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Topic Review (Newest First)
01-30-2014 12:54 PM
COStrider
Quote:
Originally Posted by TerryC6 View Post
This is the result of one wheel or the other locking up. It should never do this in a straight line. The system uses the steering wheel sensor, yaw sensor and wheel sensors to determine if the vehcile is under control. If your steering wheel is just a little off and you hit a bump, correct in the wrong direction (according to ESC) it could engage the system. The other problem you could have is a loose connection or even a computer starting to go bad. In any case get it checked out.
10-4. Will look into it. PS your tires are super sticky in your avatar- what kind? Lol
01-29-2014 03:02 PM
TerryC6
Quote:
Originally Posted by COStrider View Post
It feels like anti-lock feedback in the pedal but in the steering wheel. I'm pretty sure it's related to ESC/ESP because the Amber warning light comes on at the time of the steering wheel seizing/locking. It feels like a second or two but like someone said it's likely a split second or two.

To clarify, it returns to normal, it doesn't actually stay locked up. And I mistyped in one reply by saying it happened after the new front end components were installed. It has happened since the lift was installed, and has continued after the new front end was installed.

I remember reading someone posting about the steering wheel needing to be centered (AEV PROCAL has a feature that establishes this) or funky stuff can happen with the steering via the ESP/ESC. I can have them double check that was completed. Maybe that is the cause?

Nothing is actually physically binding in the steering system.
This is the result of one wheel or the other locking up. It should never do this in a straight line. The system uses the steering wheel sensor, yaw sensor and wheel sensors to determine if the vehcile is under control. If your steering wheel is just a little off and you hit a bump, correct in the wrong direction (according to ESC) it could engage the system. The other problem you could have is a loose connection or even a computer starting to go bad.

In any case get it checked out.
01-29-2014 12:06 PM
COStrider
Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
If your steering is locking up, something is wrong. The JK's steering system is mechanical, there is nothing to lock up. Dont confuse offroad bumps (which may temporarily (talking split seconds here) stop you from turning the other way with a locked up steering wheel. The JK doesn't even have a steering lock.
It feels like anti-lock feedback in the pedal but in the steering wheel. I'm pretty sure it's related to ESC/ESP because the Amber warning light comes on at the time of the steering wheel seizing/locking. It feels like a second or two but like someone said it's likely a split second or two.

To clarify, it returns to normal, it doesn't actually stay locked up. And I mistyped in one reply by saying it happened after the new front end components were installed. It has happened since the lift was installed, and has continued after the new front end was installed.

I remember reading someone posting about the steering wheel needing to be centered (AEV PROCAL has a feature that establishes this) or funky stuff can happen with the steering via the ESP/ESC. I can have them double check that was completed. Maybe that is the cause?

Nothing is actually physically binding in the steering system.
01-29-2014 11:30 AM
NFRs2000NYC
Quote:
Originally Posted by COStrider View Post
Come on out to Denver I'll show you. I'm driving straight going between 10-30 mph depending on the stoplight timing etc and it's 5 blocks from my house and I've lived there for 2 years with the JK. It never did that in stock trim FYI.

AND THE STEERING WHEEL LOCKS UP

There is no debating it, just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean I hasn't happened to me or the OP! I have no technical explanation to debunk your theory, although I promise you it's a reality.
If your steering is locking up, something is wrong. The JK's steering system is mechanical, there is nothing to lock up. Dont confuse offroad bumps (which may temporarily (talking split seconds here) stop you from turning the other way with a locked up steering wheel. The JK doesn't even have a steering lock.
01-29-2014 11:23 AM
COStrider
Quote:
Originally Posted by TerryC6 View Post
And I can assure you that spinlock is correct. As far ESC goes it only applys selective bracking individuals wheels. There is no electrically control mechanism in the steering system capable of interfering with the steering system. The power steering pump is mechanically powered and the steering system is mechanically connected the steering box. For the steering to be impacted it would need to be steer by wire or have a braking system somewhere in the steering system, does not exist. ESC exist on many vehicles including my Vette. ESC can not over come physics though. If the slide is big enough you are going to go around. Driving with ESC though is a different skill than driving without and means over coming skills learned without the system. Unlike conventional skills, counter steering in a slide with ESC you want to continue to hold the turn. The reason for this ESC uses the steering posistion sensor to determine what you want to do. If you counter steer and then ESC kicks in you will most likely end up end up going a direction you did not intend to go. Like anything else it takes practice and understanding to live with ESC. If you are wheeling or playing in the snow by all means disable it. But for normal driving or driving in wet conditions if you understand it, it works very well. In fact it works so well that when I race the Vette in wet conditions I keep it on.
Come on out to Denver I'll show you. I'm driving straight going between 10-30 mph depending on the stoplight timing etc and it's 5 blocks from my house and I've lived there for 2 years with the JK. It never did that in stock trim FYI.

AND THE STEERING WHEEL LOCKS UP

There is no debating it, just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean I hasn't happened to me or the OP! I have no technical explanation to debunk your theory, although I promise you it's a reality.
01-29-2014 11:23 AM
Cash_097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sueby View Post
Sweet! Thanks for testing it out & updating. I only want it for off road so I'm not worried about no cruise or anything like that - I just want the nannies 100% off off road.
Not sure what you mean "nannies"?
01-29-2014 10:26 AM
TerryC6
Quote:
Originally Posted by COStrider View Post
You are wrong. My steering wheel has an effect where you can't turn it at all over the same crazy bump on a bridge expansion joint. It locks up. It happens regularly at that spot but rarely anywhere else. All the parameters are set accordingly for gears and tire size with a procal. It feels like the power steering goes out for a second or two. NOT A GOOD FEELING. And it's happened since I had a completely new front suspension (all synergy: trac bar, tie rod, drag link, ball joints, trac bar and steering sector shaft brace) and a fresh alignment on a brand new alignment rack.

I can assure you the power steering wheel system IS affected by ESP or ESC or whatever electronic bs is in place.

2012, 6 speed, AEV 3.5", 35's, procal, etc

And I can assure you that spinlock is correct. As far ESC goes it only applys selective bracking individuals wheels. There is no electrically control mechanism in the steering system capable of interfering with the steering system. The power steering pump is mechanically powered and the steering system is mechanically connected the steering box. For the steering to be impacted it would need to be steer by wire or have a braking system somewhere in the steering system, does not exist.


ESC exist on many vehicles including my Vette. ESC can not over come physics though. If the slide is big enough you are going to go around. Driving with ESC though is a different skill than driving without and means over coming skills learned without the system.

Unlike conventional skills, counter steering in a slide with ESC you want to continue to hold the turn. The reason for this ESC uses the steering posistion sensor to determine what you want to do. If you counter steer and then ESC kicks in you will most likely end up end up going a direction you did not intend to go.

Like anything else it takes practice and understanding to live with ESC. If you are wheeling or playing in the snow by all means disable it. But for normal driving or driving in wet conditions if you understand it, it works very well. In fact it works so well that when I race the Vette in wet conditions I keep it on.
01-29-2014 09:13 AM
COStrider
Quote:
Originally Posted by spinlock View Post
OP, ESC in no way limits your steering ability. It actually works by reading your steering inputs and the Jeeps motion to keep you out of trouble. The only way it controls "steering" the Jeep is through selected inputs to brakes on the individual wheels as described above. Make sure you understand what it does because it there for your safety, including to avoid rolling over while doing donuts in the snow.
You are wrong. My steering wheel has an effect where you can't turn it at all over the same crazy bump on a bridge expansion joint. It locks up. It happens regularly at that spot but rarely anywhere else. All the parameters are set accordingly for gears and tire size with a procal. It feels like the power steering goes out for a second or two. NOT A GOOD FEELING. And it's happened since I had a completely new front suspension (all synergy: trac bar, tie rod, drag link, ball joints, trac bar and steering sector shaft brace) and a fresh alignment on a brand new alignment rack.

I can assure you the power steering wheel system IS affected by ESP or ESC or whatever electronic bs is in place.

2012, 6 speed, AEV 3.5", 35's, procal, etc
01-28-2014 06:57 PM
spinlock OP, ESC in no way limits your steering ability. It actually works by reading your steering inputs and the Jeeps motion to keep you out of trouble. The only way it controls "steering" the Jeep is through selected inputs to brakes on the individual wheels as described above.

Make sure you understand what it does because it there for your safety, including to avoid rolling over while doing donuts in the snow.
01-28-2014 05:52 PM
Sueby Sweet! Thanks for testing it out & updating. I only want it for off road so I'm not worried about no cruise or anything like that - I just want the nannies 100% off off road.
01-28-2014 04:20 PM
Cash_097 No cruise control, but it's hard to cruse on bad roads. Main thing is I have control of the jeep again. About 7 miles from work with no problems so far.
01-28-2014 09:06 AM
mckey73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash_097 View Post
The hill decent light flashes a few times then goes out. The abs & traction light stay on. 2012 JKS.
So you can drive it to work like that with no issues?
01-28-2014 05:58 AM
Cash_097 The hill decent light flashes a few times then goes out. The abs & traction light stay on. 2012 JKS.

Attachment 709977
01-27-2014 11:00 PM
Sueby
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash_097 View Post
Mine is an automatic. Didn't seem to slow it down any, but I only use it when playing in the snow. I tried the 7 second trick but no luck. Maybe I didn't do something correct.
So you installed the bypass switch on your auto & it works - like flip the switch & all the lights on the dash light up and everything & no nannies kick in? No abs, no hill descent, no nothing?? That would be awesome.
01-27-2014 10:53 PM
Sueby
Quote:
Originally Posted by mckey73 View Post
Holding it down for seven seconds will disable all but three of the parameters monitored by the esc system. To completely disable it you have to disable the accelerometer like the link above describes. Those same 3 things are still active in 4 lo, so it's not totally disabled in this situation either. This should have no effect on your transmission, it won't put it in limp mode. The esc system on these vehicles is horrible, especially if you are on anything other than dry pavement.
No offense, but how do you know that? Are you just guessing or have you seen it done? I did a ton of reading after my Jeep freaked out one day climbing a big ass rock in 4L & almost killed me (ok, maybe a slight exaggeration!) & all I could find was it works great on a stick but not on an auto.

Numerous threads like this one all over the place: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f96/e...ation-1431350/

http://www.jkfreaks.com/forums/archi...hp/t-7749.html
01-27-2014 08:39 PM
mckey73
Quote:
Originally Posted by relyt View Post

Just to clarify, this is not correct. The steering is a 100% mechanical connection from the steering wheel to the wheels themselves. The ESC works by firing the brakes at individual wheels in an attempt to stop a slide. It is an uncomfortable feeling, but it is actually very effective. That said, if you're trying to drift around parking lots or do donuts, you'll want to turn the system off by holding the traction control button for 7 seconds. The system should remain off until the ignition is cycled, and will need to be disabled again if desired.
Holding it down for seven seconds will disable all but three of the parameters monitored by the esc system. To completely disable it you have to disable the accelerometer like the link above describes. Those same 3 things are still active in 4 lo, so it's not totally disabled in this situation either.

This should have no effect on your transmission, it won't put it in limp mode. The esc system on these vehicles is horrible, especially if you are on anything other than dry pavement.
01-27-2014 07:51 PM
2trackin I have a 2014. I can turn it off in 4hi by holding the button down for several seconds but only when at a stop. You cannot disable it while moving. Once disabled you may proceed to drive with traction control and stability control disabled. I used it this way other this past weekend while wheeling seasonal roads with over three foot of snow.
4lo it is automatically disabled.
01-27-2014 07:43 PM
Cash_097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sueby View Post
Any of you guys that have done the bypass switch on the newer Jeeps (12+) have an automatic? I want to do this but from all I've read on an auto it will put the jeep in limp mode but it works fine on a stick.
Mine is an automatic. Didn't seem to slow it down any, but I only use it when playing in the snow. I tried the 7 second trick but no luck. Maybe I didn't do something correct.
01-27-2014 03:53 PM
relyt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash_097 View Post
It disables your steering wheel intermittently when trying to do a doughnut in the snow.
Just to clarify, this is not correct. The steering is a 100% mechanical connection from the steering wheel to the wheels themselves. The ESC works by firing the brakes at individual wheels in an attempt to stop a slide. It is an uncomfortable feeling, but it is actually very effective. That said, if you're trying to drift around parking lots or do donuts, you'll want to turn the system off by holding the traction control button for 7 seconds. The system should remain off until the ignition is cycled, and will need to be disabled again if desired.
01-27-2014 01:52 PM
Sueby Any of you guys that have done the bypass switch on the newer Jeeps (12+) have an automatic? I want to do this but from all I've read on an auto it will put the jeep in limp mode but it works fine on a stick.
01-26-2014 08:49 PM
mckey73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash_097 View Post
Mines a 2012. Not sure on a 2014.
I know 13's are just the same, not sure if anything changed for '14 or not. I guess you could pull the center console and cut the appropriate wire to see if it works. If it doesn't just splice it back together.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash_097 View Post
Abs & traction control light stay on.
Bypass switch (one I installed) open or on - allows the driver to have control of the jeep, like the earlier models 97 etc.
Switch in the closed or off position returns it back to factory - no lights laminated. Haven't tried it in 4L.
It works the same in 4L. Once you flip the switch you installed it won't go back to normal until you flip the switch again and cycle the ignition.
01-26-2014 08:42 PM
Cash_097 Abs & traction control light stay on.
Bypass switch (one I installed) open or on - allows the driver to have control of the jeep, like the earlier models 97 etc.
Switch in the closed or off position returns it back to factory - no lights laminated. Haven't tried it in 4L.
01-26-2014 02:11 PM
Xena1 After you turned it off, does the "off" light stay on? What happens when you push the "off" button, and lastly, does it come on in 4L?
01-25-2014 03:58 PM
Cash_097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xena1 View Post
Does this work with 2014's too? Thanks!
Mines a 2012. Not sure on a 2014.
01-25-2014 07:19 AM
Xena1
Quote:
Originally Posted by getoffmyleg View Post
Does this work with 2014's too? Thanks!
01-25-2014 06:52 AM
Cash_097 Just tried the bypass switch setup and it works great! Thanks for everyone's help.
01-24-2014 12:33 AM
mckey73 You will never be able to completely shut it off.

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/ab...res-87119.html
01-24-2014 12:29 AM
getoffmyleg Check out this post.

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/ma...le-155357.html
01-23-2014 10:55 PM
TerryC6 Stability control and roll mitigation function by applying brakes to individual wheels to correct the slide or roll.
01-23-2014 09:05 PM
Cash_097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott2373 View Post
Cuts your steering ability? That's a new one...how does that work, exactly?
It disables your steering wheel intermittently when trying to do a doughnut in the snow.
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