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-   -   Avoiding "Hot Oil" on the Beach (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/avoiding-hot-oil-on-the-beach-110188.html)

irideducs 08-30-2011 02:21 PM

Avoiding "Hot Oil" on the Beach
 
I am new to the Wrangler and all of the threads about auto tranny overheating and the need for auxillary coolers had me concerned about taking my stock 2010 JKU on the Cape Cod dunes / beach this summer. I did a couple of short trips last year with no "Hot Oil" message, but didn't know how hot I was running.

This year, I installed an Aeroforce Interceptor scan gauge and watched the readings. I went out on 6 consecutive days and conditions ranged from packed to 10" deep soft sand -- flat on the beach, but some up and downs to get there. Speeds between 5 and 15 mph, outside temp between 75 and 85 degrees.

I followed the park service guidline of airing down to 11 psi and did the first day in 4 Hi (suggested by the rangers) with traction control fully off (by holding the button until the ding and message appeared on the dash). I started in Drive with overdrive deactivated.

Within 15 minutes, transmission temps rose from about 150 degrees to over 205 degrees. Since I was generally driving slowly, I tried manually shifting to 1 and 2 (watching the revs) and temps continued to climb. We stopped and played on the beach before things heated up enough to give me a warning, but it seems only to be a matter of time.

I drove the same route out in 4Lo, in Drive w/ overdrive deactivated and temps never exceed 165 degrees. Same results on subsequent days on different beach drives.

Maybe this is old news to most of you, but the user's manual gave me no hints that auto Wranglers don't like to be driven slowly in 4Hi. It only describes the upper speed limits of each selection and suggests that you use only what is necessary - 2wd - 4Hi - 4Lo - to get the job done, and I had no problem getting through the sand in 4Hi.

I no longer think I need a tranny cooler for my purposes and wondered how many others might be in the same boat.

On a slightly different topic -- I got the Staun tire deflators and a Viair 300p portable compressor for this trip and they were perfect for my needs (those who offroad more often may want more powerful stuff).

JIMBOX 08-30-2011 02:42 PM

:whistling: welllll, Getting and installing an aux cooler, is CHEAP insurance for all driving situations in your JKU--

Since you have the ECU generated "hot oil" warning---you'll be warned before your tranny goes into "disability retirement"

Not getting an aux cooler, is like, not taking the wrapper off your hamburger, before you eatit--you can doit, but you'll suffer later !!

Get an aux cooler --well under $100 bucks and NO MORE PROBLEMS !!

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

rcase13 08-30-2011 02:52 PM

As soon as you hit that deep sand the engine/transmission is under a huge load almost like towing. In those situations past vehicles have said to keep the revs up. Not red line high but high enough to get the fluids moving through the transmission to cool it down. If the revs are low and the transmission is running slow it can't move the fluid through the engine/transmission fast enough to keep it cool. If raising the revs doesn't do the trick then the only option is as JIMBOX said and spring for a cooler. Or just spring for the tow package. Doesn't that add a transmission cooler?

JIMBOX 08-30-2011 03:02 PM

:D I'm afraid that the jeep auto cooler (warmer) in 2001 thru 2011 is TOTALLY INADEQUATE--

Thats why Chrysler came out wit recall j30-to reflash the ECU for the "hot oil" warning, if you had it done, and


Quote:

Originally Posted by rcase13 (Post 1523579)
As soon as you hit that deep sand the engine/transmission is under a huge load almost like towing. In those situations past vehicles have said to keep the revs up. Not red line high but high enough to get the fluids moving through the transmission to cool it down. If the revs are low and the transmission is running slow it can't move the fluid through the engine/transmission fast enough to keep it cool. If raising the revs doesn't do the trick then the only option is as JIMBOX said and spring for a cooler. Or just spring for the tow package. Doesn't that add a transmission cooler?

Higher rpm does help the tranny-thats right, but anytime you get the "hot oil" warning, you've only got a few minutes before the engine will go into "limp mode" and who knows where you might be -AT THAT MOMENT--

The tow pkg had nothing to do with the cooler and it's still in the A/C condenser--NOT THE RADIATOR--

I've noticed that the new 2012 jeeps, certain models are coming with a seperate FLUID cooler in front of the condenser--but it's too late for the 07 thru11 Listen up !!

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

irideducs 08-30-2011 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JIMBOX (Post 1523542)
:whistling: welllll, Getting and installing an aux cooler, is CHEAP insurance for all driving situations in your JKU--

Since you have the ECU generated "hot oil" warning---you'll be warned before your tranny goes into "disability retirement"

Not getting an aux cooler, is like, not taking the wrapper off your hamburger, before you eatit--you can doit, but you'll suffer later !!

Get an aux cooler --well under $100 bucks and NO MORE PROBLEMS !!

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

No doubt. Did not mean to suggest that the JKU auto transmissions are adequately cooled for what the Jeep should be expected to handle - only that the user has some control over how bad the situation becomes. I haven't seen my temp exceed 180 on the street so far this summer, but I don't live in a particularly hot climate or do a lot of mountain driving / towing.

redsoxx1918 08-30-2011 04:58 PM

Well, it seems that, from irideducs' experiment, that even without the cooler, you should be ok if you use 4LO in the appropriate situation.

JIMBOX 08-30-2011 05:11 PM

:whistling: You guys remind me of a young Heroin/alcohol addict, who says "yea, I know what you're saying, but I'll just do this for a little while longer--Hell, I can quit anytime !!

It's your jeep--just do what you think is right for YOUR jeep !!

:rolleyes::rolleyes: JIMBO

rics1997 08-30-2011 05:32 PM

Cooler was one of the first mods I did and was one of the best investments IMO. Got a B&M 70264 Supercooler for automatic transmission off E-bay for around $70 including shipping.

irideducs 08-30-2011 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JIMBOX (Post 1524088)
:whistling: You guys remind me of a young Heroin/alcohol addict, who says "yea, I know what you're saying, but I'll just do this for a little while longer--Hell, I can quit anytime !!

It's your jeep--just do what you think is right for YOUR jeep !!

:rolleyes::rolleyes: JIMBO

To be clear Jimbox, I don't disagree that an aux cooler is cheap insurance - every Wrangler should come with one. You are 100% right. I was just struck by the dramatic difference in operating temps between 4Hi and 4Lo in a situation that did not seem to require 4Lo. Plenty of "experienced" people - Cape oversand rangers included - preach using 4Hi until you need 4Lo, but is that really good advice if you are off road and under 20 MPH, with or without a cooler?

JIMBOX 08-30-2011 06:35 PM

:D Yea, I wasn't pickin on you, but the use of 4lo with the JK/JKU autos has been lauded for almost 4 years now and



Quote:

Originally Posted by irideducs (Post 1524241)
To be clear Jimbox, I don't disagree that an aux cooler is cheap insurance - every Wrangler should come with one. You are 100% right. I was just struck by the dramatic difference in operating temps between 4Hi and 4Lo in a situation that did not seem to require 4Lo. Plenty of "experienced" people - Cape oversand rangers included - preach using 4Hi until you need 4Lo, but is that really good advice if you are off road and under 20 MPH, with or without a cooler?

That operation, with the locked torque converter and HIGHER RPM allows the cooling system to operate at a better percentage,but

Especially in sand/dunes/hills--4Lo is just, way to slow, a tire speed and 4Hi almost HASTOBE used--hence the push for the aux cooler-

Now with my Rubi/regeared I'm able to use 4Hi in 90%of the cases, where before I HAD to use 4LO, which with a Rubi can be tough in rpm control !!

The trouble with NON-JK owners is they have always used 4Hi in sand/beach and NEVER had trouble---well, you just can't do that in a JK/JKU auto(stock)--it's just hard to realize---unless you have driven one--for a while-

Keepyerpowderdry

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

joe002 08-30-2011 10:56 PM

irideducs - that for the reading using your ProCal. Iíve driven in the desert when it was well over 100, and climbed mountains up in Colorado, and havenít seen the ďdingĒ or seen the ďHot OilĒ light. When Iím wheeling Iím in 4 Low, if Iím on a dirt road Iím in 4 High or 2 High. It looks like 4 Low keeps your transmission cool compared to 4 High.

I considered getting a transmission cooler, but my Dealer who in writing said my lift would not affect my warrantee was so-so about a transmission cooler. I figured if I ever got the message (or ding) I would bring it over and see if they changed their mind, but I havenít seen it yet. Without the ProCal I didnít know how close Iíve come, but from your results it looks like thereís a pretty good margin. Thanks again for the information.

3JKs1H1 08-30-2011 11:02 PM

Altutude plays a part in this as well. If you're wheeling in Colorado, where many trails are at 9000-13,000', because the air is thinner, you have less air moving through your intake, effectively overfueling. This is especially common on turbocharged vehicles. So the slower engine rpm leads to low boost and overfueling, leading to high egts. You might feel power in Hi, but at 1700 rpms, you're lugging the motor and both it and the tranny get real hot. Drop into 4L, run the rpms up 500 rpm to 2200 and EGT's can drop a few hundred degrees, tranny temp might drop 30 or 40 degrees - plenty to matter. An EGT probe and a trans temp gauge make you a more aware driver. I'm adding one or both sometime this fall.

Abdul-Hakeem 01-08-2012 12:32 AM

I live in one of Earth's hottest countries and drive in the desert all the time, usually with at least 3 people in the car (but one is small) and a lot of water and camping/safety equipment. I use 4 high on packed sand that's not really steep, 4 low on all soft sand and on anything steep. I have never, ever had the hot oil light go on. I was going to buy a transmission cooler, but have changed my mind. My Jeep is a 2011 JK Sport with a soft top and 2 doors, and is stock except the steering wheel cover. :)

joe002 01-08-2012 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abdul-Hakeem (Post 1899446)
I live in one of Earth's hottest countries and drive in the desert all the time, usually with at least 3 people in the car (but one is small) and a lot of water and camping/safety equipment. I use 4 high on packed sand that's not really steep, 4 low on all soft sand and on anything steep. I have never, ever had the hot oil light go on. I was going to buy a transmission cooler, but have changed my mind. My Jeep is a 2011 JK Sport with a soft top and 2 doors, and is stock except the steering wheel cover. :)

I thought export Jeeps already have an external cooler - at least I saw pics of some in Egypt that came with them stock...

Bobilicious 03-01-2012 11:03 AM

In Qatar, and no tranny cooler. In 4h in desert, give it 20 minutes, and you will enjoy the hot oil warning. Dealer is installing the molar aux tranny cooler as bespeak, hopefully that will fix the issue!

fawsty 03-01-2012 09:08 PM

I recently went this battle with the dealership and chrysler. I won, and they put/installed and paid for a tranny cooler on my 2011 JKU sport. All it took was a few phone calls and a trip to the dealership to do the install. Jeep knows about this issue, but does not want to do a recall, as only about 10 percent of the owners will ever use their Jeep in such a way that it become an issue to them. They are playing the odds....

I simply reminded them that a cooler would be considerably less that a new transmission for them to put in...

Steven

CapnRich22 03-26-2012 09:08 AM

Steven, i went campin this last weekend and finally got my "HOT OIL" warning.. i've been in the desert at 110+ and never got it, and it was only 75-80 this weekend.. but I was in 2hi for about 40miles going around 15-20mph steep grades. What did you say when you called, who did you call? I sent a message when I got home sunday to my dealer/service... waiting response

nickmimi 03-26-2012 11:43 AM

I am also waiting for a decision from Jeep about installing a HD cooler. Should hear something this week.

CapnRich22 03-26-2012 11:59 AM

Definitely post up here with what you get, If I don't hear back from the dealer today, I will be calling and bugging them until I do, but would be good to have a " well so and so dealer did it" as a back up to further push them to do it

JIMBOX 03-26-2012 12:27 PM

-Why don't you just doit youirself??

Less than $100 bucks and you can drive your JK anywhere !

-JIMBO

CapnRich22 03-26-2012 01:08 PM

i plan(ned) on doing it myself but free is free... if i don't get an answer back I will be doing it myself very soon

nickmimi 04-06-2012 09:04 PM

Jeep approved the upgrade on them. Was installed by dealer yesterday. Only had to make 1 call, placed complaint. Customer service called me back. He rambled on stating that the vehicle is built for street use mostly and that the upgrade wouldn't be covered. I told him I have never seen a jeep commercial with a wrangler on the street. I asked to speak to a supervisor and was told they would call me back. Supervisor called and left a message stating they were looking into it and would let me know. Next call I received was from dealership letting me know it was approved and they were ordering parts for install.

mzanferrari 01-05-2014 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobilicious (Post 2091075)
In Qatar, and no tranny cooler. In 4h in desert, give it 20 minutes, and you will enjoy the hot oil warning. Dealer is installing the molar aux tranny cooler as bespeak, hopefully that will fix the issue!

Hello Bobilicious,
i live in Qatar too and had the oil alarm few times while driving off road (mostly sand).
Did you get your extra cooler installed?
Which dealer and which cooler did you use?
Did you purchase the cooler from the dealer?

Thank you a lot!
Cheers,
Marco

doufus1 01-05-2014 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abdul-Hakeem (Post 1899446)
I live in one of Earth's hottest countries and drive in the desert all the time, usually with at least 3 people in the car (but one is small) and a lot of water and camping/safety equipment. I use 4 high on packed sand that's not really steep, 4 low on all soft sand and on anything steep. I have never, ever had the hot oil light go on. I was going to buy a transmission cooler, but have changed my mind. My Jeep is a 2011 JK Sport with a soft top and 2 doors, and is stock except the steering wheel cover. :)

Dead wright. Use the jeep for what it is meant to be used for and you will not have an issue. I can go up and down a beach with nothing but soft sand and hills. Keep it in 4lo and not an issue. And yes the outside temp is high. Some days around 105f. Jeep still runs fine.

Even the op stated this. When he drove in 4lo the temp was fine. 4hi was just to much strain on the jeep. No need for the extra cooler.

TreyJK 01-08-2014 08:38 PM

So does an after market cooler void warranty? I thought I read someone's post that it possibly could but I didn't see any definitive answers.


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