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-   -   Rubicon vs. Sport suspension??? (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/rubicon-vs-sport-suspension-147664.html)

Smihty 03-20-2012 03:50 PM

Rubicon vs. Sport suspension???
 
What exactly is the difference if any between the Rubicon and Sport suspensions in a 2 DR?

MTH 03-20-2012 03:57 PM

Better shocks.

The coils may be stiffer or not, but this varies Jeep-to-Jeep rather than based on trim level.

ESP 03-20-2012 04:02 PM

^ Yep and what he really means about the coils is it depends on what monkeys are working on the assembly line the day your jeep was put together

Smihty 03-20-2012 04:05 PM

I am interested in swapping mine (sport) out for someones leftovers (Rubicon). Is there a spring chart out there that can guide me in the right direction? I want to a stiffer set.

Also, If anyone reads this that has a set available, let me know.

MTH 03-20-2012 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smihty (Post 2161360)
I am interested in swapping mine (sport) out for someones leftovers (Rubicon). Is there a spring chart out there that can guide me in the right direction? I want to a stiffer set.

Also, If anyone reads this that has a set available, let me know.

There's no chart. It varies Jeep-to-Jeep. You actually need to get under the Jeep and look at your coils.

The closer the last two numbers (not letters) are to 19 in the front and 60 in the rear, the stiffer the springs. So if you go from 14/54 to 19/60, you could end up with an inch or more of lift. If you go from 17/59 to 19/60, you might get a little lift but it'll hardly be noticeable.

Smihty 03-20-2012 05:09 PM

Looks like I've got 14/55's. Definitely gonna go hunting for a new set. I'm holding out for a year (hopefully) on the lift/35's til next year. This will help til then.

Thanks for the help and if you hear of someone with rubi shocks/springs let me know

JIMBOX 03-20-2012 05:24 PM

:whistling: The front sway bars are different too--can't swapem !

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

Smihty 03-20-2012 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JIMBOX
:whistling: The front sway bars are different too--can't swapem !

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

Could you elaborate on that. Do I need rubi front sway bars too for the shocks? What can't I swap?

rics1997 03-20-2012 06:19 PM

New ones form mopar are not that expensive. I would just get a 19/60 from them. You will find it hard to get a 19/60 off any Jeep. 18/59's are common but not really a Rubicon thing but more an Unlimited thing. the 4dr tends to have stiffer springs over a 2dr. I helped someone with a Rubicon awhile back to find out what he had and his 2dr Rubi had 15/55's. So don't assume a Rubi has better spring takeoffs. Shocks are better though.


Saying that, no matter what Chrysler has a blind monkey pick coils off the shelf during production

JIMBOX 03-20-2012 06:20 PM

:whistling: Rubi has a-E-SWAYBAR disconnect ($2000 bucks)-


Quote:

Originally Posted by Smihty (Post 2161768)
Could you elaborate on that. Do I need rubi front sway bars too for the shocks? What can't I swap?

The actual front swaybar is two piece/w an electric disconnect motor/gear/box--

You don't needit /w shocks, the SAHARA sway bars are adequate and if you want disconnects, then aftermarket disco-links !

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

rics1997 03-20-2012 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smihty (Post 2161768)
Could you elaborate on that. Do I need rubi front sway bars too for the shocks? What can't I swap?

The front sway bar has a electronic disconnect that doesn't work on non rubicons. Saying that one company does make a manual box for the disco making it work on a non rubi.

You don't need the sway bar to switch out the shocks or coils but doubt the coils will be worth the change unless it's a unlimited Rubi your getting it from and even then it may not be the best out there

rics1997 03-20-2012 06:23 PM

Check out this thread. It has order information

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/con...wap-55849.html

Smihty 03-20-2012 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rics1997
Check out this thread. It has order information

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/con...wap-55849.html

Great info. Thanks rics. I think I'll save myself the time and effort and give mopar a call for the 19/60's. Is it worth it to get HD shocks while I'm at it or are the stock shocks adequate? I plan on loading her down pretty good with towing/cargo.

Crush2012 03-20-2012 06:44 PM

Would it be worth it to swap out Rubicon shocks into my Sport?

rics1997 03-20-2012 06:55 PM

if you get them cheap enough. Really though, go to the vendor section and look at the ZONE thread. The zone shocks are dirt cheap and though they may only last about 80% as long as better shocks they cost less then 1/2. Last I checked they were in the mid to upper $30 range per shock and a good upgrade for non rubi's. The only thing about RUbi take off is you don't know what they have gone through. Blistens are great shocks but will cost in the $80 range and Fox (better shocks) are $100 each.

Crush2012 03-20-2012 07:09 PM

I would be getting them off a brand new rubicon that had suspension upgrade the day it got delivered. Would also be getting the coils that are 19/60 where as mine are 14/56 for $150. Good deal?

Jurhip 03-20-2012 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crush2012 (Post 2161996)
I would be getting them off a brand new rubicon that had suspension upgrade the day it got delivered. Would also be getting the coils that are 19/60 where as mine are 14/56 for $150. Good deal?

Higher springs rates mean just that. It does not make them better. Many think that because these typically go on Rubicons that they must be better. This is untrue. If you plan on increasing the weight of your Jeep, using where you think bottoming out is likely, or like a stiffer ride higher rates are better.

IMHO, I would start with quality shocks, OEM or aftermarket. This is where you will see 75% of your "gains".

daggo66 03-20-2012 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crush2012 (Post 2161996)
I would be getting them off a brand new rubicon that had suspension upgrade the day it got delivered. Would also be getting the coils that are 19/60 where as mine are 14/56 for $150. Good deal?

He had 19/60's stock on his Rubicon?

Crush2012 03-21-2012 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daggo66 (Post 2163306)
He had 19/60's stock on his Rubicon?

That is what he tells me. Is is a 4 door, hard top with Max tow.

MTH 03-21-2012 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurhip (Post 2162430)
Higher springs rates mean just that. It does not make them better. Many think that because these typically go on Rubicons that they must be better. This is untrue. If you plan on increasing the weight of your Jeep, using where you think bottoming out is likely, or like a stiffer ride higher rates are better.

IMHO, I would start with quality shocks, OEM or aftermarket. This is where you will see 75% of your "gains".

Of course, this depends on how you define "better" or "gain."

No doubt that better shocks to go with whatever your current coils are will provide superior dampening, so they will be a "gain" presuming you don't like a bouncy ride. But you won't get any height. Higher rated coils will lift the jeep higher and provide a stiffer ride. Whether that's a "gain" (or an "upgrade" or "better"), is subjective.

Quote:

Originally Posted by daggo66 (Post 2163306)
He had 19/60's stock on his Rubicon?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crush2012 (Post 2164061)
That is what he tells me. Is is a 4 door, hard top with Max tow.

Very unusual.

JIMBOX 03-21-2012 09:58 AM

:whistling: Well, I don't know how unusual it might be-


Quote:

Originally Posted by MTH (Post 2164269)
Of course, this depends on how you define "better" or "gain."

No doubt that better shocks to go with whatever your current coils are will provide superior dampening, so they will be a "gain" presuming you don't like a bouncy ride. But you won't get any height. Higher rated coils will lift the jeep higher and provide a stiffer ride. Whether that's a "gain" (or an "upgrade" or "better"), is subjective.





Very unusual.

My Rubi came with 19s both sides-front and 60s both sides rear and she was made in Aug-'08--go figure !

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

MTH 03-21-2012 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JIMBOX (Post 2164332)
:whistling: Well, I don't know how unusual it might be-




My Rubi came with 19s both sides-front and 60s both sides rear and she was made in Aug-'08--go figure !

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

You and kjeeper (who has a 2007) are the only two I've heard of first hand. By contrast, I know a number of Rubi owners have chimed in to the various 19/60 coil threads and mentioned they don't have 19/60s on their Rubis. Anecdotal I know, but it all supports my DRUNK MONKEY theory!! :dance:

Jurhip 03-21-2012 02:08 PM

[QUOTE=MTH;2164269]Of course, this depends on how you define "better" or "gain."

No doubt that better shocks to go with whatever your current coils are will provide superior dampening, so they will be a "gain" presuming you don't like a bouncy ride. But you won't get any height. Higher rated coils will lift the jeep higher and provide a stiffer ride. Whether that's a "gain" (or an "upgrade" or "better"), is subjective.
QUOTE]


Though it seems Wrangler makes all their spring lengths the same, technically a higher spring rate does not mean a higher ride height. The two are independent of each other and dependent on the unloaded spring height & rate (load also, but lets assume that is the same for each spring)

That said, you will get a small increase in height since Jeep makes their springs this way.

When I said "gain" I meant that for the money, shocks provide more change than springs will in the ride quality/handling department. I guess that change can go in the good or bad direction.

MTH 03-21-2012 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurhip (Post 2165241)
Though it seems Wrangler makes all their spring lengths the same, technically a higher spring rate does not mean a higher ride height.

I wonder if we're using the term "spring rate" the same way?

When I say "spring rate," I mean the change that occurs from a part number standpoint--front coils are available from around 12 to 19, and rears are available from around 52 to 60. You might be using it from some sort of mechanical engineering viewpoint, where it's a function of load and length and so on.

Used the way I intend, higher "spring rate" absolutely lifts the jeep. This is especially true on 2 doors, which (obviously) weigh less and are generally equipped from the factory with "spring rates" at the lower end.

Taking an otherwise stock 2 door from 14/55 to 19/60 generates about 2" of lift. Indeed, stood side-by-side without any load, the 19/60s will by considerably taller.

So what I was driving at with my prior post was that whether somebody "gains" more out of higher numbered springs or superior shocks really depends on what's important to them: If they want greater height or greater ride comfort/handling.

JIMBOX 03-21-2012 02:31 PM

:whistling: No truer words were ever spake-


Quote:

Originally Posted by MTH (Post 2165275)
I wonder if we're using the term "spring rate" the same way?

When I say "spring rate," I mean the change that occurs from a part number standpoint--front coils are available from around 12 to 19, and rears are available from around 52 to 60. You might be using it from some sort of mechanical engineering viewpoint, where it's a function of load and length and so on.

Used the way I intend, higher "spring rate" absolutely lifts the jeep. This is especially true on 2 doors, which (obviously) weigh less and are generally equipped from the factory with "spring rates" at the lower end.

Taking an otherwise stock 2 door from 14/55 to 19/60 generates about 2" of lift. Indeed, stood side-by-side without any load, the 19/60s will by considerably taller.

So what I was driving at with my prior post was that whether somebody "gains" more out of higher numbered springs or superior shocks really depends on what's important to them: If they want greater height or greater ride comfort/handling.

A ""gain"--"Better" ride to a 19 yr or "wife" is gonna be judged by "ONE" thats an impossible description--

It's like a guy says--I wanna raise my jeep 4"/35" tires and keep the ride same as "STOCK"--

It's a jungle out there and there aren't simple answers !

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

daggo66 03-21-2012 02:45 PM

[QUOTE=Jurhip;2165241]
Quote:

Originally Posted by MTH (Post 2164269)
Of course, this depends on how you define "better" or "gain."

No doubt that better shocks to go with whatever your current coils are will provide superior dampening, so they will be a "gain" presuming you don't like a bouncy ride. But you won't get any height. Higher rated coils will lift the jeep higher and provide a stiffer ride. Whether that's a "gain" (or an "upgrade" or "better"), is subjective.
QUOTE]


Though it seems Wrangler makes all their spring lengths the same, technically a higher spring rate does not mean a higher ride height. The two are independent of each other and dependent on the unloaded spring height & rate (load also, but lets assume that is the same for each spring)

That said, you will get a small increase in height since Jeep makes their springs this way.

When I said "gain" I meant that for the money, shocks provide more change than springs will in the ride quality/handling department. I guess that change can go in the good or bad direction.

The lengths are not the same. When I removed my stock "14" coil and compared it side by side with the new "19" coil, the 19's were noticeably longer and thicker. I gained 2" when I installed mine.

Cyalume 03-21-2012 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daggo66 (Post 2165340)

The lengths are not the same. When I removed my stock "14" coil and compared it side by side with the new "19" coil, the 19's were noticeably longer and thicker. I gained 2" when I installed mine.

2" is quite a difference,. Wouldn't this change make the front end higher than the rear, if say you already had a leveling kit?

My Sport has 14/56, pretty happy with the ride currently.

daggo66 03-21-2012 02:52 PM

I would think so if you left the puck in. I have the 19's in front and 60's in the rear and my Jeep looks level to me.

http://i674.photobucket.com/albums/v...Picture001.jpg

Smihty 03-21-2012 02:57 PM

Wow guys... this has turned out to be a more insightful thread than I expected. From my standpoint, using my jeep as a weekend warrior towing vehicle, I need a stiffer suspension to handle the extra weight. I'm also riding pretty low on the stock suspension, so the extra 1" I'll get is a great alternative to spending the $$$ I'd have to do for an aftermarket lift (which I will get once I have the cash for tires/lift)

Ride quality is an afterthought. Its not Benz, its an off road, trail busting, rock crawling beast. Let them tires eat :D

JIMBOX 03-21-2012 03:04 PM

:whistling: Ride quality is purely independant , as I said earlier-


Quote:

Originally Posted by Smihty (Post 2165371)
Wow guys... this has turned out to be a more insightful thread than I expected. From my standpoint, using my jeep as a weekend warrior towing vehicle, I need a stiffer suspension to handle the extra weight. I'm also riding pretty low on the stock suspension, so the extra 1" I'll get is a great alternative to spending the $$$ I'd have to do for an aftermarket lift (which I will get once I have the cash for tires/lift)

Ride quality is an afterthought. Its not Benz, its an off road, trail busting, rock crawling beast. Let them tires eat :D

My Rubi weighs inexcess of 5200 lbs and with the 19/60 combo and RS9000XL shocks--in their stiffer setting and the ride is non-bouncing/non-leaning and "SOLID"/w abrupt speed bump action-

:dance::rofl: JIMBO !


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