Jeep Wrangler Forum

Jeep Wrangler Forum (http://www.wranglerforum.com/)
-   JK General Discussion Forum (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/)
-   -   Another 2011 or 2012..... (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/another-2011-or-2012-a-105234.html)

jrmcgill25 08-01-2011 08:26 AM

Another 2011 or 2012.....
 
Ok guys I know you're probably getting tired of hearing this but I can't find answers in the other forums. Seems like all of them get off subject. Anyways I just sold my YJ and am looking at a JKU. My question is should I jump on a 2011 and take advantage of the low prices/incentives or should I wait on the 2012 for the new drivetrain? Is it really worth the wait and more $ to get the 2012 or would I be better off getting a 2011 for a lower price and upgrading it myself? Also if it helps I'm looking at a Sport S or a Sahara if the price is right. Rubicon is not an option. Help!! Thanks

RaiderRUBICON 08-01-2011 08:42 AM

Buy a 2011, cause the price will be right.You can always jump to a 2012 later on, if you choose.

AJ:)

KSCRUDE 08-01-2011 08:53 AM

I own a 2 door 11 sahara, and they are so underpowered that if I was you there is no way in hel I would buy a 3.8 jku. Go for the 12 and you will be grateful forever, as everybody I know with a 3.8 jku is not very pleased with the power. I love my 2 door, and would like to drive a 12 just for fun, but I really don't want to mod another jeep right now, so I will keep it and maybe get me a 12 RAPTER and just have both to play with. I can drive a different vehicle every day for 2 weeks and still not run out, so I will get by with the wranger I have now. It is one of the more fun vehicles I have to drive!

jrmcgill25 08-01-2011 09:00 AM

I know basically everyone with a JKU says they're under powered but if I bought a 2011 vs a 2012 I'd have more money to play with for mods so I guess that's where my dilemma comes in. Go ahead and buy the latest and greatest and not worry about upgrades, or buy a 2011 and boost the performance a little bit?

CG3 08-01-2011 09:02 AM

Have you driven an '11? I have a 4 door... I love it. I drive up Big Cottonwood Canyon from Salt Lake City to go home if I go to town. (Think mountains). No problem. Parley's to Park City is a bit tough, I turn up the stereo, and just go. I test drove these conditions before I bought.
Drive it. If you like it - get employee pricing or better, and buy it. If not, wait.
:wavey:

jrmcgill25 08-01-2011 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CG3 (Post 1427912)
Have you driven an '11? I have a 4 door... I love it. I drive up Big Cottonwood Canyon from Salt Lake City to go home if I go to town. (Think mountains). No problem. Parley's to Park City is a bit tough, I turn up the stereo, and just go. I test drove these conditions before I bought.
Drive it. If you like it - get employee pricing or better, and buy it. If not, wait.
:wavey:


Are you running stock set up or have you added a lift/tires etc?

jrmcgill25 08-01-2011 09:06 AM

Any idea what I should be able to get this one for? Just a ballpark. I have a TL so even if I couldn't get employee pricing what would the invoice be?

http://www.jeep.com/hostc/getWindowS...BA3H19BL570563

MTH 08-01-2011 09:10 AM

If you get a 2011, I'd recommend getting the manual transmission. This helps a lot with power. Plus, the 2012s come with the same manual transmission, so the only improvement really is the engine.

If you get an auto transmission, I'd expect it'll feel underpowered. However, if you've got about $1200 or so for a regearing aftermarket, you can change that. So to me, I'd add $1200 onto the cost of every auto trans 2011 I saw.

That may make it not such a good deal compared to the 2012s. The 2012s are not only getting the new engine, but also getting a new auto transmission.

Candidly, if I was in the market now I'd wait to test drive both.

CG3 08-01-2011 09:18 AM

Only mods to date: Garvin Wilderness Rack built and installed. Only need about 1-2" more on the ground clearance. Will get that with shocks/coils, then tires when needed or more $ saved up.

At this point in time, with the new jeeps on the horizon, you should be able to get employee pricing or better.

Ballpark price? 28nchange. Your mileage may vary... just a guess. Don't buy when you first go. Leave. Make yourself leave. And be sure you find a place with lots of jeeps (particularly wranglers) on the lot.

If you can't get a price you are VERY happy with... wait.
If you don't like the power... wait.

Meanwhile, I'm driving mine and :wavey:
:dance:

JIMBOX 08-01-2011 09:22 AM

:whistling: Nothing wrong with wanting the NEW ONE, but


Quote:

Originally Posted by KSCRUDE (Post 1427892)
I own a 2 door 11 sahara, and they are so underpowered that if I was you there is no way in hel I would buy a 3.8 jku. Go for the 12 and you will be grateful forever, as everybody I know with a 3.8 jku is not very pleased with the power. I love my 2 door, and would like to drive a 12 just for fun, but I really don't want to mod another jeep right now, so I will keep it and maybe get me a 12 RAPTER and just have both to play with. I can drive a different vehicle every day for 2 weeks and still not run out, so I will get by with the wranger I have now. It is one of the more fun vehicles I have to drive!

Evidentally you don't read any of the forums--they are only underpowered FROM THE FACTORY-simple mods make them pure pleasure-3.8L, great little motor--


Quote:

Originally Posted by jrmcgill25 (Post 1427908)
I know basically everyone with a JKU says they're under powered but if I bought a 2011 vs a 2012 I'd have more money to play with for mods so I guess that's where my dilemma comes in. Go ahead and buy the latest and greatest and not worry about upgrades, or buy a 2011 and boost the performance a little bit?

Maybe only your friends with JKUs say "underpowered"--WRONG -they're great-

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTH (Post 1427923)
If you get a 2011, I'd recommend getting the manual transmission. This helps a lot with power. Plus, the 2012s come with the same manual transmission, so the only improvement really is the engine.

New JK/JKU with manual, be the KING of your block !

If you get an auto transmission, I'd expect it'll feel underpowered. However, if you've got about $1200 or so for a regearing aftermarket, you can change that. So to me, I'd add $1200 onto the cost of every auto trans 2011 I saw.

That may make it not such a good deal compared to the 2012s. The 2012s are not only getting the new engine, but also getting a new auto transmission.

Candidly, if I was in the market now I'd wait to test drive both.

Me too, gotta try that new 5spd auto-and hope for tranny cooling changes !!

Smokemifyougotem

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

jrmcgill25 08-01-2011 09:36 AM

I'm all for waiting on the 12's but are they going to be offering the 0% financing on the 12's or is that just for the leftover 11's?

MTH 08-01-2011 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrmcgill25 (Post 1428006)
I'm all for waiting on the 12's but are they going to be offering the 0% financing on the 12's or is that just for the leftover 11's?

Doubtful.

The incentives shift every few months. The 2011s weren't up for zero percent when they came out, it's only now that the 2012s are starting to hit the lots that zero percent is available for 2011s. I'd expect the 2012s won't be up for zero percent when they first arrive, and, if they sell well, they might not be elligible for it (if at all) until after the 2013s show up.

fjrrider 08-01-2011 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrmcgill25 (Post 1427918)
Any idea what I should be able to get this one for? Just a ballpark. I have a TL so even if I couldn't get employee pricing what would the invoice be?

http://www.jeep.com/hostc/getWindowS...BA3H19BL570563

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/201...ad-101089.html
Look at the 1st post. It has pricing for each model MSRP (Invoice). You can build your own, figure out what the MSRP and invoice would be. When you see what the invoice price is, deduct 1% and that's your TL pricing.

mudpup 08-01-2011 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTH (Post 1427923)
If you get a 2011, I'd recommend getting the manual transmission. This helps a lot with power. Plus, the 2012s come with the same manual transmission, so the only improvement really is the engine.

+ 1

My thoughts exactly. Plenty of power for me. I'm just waiting for the 12s to finally arrive so I can see the DIF in person in a test drive. Beyond that just hope everyone gets their orders filled soon so we can all move on :thumb:

rics1997 08-01-2011 10:30 AM

I think as long as you don't get a JKU with 3.21 gears a 2011 is just fine, especially a manual. But I do think the Unlimited version will see the most benefits to the new engine as long as you still don't get the 3.21. Not sure what Chrysler every thought when they said lets put 3.21 gears in a 4500lb JKU. Don't care what engine or transmission it has.

Mr. Drummond 08-01-2011 10:51 AM

Is 5% under invoice plus the 0% for 60 unreasonable? Can i do better with the 2012's coming?

I have driven the 2010s quite a bit, and for my style of driving, the power is fine. If i can save a few thousand and get the special financing, i will be happy.

Thoughts?

10to10 08-01-2011 11:11 AM

I picked up a 2011 JKU Rubicon a few months back. I've read all the good and the bad about the motor, transmission, etc...If you can find a good deal for a 2011..Go for it! I have no regrets not waiting for the 2012. Find yourself a good deal on a 2011 and start with some mods...you will save cash over buying a new 2012.

I have an Auto, and its really not that bad at all. I think the 2012 auto 5 speed transmission would be nice but I can live with a 4 speed. And the new 3.6 Pen motor is also a minivan motor, and aint all the great - wont perform miracles and don't think Jesus will endorse said motor as some have claimed. Supercharger or Hemi for real power..otherwise its just another v6..don't get yourself worked up about the 3.8 vs 3.6..in a few months I think you will hear the 3.6 aint the savior motor the Wrangler was needing...Bring on a Good Diesel.

Anyhow, best of luck to you...and you will love the 2011 interior!

kjeeper10 08-01-2011 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10to10
I picked up a 2011 JKU Rubicon a few months back. I've read all the good and the bad about the motor, transmission, etc...If you can find a good deal for a 2011..Go for it! I have no regrets not waiting for the 2012. Find yourself a good deal on a 2011 and start with some mods...you will save cash over buying a new 2012.

I have an Auto, and its really not that bad at all. I think the 2012 auto 5 speed transmission would be nice but I can live with a 4 speed. And the new 3.6 Pen motor is also a minivan motor, and aint all the great - wont perform miracles and don't think Jesus will endorse said motor as some have claimed. Supercharger or Hemi for real power..otherwise its just another v6..don't get yourself worked up about the 3.8 vs 3.6..in a few months I think you will hear the 3.6 aint the savior motor the Wrangler was needing...Bring on a Good Diesel.

Anyhow, best of luck to you...and you will love the 2011 interior!

This^^

Stallion289TX 08-01-2011 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrmcgill25 (Post 1427837)
Ok guys I know you're probably getting tired of hearing this but I can't find answers in the other forums. Seems like all of them get off subject. Anyways I just sold my YJ and am looking at a JKU. My question is should I jump on a 2011 and take advantage of the low prices/incentives or should I wait on the 2012 for the new drivetrain? Is it really worth the wait and more $ to get the 2012 or would I be better off getting a 2011 for a lower price and upgrading it myself? Also if it helps I'm looking at a Sport S or a Sahara if the price is right. Rubicon is not an option. Help!! Thanks

When I visited my dealership to place an order for 2012 Rubicon, the sales manager said “if you buy a 2011, I will make you a great offer.” I got excited and responded “what is the great offer” he responded “around $2K off invoice!.” I really thought that he was either joking or thinks that I'm stupid! My response was “I would only go for a 2011 model if you offer $8K below invoice PERIOD.”

I would wait for the 2012 because the incentives dealers are making you believe to be great are actually a joke.

MTH 08-01-2011 11:31 AM

I'd be pretty surprised if the auto transmission isn't a big improvement.

I haven't been following the details, but I understand the gear ratio calculations show that 3.73s with the new transmission will be like 4.88s with the old one. FWIW, whenever anybody comes on here complaining about the power of their auto transmission, my go-to advice has been to regear their diffs to 4.88 or 5.13. Everyone who does that seems very happy.

So, if the 2012 changes mean that it comes from the factory with that kind of pull, I'd expect it'll feel like a big improvement. Then on top of that add some extra hp, even if it's not all available at normal RPMs. Then add the extra torque, which is available at normal RPMs.

For an auto, I'd wait and make sure I got to test drive both. Just my two cents.

JIMBOX 08-01-2011 11:39 AM

:whistling: You may remember that one of my FEW comments on this 2012 "Dream Jeep" was wait for some reaction from people with BIGGER tires and reaction at hiwy speeds--WITH AUTO/O/D-- can't wait to hearit !!

If it still downshifts with 33/34/35" tires-then you're buying it just because you want a new JEEP !!

Right ??

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

Piper54 08-01-2011 11:50 AM

Find an an 11 you want and deal, deal, deal! If the salesman says I'll be right back, tell him you are going to leave and go to another dealer. I've got a 2 dr but I believe the guys with the JKU's when they say they are not underpowered, a jeep just isn't built for speed. I love my Jeep and I'm keeping it. :whistling:

Piper

jrmcgill25 08-01-2011 12:22 PM

Thanks everybody for the replies. I'm leaning towards the 11 because of the cheaper price, financing, and I don't really need major power its going to be more of a daily driver for me than off-road. Also if I decide I need more power I can always regear/intake/exhaust mod. The 12 still sounds good because of the new motor and tranny but I'm just not sure I can pass up a good deal on the 11 if I get the right price.

Chasin Tail 08-01-2011 03:42 PM

you are so close to seeing a whole lot of 2012's delivered to the dealerships and also to all of us that have jeeps on order..

Why not wait another week or 2 before making a decision. Once we all get ours, Im sure there are going to be TONS of reviews on them.. A bunch of forum members should have them within the next week or two.

Then, you can see if they are all they are cracked up to be.. or go on a test drive on both an 11' and a 12' off the same lot and make your own judgement..

I can tell you this..
The wife and I spent last week in Vegas. We Rented a 2010 JKU Auto/3.73's in it. It had 38,000 miles on it.. If the new motor is not a LOT more powerfull than that one.... Im going to back out of my order. It was gutless, and couldnt even stay in 4th gear on the highway half of the time on our way to see Lake Mead and the Dam. It was constantly bogging down, then downshifting just to hold 60 mph. Thats running the puny 16' stock wheels/tires..

We were NOT impressed at all with the power on that JKU.. So for me.. Its an 2012 or nothing.

MTH 08-01-2011 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chasin Tail (Post 1429059)
I can tell you this..
The wife and I spent last week in Vegas. We Rented a 2010 JKU Auto/3.73's in it. It had 38,000 miles on it.. If the new motor is not a LOT more powerfull than that one.... Im going to back out of my order. It was gutless, and couldnt even stay in 4th gear on the highway half of the time on our way to see Lake Mead and the Dam.. Thats running the puny 16' stock wheels/tires..

We were NOT impressed at all with the power on that JKU.. So for me.. Its an 2012 or nothing.

Again, it's been said before (in this thread), but just to be clear: That's really a gearing issue. Look at the gearing chart that's floating around here for the 3.8 autos and you'll see that 3.73 is in the "barely competent" range. Regear the diffs in that same Jeep to 4.88s or 5.13s, and I expect you would've been pleased. The combination of the new engine and the new auto trans effectively accomplishes this, plus a little more. So it should be just fine.

SlackerMD 08-01-2011 03:52 PM

I've had the 2012 for about 3 days now. The power in the 6-speed is noticeably increased from the 3.8l, however not super-significant--at least with the 6-speed. The power and drive-ability in the 2012 auto is, however, SIGNIFICANTLY improved over the 3.8l stock. If you want an auto tranny and do not want to mod it, you will be happier with the 2012. If you want a manual tranny, you'll gain a lighter, slightly more powerful and a "greener" engine (BUT FOR THE LIFE OF ME I CANNOT FIND ANY GREEN ON IT!) with he 3.6l, but i am not sure if those differences are worth the ~$2k cost difference right now with the rebates available on the 2011's.

2012'S are hitting local dealerships now, so you should hold off and drive both and compare for yourself.

Chasin Tail 08-01-2011 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTH (Post 1429074)
Again, it's been said before (in this thread), but just to be clear: That's really a gearing issue. Look at the gearing chart that's floating around here for the 3.8 autos and you'll see that 3.73 is in the "barely competent" range. Regear the diffs in that same Jeep to 4.88s or 5.13s, and I expect you would've been pleased. The combination of the new engine and the new auto trans effectively accomplishes this, plus a little more. So it should be just fine.

Yes its a gearing issue.. But he's asking about stock vs stock..

So, he could buy a 2011 and save $2000 +/-... then spend $1500 to re-gear.

OR

Buy a 2012 and hopefully NOT have to re-gear for decent performance.

Out of pocket difference +/- $500.

But you'd end up losing money with a 2011 at some point on resale value vs a 2012..

Hence why I ordered a 2012, and am standing by waiting to actually drive one, to see if that chart that has been floating around is actually as it seems...

As of yet we only have 2 maybe 3 people that are on these forums that have driven a 2012.. neither were Auto's... So the Jury is still out..
One of the reviews of the 2012 was that it was more powerful, but not earth shattering...

So, again... At this point in the game, I would wait another couple of weeks and drive both and make a decision then.. There isnt any reason to go make an impulse buy this soon before they hit the dealerships if you dont already have one ordered..

We loved everything about the jeep we rented in Vegas, except the lacking power.. So with the new Auto/5speed and 3.73's and in a JK, Im pretty sure it will be what we are looking for in improved performance.

But until We actually drive it... Reading some hypothetical numbers on a chart on the internet is just... hypothetical:)

rvcruzer 08-03-2011 09:03 AM

We just traded our 2005 TJ Unlimited on a 2012 Rubicon Unlimited. Scheduled to ship August 9th so it's soon, but not here yet. We test drove a GC with the Pentastar V6 and then a 2011 Sport Unlimited with the 3.8 V6 and did find a noticeable difference. Both were automatics but the 2011 was a 4 speed while the 2012s get the 5 speed, which will help.

The 2011s do have rebates or financing incentives and it's easier to get more knocked off the sticker than on a 2012 but it's future resale value will also be less so most of what you pay extra now you'll get back later and it's not that big of a bite.

My ideas was to get the basic engine drivetrain where I want it. Jeeps get modified but I didn't want to have to rebuild what I have - only add to it. At this time I have the Rockhard bumpers and skid plates and Warn Powerplant ready to go on it but will wait for a lift kit and larger tires later on when funds allow. I also have to set it up for flat towing behind a motorhome so lighting, air brakes, and towbar connections are also an initial concern.

Compared to the 3.8 V6, the 3.6 liter engine comes alive quite well with an extra 80 HP. That HP does come in at peak RPM though so you won't see that much of an improvement at lower revs, but it is still there. I also think that the 5 speed automatic is going to add considerably to driveability compared to the 4 speed automatic. 6 speed manual owners probably won't notice as much because they'll have better control over their revs.

Comac90 08-03-2011 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrmcgill25 (Post 1428006)
I'm all for waiting on the 12's but are they going to be offering the 0% financing on the 12's or is that just for the leftover 11's?

IMHO - NO WAY. Seriously, the last time Jeep offered 0% financing on Wranglers was 1997 (or was it '96?). Demand is beginning to out pace supply; Wrangler sales worldwide are up and Jeep is looking at options to expand capacity. There's no reason (now or foreseeable) to give 0% on anything but the 2011s.

Expect 0% on 2011s until they're gone and then again in 2025. :D


T

MTH 08-03-2011 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comac90 (Post 1434931)
IMHO - NO WAY. Seriously, the last time Jeep offered 0% financing on Wranglers was 1997 (or was it '96?). Demand is beginning to out pace supply; Wrangler sales worldwide are up and Jeep is looking at options to expand capacity. There's no reason (now or foreseeable) to give 0% on anything but the 2011s.

Expect 0% on 2011s until they're gone and then again in 2025. :D

I agree they won't offer 0% on the 2012s when they arrive, but just FYI--I got 0% on my 2010.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:30 PM.