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-   -   Winter tires? (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/winter-tires-163854.html)

JeepinNW 06-01-2012 05:09 AM

Winter tires?
 
I've been assuming that when I buy my Jeep I will have a set of summer tires/wheels and a set of winter tires/wheels.

I need proper winter tires (with the mountain/snowflake logo) for the winter. In the world of cars, you generally don't use your winter tires in the summer.

I now see that I might be thinking about this all wrong. The DuraTrac tires (which seem to be popular among Jeep owners?) are severe snow rated.
Wrangler DuraTrac | Goodyear Tires

Is anyone here (in areas where winter tires are needed in the winter) using two different sets or do you just choose a good tire that is also snow rated and use it all year round?

Perhaps it would be more useful/economical to do this:
- Buy the Jeep with the cheapest wheel/tire option. That's the 16" steel rims with the Wrangler ST tires. I would throw these on for long highway road trips.
- Buy a second set (15" rims with 33" DuraTrac?) for offroad/local/winter use. Realistically these would sit on the car most of the time.

kjeeper10 06-01-2012 05:52 AM

You answered your own question.

Duratrac baby. One of the best-most popular-all season tire, on this forum :thumb:

jppower 06-01-2012 08:04 AM

I take it those dura tracs won't fit on the stock wheels?

MTH 06-01-2012 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jppower
I take it those dura tracs won't fit on the stock wheels?

I'd expect they make them in sizes that'll fit the stock wheels. And if you add wheel spacers you should have multiple options.

Make sure you look at the costs though--it may be cheaper to buy 5 new 15" wheels, 5 tires for the 15" wheels, and then sell your old wheels/tires to recoup some costs than it would be to just buy 5 new tires for your current wheels.

jyp 06-01-2012 09:00 AM

Newb here, but i live where you *really* need winter tires (Montreal) on normal cars. The mud terrain tires that came with the rubi are technically legal for winter use until 2013, when "all-season" tires of any kind will be banned. Nonetheless, the previous owner had bought and used a set of winter tires and I'm glad he did.

What makes a winter tire is not so much the groove profile, but the rubber formulation. If a tire has the right hardness for summer temperatures, it will be too hard in cold temperatures. There's really no getting around that. If you live in the states somewhere where you never see -20celsius, you might be fine with soft mud type tires, but there's a reason they are being banned for winter use where the temperatures drop really low.

I say get winter tires and mud summer tires. In whatever order is easiest on the wallet. That will be safest and you'll save your mud tires (which being soft wear out fast) to make them last longer.

Have you thought of selling the tires you'll get with the jeep to recoup the cost of tires?

Last thing: my winter tires are road tires, not offroad tires. I didn't like that at first until i realised that i saved (yes saved... in winter) 3MPGs with them. If you don't plan on wheeling in the winter, consider that option.

KarlG 06-01-2012 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeepinNW (Post 2425023)
I need proper winter tires (with the mountain/snowflake logo) for the winter. In the world of cars, you generally don't use your winter tires in the summer.

I now see that I might be thinking about this all wrong. The DuraTrac tires (which seem to be popular among Jeep owners?) are severe snow rated.
Wrangler DuraTrac | Goodyear Tires

Is anyone here (in areas where winter tires are needed in the winter) using two different sets or do you just choose a good tire that is also snow rated and use it all year round?

Hard to beat the Duratracs. Works very good in winter, (We average 9ft a year), decent wet/dry road, decent all terrain off road. :thumb:

cfy 12-27-2013 08:11 AM

Winter Tire mk/md & size
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jyp (Post 2425369)
Newb here, but i live where you *really* need winter tires (Montreal) on normal cars. The mud terrain tires that came with the rubi are technically legal for winter use until 2013, when "all-season" tires of any kind will be banned. Nonetheless, the previous owner had bought and used a set of winter tires and I'm glad he did.

What makes a winter tire is not so much the groove profile, but the rubber formulation. If a tire has the right hardness for summer temperatures, it will be too hard in cold temperatures. There's really no getting around that. If you live in the states somewhere where you never see -20celsius, you might be fine with soft mud type tires, but there's a reason they are being banned for winter use where the temperatures drop really low.

I say get winter tires and mud summer tires. In whatever order is easiest on the wallet. That will be safest and you'll save your mud tires (which being soft wear out fast) to make them last longer.

Have you thought of selling the tires you'll get with the jeep to recoup the cost of tires?

Last thing: my winter tires are road tires, not offroad tires. I didn't like that at first until i realised that i saved (yes saved... in winter) 3MPGs with them. If you don't plan on wheeling in the winter, consider that option.


What do you recommend? Living in NL and doing a lot of hwy driving, stock wheel terrible in the snow and slush.

Strokerswild 12-27-2013 08:34 AM

My Duratracs stay on my Jeep all year.

Best tire in snow that I've ever had, I'd buy them again. Most of the time I don't even have to engage the transfer case.....

panthermark 12-27-2013 08:39 AM

Maybe some more folks from Canada could chime in here. Will Dura-tracs meet the new requirements?

jeffashford 12-27-2013 09:27 AM

Two sets of tires/wheels made sense for me, I am 3 miles from pavement on a rocky road that stays snowpacked/icy all winter. This is my DD and I often go off road in the winter for hunting and fishing trips. Ordered Duratrac's/wheels that came mounted/balanced.....will change back to off road tires in spring. Did on-line with DTD, found it best to just feel the pain once and not have the need to buy tires for many years.

ESA31.8T 12-27-2013 09:55 AM

We live in the Sierra's (North Lake Tahoe) and have used the Duratracs on just about every 4WD we've had including the Jeep. They have the mountain snowflake symbol making them legal for severe snow requirements.

We use them all year round on the Jeep JKU and it is one of our daily drivers. They are also used by the local public and private service companies (power, fire, etc) around here as well.

i82much 12-27-2013 10:03 AM

Just because it has a snowflake does not mean it is a true winter tire. Ice performance from anything other than a dedicated winter tire is going to be iffy at best.

Pancake House 12-27-2013 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by panthermark (Post 7008449)
Maybe some more folks from Canada could chime in here. Will Dura-tracs meet the new requirements?


Duratracs are the *only* MT that is rated for winter and compliant with the new driving laws. That being said, a 12.5" wide tread face is often undesirable with it's lower contact patch psi.

Studded arctic claw tires on my Jku, sandbags and my recovery gear right on the axle for more weight
We had a horrible storm of 5hrs of freezing rain, followed by a 12" dump of snow, then a -25 deep freeze. Hard pack glare ice for 2 weeks everywhere.

Setup worked great.

i82much 12-27-2013 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pancake House (Post 7009793)
Duratracs are the *only* MT that is rated for winter and compliant with the new driving laws. That being said, a 12.5" wide tread face is often undesirable with it's lower contact patch psi.

Studded arctic claw tires on my Jku, sandbags and my recovery gear right on the axle for more weight
We had a horrible storm of 5hrs of freezing rain, followed by a 12" dump of snow, then a -25 deep freeze. Hard pack glare ice for 2 weeks everywhere.

Setup worked great.

I wouldn't really call a Duratrac a mud terrain. Closer than an all-terrain, but not a true MT.

robskully 12-27-2013 11:43 AM

I have been using BFG All-Terrain T/A KO tires on all my trucks for 25 years all year round. The last 11 years I have even plowed with them on my 3/4 ton Dodge. Never got stuck or slid of the road in Winter.
Rob .....

Strokerswild 12-27-2013 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robskully (Post 7011385)
I have been using BFG All-Terrain T/A KO tires on all my trucks for 25 years all year round. The last 11 years I have even plowed with them on my 3/4 ton Dodge. Never got stuck or slid of the road in Winter.
Rob .....

My previous favorite all-around tire.

Omar Brannstrom 12-27-2013 12:14 PM

Howdy from Sweden

Goodyear in Sweden say that Dura trac is not a winter tire and then not allowed in Sweden in wintertime. So Dura trac is not a true winter tire, so maybe the rubber is to hard or to few saipings?

But what do they mean? Ofcourse Goodyear want to sell tires but they say that Dura Trac is not a tire for the winter use. They only mension UltraGrip SUV here as a legal tire here.


Goodyear-däck*

I think here the manufacturer says here what is legal or not.

I wanted a aggressive wintertire and I went with Cooper st Maxx and according to Cooper in Sweden it is a wintertire and then it is legal in Sweden.

ST maxx have less sieps than a duratrac but is legal here, but if Goodyear sold st maxx they would probably not be concidered as a wintertire and not be legal.

A true wintertire is better but looks boring thats why I went with the most aggressive approved wintertire here :) and I got mine studded 265/70/17 Cooper st Maxx

http://www.pbase.com/omar_brannstrom.../147824940.jpg

JerryJeepster 12-27-2013 12:22 PM

I don't do winter driving here in Florida but the Duratracs are stud compatible!

ptp023 12-27-2013 01:50 PM

Duratracs
 
I've only been driving on mine for about two months, but I live in the Harsh Winter Wastleand of ND... & they've worked great for me so far on ICE & SNOW...

That Jeep Guy 12-27-2013 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeepinNW (Post 2425023)
I've been assuming that when I buy my Jeep I will have a set of summer tires/wheels and a set of winter tires/wheels.

I need proper winter tires (with the mountain/snowflake logo) for the winter. In the world of cars, you generally don't use your winter tires in the summer.

I now see that I might be thinking about this all wrong. The DuraTrac tires (which seem to be popular among Jeep owners?) are severe snow rated.
Wrangler DuraTrac | Goodyear Tires

Is anyone here (in areas where winter tires are needed in the winter) using two different sets or do you just choose a good tire that is also snow rated and use it all year round?

Perhaps it would be more useful/economical to do this:
- Buy the Jeep with the cheapest wheel/tire option. That's the 16" steel rims with the Wrangler ST tires. I would throw these on for long highway road trips.
- Buy a second set (15" rims with 33" DuraTrac?) for offroad/local/winter use. Realistically these would sit on the car most of the time.

As Omar mentioned, according to Goodyear in Europe, DuraTracs are not winter rated. Yes, I understand that they do have the snowflake. But it is more than a bit odd that the manufacturer would advertise the same exact product as having certain properties in one part of the world but not in another - unless there are differing definitions of "sever winter conditions"

I am currently running Cooper Discoverer MS on a 2013 JKU and ran this same set of tires on my 2010 JKU for three years. That should say something about my satisfaction with the wear and the grip of these tires.

But, around september I was planning to put the Cooper ST Maxx on - but winter crept up on me before I could solve the issue of added weight on the stock spare tire carrier (my dear wife was understanding enough to just shake her head and roll her eyes when I announced I was replacing 5 perfectly good tires with 5 new and expensive ones, but convincing her of the added cost of a new bumper and tire carrier didn't happen before winter arrived. Fingers crossed for a solution by next year.)
With the DuraTracs not a legal option here (and probably not a sensible one either due to our icy roads) I just put on the old 17" Coopers.

As far as the OPs original question goes, I would recommend:
Keep what came on the Jeep for long trips like on-road family vacation trips etc. for the mpg, ride, and noise.

Definitely get the ST Maxx for off road, if your budget allows for a tire carrier (or my alternate plan of four ST Maxxs and the original spare).

And in the winter use an actual winter tire, preferably studded where legal, and I highly recommend the Cooper Discoverer MS based on actual experience.

I apologise for my lack of DuraTrac love here, I know they are claimed to be magical but I drive in real on and off road situations and am not the kind to trust in magic.

That Jeep Guy 12-27-2013 01:59 PM

Oops
 
I forgot to mention that I do go off road in winter with the Discoverer MS. I've winched out a number of time in mud holes in the rest of the year but, so far, not in winter. (no mud holes I guess)

They are not perfect or the greatest - off road in winter - but will do fine until I fit the ST Maxx.

i82much 12-27-2013 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by That Jeep Guy (Post 7013737)

I apologise for my lack of DuraTrac love here, I know they are claimed to be magical but I drive in real on and off road situations and am not the kind to trust in magic.

Smart guy here. There is no magical tire that is optimal under all circumstances. The Duratrac may be the best compromise ever, but it is not a true winter tire. For that matter, it is not a true mud tire. It may be pretty darn good in the mud and pretty darn good in the winter, and it may be the best choice for 95% of folks. But if your first concern is really driving on the road in the winter, and in particular black ice or glare ice, a TRUE winter tire is your best bet besides chains.

the_saint 12-27-2013 05:48 PM

Have had the General Arctic Altimax on the JKU for a few months.

Thoughts:

1. Better than stock tires.
2. Better than Duratracs on ice/slush according to the Jeep that slid into an intersection while I had no issues stopping in the same conditions (we were side by side, until he couldn't stop).
3. Quite stable in the snow/slush. Better than Michelin X-Ice2s on my AWD Subaru or my wifes Mercedes 4matic.
4. Ice traction is satisfactory for a winter tire. Requires a much more 'gentle' turn in to maintain traction, I suspect the weight of the Jeep has a large aspect to this, but nowhere near the confidence I have with the Michelins.

I just put a set of Blizzaks on my dad's Maxima (his uncool Christmas gift) this afternoon and took it for a road test and they blow the Michelins and General Altimax away for ice-grip as well as snow.

My next set for the Jeep will be the Nokian Hakka Whatever they will be selling in 4 years.


Final Verdict: I am very glad that put winter tires on the Jeep and feel that they are a worthwhile investment. I don't drive through snow more than 12 inches deep very often so can't comment on that kind of performance.

Michel347 12-27-2013 06:22 PM

We are up to almost 3 feet of snow here, in this early winter, I agree, the Blizzak DM-V1 blow away the Michelin X-Ice 3 of my wife's and X-Ice 2 of my daughter.

To my surprise, after now 3000 km, to don't show any wear yet, but it is still early to comment about wear. As far as traction and braking I must say they are impressive.

JTPhoto JK 12-27-2013 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by panthermark (Post 7008449)
Maybe some more folks from Canada could chime in here. Will Dura-tracs meet the new requirements?

Yes Duratracs meet the Canadian requirement. They are classified as an aggressive A/T Not an M/T. There are very few tires that have the snowflake emblem on them.

As for the tire comparison. Blizzacks are awesome hands down, however, they will NOT keep up with a studded Duratrac period in any winter condition.

the_saint 12-27-2013 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTPhoto JK (Post 7020577)

As for the tire comparison. Blizzacks are awesome hands down, however, they will NOT keep up with a studded Duratrac period in any winter condition.

I would love to see this comparison.

The studded Duratrac versus the Blizzak and the Nokian Hakka 7.

I suspect that even the non-studded Hakka 7s would beat the studded Duratrac.

JTPhoto JK 12-27-2013 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_saint (Post 7021585)
I would love to see this comparison. The studded Duratrac versus the Blizzak and the Nokian Hakka 7. I suspect that even the non-studded Hakka 7s would beat the studded Duratrac.

Not likely. We have auto ice races in the winter here and they have different classes for studded and unstudded. Unstudded cannot go near as fast as the studded class on a circuit track.

I also photograph ice racing motorcycles and although they are a bit different stud (not a spike) then a car tire they can grip glare black ice.

Vt rider 12-28-2013 06:01 PM

I'd go for the Duratracs for spring, summer and fall.
For serious winter driving, I do Nokian Hakkapellitta studded tires.
IMHO there is nothing better.
However, I don't do off road in the winter, but do drive rural, dirt roads in Vermont without a problem.

i82much 12-28-2013 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTPhoto JK (Post 7020577)

As for the tire comparison. Blizzacks are awesome hands down, however, they will NOT keep up with a studded Duratrac period in any winter condition.

Hah! Hey if you are going to make something up at least go long, I give you credit for not being shy.

JTPhoto JK 12-28-2013 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by i82much (Post 7035249)
Hah! Hey if you are going to make something up at least go long, I give you credit for not being shy.

Ever gone to ice races ... Evidently not.


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