Jeep Wrangler Forum - Reply to Topic
Jeep Wrangler Forum

Go Back   Jeep Wrangler Forum > WF Local > WF Local Forums for Your Region and State > California Jeep Forum > The SoCal Clubhouse

Join Wrangler Forum Today


Thread: The SoCal Clubhouse Reply to Thread
Title:
  
Message:
Post Icons
You may choose an icon for your message from the following list:
 

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Jeep Wrangler Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Additional Options
Miscellaneous Options

Topic Review (Newest First)
Today 06:59 PM
iwaxmyjimmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunner View Post
Post a link or pm it to me. I have to go to a wedding rehearsal. LOL I'm the best man he could find.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/newbi...trail-rig.html

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/gener...erman-not.html

Found arguments from both sides in these.
Today 06:51 PM
Gunner Post a link or pm it to me. I have to go to a wedding rehearsal. LOL I'm the best man he could find.
Today 06:31 PM
iwaxmyjimmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunner View Post
Hmmm I wonder if it has to do with the caster angles and lack of camber thrust.
There is so much involved with perfecting the handling of a car but when you think about it that's a car, not a solid front axle jeep. You can really dial in the ackermann with reverse high steer from what I've been researching over on pirate.
Today 06:27 PM
Gunner Hmmm I wonder if it has to do with the caster angles and lack of camber thrust.
Today 06:08 PM
iwaxmyjimmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunner View Post
Ooops your right we used reverse ackermann on the race cars...
From what I under stand reverse/anti ackermann is the outside tire turns more, ankermann is the inside tire, and parallel is just the turn the same speed.
Today 06:05 PM
Gunner Ooops your right we used reverse ackermann on the race cars...
Today 06:03 PM
iwaxmyjimmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditchdoc View Post
Wheelbase and speed is irrelevant.
Wheel base is just how you get the percentage when you calculate it. 100% ackermann would mean if you drew lines from the TRE holes to the rear diff in a fashion to which they intercept, they would cross directly over the center of the rear housing.
Today 06:01 PM
iwaxmyjimmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditchdoc View Post
I would leave the angles to the pros. I'm not smart enough to make them.
Well I might have a little crappier turning radius with my proposed high steer setup but big sidewall tires flex and slip on asphalt too. So ima go for it and if it don't work I've got a spare pair if knuckles
Today 06:00 PM
Ditchdoc Wheelbase and speed is irrelevant.
Today 05:58 PM
Gunner My experience with it is in road racing cars. Not in street cars. Your right on that on the freeway it is a non player. Not enough wheel speed differential. It's been a long time since I did suspension. I would have to go back and look it up to refresh. In high speed cornering say a 100 mph tight 180 then it would come into play for both tire wear and slippage caused by not being able to describe the perfect arc on both tires. Again I would say for a dirt car it is a non event. Im gonna go look it up, its been a while.
Today 05:57 PM
Ditchdoc I would leave the angles to the pros. I'm not smart enough to make them.
Today 05:49 PM
iwaxmyjimmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunner View Post
Ackermann is about the arc's the front tires describe in a turn due to track width differences. It reduces tire scrub. It should not make any difference if your wheelbase is 90 inches or 116 as long as your track is the same the ackermann principle still applies. The inside tire turns in a smaller diameter than the outside one does. So the front and rear tires both spin more rotations on the outside than the inside ones do. The difference in the angles allow for easier steering. In the rear you can't steer the tires so you have an open differential to allow for differing tire speeds. Thats why when you use spools it's a booger to steer and the rear will try to push you straight in a turn. I still think ackermann plays a part in a street driven jeep. Maybe in a hard core rock monster it would not be a big deal as long as high speed corners don't come into play. Your going much more rock than street but it would be hard to remove it without some different arm lengths. I believe my Currie has made no changes to my setup due to all the factory arm lengths. If you do custom high steer then you could easily tune it out.
When you measure to the get percentage, it's the tie rod mounting width divided by the wheelbase. Everything I've been reading deals more with passenger cars than a trail/street rig. It's really going to effect low speed turning in a parking lot and that's about it. It's not going to change the highway drive bc the angles are so much smaller. From everything I've been researching it's going to be noticed at maybe 20 mph and under if that. JK(U)s have anti ackermann built in. If a 2dr JK has 70% then a 4 door would be even less bc of the wheel base. Now if someone can explain it more In dept then this I'm on all ears. The length of the Arms has no input in it since you try and keep the TRE locations in line with the centerline of the ballpoints/king pin. Length of the arms déjà provide simple leverage though.
Today 05:37 PM
Gunner
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditchdoc View Post
I wish I still had my buggy. That thing was terrifying and had homicidal handling. You would have loved to go for a spin it it.
196 at ElMirage and 206 at the Silver State Classic. LOL it had so much lift it was spinning the tires in the dirt at top speed. The speedo read 220.
Today 05:31 PM
Gunner
Quote:
Originally Posted by iwaxmyjimmy View Post
Speaking of handling I'm reading up on ackermann, it's totally pointless bc my wheelbase will change and a JKU uses the same mounts as a JK. I feel like I wasted a lot of time reading about it lol
Ackermann is about the arc's the front tires describe in a turn due to track width differences. It reduces tire scrub. It should not make any difference if your wheelbase is 90 inches or 116 as long as your track is the same the ackermann principle still applies. The inside tire turns in a smaller diameter than the outside one does. So the front and rear tires both spin more rotations on the outside than the inside ones do. The difference in the angles allow for easier steering. In the rear you can't steer the tires so you have an open differential to allow for differing tire speeds. Thats why when you use spools it's a booger to steer and the rear will try to push you straight in a turn. I still think ackermann plays a part in a street driven jeep. Maybe in a hard core rock monster it would not be a big deal as long as high speed corners don't come into play. Your going much more rock than street but it would be hard to remove it without some different arm lengths. I believe my Currie has made no changes to my setup due to all the factory arm lengths. If you do custom high steer then you could easily tune it out.
Today 05:20 PM
Zombiehunta666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditchdoc View Post
I wouldn't but any carbureted vehicle unless a bike.
I'd agree. Only Things is now those FI dirt bikes are finally starting to come around...
Today 05:18 PM
Zombiehunta666
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDgasser View Post

Bob... You of all people should know this already. "There's no replacement for displacement"
:ROFL: havnt heard that one in awhile.
Today 05:03 PM
Ditchdoc
Quote:
Originally Posted by iwaxmyjimmy View Post
Speaking of handling I'm reading up on ackermann, it's totally pointless bc my wheelbase will change and a JKU uses the same mounts as a JK. I feel like I wasted a lot of time reading about it lol
Unless your track is different front and back it kinda naturally applies.
Today 04:18 PM
JoeBot13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunner View Post
Speed limiter is removed in the computer.
well in that case a trip back out to the lake beds may be in order after that ripp is installed
Today 04:13 PM
iwaxmyjimmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditchdoc View Post
I wish I still had my buggy. That thing was terrifying and had homicidal handling. You would have loved to go for a spin it it.
Speaking of handling I'm reading up on ackermann, it's totally pointless bc my wheelbase will change and a JKU uses the same mounts as a JK. I feel like I wasted a lot of time reading about it lol
Today 04:00 PM
Ditchdoc I wish I still had my buggy. That thing was terrifying and had homicidal handling. You would have loved to go for a spin it it.
Today 03:53 PM
Ditchdoc Gee gunner sounds like you need to get a raptor.
Today 03:49 PM
Gunner
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeBot13 View Post
I guarantee you'd find your limiter that is for sure!
Speed limiter is removed in the computer.
Today 03:48 PM
Gunner Go to the YJ tech section and look up Nutter Bypass. That helps a bunch.
Today 03:47 PM
JoeBot13 This was 20 years ago and it still gives me shivers to think about it
Today 03:45 PM
Ditchdoc My dad had some old Porsche it use a mechanical injection. That thing was genius.
Today 03:41 PM
Ditchdoc
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeBot13 View Post
Vapor lock is an issue, and the lower fuel pressure makes driving inclines difficult to do without stalling. These are issues you'd run into on the trail often, for day to day driving not so much. Maintenance wise it's a nightmare. My first two cars were carbed, and I still have nightmares about this 3-barrel Honda crap of a carb on my first car. I spent more time on that POS's vacuum lines than it took me to strip my engine down to the pistons and rebuild the head. I marked all of the vacuum lines when I took it apart, and still ended up with leftover lines when I put it back together. I hate carbs.
Those Americanized imports were the best. So you think you figured out the rubrics cube, Go figure a carbureted honda.
Today 03:12 PM
JoeBot13 Vapor lock is an issue, and the lower fuel pressure makes driving inclines difficult to do without stalling. These are issues you'd run into on the trail often, for day to day driving not so much. Maintenance wise it's a nightmare. My first two cars were carbed, and I still have nightmares about this 3-barrel Honda crap of a carb on my first car. I spent more time on that POS's vacuum lines than it took me to strip my engine down to the pistons and rebuild the head. I marked all of the vacuum lines when I took it apart, and still ended up with leftover lines when I put it back together. I hate carbs.
Today 02:59 PM
Gunner One thing about Carbs is todays fuels. They have more and more ethanol in them. That attacks older gaskets and parts not designed for it. It also attracts water which then sits in the bottom of fuel bowls and causes sludge and rust. EFI systems don't have these problems. They are designed with the fuels in mind and don't have places for the water to hide.
Today 02:58 PM
Ditchdoc Even on bikes I will take efi over carb but cost kinda takes the fun out of it.
Today 02:54 PM
Ditchdoc Well I'm a person of incredible simplicity. Carburetors believe it or not has more parts and complexity ( not complicated) than any fuel injection.
Plus fuel injection works at higher psi approx 65 psi vs carb at 7 to 15. So more force is always better. Bwha ha ha.
This thread has more than 30 replies. Click here to review the whole thread.

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:21 PM.



Jeep®, Wrangler, Liberty, Wagoneer, Cherokee, and Grand Cherokee are copyrighted and trademarked to Chrysler Motors LLC.
Wranglerforum.com is not in any way associated with the Chrysler Motors LLC