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-   -   To shift or not to shift.... (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/to-shift-or-not-to-shift-145383.html)

Raziel 03-09-2012 11:40 PM

To shift or not to shift....
 
Tonight I had a bit of a weird shift. Started the beastie up & went to shift into reverse. As I was moving it down into reverse, I hear and feel it grind & bang right into reverse. No idea why... Foot was all the way down for the clutch. Shifted back out & back into it & it was all good.

Besides that, I've had a few times or so that when I was trying to shift into any gear it wouldn't let me. So if I was trying to go in third, I would have to shift in 2nd or 4th (or any other) first & then I could get into 3rd.

Anyone had this problem? What was the problem for you?

jk'n 03-10-2012 12:02 AM

Mine is a 2008 and I've had it since August of 2008. I've had all manner of shifting quarks but I would not call any of them out of the ordinary. My jeep shifts more like a truck than a sports car. I'm guessing that this has a lot to do with the idea that it is a lot more heavy duty than a sports car transmission. The synchros are a little more stiff so sometimes.....especially when I first got it, I would miss shifting all the way and I would grind it a bit. That rarely happens now. Especially when it is cold, it might slip a few teeth by as I go into the next gear but that usually goes away as it warms up. Sometimes I have trouble shifting into reverse but I just shift it into another gear and then back to reverse and it goes in just fine. Occasionally it won't go into a gear but I think that has to do with a perfectly timed two gears coming together tooth to tooth and backing it off and trying it again usually gets it into gear. This doesn't happen very often. My transmission is still solid after 60,000 plus miles. If anything, I would say that it seems easier to shift as it has aged.

kbwwolf 03-10-2012 12:24 AM

I've had a couple instances where it was difficult to get into reverse. But, like jk'n said, I just backed off and went at it again, and it worked fine.

Never had any grinding or clunking. In some of my other vehicles at times, but not yet in my Wrangler.

SilverSport 03-10-2012 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kbwwolf (Post 2123831)
I've had a couple instances where it was difficult to get into reverse. But, like jk'n said, I just backed off and went at it again, and it worked fine.

Never had any grinding or clunking. In some of my other vehicles at times, but not yet in my Wrangler.

Same here.

Zarkstrife 03-10-2012 01:32 AM

Sometimes in my 12 Sahara It wont let me shift to first from Neutral, as other posters have said just back off and try again. What I really dislike about the 6 speed is that I cant downshift from 3rd to 2nd unless the vehicle is below 20mph, makes engine braking clunky. I cant even downshift into first unless the vehicle is not moving. Guess its some sort of safety system so you cant downshift into the wrong gear. Just Annoying, anyone else notice this?

FreezerJeep 03-10-2012 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarkstrife
Sometimes in my 12 Sahara It wont let me shift to first from Neutral, as other posters have said just back off and try again. What I really dislike about the 6 speed is that I cant downshift from 3rd to 2nd unless the vehicle is below 20mph, makes engine braking clunky. I cant even downshift into first unless the vehicle is not moving. Guess its some sort of safety system so you cant downshift into the wrong gear. Just Annoying, anyone else notice this?

Ya just so you don't drop to say 1st when you meant 3rd as that would be really hard on the tranny.

Celtic 03-10-2012 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreezerJeep (Post 2124084)
Ya just so you don't drop to say 1st when you meant 3rd as that would be really hard on the tranny.

When downshifting, double clutch and blip the throttle to bring the revs up. It should slide in if you sync everything correctly. Mine does. Be prepared for some pretty intense engine braking though.

If the shifter does not easily slide into the next lower gear, the trans is basically saying that you are moving too fast to be in that gear on a downshift.

Gate53 03-10-2012 03:02 AM

I used to use engine braking a lot on the road (I'm a truck driver I shift plenty) till someone asked me what's cheaper to replace a few brake pads or a clutch? I just bother to engine brake offroad now. lol

mgola27 03-10-2012 10:04 AM

I can get smooth shifts, but it takes some work. It definitely doesn't want to be thrown around like a sports car, though.

As far as getting into reverse, we used to grind a lot, but once I read about shifting into first and then reverse, it's been as smooth as can be. It didn't take long to learn the technique either, so I don't even think about it now.

SilverSport 03-10-2012 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarkstrife (Post 2124012)
Sometimes in my 12 Sahara It wont let me shift to first from Neutral, as other posters have said just back off and try again. What I really dislike about the 6 speed is that I cant downshift from 3rd to 2nd unless the vehicle is below 20mph, makes engine braking clunky. I cant even downshift into first unless the vehicle is not moving. Guess its some sort of safety system so you cant downshift into the wrong gear. Just Annoying, anyone else notice this?

I can usually coax the shifter into first once my speed has dropped to about 1-2 mph.

mgola27 03-10-2012 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gate53
I used to use engine braking a lot on the road (I'm a truck driver I shift plenty) till someone asked me what's cheaper to replace a few brake pads or a clutch? I just bother to engine brake offroad now. lol

In my younger days, I used engine braking a lot of the time, but my brother mentioned the same thing about changing brakes vs. changing a clutch or tranny.

Although, it just doesn't seem right to simply drop it into neutral and coast/brake to a stop.

Now, I downshift, but not for engine braking. I simply ensure I'm in the right gear as I'm slowing. That way, if the light changes or I need to maneuver in any way, I'm already in the correct gear to start accelerating again.

If I were in neutral, I'd have to guess which gear to be in to get going again.

Yella 03-10-2012 10:23 AM

I've had a couple of instances where the foot and the hand were out of sync with each other and grind the gears pretty good.
It's kinda funny. The hand flies off the shift knob and yells at the foot, "THAT WAS YOUR FAULT".
In the mean time I'm looking around to see who heard that...:whistling:

FreezerJeep 03-10-2012 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celtic

When downshifting, double clutch and blip the throttle to bring the revs up. It should slide in if you sync everything correctly. Mine does. Be prepared for some pretty intense engine braking though.

If the shifter does not easily slide into the next lower gear, the trans is basically saying that you are moving too fast to be in that gear on a downshift.

Hmmmm interesting.

Also a good point gate53. It would be cheaper to replace pads (and easier!) than a clutch.

Bryce

Casotakar1229 03-10-2012 10:41 AM

lol..I accidentally downshifted way too low and got some serious engine breaking I had to immediately put into neutral or I thought I was going to flip end over end (not that bad, but at the time it was pretty fast breaking). Not sure mine has the built in mechanism for preventing me to shift into any gear I want at any speed? hmmm, maybe I haven't driven enough to figure out.

SilverSport 03-10-2012 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgola27 (Post 2124629)
Now, I downshift, but not for engine braking. I simply ensure I'm in the right gear as I'm slowing. That way, if the light changes or I need to maneuver in any way, I'm already in the correct gear to start accelerating again.

I practice the same thing.

Yella 03-10-2012 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRubi (Post 2124743)
I practice the same thing.

Me too.
I try to be prepared to accelerate at all times but you gotta watch out for those cabooses that try to make the light on the other side.

jk'n 03-10-2012 06:50 PM

From the days of no synchro in first gear, I don't shift into first unless I'm stopped. If barely moving, I use a little clutch as if I were starting off in first but I'm in second. I downshift into 2nd as high as about 35 to do engine braking. Doing that doesn't wear on the clutch unless you slip it a lot. When I downshift, I'm off of the clutch as quickly as possible and still have it be smooth. I even goose the gas a little as I come off of the clutch to ease the transition and be off of the clutch pedal. I have driven standards like this for over 30 years and usually get at least 125,000 out of a clutch and have gone as long as 175,000. Usually what happens is that there is some other reason for the engine to be down like changing the fly wheel due to starter issues engaging with it and while they did that, I had them replace the clutch saving some of the labor.

kik 03-10-2012 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRubi (Post 2124743)
I practice the same thing.

Same here.

SilverSport 03-10-2012 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jk'n (Post 2125897)
From the days of no synchro in first gear,......

Ah the good old days :punk:. My first vehicle was a pickup, had 4 speed manual and 1st gear was very low ratio, what we referred to as 'granny gear'. No synchro so had to be stopped to engage 1st.

With my JK, I find that when moving 2 mph or less, if I attempt to shift into 1st and hold slight pressure, when the speed hits the sweet spot, it slips right in.

Raziel 03-12-2012 09:12 AM

I've notice this too for 2nd & 1st. And like others said, some safety issue for it. But, if I'm cruising at a very low speed, like coming up to a light or stop sign to make a right turn. I usually try to be in about 2-3 gear. I did manage to drift mi babi once cause I was in 3rd on a turn with a bit of speed still. That was interesting... But on other hands, the reverse issue was that one night only so far. And like I said, foot was all the way on clutch & never let it go. It grind/bang into it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarkstrife (Post 2124012)
Sometimes in my 12 Sahara It wont let me shift to first from Neutral, as other posters have said just back off and try again. What I really dislike about the 6 speed is that I cant downshift from 3rd to 2nd unless the vehicle is below 20mph, makes engine braking clunky. I cant even downshift into first unless the vehicle is not moving. Guess its some sort of safety system so you cant downshift into the wrong gear. Just Annoying, anyone else notice this?




Yea, I rather change brakes than a clutch. I use engine braking every once & awhile. I try not to do that though. It may help with slowing down and all, but I'll try not to do it often.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgola27 (Post 2124629)
In my younger days, I used engine braking a lot of the time, but my brother mentioned the same thing about changing brakes vs. changing a clutch or tranny.

Although, it just doesn't seem right to simply drop it into neutral and coast/brake to a stop.

Now, I downshift, but not for engine braking. I simply ensure I'm in the right gear as I'm slowing. That way, if the light changes or I need to maneuver in any way, I'm already in the correct gear to start accelerating again.

If I were in neutral, I'd have to guess which gear to be in to get going again.




:facepalm::rofl: Right with you on this :hide:. It's like Spy Vs Spy with the hand and foot :banghead:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yella (Post 2124672)
I've had a couple of instances where the foot and the hand were out of sync with each other and grind the gears pretty good.
It's kinda funny. The hand flies off the shift knob and yells at the foot, "THAT WAS YOUR FAULT".
In the mean time I'm looking around to see who heard that...:whistling:


mjf232 03-12-2012 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kik (Post 2125925)
Same here.

x4

blw2000 03-12-2012 10:59 AM

Mine is always a bit hard to get into reverse unless I first shift it into first gear. I thought this was normal (my old VW was like this, too!)

Raziel 03-12-2012 04:37 PM

VW IS THE MOTHER LOAD OF ALL CRAP ASS VEHICLES!!!! Not like I have an issue with german blood belching twat waffle vehicles... THEY ALL SHOULD BURN!!!!

SilverSport 03-12-2012 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raziel (Post 2132145)
VW IS THE MOTHER LOAD OF ALL CRAP ASS VEHICLES!!!! Not like I have an issue with german blood belching twat waffle vehicles... THEY ALL SHOULD BURN!!!!

Don't sugarcoat it, tell us how you really feel about VWs. :rofl:

Raziel 03-13-2012 08:33 AM

Ok! If you insist! :D:thumb:

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRubi (Post 2133818)
Don't sugarcoat it, tell us how you really feel about VWs. :rofl:


jk'n 03-17-2012 09:46 AM

After putting 60+K on the odometer, the problems getting it into gear have become less. I don't know if I'm getting used to the quirks or if the transmission is just wearing in nicely. I rarely have difficulty getting it into any gear. There is a knack to shifting a heavy duty transmission into gear and the synchros are able to help that happen. I would try some various ways with pressure. For me, I put it right up against the gear and it falls right in. Sometimes when it is cold I might feel a couple of teeth slip by once in a while. I'm not forceful but I am firm with it. I don't slam it from gear to gear quickly. More like click out of gear...............click into gear. Just a small pause in between. When down shifting into second at a good clip (35-40) I hold it hard left and use a fair amount of pressure. It always goes in. Then I'm off of the clutch as soon as possible. I don't spend a lot of time slipping it.....that is what will prematurely wear it out. Most of the time if in sixth, I downshift 4 then 2. Usually by the time I get to 2 I'm 30 or below mph.


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