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-   -   New 2012 JK gouges and deep scratches on chassis (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/new-2012-jk-gouges-and-deep-scratches-on-chassis-126973.html)

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 12:17 AM

New 2012 JK gouges and deep scratches on chassis
 
I finally got my new Rubi home yesterday, so the first thing I did was inspect everything I could including the underside. What I noticed was this:

1. Black paint on axles seemed to be really poor quality. The black paint on the outside of the frame rails appeared to be of better quality and very smooth in texture and more dull in luster whereas the paint on the axle housings and tubes appeared to be very grainy and shiny and in fact I noticed that there appeared to be overspray on the inside portion of the the rims. This overspray isnt visible on the outer side of the rim but it makes me wonder if they are spraying the axles with paint while the rims are on?

2. Axle tubes front and rear near the shock mounting brackets appear to have gouges that encircle about half of the tube and penetrates through the black paint leaving bare metal. These gouges are approximately .25" in width. Additionally there appear to be some "dings" through the black paint randomly on the edges of the inner-C's.

3. Frame rails have 4 equally placed "wear marks" that at least have scuffed up the black frame paint visibly and at best penetrate through the paint. In addition, the body seems to have 4 of these "wear marks" also equally spaced and approximately located at the front and back of the door sills on either side.

4. Various other random scratches e.g. on the underside of the muffler, fuel tank skidplate, brake line mounting brackets, sticker partially pulled off and ripped from rear shock.

5. Noticed a couple small aluminum particles/shavings on the drivers side carpet when I was installing my huskyliner floormats. Not sure if its just a piece of metal flashing that came off a casting or what.

I realize that this area of the vehicle is not held to the same quality standards as the visible exterior areas, but it still goes to show the quality and care the workers use when putting these things together (I'm now a believer in the drunken monkey theory). It seems to me that these parts are being handled very roughly and just thrown on the vehicle without even attempting to preserve the finishes. In addition, not only is it not a disappointing testimony to craftsmanship these days but the lack of paint on these parts is just going to allow rust to set in faster.

First thing I thought when I saw the gouges on the axles was that something happened to the vehicle in shipment, however, I went down to a dealership to buy an oil filter (not the same dealership I bought the Jeep from) and they had 3 2012's sitting out front so my curiosity got to me. I crawled under each of the three (1 rubicon, 1 X, and 1 sahara) and all exhibited the gouging on the axle tubes to some degree and in fact one there was much worse. In addition these other jeeps appeared to have the poor quality axle paint and overspray on the inside of the rims.

It seems to me that the presence of these marks is possibly due to mechanically assisted lifting devices used to maneuver the parts around during the assembly process but I'm not sure.

Has anyone else noticed any of these defects on their JK?

Bappy56 12-11-2011 12:28 AM

Ouch!
 
It sounds like someone got ahead of themselves!:nonono: We have an 09' JK in better shape than that and we got it used!!! Well best of luck, but jeeps, they're tough.:)

Bappy,

"When the going gets tough, the tough gets Jeeps."

BillyPete 12-11-2011 12:36 AM

Good thing we arent buying pianos here. Most peeps dont dive under their new jeeps to check out the tiedown marks. I will check out my new 2012 on monday when it comes in.

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 02:11 AM

In addition I should add 2 other weird quirks I noticed:

1. If the clutch pedal (6 speed manual transmission) is depressed fully to the floor very firmly (most noticable when transmission is in neutral) you can start to hear what sounds like a faster pitch louder whizzing or whirring sound that goes away if you slightly release the clutch pedal. Should this be anything to worry about? I should note that I am used to the gear clash sounds that the NV3550 5spd made in my TJ while in neutral but this is different in that it really only seems to happen when the clutch pedal is fully firmly depressed.

2. I have the normal heater (not temperature control one) and I notice that when I turn it on it sounds like the fan will just blast and then you can hear the flappers inside the ducts moving or something and redirecting the air and then it seems to become quieter. When I switch settings you can hear the flappers moving inside the dash but it seems like it takes longer than I would expect to reset itself if that makes any sense. Is this a common complaint?

Just a heads up for anyone thinking about break-in procedures....I just gave her the first oil change at 100mi, and as suspected multiple aluminum particles captured in the filter element along with discoloration and metal flakes seen in the oil. In fact the first 20 or so miles are going to produce the most debris as the mating surfaces of moving parts in the engine bed together, so its best to change it early and often during break-in.

Thanks,
Shawn

blackforestgreen 12-11-2011 02:36 AM

well shawn, seems you are not happy with the height of the jk, the delivery of the jk, the quality of the jk, a used hummer may have been a better vehicle for you.

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 02:38 AM

@ billy - I actually requested that my dealer leave the jeep just as it came off the truck and not to remove and stickers or plastic or otherwise detail the vehicle and because of that I got a bunch of documents that would have probably been thrown out otherwise.

One of those documents is the "vehicle shipping order" and it lists specific vehicle handling instructions on it as follows:

-Vehicle can be secured with 4 chains using R-hooks in the oval slots in the frame or
-Vehicle can be secured with four tire straps that secure in front and behind the tire.
-Do not mix chains and straps on the same vehicle.

As I mentioned, the major gouges were on the axle tubes not on the underside of the frame rails where the chaindown slots are, so based on this I really don't think these are "tiedown" marks because the transportation company is not allowed to secure the vehicle by the axles. Plus this doesn't explain the numerous other blemishes noted.

Thanks,
Shawn

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 02:40 AM

@blackforest - what kind of response is that? I'm trying to see if any of these things I am noticing are common complaints and gauge on how many other forum members are seeing this stuff and whether its really an issue to be concerned with or not...Obviously after paying $30K and waiting 1.5 months, I would rather have an unscratched jeep whose clutch doesnt make a weird whirring sound but trust me I am in no way complaining yet.

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyPete (Post 1817572)
Good thing we arent buying pianos here. Most peeps dont dive under their new jeeps to check out the tiedown marks. I will check out my new 2012 on monday when it comes in.

Why wouldn't I dive under there? Thats where all the good stuff is :)

Dgdds91 12-11-2011 05:44 AM

I totally agree with you! When you pay this kind of money for a brand new vehicle, it should be delivered in perfect shape! These comments from supposedly die hard jeepers are ridiculous. You wouldn't take delivery of a scratched and dented Porsche, BMW etc. you would be paying a whole lot more for? I don't care if it is a jeep, it should not be scratched, dented, leaking, making all kinds of noises, etc! Just my opinion.

kjeeper10 12-11-2011 06:04 AM

Don't think the underside matters, does it?
I mean in 2 months there will be service rust anyhow.
Same as a NEW vehicle that sat on the lot for a while. Or what if it was test drove?
I mean I know it was ordered but that stuff is normal. People don't request LOT vehicles diffs to be repainted before sale.

The clutches on these are very noisy I've noticed. I would not be concerned about that but keep an ear out of creaks/squeaks
under load. There were/are TSB's on earlier JK's with clutch problems.

Bout all I got.

Congrats-- take it off road, put some real scratches on it :thumb:

Ken

mikekeeper 12-11-2011 11:46 AM

Take a look under most vehicles and you are bound to see many of these 'issues'. Assembly of these components aren't done by hand so there is bound to be scuffs, marks, etc. If you want pristine then pay $500,000 for a hand built car.

And changing the oil at 100 miles? Why not at 5 miles and every 5 miles after that? If the engine mating particles were that big of an issue the manufacturer would chnage the oil at 100 miles for free because it would reduce their warranty costs for damaged engines. I've had 27 new cars and never changed the oil before the recomemnded period and never had a single engine problem.

kbwwolf 12-11-2011 11:59 AM

No Jeep should ever leave the lot without being fully inspected by the buyer BEFORE the deal is done.

I spent almost 2 hours going over mine before I met the finance officer and officially took delivery. Not only did I crawl under it, but I used a mirror to see into places I wouldn't otherwise have been able to see into. I checked all the fluids, the lights, the media center and EVIC, tire pressure, all the welds and seams that I could see, the carpets, seats, jack & stand, the soft top...it was exhaustive.

And all of it was done with the 600 page hard copy of the manual in hand.

To date I've had zero complaints.

EDIT: And, yes, there were some scratches on the undercarriage. Not worth bitching about, IMHO.

daggo66 12-11-2011 01:24 PM

Next week should be interesting when the drive shaft starts to show signs of rust. :popcorn:

kik 12-11-2011 03:51 PM

Didn't have any of those issues with my 10 Rubi. However, there are non-painted metal parts under there like daggo said which develop a bit of a patina. Don't like the sound of the clutch issue. I never had that either. Something to watch. Maybe the heater mechanism is re-designed because I've never noticed that. Good luck with your new Rubi. Wait untill you get a few thousand on it. Hopefully, you'll still be satisfied. Actually, I think for the most part the quality is pretty good. And, about the BMW thing; had an 03 M3 from new and the quality basically sucked. So much for paying about twice the amount of a JK. However, I'm sure there are alot that didn't. I guess if the stars don't line up when it's built **it happens.

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daggo66 (Post 1818514)
Next week should be interesting when the drive shaft starts to show signs of rust. :popcorn:

Already got that covered literally......with silicone spray :)

kjeeper10 12-11-2011 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRubi2012

Already got that covered literally......with silicone spray :)

Let me know if you want to sell in a few years :p

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjeeper10 (Post 1817779)
Don't think the underside matters, does it?
I mean in 2 months there will be service rust anyhow.
Same as a NEW vehicle that sat on the lot for a while. Or what if it was test drove?
I mean I know it was ordered but that stuff is normal. People don't request LOT vehicles diffs to be repainted before sale.

The clutches on these are very noisy I've noticed. I would not be concerned about that but keep an ear out of creaks/squeaks
under load. There were/are TSB's on earlier JK's with clutch problems.

Bout all I got.

Congrats-- take it off road, put some real scratches on it :thumb:

Ken

The most concerning thing about the paint is the overspray on the inside of the rims and the weird texture/color of the paint on the axles. Is it possible that they botched my paint job and ran it back through with the assembled rolling chassis?

The 2012 has a new clutch from previous years, but it really sounds to me like the throwout bearing is shot.

Plus the other thing I should note is that I have used 1/2 tank fuel in 100 miles of driving. I havent refilled yet to calculate the mileage, but its obvious that its going to be around 11mpg which is rediculously low. Even though im still breaking the engine in I should only be around 3-4 mpg less than my targeted mpg which means I can probably expect 15mpg when all is said and done. I didn't buy it for mileage but that would be very dissappointing as I was able to get 20mpg out of my TJ with the 4.0.

Factoring this all together I am starting to think I got a lemon....further bring to light the fact that my build sheet states that my vehicle was in PR4 at 6:19pm on 11/23. 2nd shift the day before thanksgiving. Additionally, the build sheet states: Quality Policy, To be the premier manufacturing company in the world. That seems like a pretty lofty goal considering what I am seeing.

Do you think I would have any luck in trying to bring it back and get a different Jeep?

kjeeper10 12-11-2011 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRubi2012

The most concerning thing about the paint is the overspray on the inside of the rims and the weird texture/color of the paint on the axles. Is it possible that they botched my paint job and ran it back through with the assembled rolling chassis?

The 2012 has a new clutch from previous years, but it really sounds to me like the throwout bearing is shot.

Plus the other thing I should note is that I have used 1/2 tank fuel in 100 miles of driving. I havent refilled yet to calculate the mileage, but its obvious that its going to be around 11mpg which is rediculously low. Even though im still breaking the engine in I should only be around 3-4 mpg less than my targeted mpg which means I can probably expect 15mpg when all is said and done. I didn't buy it for mileage but that would be very dissappointing as I was able to get 20mpg out of my TJ with the 4.0.

Factoring this all together I am starting to think I got a lemon....further bring to light the fact that my build sheet states that my vehicle was in PR4 at 6:19pm on 11/23. 2nd shift the day before thanksgiving.

Do you think I would have any luck in trying to bring it back and get a different Jeep?

New clutch? First I heard of that. I believe they are the same 07-12
There has been post of 12's having clutch issues.

This is a jeep. $35,000 is really not a lot
$75,000 BMW yup.... I want it perfect.
These wranglers are sprayed all together. Take a look under the sport bar padding.
Or under the hinges, they are Unpainted.

Lemon? Check your state lemon laws but good luck unless it is safety related. Work with your dealer if something really bothers you.

You mileage will get better but don't expect 20+ unless your driving all highway. The Jk rubicon especially the 4 door is heavier than a sport/Sahara. 4.10's in the axles (unless optioned with 3:73)
17 seems the norm.

It's a jeep brother, it's not going to be perfect. Love it, drive it, and it should
Last a very long time.

chucky cheese 12-11-2011 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjeeper10 (Post 1818920)
New clutch? First I heard of that. I believe they are the same 07-12
There has been post of 12's having clutch issues.

This is a jeep. $35,000 is really not a lot
$75,000 BMW yup.... I want it perfect.
These wranglers are sprayed all together. Take a look under the sport bar padding.
Or under the hinges, they are Unpainted.

Lemon? Check your state lemon laws but good luck unless it is safety related. Work with your dealer if something really bothers you.

You mileage will get better but don't expect 20+ unless your driving all highway. The Jk rubicon especially the 4 door is heavier than a sport/Sahara. 4.10's in the axles (unless optioned with 3:73)
17 seems the norm.

It's a jeep brother, it's not going to be perfect. Love it, drive it, and it should
Last a very long time.

I agree 35000.00 is not alot when it comes to a vehicle. I do not think you have the degree of problems that would even come close to a return. Drive it and you will find it drives like a 35000.00 vehicle and if you have a problem use the warranty.

joe002 12-11-2011 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRubi2012 (Post 1818886)
...Do you think I would have any luck in trying to bring it back and get a different Jeep?

I think you need to return it and get something else.

daggo66 12-11-2011 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRubi2012 (Post 1818886)
The 2012 has a new clutch from previous years, but it really sounds to me like the throwout bearing is shot.

I know it always seems like I'm busting your chops, but I'm really curious as to where you've been getting your information because almost all of it has been wrong. The 2012 has the same manual transmission that all of the JK's have been using and in fact the last year or two of the TJ used it as well.

Now, yes techinically the clutch is different because it's a different engine, but it's the same design so there shouldn't really be a difference. It's a hydraulic clutch, but it will have a different part number.

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 05:38 PM

5 Attachment(s)
Here are photos of some of the damaged areas. Picture quality isnt the best, but it gets the point across.

Attachment 82640

Attachment 82641

Attachment 82642

Attachment 82643

Attachment 82645

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daggo66 (Post 1819000)
I know it always seems like I'm busting your chops, but I'm really curious as to where you've been getting your information because almost all of it has been wrong. The 2012 has the same manual transmission that all of the JK's have been using and in fact the last year or two of the TJ used it as well.

Now, yes techinically the clutch is different because it's a different engine, but it's the same design so there shouldn't really be a difference. It's a hydraulic clutch, but it will have a different part number.

Bust away because I didn't say anything about the transmission which I know is the same NSG370 used since 2005. I haven't noticed any transmission problems yet, just the squealing sound from the clutch.

kjeeper10 12-11-2011 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRubi2012

Bust away because I didn't say anything about the transmission which I know is the same NSG370 used since 2005. I haven't noticed any transmission problems yet, just the squealing sound from the clutch.

Google Project JK clutch TSB
There for earlier JK's but the clutch is unchanged. One is for the clutch disc and other TOB.

kjeeper10 12-11-2011 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRubi2012
Here are photos of some of the damaged areas. Picture quality isnt the best, but it gets the point across.

My question- is that actually paint or a coating material that disappears anyhow
over time?

wanderlust 12-11-2011 05:55 PM

Looked at the bottom of my jeep today, holy cow! Looks like someone bashed the crap out of it on rocks! Oh wait, I forgot, I went jeepin.

kbwwolf 12-11-2011 05:56 PM

I had trouble getting a small piece of gravel outta my tire treads the other day. Passenger side front, which is the worst!

And yet, the next day I gazed upon my Jeep, and thought...:flowers:

RedRubi2012 12-11-2011 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjeeper10 (Post 1819095)
Google Project JK clutch TSB
There for earlier JK's but the clutch is unchanged. One is for the clutch disc and other TOB.

I have already seen those TSB's but my condition is opposite. When the pedal is pressed in it starts to make the squealing noise and when it is released slightly it stops.

mcrascal 12-11-2011 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjeeper10 (Post 1819095)
Google Project JK clutch TSB
There for earlier JK's but the clutch is unchanged. One is for the clutch disc and other TOB.


The 2012 sales brochure states "The standard 6 speed manual transmission gets redressed with new clutch housing and assembly and a new flywheel."

Is that difference irrelevant?

kjeeper10 12-11-2011 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedRubi2012

I have already seen those TSB's but my condition is opposite. When the pedal is pressed in it starts to make the squealing noise and when it is released slightly it stops.

Released slightly? Isn't that "riding the clutch" so to speak :D

You have a warranty though. Have it looked at.


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