeYJ
01-26-2013 10:32 AM
Vroooom Look folks,
I started this thread as a point of humor and its degraded into unpleasantness from all sides. Which is counterproductive for ALL...regardless of intentions.

Common sense states...You dont argue with an idiot. You cannot change their mind. Common practice states...idicy is usually a matter of which side of the debate you side with...the OTHER person is always the idiot.

Pragmatism states that you express your point of view. The other person expresses theirs, and whomever can generate the most EVIDENCE to support their position...wins.

Unfortunately...in emotional debates (politics and religion), evidence is the very first thing to get flushed in preference for "gotcha" sound-bites. Guns are an especially volitile topic since they seem to have the ingredients for a religious AND political fight...with a generous sprinkling of conspiracy, hate-mongering and fear-motivations.

The fact is...as we have seen throughout the world, and through out history. If you take the guns away, the bad guys will have fewer guns....Thats a fact. The good guys will have fewer guns...thats a fact. The bad guys will then have a statistically HIGHER power quotient than will the good guys. And in the end, if you take the guns away...the REALLY bad guys...the sickos....just strap bombs to themselves. Thats a FACT. Crazy all ways finds a way.

Once again...we have allowed our attention to be diverted away from the problem... mental health. And onto the symptom...guns, bullying, violence...

Our Bi-Cameral legislature was designed specifically to avoid REACTIONARY governance. But instant media and the clamoring for face-time with the camera to look like they are "Doing something" forces bad things into catastrophic calamities and it becomes a Keystone cops comedy of showing who can make the most grandios gesture of "how much they care" and the polarized tug of war between political idiologies spins into a battle that is more against the other side of the isle than for any particular set of values.

"Whatever the other side says is wrong and in fact is so wrong that I will have to take the most extreme, opposit position possible just to show that I am so much different from them...oh...wait...what were we talking about, again?"

The Constitution.

oh...yeah...that.

I've often thought that it would be benificial to all if an OP had the power to close the thread that they started once they felt that their question had been answered, or their topic had been exhausted.

If I had that button, I'd push it cuz this issue is done. Neither side is interested in changing their opinions. Neither is actually very interested in the foundations of the opinions of others. This is just serving as a stage for each to wrap themselves in their causes and wave their flag about how right they are and how much of an idiot the other side is.

Find and Fix the crazy...and most everything else falls into place...without needing to circumvent the constitution.

Now....lets all go back to fighting over who has the coolest bumper or how stupid the other guys seat-covers are.
01-26-2013 10:21 AM
SinisterWarWagon99
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Green Machine
A LITTLE GUN HISTORY
In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were round
ed up and exterminated
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total... of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
X2 Exactly.
01-26-2013 09:55 AM
The Green Machine A LITTLE GUN HISTORY
In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were round
ed up and exterminated
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total... of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
01-26-2013 09:47 AM
The Green Machine
Quote:
Originally Posted by gus54 View Post
Ephesians 6:10-13
01-26-2013 09:00 AM
BlueRidgeYJ
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208

Agree with you other than the part about me being a "he".

I know, always so contrary...
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208

Surely you don't need me to explain the difference between an improvised weapon and a purpose-built weapon. Or between a Tiffany lamp and an AR-15.
...
Tiffany lamp was a big clue, ma'am. Lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doublebarr
See the first declaration followed by the second which I was VERY easily able to prove the lack of factual information provided in those statements with very factual information. Had I chosen to "walk on by", then they would have stood as truth, which they obviously are not.

You can choose to walk away, I have chosen to stand and "fight" with either action or word. But for now, I am off in my jeep to visit a gun show today and see what I see. I'm going to have a GOOD day
All due respect, you just solidified the belief that killing multiple fleet-footed targets in a bunching is much easier with a high capacity AR type rifle. I am pretty sure that is one of eds primary arguements, and the main reason high caps are about to go bye-bye. It is OK, we have always alledged we can reload so fast it is moot, right? Pony up

I tend to keep my mouth shut on that one, because hi-caps are a really touchy part. I don't particularly oppose legislation limiting sales of them, but then again if I still had any guns I would have more than I would ever need. Statistics show you do not need it for defense.
Of course, making mags once you have an angle and follower templete is not a very advanced skill. Springs can be attached together if ya don't know how to make em. I have even heard of unskilled metal workers making 10rnd stick mags into 72rnd drums.
And I'll be headed to the show tomorrow, getting some inkwork done today
01-26-2013 08:01 AM
Doublebarr
Quote:
Originally Posted by cavediverjc View Post
Guys, I think it's evident that you aren't going to change Ed's mind. He has his opinion and we have ours. His is as "right" as ours. Seems kinda stupid to argue with someone knowing you'll never change his mind to your way of thinking. He has a right to voice his opinion and we have ours. I think we're just beating a dead horse at this point, and I'm sure Ed feels the same way. Maybe we should all just agree to disagree and move on.
No, it is not "beating a dead horse" when wrong information is perpetuated by someone and others reading it think "oh, it must be right because there it is in black and white". When a false claim is made, it is the responsibility of those who know the truth to counter that information with factual information if they are able, else something repeated often enough becomes fact in the mind of todays media fed public. This is why so many are so ignorant about guns today. Therefore, it does no one any good to allow the previous statements to stand when it was so easy to prove them false:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208 View Post
All they know is that there doesn't seem to be a valid reason why any member of the general public needs to own high capacity guns any more than they need bazookas, tanks, attack helicopters or sea-to-air-anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208 View Post
Aw, c'mon BlueRidge. I consider you to be one of the sharper tacks in this box. Surely you don't need me to explain the difference between an improvised weapon and a purpose-built weapon. Or between a Tiffany lamp and an AR-15.
.
See the first declaration followed by the second which I was VERY easily able to prove the lack of factual information provided in those statements with very factual information. Had I chosen to "walk on by", then they would have stood as truth, which they obviously are not.

You can choose to walk away, I have chosen to stand and "fight" with either action or word. But for now, I am off in my jeep to visit a gun show today and see what I see. I'm going to have a GOOD day
01-26-2013 07:52 AM
BlueRidgeYJ But since there are no more boolits to buy all I can do is beat things with a stick, and dead horses are better than live ones.... lmao...
01-26-2013 01:42 AM
ed98208
Quote:
Originally Posted by cavediverjc View Post
Guys, I think it's evident that you aren't going to change Ed's mind. He has his opinion and we have ours. His is as "right" as ours. Seems kinda stupid to argue with someone knowing you'll never change his mind to your way of thinking. He has a right to voice his opinion and we have ours. I think we're just beating a dead horse at this point, and I'm sure Ed feels the same way. Maybe we should all just agree to disagree and move on.
Agree with you other than the part about me being a "he".

I know, always so contrary...
01-25-2013 11:40 PM
cavediverjc Guys, I think it's evident that you aren't going to change Ed's mind. He has his opinion and we have ours. His is as "right" as ours. Seems kinda stupid to argue with someone knowing you'll never change his mind to your way of thinking. He has a right to voice his opinion and we have ours. I think we're just beating a dead horse at this point, and I'm sure Ed feels the same way. Maybe we should all just agree to disagree and move on.
01-25-2013 02:36 PM
viperx6x9x Okay, forgot about hog hunting, I would definitely want more than one 30 rounder for that. Especially if your are using the .223 round the majority of AR's accept. Hog's don't always fall on the first shot, and you do not want one of those things charging you. And like Doublebarr said, you don't want them getting away either. Those things tear up all the crops, and there can be decent money in hunting them. People, especially farmers, will pay to get them off their land.

Personally I also like the M1 for this, bigger bullet = hopefully the hog drops on the first shot. But the drawback is you only get 8 shots in a clip. And the reloading is kind of clumsy on them. So this sort of supports your argument for more rounds too.
01-25-2013 01:06 PM
ed98208
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doublebarr View Post
I'm going to assume you don't really know what AR-15's are used for COMMONLY in hunting practices since you said you aren't a gun person. AR-15's are the gun of choice for hog hunts. They are a MODERN Sporting rifle. You know, kinda like how all good things are constantly updated and made just that little bit better with each new year or model (or they're supposed to be anyway but can't prove it by most kitchen appliances any more the way they break down). Those of us that hog hunt to remove this horrible blight on the rural areas that produce the crops and livestock that feed all those city folks and protect the native species that live in those areas use the AR-15 as one of our most "go to" tools of choice because of their reliability and the option of larger mag capacity.

When you find a "herd" you want ALL of them dead...You want to take out the entire group.

One shot, reload, then another shot, reload then another shot if you're lucky then the group is gone into the brush, scrub, hills etc, with a "Traditional" sporting weapon and you better be a good shot to hit all three of those pigs with each of those three shots. If you have a high capacity mag with a "Modern" sporting weapon such as an AR-15 you can shoot (providing you can hit what you aim at and practice) a full mag of 30 or more and take out 10 or more pigs in that same time...

So yes Virginia, there is a Sporting reason for a weapon DESIGNED to be more efficient and productive than previous years models...
Okay, so...just to get this straight: You're saying that the best tool for achieving the most kills in the shortest period of time is a high capacity gun. That if you had to stop to reload then some targets would get away because once the shooting starts, they're all running for their lives. BUT since you can shoot 30 bullets just as fast as you can pull the trigger, you can kill more than you could with a regular capacity weapon.

Well, I think we're in complete agreement then. *shrug*
01-25-2013 12:51 PM
IndyJeepMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208 View Post

Dylan Klebold primarily used a TEK-9 with one each of 52, 32 and 28 round magazines. The VA Tech shooter carried two handguns and numerous 10 and 15 round magazines; the 9mm were hollow-points. The Aurora shooter used a Smith & Wesson M&P15[11] semi-automatic rifle with a 100-round drum magazine. The Sandy Hook shooter used a Bushmaster XM15-E2S rifle with a 30-round magazine.

Yes, there were multiple guns at each incident and some of the killers had additional handguns and magazines that would not be restricted by the proposed legislation, but all of the shooters carried and killed with at least one weapon and/or magazine that would be restricted. I don't know if you meant to imply somehow that they used ordinary, everyday 6-shooters, but it's just not the case.

I have a theory that I'm mulling over about these particular killers...each of them dressed up in a "costume" to do the murders, I believe. They all wore commando-type gear to some extent. The VA Tech shooter sent videos of himself to the news on the day of the shootings, posing and posturing with his gear and guns. The Aurora shooter was head to toe in black tactical gear. The Columbine shooters were into the Matrix look. Not sure about Sandy Hook as reports differ but some said he wore black tactical gear. So it seems to me that there's a fetishistic, macho-fantasy appeal at work here, one that maybe could only be complete if they used the "right" guns. Like I said, not a complete thought but something I'm formulating.

p.s. Viper, is anyone trying to take away ALL the guns? If so, I haven't seen that report.
Look up the AWB of 94.

Those high capacity magazines and that Tek9 were banned..

Still used it. Cracks banned too, i dont see people stop doing it. Proposing regualtions, especially constitutional rights on the citizens of this United States is tyrannical.
01-25-2013 12:28 PM
SinisterWarWagon99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bodyarmorguy

And the 100 round drum magazine created a malfunction that he was unable to clear very early in the assault. The majority of what he did was carried out with a shotgun, yep...a plain old shotgun, very few of which hold more than 5 or six shells. He also used a pistol

FAIL!
Turn on and watch the news or do a google search. The media is finally reporting (read: admitting) that the AR15 was located in the car and was never used during the attack...all handgun. Some moron medical examiner, before conducting any autopsy made a comment to the effect of "He must of been using some sort of high power rifle" and the media ran with it.
The first reports after the shooting actually stated that it was handguns used in the Sandy Hook shooting. And that a Bushmaster "assault" style rifle was found in the car.... Then the story "changed" for the betterment of the "agenda" at hand. Media has been so twisted on the details that no one really knows the truth anymore. It's all in how certain people want the situation to be perceived to help their cause.
01-25-2013 12:17 PM
Doublebarr
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208 View Post
Surely you don't need me to explain the difference between an improvised weapon and a purpose-built weapon. Or between a Tiffany lamp and an AR-15.

.
I'm going to assume you don't really know what AR-15's are used for COMMONLY in hunting practices since you said you aren't a gun person. AR-15's are the gun of choice for hog hunts. They are a MODERN Sporting rifle. You know, kinda like how all good things are constantly updated and made just that little bit better with each new year or model (or they're supposed to be anyway but can't prove it by most kitchen appliances any more the way they break down). Those of us that hog hunt to remove this horrible blight on the rural areas that produce the crops and livestock that feed all those city folks and protect the native species that live in those areas use the AR-15 as one of our most "go to" tools of choice because of their reliability and the option of larger mag capacity.

When you are eradicating this pest (there is no limit on numbers you can harvest because they are an invasive species and need to be eradicated as much as possible), they run in groups of anywhere form 5 to easily 30 or more in one "herd". The goal of hog hunting is NOT one kill to feed your family, but again to remove an invasive species to protect the native flora and fauna along with the protection of crops and resources for food animal production. When you find a "herd" you want ALL of them dead, because ONE pregnant hog can and usually ends up birthing at least 10 viable piglettes who then go on to reach sexual maturity long before one year of age and then each of them birth at least 10 viable piglettes, who then go on to do their thing. That original hog goes in search of a mate within 2 months of birthing her piglettes and will have at least one more litter in that same year, each of those successive members of the litter then going on to have their own litters. You want to take out the entire group.

One shot, reload, then another shot, reload then another shot if you're lucky then the group is gone into the brush, scrub, hills etc, with a "Traditional" sporting weapon and you better be a good shot to hit all three of those pigs with each of those three shots. If you have a high capacity mag with a "Modern" sporting weapon such as an AR-15 you can shoot (providing you can hit what you aim at and practice) a full mag of 30 or more and take out 10 or more pigs in that same time, thus being much more conservation and environmently friendly, you know, saving habitat and such by getting rid of more of what is destroying it.

So yes Virginia, there is a Sporting reason for a weapon DESIGNED to be more efficient and productive than previous years models, such as an AR-15. AND it is used quite commonly in that application. Many "varmit" hunts are done with AR-15's beyond hogs, such as coyote, fox, gopher and other pest species, and it's not to give the gun a reason for existing, as sportsmen don't sacrifice accuracy and the best tool just to "protect the reputation" of something that is not the most efficient tool.

Want to tell me again, after learning something that I am assuming you didn't know due to the stance you are taking on the tool, that there is only one "valid" reason the weapon exists and it is not necessary nor an actual sporting designed weapon? I wouldn't do that if you want to continue to honestly discuss the topic.
01-25-2013 12:08 PM
Bodyarmorguy
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208 View Post
The Aurora shooter used a Smith & Wesson M&P15[11] semi-automatic rifle with a 100-round drum magazine.
And the 100 round drum magazine created a malfunction that he was unable to clear very early in the assault. The majority of what he did was carried out with a shotgun, yep...a plain old shotgun, very few of which hold more than 5 or six shells. He also used a pistol

Quote:
Originally Posted by ed98208 View Post
The Sandy Hook shooter used a Bushmaster XM15-E2S rifle with a 30-round magazine.
FAIL!
Turn on and watch the news or do a google search. The media is finally reporting (read: admitting) that the AR15 was located in the car and was never used during the attack...all handgun. Some moron medical examiner, before conducting any autopsy made a comment to the effect of "He must of been using some sort of high power rifle" and the media ran with it.
01-25-2013 10:53 AM
Jiffydarren Boy, this seems like the right thread for my story. I was out on a boat with my buddy and we had all of our guns with us on the boat and we were going across a lake up in the rockies... it was a HUGE lake... Anyway, some other guy ran in to us and tipped our boat just far enough for all of our guns to fall in to the lake, right in the middle of the lake, and they all sunk all the way to the bottom. Sucks, man I'm pissed.
01-25-2013 10:47 AM
viperx6x9x My mistake Blue ridge. I got so hung up on the Assault Rifle thing i forgot it was named after Armalite.

But see what the media does? The news kept calling the rifle used in sandy hook an assault rifle. Now everybody is up in arms about Assault Rifles.

Here's an example of how bad it's gotten. I am watching a concealed carry pistol at auction for my wife. She doesn't like my .45 so we are downgrading to 9mm. Anyways, there is a 5 pack of 30 round AR mags going for the same price as the pistol. That is crazy. Before sandy hook you could get a p-mag brand new for $15, or the used metal military style for $5-10 if you bought them in bulk.
01-25-2013 10:05 AM
Mom sold the Jeepster Free citizens don't need Constitutional authority to act. Government does.
01-25-2013 08:58 AM
WeekenderATX It's like boiling a frog. Drop him in boiling water and he'll jump out. But drop him in cold water, turn the heat up slowly, and he'll just sit there and cook.
And Feinstein is a bee-yotch. Who hires these useless people? Oh yeah- us, the electorate. Yuck.
01-25-2013 08:41 AM
SinisterWarWagon99
Quote:
Originally Posted by viperx6x9x
The problem with more rules and regulations on gun control, is that only the people that were already following the current rules and regulations are going to follow the new ones.

This will not effect the criminals, that are making a bad name for firearms, one bit. They will get what they want on the black market or from some salesman in a dark alley anyway.

2. Go ahead and ban assault rifles. Push the criminals toward other cheaper guns, like that $180 mossberg shotgun at walmart. Far more dangerous weapon for a shooter to take into a room of people IMO. How about we take away every gun on earth, melt them all down, and make a huge statue out of them. Still won't stop another Sandy Hook. The gun was a tool, they will find another tool. Look at the Taliban and their suicide bombs. And what, pray tell, are all the law abiding citizens going to protect themselves with when that happens? Pepper spray? Stranger danger whistle?

3. An assault rifle has full auto capabilities. An AR-15 is only thought of as such because some dummy decided to name it Assault Rifle-15. The M-16 and M-4 it is modeled after are Assault Rifles, and there are already laws in place preventing people from buying the parts necessary to turn an AR-15 into an M-16.

4. They want to limit the capacity of "clips". The last firearm I can remember that used "clips" was the M1 Garand. Produced in WW2. It's called a magazine Washington. The lawmakers shouldn't be allowed to make any new laws about a gun when they can't even name the parts of said gun. If they think an AR-15 uses a clip, then they don't even understand how the thing works.

I agree with what one of the members said about the gun makers getting rich right now. Go ahead and call up an AR15 manufacturer, any of them, ask how long the waiting list is to get a rifle if you order one today.

My heart goes out to all those who lost love ones in the Sandy Hook attack. There was no excuse for what that guy did. But this has happened before, will happen again with or without a gun. But messing with 2nd amendment rights is going to create far more problems than it solves.

I apologize to any I may have offended but this whole thing is a sore subject. I grew up in the south, learned to hunt with rifles and shotguns. I shoot competitively in CMP and NRA competitions. I'm not saying I'm good at it, it's just what I enjoy doing. The only thing we ever hurt is a piece of paper with a bullseye on it. Taking my right to bear arms would be taking a way of life away from me. But that is nothing, there are many who still live off the land, the only food on their plates is what they hunt. I would love to see how it works out for anyone who tries to take their guns.
This right here is the most accurate explanation I have yet to see on this thread. You have to at least take into consideration that if he didn't have access to the guns, he would have just gone on You Tube and found out how to make a bomb loaded up the car drive it through the front door and blew up the whole school killing way more. If somebody with criminal intentions has their mind set to do harm, they will figure out a way to do it.
As far as the gov't trying to regulate guns.... This is just the start. Just like Australia,China, Germany and others. Right before the S.H.T.F. If you don't like guns. Don't buy them or own them. But don't try to push your views on all when it's only a very few that cause the problems. Criminals and psychopaths will still have them or just find another way.
If you are ok with giving up more of your rights as an American that's fine. But I will not! This is a big one. If it were ever to happen it would continue with more and more until you have nothing. And you would have nothing to say about it and no way to defend yourself or your family. Be ready to be a gov't controlled drone...you might find yourself willing to work for food and gov't supplied shelter, pay ungodly taxes,and just work til you tip over. Could be a little far fetched,but in other ways might not be so far off. Check out how other countries are that are run by dictators and no citizen rights. You stand up for what you believe and the next day you're gone.
01-25-2013 08:38 AM
G54
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Green Machine View Post
Joel 3:10
Ephesians 6:10-13
01-25-2013 08:33 AM
BlueRidgeYJ Viper, AR stands for Armalite, the company Eugene Stoner worked for when he designed the AR10 & 15. Also, all legislation I have seen (except 2 speeches by Republicans) reference them as mags. In 1944 Nazi Germany designed and built the Sturmgewehr 44 "Storm Rifle", more acurately translated "Assault Rifle". This is what the AK, M16, and most other evil rifles call Grandpa.

Ed, columbine was pistols. Plain and simple. And IEDs, which have been illegal for a long time. So was VT. And ONLY pistols - why is this hard to grasp? Aurora had a shotgun (long rifle), pistols, and an AR. Newtown has very conflicting reports, he certainly killed himself with a pistol. NBC reported the AR was in the car while Lanza lay dead inside (but that's a diff conversation). What political assasination has happened with an AR? I can think of one attempt. Since 1944, care to name the pistol assasinations?

Assault Rifles (as you call them) do not pose a threat to the populace at large. Guns do, or they don't. 1 kind does not pose a more serious risk, and if they do police don't need em either.

All this is in addition to the American Ignorance of laws prohibiting a standing national army, the purpose of my right to own military weaponry. It was guns from the armorer, not the gunsmith, that they were talking about. It was B Franklin who petitioned the govt to purchase and hand out military arms to the populace of PA to form protective militias, some 30+ years before he signed the Constitution.
01-25-2013 06:08 AM
viperx6x9x sorry, i know they aren't trying to take away all of them, i got carried away. I was just trying to make the point that even if they did, it wouldn't stop things like this from happening. There are sick people out there, like you stated, wearing weird costumes and such. And they will find another tool with which to do harm to others.

and yes, i can agree that you do not need a 30 round magazine. If you can't hit a deer with the first 29, then you aren't gonna hit it with the 30th. It just pisses me off that the politicians making up this legislature can't even name the part correctly, which gives the impression that they don't know a thing about the gun they are trying to regulate.
01-25-2013 01:44 AM
ed98208
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueRidgeYJ View Post
Handguns kill. They kill often. They killed in Columbine, 4 years into an AWB. They killed in VT, with 21 normal capacity mags. They killed in Aurora, and they killed in Newtown.
Dylan Klebold primarily used a TEK-9 with one each of 52, 32 and 28 round magazines. The VA Tech shooter carried two handguns and numerous 10 and 15 round magazines; the 9mm were hollow-points. The Aurora shooter used a Smith & Wesson M&P15[11] semi-automatic rifle with a 100-round drum magazine. The Sandy Hook shooter used a Bushmaster XM15-E2S rifle with a 30-round magazine.

Yes, there were multiple guns at each incident and some of the killers had additional handguns and magazines that would not be restricted by the proposed legislation, but all of the shooters carried and killed with at least one weapon and/or magazine that would be restricted. I don't know if you meant to imply somehow that they used ordinary, everyday 6-shooters, but it's just not the case.

I have a theory that I'm mulling over about these particular killers...each of them dressed up in a "costume" to do the murders, I believe. They all wore commando-type gear to some extent. The VA Tech shooter sent videos of himself to the news on the day of the shootings, posing and posturing with his gear and guns. The Aurora shooter was head to toe in black tactical gear. The Columbine shooters were into the Matrix look. Not sure about Sandy Hook as reports differ but some said he wore black tactical gear. So it seems to me that there's a fetishistic, macho-fantasy appeal at work here, one that maybe could only be complete if they used the "right" guns. Like I said, not a complete thought but something I'm formulating.

p.s. Viper, is anyone trying to take away ALL the guns? If so, I haven't seen that report.
01-24-2013 11:44 PM
viperx6x9x The problem with more rules and regulations on gun control, is that only the people that were already following the current rules and regulations are going to follow the new ones.

This will not effect the criminals, that are making a bad name for firearms, one bit. They will get what they want on the black market or from some salesman in a dark alley anyway.

2. Go ahead and ban assault rifles. Push the criminals toward other cheaper guns, like that $180 mossberg shotgun at walmart. Far more dangerous weapon for a shooter to take into a room of people IMO. How about we take away every gun on earth, melt them all down, and make a huge statue out of them. Still won't stop another Sandy Hook. The gun was a tool, they will find another tool. Look at the Taliban and their suicide bombs. And what, pray tell, are all the law abiding citizens going to protect themselves with when that happens? Pepper spray? Stranger danger whistle?

3. An assault rifle has full auto capabilities. An AR-15 is only thought of as such because some dummy decided to name it Assault Rifle-15. The M-16 and M-4 it is modeled after are Assault Rifles, and there are already laws in place preventing people from buying the parts necessary to turn an AR-15 into an M-16.

4. They want to limit the capacity of "clips". The last firearm I can remember that used "clips" was the M1 Garand. Produced in WW2. It's called a magazine Washington. The lawmakers shouldn't be allowed to make any new laws about a gun when they can't even name the parts of said gun. If they think an AR-15 uses a clip, then they don't even understand how the thing works.

I agree with what one of the members said about the gun makers getting rich right now. Go ahead and call up an AR15 manufacturer, any of them, ask how long the waiting list is to get a rifle if you order one today.

My heart goes out to all those who lost love ones in the Sandy Hook attack. There was no excuse for what that guy did. But this has happened before, will happen again with or without a gun. But messing with 2nd amendment rights is going to create far more problems than it solves.

I apologize to any I may have offended but this whole thing is a sore subject. I grew up in the south, learned to hunt with rifles and shotguns. I shoot competitively in CMP and NRA competitions. I'm not saying I'm good at it, it's just what I enjoy doing. The only thing we ever hurt is a piece of paper with a bullseye on it. Taking my right to bear arms would be taking a way of life away from me. But that is nothing, there are many who still live off the land, the only food on their plates is what they hunt. I would love to see how it works out for anyone who tries to take their guns.
01-24-2013 11:42 PM
IWANNAOFFROAD
Quote:
Originally Posted by swampbuggy98 View Post
Great story! It's funny how the "educated" among us are the first ones to tighten up when they get proved wrong!
for sure lol
01-24-2013 10:57 PM
swampbuggy98
Quote:
Originally Posted by IWANNAOFFROAD View Post
Hey guys I wanted to share a story with you guys. Today in economics class our teacher (Extremely liberal) brought up world issues which our country face. Of course gun control came up. He stated that he believed that there should be a ban on all semi automatic fire arms. He said he believes this because of all the shootings and the sandy hook incident. Most of the class nodded there head. I put my hand up and the teacher asked me what my take on it was. I stated I believe that it's my right to have a semi automatic rife. He said why do you think that? I said its to defend against tyranny. He said that ridiculous you really think that if all the gun people stood together that you could take over the government. I said yes I do believe so sir. He said what about all the tanks and the planes. I replied Americans have done it before 1776, militia took over the most powerful military in the world. My teacher was baffled and my classmates were starting to stand behind me. He then said what about the 20 children who died and the theater incident where the guy bought his gun legally. I simply replied what about the thousand of would be children that were aborted? The whole class became a uproar and a couple of people saying Brandon for president. I thought it was pretty cool and decided to share it with you guys.
Great story! It's funny how the "educated" among us are the first ones to tighten up when they get proved wrong!
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