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Topic Review (Newest First)
07-22-2013 12:15 PM
DJL2 ND - I am not part of the uber cool Jeep club yet - I'm going to tell you a secret:

I keep a set of SureFire earplugs in my Jeep at all times. If I happen to be rolling top off or doors off, I throw them in (even windows down, actually) because it is LOUD. As a motorcyclist, I know that sustained wind noise = permanent hearing loss and I prefer to avoid that.

I recently read a piece in one of the off road mags where they did a huge expedition out West in an X-terra. Sure, I was upset it wasn't a 4Runner (heh), but that truck tackled some pretty serious terrain. The reality is that, 99% of the time, to drive terrain a X-Terra Pro-4 or 4Runner Trail cannot handle means you need to look for it.
07-21-2013 12:26 PM
NDTransplant I agree, DJL2---makes me think of the Subaru commercials I've seen of late. "Wow, look at that all-wheel drive station wagon go down that gravel driveway!" lol

I've never even been in a Jeep with the top down/removed, so I'd be lying if I commented on how 'cool' or 'awesome' that may or may not be! And, a good driver in even something stock, such as a ForeRunner or an X-Terra can do some interesting things. I recall seeing a little Suzuki Samari coming down a hill I was struggling to get up with my 2-stroke dirt-bike...with nothing more than some oversize tires. So, the skill of the driver is unquestionably is an important factor; maybe the most important one?

Given my experience riding dirt bikes in the mountains and desert areas of Arizona, though, I think the Jeep is best design out of the box.
07-21-2013 11:14 AM
DJL2 I will throw in a slightly redacted version of my "SUV are now station wagon/minivan rant."

What do you see in commercials for supposedly off-road capable vehicles? You see a vehicles driving down a dirt or possibly gravel road. The point being it IS a road - leveled and graded. I could drive my BMW 335i down exactly the same road without any trouble. The fact that you can kick up some dust and there are mountains in the background does not make it "off-road."

I firmly believe that folks are now conditioned to think of anything that doesn't have an asphalt of concrete surface as "off-road." Fire breaks and trails are not off-road - they are a trail made specifically for vehicle access and technically qualify as either an improved road or unimproved road depending on grading, maintenance, etc.

Why bother with all that? Well, because unless you actually plan on a trail where things like ground clearance, approach and departure angles, breakover and articulation are going to be factors in your driving they don't need to be a factor in your purchase. I'm a Toyota over Nissan guy myself, but if all I wanted to do was bomb fire roads and trails at high speed I'd be in a 4Runner over a Wrangler - not because the 4Runner is more capable off-road, but because it is more capable on-road where I'm planning to use it.

I love my Jeep - I don't mind that it is a bit on the harsh side of things. I have a 4-dr because I need/want the added cargo space. As long as you test drive and have an idea of what you're getting into - go for it.
07-21-2013 10:32 AM
panthermark I'd order a 2014....
Check with your employer to see if you are already eligible for a Chrysler Affiliate Discount, or join Tread Lightly. That way you are guaranteed to not pay more than 1% below invoice...and of course, you can negotiate below that number. 2%-4% below invoice is what we often see around here.

As far as what model....really depends on how you will use the Wrangler.

If you are looking at two doors, pay close attention the power convenience package and window tint, if I remember correctly, those are options on the Sport and Rubi, but standard on the Sahara.
07-21-2013 10:19 AM
Originally Posted by NDTransplant View Post
Now the Sport, Sahara, Rubicon debate comes up. Given my extremely limited knowledge of Jeeps, it kind of seems to me like the Sahara package is a bit over-priced, but I really like the fact that you can get color-matched hardtop and fender flares. I like the saddle-colored accents available in the interior, also.
The Sahara package REQUIRES a color mathced top and fenders. They are optional on a rubi but you can still get it that way if you want. You can also only get one or the other if you want.
07-21-2013 01:39 AM
coelement777 I just bought a 2013 sport about a month ago. I was debating between a new one and a 06 rubicon with 40k on it for about the same price. I ended up going with a sport, and i will upgrade it as my budget allows until it is better then a stock rubicon on trails. I just put 31" duratracs on it and black wheels. When it is paid off, i will be lifting it, putting 35's or 37's on it and regearing it. Buy the sport and upgrade it to suit your tastes, then you will have no reason to get rid of it.
07-20-2013 09:55 PM
NDTransplant Wife and I went for a test drive in a 2013 Sport today...much to my surprise she seemed to really like it.

Took it down the Interstate, and have to say I think the ride was more refined than I was anticipating. Not really sure what I was anticipating, guess I'm thinking of the Jeeps on M*A*S*H or something, haha.

Now the Sport, Sahara, Rubicon debate comes up. Given my extremely limited knowledge of Jeeps, it kind of seems to me like the Sahara package is a bit over-priced, but I really like the fact that you can get color-matched hardtop and fender flares. I like the saddle-colored accents available in the interior, also.

Not sure about the 18" wheels on the have you priced over-sized tires in 18"??? HOLY COW! That would be a ways off, of course.

I can appreciate the factory lockers on the Rubicon, but that is also something that could be added later. And, I don't see myself taking a new $30K vehicle out in areas that demand dual lockers. I've been wrong before, however!

Looked in the engine compartment a bit, never did find the spark plugs! Boy things have changed since the days of the simple 350 Chevy and the 300 6-banger Ford, etc., etc.

Our local dealer doesn't really have anything I'd be interested in, so I'm wondering- do I buy from a dealer 500 miles away to get what I want in a 2013, or 'support the local dealer' and order a 2014?

Need to really see what the numbers would be on working a deal, of course, but what's your opinion on 'buying local'?

07-18-2013 01:01 AM
Ripnowell45 I actually just sold my Xterra Off Road and got the JKU, I will never look back. I loved my X but as said before the aftermarket world is very small and very expensive. Test drive both and see what you like better. The 2 door has no where near the cargo room that is why I went with the 4 door. The gas mileage was terrible on the X too. Had 33's, basket up top and Xoskel light bar and if I was lucky I would get 15mpg Hwy, now I get around 19.
07-17-2013 10:31 PM
RUOMO10 I currently own a 2001 sexterra. I love it, but I am ordering a 2014 rubi come August/September. I will say this, a few years ago I took my stock sexterra to Rausch Creek up in PA with my buddies who all had modified jeeps and it was a blast. I was surprised that I was able to do most of the stuff they did. I just had slightly larger tires then stock. I couldn't really flex like them, but I could do just about everything else. Did a little rock climbing, mudding, trails, etc. while there. Was this a good idea in the long run with my stock vehicle? Eh, not really as I have issues now, but it was awesome.

Edit:also have lots of rusting underneath. But she's old.
07-17-2013 09:03 PM
Originally Posted by viperx6x9x View Post
Granted this vehicle came used from the heavily salted, and whatever else they use for ice, roads of Maine.
We actually use calcium chloride and sand in most places, calcium chloride doesn't cause rust

Rust isn't as big of a problem as you would expect, it's usually more a problem with particular types of vehicles. None of my vehicles have ever had rust problems (15 year old saab, 10 year old land rover, three other saabs between 8 and 10 years old)...

Our 1996 nissan pathfinder did rust a lot faster than anything else we've ever had. It's hard to find one of those of that generation up here these days where fenders aren't rusted all the way through.
07-17-2013 08:59 PM
bflank I had a 2000 Xterra. For the kind of offroading you describe I'd pick the vehicle that you like best. Both will perform well. It comes down to trading the additional aftermarket possibilities and the fun of running doorless and topless with the Wrangler for a somewhat quieter and softer ride with the X. As someone else said though if you want a more "civilized" offroader the Grand Cherokee is definitely worth a look.

In this forum however, expect us to steer you towards a Jeep.
07-17-2013 06:56 PM
NDTransplant Wow I had no idea a first-time poster would generate so many responses- and all good points.

I was discussing this with a colleague of mine the other day...he said the X-Terra makes a nice chick vehicle, but don't let that stop you from buying one. He always has encouraging remarks like that...

Interesting point on the Moab trip, YJMadness....if you look at the specs, the X-Terra supposedly only has an inch difference in ground clearance, but when you see that giant plastic fascia on the front bumper, and compare approach angles, etc., etc., well it's like one guy said- X-Terra is a good daily driver capable of some off-road; Jeep is a good off-roader capable of handling highway duty.

Give me a couple weeks to sort some things out....I'll check out some used Unlimiteds as well.
07-17-2013 05:25 PM
YJmaddness I have a 13 Ruby Unlimited and my mother has a 13 X Terra 4x. I talked her into coming down to Moab during Jeep Safari this spring and maybe try and get her on the trails. We're both have stock suspension soI picked an easier trail to do. We ended up parking her Nissan at the trailhead because it was so low to the ground we worried about ripping her mud flaps off. Then just last week we went out to go do another mountain road, And did the same thing. Its not that i do a lot of hardcore rock crawling (yet) but to get up to some of the old mountain roads you need a little more clearance otherwise you're going to end up replacing your oil pan. For off-road practicality purposes the Jeep is a no brainer to me.
07-17-2013 05:19 PM
dwilly I am a big Nissan fan. I had the '07 Xterra Off Road. I had a 3 inch lift and 33s. I was able to do just about anything I wanted trail wise. Biggest trails I tackled was Poison Spider, Hells Revenge and a few local black diamonds here in stock form (including factory tires). The limit is how far you want to take it. I wanted to tackle bigger and wilder things than what an IFS was capable of doing. To get a Xterra where I wanted it would have cost me about 10 grand in mods, including SAS. There is also the factor of after market support for Nissan. There almost isn't. Sliders run about $600. A front bumper will run at least $1K. Power, torque, and MPG are all very close. If I could go back I probably would have purchased a Jeep in the first place. I did not know I would get the wheeling bug this bad and feel I needed a solid axle for some of the trails I want to do these days. Just think about what you want to do with it, and what might want in the future.

My .02
07-17-2013 05:15 PM
viperx6x9x If you get an xterra, have it undercoated. My wife had a 2000 model, whatever v6 they had at the time, pretty much base model. Drivetrain was rock solid, we never managed to hurt it. However, the underside rusted so bad that at one point it literally snapped a leaf spring in half going over a rough spot in the road.

Granted this vehicle came used from the heavily salted, and whatever else they use for ice, roads of Maine. It was at a disadvantage to corrosion in the first place. But seriously, a leaf spring on a paved road?

It could go anywhere we needed it to go, we weren't trying to crawl rocks or anything crazy like that though.

Don't know anything about the newer xterras, but that one was slow, and not great on mileage either. But jeeps are the same way so no big loss going either way.
07-17-2013 04:56 PM
HK_Runner The 2-door can be a pain. I have one but I bought it for the tight trails here and I have my 4Runner too. I also wanted that tight turning radius. If it is your DD, it will be inconvenient. There is barely enough room to fit two people and 6 rabbits.
07-17-2013 04:41 PM
tontwins I was in the exact same boat as you. Pro-4x vs wrangler 2 door... I went with the jeep. I've been pretty happy with my choice but if its going to be a daily driver I'd consider a bigger car then the 2 door jeep. yes I love driving it but get annoyed ny the lack of space, no stock roof rack, the swing out hatch is a pain with a bike rack... I think a 4 door if built right can look cool otherwise meh... I've seen people get 4 door sports for 26k pout the door just have to work hard to get a dealer to dance
07-17-2013 03:57 PM
yjswampthing I've had 2 - 2 doors that I loved more than any of my other cars. I now have a 4 door that I love more than both of my 2 doors.

To me you can't really compare a 4door SUV with a 2 door wrangler if you need it for daily driving, grocery getting, trips to home depot, etc. That 2 door will get on your nerves for anything other than driving in my experience and opinion. They just don't have much room for anything. I would go with the Xterra if you're stuck between those two. *Pause for attack from 2 door owners...

That being said... I would consider getting a used 4 door over a new 2 door. 12 and later if at all possible to get the better powerplant.

I'm too lazy to get out there and compare prices and all that but I have a hard time believing that the $ a top of the line xterra will cost you will not buy a jeep that will outperform it on the trail (Rubicon,anyone?) That being said I know little about the market and prices of those so I could be completely wrong. It's happened before
07-17-2013 03:33 PM
DallasJKU I've had both. The Pro 4X is a great vehicle. I ran 2.5" coilovers and 33's. The Rockford Fosgate radio was pretty good and much better than the Jeep. The ride quality on the 4X is much better than the Jeep. With that said I wanted another Jeep and like modding my vehicles. The aftermarket support for Xterra is almost non existent with bumpers taking 6+ months to arrive. The cargo room of the Xterra is awesome actually with the front seat folded down. The Jeep looks 100X cooler and taking the top off is awesome. The 4X is more civilized, but its not a Range Rover. The locker works great on the 4X. The Jeep is way more fun than the 4X, but Nissan makes a great product with a great engine. I know I would pick the Pro 4X over the 2 door, but the 4D Jeep over the 4X.
07-17-2013 02:50 PM
TOK One of my buddies traded his XTerra (actually the second XTerra he owned) for a JKU. He's happier with the Jeep, but the XTerra is a great SUV, body on frame, good power, available rear locker. The IFS probably hurts it for hardcore offroad, but it is definitely focused on its market.

You were comparing it to a JKU Sahara, and the XTerra is every bit its match for what 98% of those two vehicles are used for.

The convertible thing and aftermarket support is of huge importance to me, you can get pretty much every cool offroad thing made for a JK. Manufacturers seem to pick and choose more when it comes to support for the XTerra, 4Runner and FJ.
07-17-2013 12:31 PM
WininUtah When I started to look for a replacement for my LJ I considered a Pro4-X. I very good friend just got one, all decked out with leather etc. I really liked it but a couple of weeks later he had some minor complaints, basically some quality issues. My brother sells Nissan and had told me that his mechanics really praised the XTerra as trouble free. So minor quality issues but good mechanics were OK.

My wife made me come to my senses, we have a Pilot and don't need another SUV. Having owned a Jeep I knew that's where my heart was, anyway. I think most people would be happy with an Xterra, they're pretty well thought out but Jeeps are a bit smaller and a I'd guess even a Sahara is a bit more capable.

Tough decision, drive both.
07-17-2013 11:03 AM
smohr33 I came from a Titan Pro-4x to a JKU. Had the Titan 3 years, got the Jeep a couple weeks ago. Had a family member with an Xterra and drove it lots, so I have a pretty good idea of what the Frontier is like to drive. FWIW I never go off road, the most "off road" use my trucks get is snowstorms, so I can't help you there. I assume the jeep would have been better off road, the Titan had a very long wheelbase and IFS. Frontier is also IFS and a decently long wheelbase.

The Jeep is my 3rd car, so the ability to have a "convertible" for the summer, and something that is great in the winter was a plus for me. If it were my only car it would be even more of a plus, kind of like having two cars in one.

I just didn't enjoy driving the Titan/Xterra, the Jeep feels alive, while the Nissans just feel like big mushy pickups. The frontier also gets pretty poor MPG, probably worse than a 3.6 JK. The only thing I enjoyed about the Titan was its towing capacity, and the ability to haul tons of crap around. Otherwise, the Jeep is a much more enjoyable truck, I'm glad I made the switch.
07-17-2013 09:54 AM
Originally Posted by NDTransplant View Post
Wow- appreciate the quick responses!

I agree- many factors to consider, but hard to duplicate the character of the Jeep.

Anyways, tests drives are in order, I guess...will keep you posted.
A while back my wife had a nice Altima and once I got my Jeep (prior to the one I have now) she started asking to drive, take the top off, and to take every dirt road she saw. Eventually she came to the conclusion that she needed a Jeep. Although she had driven off road and riden in mine a lot, I tried explaining that it wasn't going to be the daily driver she was expecting. I tried everything to talk her into a 4-Runner or X-terra because of the daily drivability, she wanted a Jeep for the wave and cool factor. So, needless to say my wifes Jeep (11' JKU) phase lasted less than a year and she was back to an Altima, "because it was a smoother ride". It is not that the Jeep has bad onroad manners...but at the end of the day it is a Jeep. You have to be prepared for the days that you wake up with 4" on rainwater in the floorboards, soaking wet seats, and a radio that no longer works because you forgot to put the top back on (or your top just leaks like mine).

So when you take a test drive keep this in mind. The 4Runner and X-terra are DD's with off-road capabilities. The Jeep is an off-road vehicle, that is able to be a DD.

My vote goes to a Wrangler hands down. When I traded in my old TJ for a "more practical DD" I teared up. I craved the summer days with a top down, the ability to go places that none of my friends could in there cars, I MISSED THE WAVE, I missed the community of people that see another Jeep pulled over on the side of the road and stop just to offer help because they saw another Jeep, I miss the online forums where you can get any and every question answered, I missed every aspect of my Jeep and the Jeep community. So I bought another (13'JK). Sure gas mileage isn't great, I have a leak in the top, and I can't go 100+mph, but I still smile ear to ear everytime I see her, and look over my shoulder just to get another glance when I walk away.
07-17-2013 08:45 AM
traitor08 Just throwing this out there. We were looking at an Xterra for my gf. She drove a JKU, we got the jeep. She liked it better.
07-17-2013 01:24 AM
COLOUJK Of course your going to get Jeep as the best option here. But what you need to do is talk and decide what will be best for what you need. If you are comparing an xterra to a 2dr wrangler your comparing apples to oranges. There is not going to be a "right" answer.

I feel like the new wranglers will compete against any SUV out there in comfort. With the hard tops they are extremely quite and the road manners on a stock rig are amazing. Offroad, nothing will compete. A stock wrangler will beat every other SUV out there with the same skill driver.

Figure out what you guys can live with and buy it. A topless/doorless wrangler is a very addicting feeling. So like the rest My vote is the wrangler.
07-17-2013 01:06 AM
NDTransplant Wow- appreciate the quick responses!

I agree- many factors to consider, but hard to duplicate the character of the Jeep.

Anyways, tests drives are in order, I guess...will keep you posted.
07-17-2013 12:10 AM
traitor08 Here is how I break down vehocles when I look at them. Really simple.

If I see a vehicle with ifs, I think of light duty wheeling or fast desert trophy truck scenario's.

When I see a vehicle with a solid front axle. I see true offroading. Lots of articulation, possible swapping of heavy and extremely heavy duty axles. Look at what offroad runs with solid axles. Monster trucks, pulling trucks, rock crawlers. There is truly an axle for every caveat of 4x4.

But with ifs, there are a lot of limitations. This is iust the short run down of my opinions. So what are you planning on doing. Coming from a almost useless car faction, most 4x4's will be above and beyond your expectations.
07-17-2013 12:09 AM
HK_Runner Yeah, I think it is his 4R. He pulls this ridiculously heavy trailer with it too. Funny timing because I was thinking of modding my 4R (also a white V8) and was looking at some of his stuff.
07-16-2013 11:59 PM
Originally Posted by HK_Runner View Post
Nice 4Runner. Is that Demello's personal 4R?
No clue, just a pic pulled off google. As for your previous post, like I said, all things being equal (assuming they are both equally capable), I go Toyota over Nissan everytime. They are simply built better. I believe the 4 Runner is roomier though.
07-16-2013 11:54 PM
HK_Runner Nice 4Runner. Is that Demello's personal 4R?
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