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-   -   My TJ audio system (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f40/my-tj-audio-system-170292.html)

eboven 06-30-2012 12:54 AM

My TJ audio system
 
So I have been putting my audio system together piece by piece. The stock TJ sound system leaves plenty to be desired, especially if you don’t have the factory subwoofer, like mine. Replacing the cheap OEM radio with an aftermarket stereo kicks it up a bit, but the small 4x6” speakers in the dash are overpowered by the rear soundbar; if you fade it all to the front, you lose all your mid and low bass. There are certainly a few major design problems that need to be overcome to achieve a truly good sound!

I replaced my stereo with my Alpine from my old car – an Alpine CDA-117. This stereo is one of Alpine’s higher end radios; 3 sets of 4 volt pre-outs for amps, plenty of EQ adjustments, highpass and lowpass filters, and my favorite: time alignment! This fine tunes your sound stage by taking into account the distance each speaker is from the listener. It makes minute changes in the timing of each speaker and helps create an accurate soundstage right in front of the listener. When adjusted properly, this can make all the difference in the world with getting an accurate sound in the difficult environment of our TJ’s. The radio also has a rear USB input for iPods and flash drives, and I also got the KCA-400BT Bluetooth adapter for hands free phoning and audio streaming.

My TJ had some cheap Pioneer 4x6” speakers mounted in the dash, a slight improvement over stock, but still not near where I wanted it. After some researching and measuring, I decided on Pioneer’s D-Series 5.25” component speakers. I wanted a component set with a separate tweeter to help with the soundstage. I mounted the 5.25” woofer under the dash in the stock location, but used the tweeter pods that the speaker set came with to mount the tweeters on the top of the dash. High frequency sound is extremely directional, meaning it needs to be aimed almost directly at the listener in order for the sound stage to remain accurate. Lower frequencies are not as directional, so it is harder for the listener to perceive where the sound is coming from; that allows subwoofers to be mounted in a trunk without affecting the sound quality. I made some MDF rings for the woofers and used the 6x8” adapters that the speaker set came with to mount the woofers in the stock locations. I did have to cut a corner off each adapter plate to clear one of the metal sub dash brackets, but a Dremel tool made quick work of that. The MDF rings were added to strengthen the mounts and reduce any flexing or vibration; probably not absolutely necessary, but I would certainly recommend it if you choose to mount your speakers in the same way. I found some pretty good locations for crossovers, too; see the pictures.

The soundbar presented another problem for me. Having speakers directly behind the front listeners’ head made the rear speakers seem louder, and really screwed up the sound stage. Instead of hearing the sound coming from in front of you, most of it was heard from behind, like you have your back turned to a concert. Like I said before, the higher the frequency, the more directional it becomes. This made me decide to experiment a bit with my Focal 6.5” component speakers. I decided to only use the woofers for the rear channel. I kept the crossovers wired inline, so the woofers only play the mid and low frequencies, and all the high frequencies only come from the front channel. This actually turned out better than I thought it would. My next step is to add a 5 channel amp, but even running the speakers off the Alpine’s amp, the system sounds much more in line with where I want it to be! The low frequencies are still lacking as far as volume goes, but the sound stage is much more accurate than before, and I know amping it up and getting my sub installed will get it right where I want it.

Future plans are for a Kicker IX1000.5 five channel digital amp, I will mount it under the driver’s dash to keep it high and dry and to keep all my precious cargo space. I also have an Elemental Designs SQ 10” sub on pre-order. I took inspiration from an idea I got (on this forum?) to make the sub enclosure in the rear seat cushion. The SQ10 is designed to work in extremely small enclosures (as small as small as 0.25 cubic feet), so my box will be a bit smaller than the plans I have seen on the forums.

Alpine stereo and Bluetooth mic mounted.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-B...2/IMG_4660.JPG

Front left crossover location
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-I...2/IMG_4657.JPG

Front left woofer mounted
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-k...9/IMG_4655.JPG

Front left woofer and tweeter.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-H...9/IMG_4658.JPG

Front right crossover location
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-q...2/IMG_4668.JPG

Front right woofer mounted
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-9...9/IMG_4672.JPG

Front right woofer and tweeter
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-t...9/IMG_4671.JPG

MDF ring for front woofers
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-l...2/IMG_4674.JPG

Front woofers behind the factory grilles
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-D...9/IMG_4676.JPG

Rear woofers mounted in the soundbar
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-h...2/IMG_4664.JPG




Let me know what you all think! I can’t wait until it’s all put together, and I will be keeping this thread updated as I go, so check back later!

eboven 11-17-2012 11:59 AM

Well, I finally got around to my amp. I purchased an Alpine MRX-V70 5-channel Class D amp. It's very small for the amount of power it puts out - 60 watts RMS x4 + 250 watts RMS x1 @ 4ohms, or 90 x4 + 350 x1 @ 2ohms. I still plan to put a sub in the rear seat, but to my dismay, Elemental Designs seems to have gone out of business! I still have to decide what sub I will use, but until then, the Alpine amp really kicked up the sound on my other speakers.

The amp went under the driver's dash. I have an '02 Wrangler with a 5-speed manual, even with the clutch pedal, there was plenty of room to fit this amp and it's mounting plate under the dash. The steering wheel still has full tilt and my feet have plenty of room- I don't even notice it's there. If you're looking for a good way to amp up your speaker system but were worried about the amp taking up more space or getting wet - this IS the solution for you. If you have a sheet of MDF, a couple bolts and nuts and some ingenuity, you can certainly do this yourself. If you are worried about the MDF sheet getting wet or holding moisture, you could just soak it in a couple coats of fiberglass resin.

On to the pics!

My driver's underdash:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-F...6/IMG_5452.JPG

Here you can see where I grounded the amp, as well as where the speaker and power wires were routed. The ground is terminated on the red bolt with the silver nut in the center of the picture.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-J...2/IMG_5453.JPG

Here you can see where the wires needed to stay close to the amp to avoid the brake pedal. Zip ties with screw mounts worked great here. I just screwed the zip ties to the amp rack.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-A...6/IMG_5454.JPG

Another of the brake pedal and wire routing.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-d...2/IMG_5459.JPG

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-X...6/IMG_5457.JPG

The amp is not visible at all unless you literally put your head on the floor and look up, so I am not too worried about thieves. The difference in sound is enormous - volume levels have easily doubled while remaining clear at all times, no distorting or crackling even when its too loud for me to handle. I have taken my half door windows off several times and it's always had enough to keep up with wind and highway noise at 65 MPH. I have no doubts that come summer when I take the hard top off too, my system will have no problem surrounding me with my music. :punk:

If you're on the fence on getting an amp, I highly recommend it!

lolpetewtf 11-17-2012 12:57 PM

Wow looks awesome. What are you using for a sub? Sound system was the first thing I did to my JK.

sjones26573 11-17-2012 01:24 PM

Nice. Only thing is I've heard for components in the dash that mounting the tweeter at the base of the windshield is an awful place. I've heard that mounted down low, as far from the driver as possible, affords the best balance. Nalin Mfg makes some plates to mount the tweeter in the correct place. I'm currently running a coax setup in the dash but plan to go component one day.

eboven 11-18-2012 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lolpetewtf (Post 3005913)
Wow looks awesome. What are you using for a sub? Sound system was the first thing I did to my JK.

I plan to make a sub enclosure to fit a single 10" in the seat cushion of the rear seat; I saw plans on another forum. I was pretty set on the Elemental Designs new SQ slimline subs, but they have gone out of business and my order was never charged or completed - I will likely go with either a Kenwood Excellon slim 10" or a Kicker CompVT 10"

The low end bass is lacking at the moment, but everything else is pretty close to where I want it. I'm sure once I get around to making the box and dropping a sub in that I will be completely happy with the setup.


Quote:

Originally Posted by sjones26573 (Post 3005967)
Nice. Only thing is I've heard for components in the dash that mounting the tweeter at the base of the windshield is an awful place. I've heard that mounted down low, as far from the driver as possible, affords the best balance. Nalin Mfg makes some plates to mount the tweeter in the correct place. I'm currently running a coax setup in the dash but plan to go component one day.

Funny you should say that. I was searching around for tweeter mounts and found the Nalin MFG ones... I decided against them for the same reason you want them. A little education in the Autosound department, and you will see why.

High frequency sound, as I said in my first post, is extremely directional, meaning the listener can often easily identify where the high frequency sounds are originating from. The lower you go in the human's audible frequency spectrum, the harder it is to determine where the sound is coming from. For this reason, Autosound experts and professionals recommend pointing the tweeter directly at the listener for the best soundstage.

Soundstage is important to audiophiles because it dictates the "feel" of the music; in order to be regarded as a properly adjusted soundstage, the listener should get the perception that their dashboard is the stage for a live music concert. You should be able to pick out the singer dead center, the bassist off to the left, and the lead guitarist moving around on the right side. The sound should come alive right in front of you - and in a car, that's the dashboard. The lower frequencies that you hear are not very directional, so subwoofers don't need to be pointed at the listener - slow moving bass waves are difficult to determine a point of origin simply by listening.

Another thing to keep in mind when placing tweeters is their distance from the woofer that plays the still somewhat directional sound just below the tweeter's range. If the two are too far apart, you will get what's called separation. You may hear the singer's voice in front of you, but the bassists riff is audible on the far right, even below the rest of the soundstage. Keep tweeters as close as possible to the woofer for the best sound quality.

After you take those two considerations in mind, which do you think will yield a better soundstage and overall sound quality with a flat response? Having the tweeter mounted low by your knee is not going to help the soundstage, I can tell you that right now. :whistling:

The only thing I liked about the Nalin tweeter pods was that they kept the tweeter close to the woofer, but in my setup, there is hardly three inches more of distance... the difference in the soundstage made up for the distance from the woofer.

NalinMFG 11-18-2012 10:43 AM

I'm afraid that I have to disagree with your interpretation of a more acoustically correct soundstage on top of the dash. We also had a huge discussion on "the other forum" regarding this very topic during the R&D phase of the tweeter mounts. Shoot me your address and I’d be happy to let you try for yourself.


Quote:

Originally Posted by SirGCal (Post 4247802)
Dash mounted tweeters are one of the worst spots in a TJ. I still don't understand why it's so popular and even more, why the new wranglers do it...

Anyhow, tweeters are far too directional and too sensitive to phase variation to be that close to the listener. You want them mounted as far away from your head, and as on-axis as you can get. Unfortunately in a TJ this doesn't work so well and you honestly get better sound from a good set of speakers in the dash or kick panel. The few times I have done component style tweeters, the most successful places I've found are just under the dash or in the kick panel.

The technical what & why has to do with the axis (where it is pointed) with distance differences between listening positions and each speaker. High frequencies are very susceptible to both effects where lower frequencies are a little more forgiving. But to keep it simple, that's why this position is a good choice.

His credentials(upper right):
Chris' Homepage


https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphot...10142127_n.jpg

eboven 11-21-2012 09:38 AM

Nalin:

I hope I didn't sound like I was bashing your products, I think you guys are doing a great service with all the design and fabrication on your products. I am sure you guys put a lot of research into your speaker upgrade systems, and have played with different positions to find the right one. I would be happy to try your tweeter mounts, but only with the understanding that I don't typically take anyone else's word for things that I know a thing or two about.

I am familiar with SirGCal and his experience. I will say that while he certainly does know his stuff when it comes to autosound, I definitely don't always agree with everything he says or does. When it comes down to it, sound is extremely subjective, and only so much can be explained through math and formulas. While I am not saying I don't believe you, I am remaining skeptical that having a tweeter further from the listener will provide an accurate soundstage as well as keep the volume levels loud enough to overcome a Jeep's road noise.

Ibuildembig 11-21-2012 11:00 AM

Although I agree with lower tweeter placement on most vehicles, sirgcal is far from an expert on anything

willms81 11-21-2012 11:35 AM

I believe this will be the recipe I follow for my audio build.

Ibuildembig 11-21-2012 11:49 AM

BTW excellent choice in mids/highs.

NalinMFG 11-21-2012 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibuildembig (Post 3018423)
Although I agree with lower tweeter placement on most vehicles, sirgcal is far from an expert on anything

I don't claim that he's an expert, but I do consider him to be a very knowledgeable and respected forum contributor. His audio opinions go a lot farther than most in my book. His credentials are a mere reference for readers who may not be familiar with him - it would be a very bold move on my end to toss a random poster's quote into a thread with with this much technical backing!

BlueRidgeYJ 11-21-2012 07:00 PM

Yet another thing Jeeps make you comprimise on. Best if you could dash mount em and drive from the back seat. Just sayin', lmao.

Still way better than not driving a Jeep ;)

bobthetj03 11-21-2012 08:22 PM

Getting proper power to the speakers makes a big difference. I like where you're going with the sound system. Don't count out the center console for a sub if you like to keep your storage. Dissadvantage about the sub in the back seat is you lose your bass if you need to take your back seat out. IMO, components are a waste of $$ in a TJ.

Ibuildembig 11-21-2012 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NalinMFG (Post 3019432)
I don't claim that he's an expert, but I do consider him to be a very knowledgeable and respected forum contributor. His audio opinions go a lot farther than most in my book. His credentials are a mere reference for readers who may not be familiar with him - it would be a very bold move on my end to toss a random poster's quote into a thread with with this much technical backing!

But in that statement lies the issue....no credentials, nothing, nada. He isn't an audio professional, not a manufacturers rep, not a builder, not even a simple installer. He claims to have owned a audio shop at one time but no one in the world outside of JF has ever heard of him. He is nothing but a bigmouth mod with an attitude, plain and simple. I'm sorry for the rant but there are thousands of people I would quote before I ever got to him.

NalinMFG 11-22-2012 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibuildembig (Post 3020440)
But in that statement lies the issue....no credentials, nothing, nada. He isn't an audio professional, not a manufacturers rep, not a builder, not even a simple installer. He claims to have owned a audio shop at one time but no one in the world outside of JF has ever heard of him. He is nothing but a bigmouth mod with an attitude, plain and simple. I'm sorry for the rant but there are thousands of people I would quote before I ever got to him.

Being the moderator for a Jeep electronics forum, running a Jeep audio how-to site, and previously owning an audio shop rate high enough in my book to merit a little credibility. I'm sorry that you feel that way towards him.

You're not going to find a lot of threads with information regarding tweeter placement in Jeeps. I try to remain actively involved in discussions that pertain to products that I sell. If there's a way to make something better - that's what I'm going to do.

I'll butt heads and defend my ideas/thoughts/opinions, but ultimately I'm here to learn from those who do consider themselves to be "experts". Right now I am convinced that mounting tweeters under the dash is the way to go.

Prove me wrong :popcorn:

Ibuildembig 11-22-2012 09:54 AM

IMO the best thing you could do is make them user adjustable. The perfect location for a tweeter is going to differ with each end user because of their size and how the sit in the vehicle. Ultimate midrange placement would be in the kickpanels with the driver facing oposing sides (ie, the passenger one will be aimed at the drivers right ear and the drivers side would be aimed at the passengers left ear) What everyone tries to achieve in the audio world is a center stage and imaging. Its near impossible in a jeep to have imaging (unless a guy wanted to hack his dash up and install a set of waveguides firing up) There are several of us on here that do this for a living and have competed for a very long time. I'm sure that they along with myself would be happy to help you out with product ideas and questions :)

eboven 11-22-2012 10:12 AM

Just want to put my $.02 in here. SirGCal does know what he is talking about most of the time. Being a mobile audio professional myself, I can tell you that most of the things I have read from him are true and make sense. His plans for a box in the rear seat are what I plan to model mine after, and looking through some of his work, he does seem pretty legit. That being said, I have seen some things that simply didn't make sense posted by him.

His description of why you shouldn't put subs into the soundbar is because it's too turbulent up there with the top off, which will damage the subs. This just doesn't make sense to me. I understand that wind will be whipping around up there, but Jeep put speakers there in the first place. If you have a 6.5" full range dual cone speaker up there, it will be effected by the wind the same as a 6.5" low range woofer. One could even argue that the stronger motor on the woofer would resist atmospheric pressure more, meaning a sub would be a better choice up there than the factory speakers. Add in a properly designed crossover network, and you have a great spot to mount some good midrange woofers to compliment the sub that's going in the back seat. I don't know of any speaker out there that won't distort in the soundbar when the Jeep's traveling down the highway at 60mph; I also don't know many people with hearing good enough to hear said distortion.

eboven 12-08-2012 05:52 PM

Well, thanks to Andrew Nalin, I installed the Nalin MFG component plates earlier this week. I was very impressed with the plates overall - nice clean cuts and they fit perfectly. The supplied hardware for the 5.25" woofer was very nice, and there were no gaps around the woofer at all. The tweeter mounts lined up perfectly with the stock door strap post's bolts, and my Pioneer tweeters fit perfectly in place with no gaps.
If you plan to replace your front speakers at all, you need to buy plates anyway, even to install a crappy 4x6" aftermarket speaker; car audio shops usually charge 20-25 bucks for them. There is no reason not to just buy the Nalin plates and get them shipped to you - it will probably end up being cheaper and will allow you to install a better sounding 5.25" speaker in the dash with no modifications. I almost feel stupid for not buying them in the first place and making my "custom" plates.

I listened to the system for about 4 days of driving to work and back - I have an hour drive each way, so I got plenty of listening in, trust me! I listen to every kind of music, from Pink Floyd to Skrillex to Avenged Sevenfold... I would say that overall, the sound was certainly improved with the tweeters mounted low where the Nalin mounts put them. The sound is more smooth, with less of an ear piercing effect. The soundstage is still great for a Jeep, so I have to admit I was proven wrong about tweeter placement.

I did notice a couple things that deserved my attention. First, with the tweeters being mounted so low, they obviously weren't as loud as they were on the dash. I first removed the 3db attenuation on the component set's crossovers. This made it a bit better, but the midrange still wanted to overpower the high frequencies. I set my Alpine stereo's fader to the front a bit, and that really made the difference.
Second, since the tweeters were not as piercing anymore, I could turn the volume up a few more notches before my ears really hated me. This made me notice some rattling from front midrange speakers at certain frequencies. I took the covers off and applied pressure on the plates in different places and was able to make the rattling stop, so I knew it wasn't the speakers themselves, rather just the metal plates rattling on the metal bars. I grabbed some dynamat scraps I had left over from my previous car's 6x9" install. Dynamat is an excellent sound deadener, it virtually eliminates panel distortion and rattling when applied properly. I covered the front of the woofer plates and mounting bars with the dynamat, reinstalled, and voila, no more rattle!

I ordered some 5.25" foam baffles, but they didn't arrive in time for the weekend. Just for fun, I figured I would give polyfill a try. It honestly made a surprising difference for the front midrange; I have mine on a 100htz highpass filter, but the mids are much more pronounced after I installed the polyfill. I also stuffed the soundbar; the 6.5" woofers I have in there definitely have noticeably more punch.

On to some pics!

Nalin woofer plates - taking the rattle out with some Dynamat. A scrap 6x9 cutout works perfectly here.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-L...6/IMG_5485.JPG

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-s...6/IMG_5487.JPG

I also Dynamatted the bars that the speaker plates screw into to keep them from rattling on the dash mounts. I filled the cavity with polyfill to slow down the low frequencies and improve midbass.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-z...2/IMG_5495.JPG

The only picture I got of the woofer and tweeter mounted before my camera died on me!
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-f...2/IMG_5497.JPG

sjones26573 12-08-2012 10:17 PM

Glad it worked for you! I actually won a set of Nalin dash and tweeter mounts after my post here so now I'm going to pick up some Polk speakers for the dash and move my Kickers to the pods to get rid of my last stock speakers. Having you satisfied with the setup makes me even more anxious to get mine installed.

dtaz04 12-12-2012 06:34 PM

will you send me a pm of all the stuff you bought and the price. i am looking to do the same thing to my jeep

LilYeller 12-12-2012 06:57 PM

Your system looks way better than mine does. I threw my system together from parts I have aquired over the past 10 years. I worked as an installer for a major retailer for a long time and got some pretty sweet stuff for next to nothing. I Put a 12 Kicker CVT in the rear seat and I can say it sounds awesome. IMO theres no better place for a sub in the wrangler. I tried it in different areas such as on the tailgate (firing into the cab and spaced out to fire towards the tailgate) Downfiring in the "Trunk" area and finally got tired of moving it around and did what I knew I should have done in the first place. All I can say is WOW. It sounds great there. I dont have a garage so my whole install is "Shade tree install" which is why it looks like it was thrown together in the matter of a few minutes. but heres a pic of the sub in the seat.
http://i1234.photobucket.com/albums/...-29-44_895.jpg

I fiberglassed the crap out of the box so it would hold up to the water. I rarely have the doors and full top on so it gets wet easily, the amps are raised off the ground so no water gets to them. Maybe one day Ill get in there and clean up the wires, make a baffle for the seat, and get the whole thing cleaned up but thats gonna have to wait for now.

One bad thing I can say about putting the sub in the seat is that it makes the seat pretty uncomfortable for an adult due to the lack of padding in there and that you are sitting up higher so theres alot less headroom.

eboven 12-13-2012 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LilYeller (Post 3097376)
Your system looks way better than mine does. I threw my system together from parts I have aquired over the past 10 years. I worked as an installer for a major retailer for a long time and got some pretty sweet stuff for next to nothing. I Put a 12 Kicker CVT in the rear seat and I can say it sounds awesome. IMO theres no better place for a sub in the wrangler. I tried it in different areas such as on the tailgate (firing into the cab and spaced out to fire towards the tailgate) Downfiring in the "Trunk" area and finally got tired of moving it around and did what I knew I should have done in the first place. All I can say is WOW. It sounds great there. I dont have a garage so my whole install is "Shade tree install" which is why it looks like it was thrown together in the matter of a few minutes. but heres a pic of the sub in the seat.

I fiberglassed the crap out of the box so it would hold up to the water. I rarely have the doors and full top on so it gets wet easily, the amps are raised off the ground so no water gets to them. Maybe one day Ill get in there and clean up the wires, make a baffle for the seat, and get the whole thing cleaned up but thats gonna have to wait for now.

One bad thing I can say about putting the sub in the seat is that it makes the seat pretty uncomfortable for an adult due to the lack of padding in there and that you are sitting up higher so theres alot less headroom.

Nice! I am currently using my Alpine Type R 12" in a large ported box whenever I have the back seat up right now. It sounds amazing, but it takes up quite a bit of room and there is no way it would fit if I needed room for any more than one other person. I've had the sub on craigslist, but everyone just keeps low-balling me, so I've held onto it; once it sells, I plan to get a 10" CVT and build it into the back seat like you did. I bet that 12" sounds pretty good!

How much padding did you have to take out? I've seen some people leave a bit more than usual and then "stuff" the box into place to keep the seat more comfortable. I have friends riding in the back seat from time to time, so I am planning to make the box as shallow as possible to allow for more padding; we will see how it goes once I get it all apart! You said the rear seat lost some headroom too; I saw you have the Rampage frameless top. I plan to get the same top this spring; how bad is it? I would imagine that with my current hardtop this would be less of a problem.

I work as a mobile electronics installer for a major electronics retailer as well... did you move to another company, or out of the industry all together?

RayW 12-31-2012 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eboven (Post 3018146)
While I am not saying I don't believe you, I am remaining skeptical that having a tweeter further from the listener will provide an accurate soundstage as well as keep the volume levels loud enough to overcome a Jeep's road noise.

Putting the tweeter further from the listener means that path length differences between left and right channels will be minimized. That should improve imaging and soundstage provided, as you said above, that the distance between tweeter and woofer is adequately small (less than 1/2 wavelength at crossover frequency for real coherence). Dash mounting the tweeter puts the near side driver much, much closer to the listener than the other side which will cause delays that are easily detected by most listeners. Compounding the problem is the fact that the woofers are farther away with less path length difference so you get a disconnect in the image between the woofer/mid and the tweeter.

Having said all that, if you put your tweeters up on the dash and it sounds good to you, turn it up and drive on. :thumb: Most acoustic minutia like that get swamped in any automobile and even more so in a Jeep so at the end of the day it just comes down to what sounds good to you.

Ray

p.s. I design speakers for a living. I can provide credentials if needed. :D

dtaz04 01-01-2013 12:09 AM

RayW do you want to design my speaker set up for me? Lol

RayW 01-01-2013 12:31 AM

Sure thing. :D Personally, all I've done so far to my Jeep (only had the TJ for a month) is to use the Nalin bracket to mount some 5 1/4" Vifa coax speakers that I had leftover from another project and drop in an Alpine head unit. Incidentally, if someone worked out a way to isolate the front of the dash speakers from the back (Jeep tried with those foam baffle thingies on the 4x6) it would really increase the bass up front. I haven't figured out an easy way to do it yet. The stuffing that eboven used is a good start.

I'm currently working out a micro-sub setup to add a little bottom end using the space between the seat base and the rocker panel. It won't be a thumper but should help round out things a little. If I get it worked out I'll start a new thread. I don't want to hijack this one anymore than has already happened.

And in an attempt to un-hijack...First rate install, eboven! I love the amp mount location.

dtaz04 01-01-2013 09:37 PM

I am looking to completely redo my system. I want to put a sub in w/o losing the little space I have

freeskier 01-02-2013 05:33 PM

Great thread. Great to hear about the Nalin tweeter brackets, I installed my audio set up before they came out so I went with coax speakers in the front. I'm thinking about redoing my sound system again this summer, with the tweeters in the stock location they are VERY muffled.

eboven 01-04-2013 09:34 AM

RayW:
It's cool to see another audiophile on the forums, I look forward to your future contributions and input here; seems like you know your stuff! I would say that the tweeters on the dash were certainly louder, but the imaging was off. Since I have switched to the Nalin tweeter mounts, the imaging is MUCH better, and the frequencies mesh together better.

I removed most of the stuffing around the woofers, and installed foam baffles sandwiched between the Nalin plates and the woofers up front. This made a notable improvement in midbass, but I get a bit of rattle from my passenger side air-vent now with certain frequencies. I usually listen to my stereo with the fader all the way to the front now, and the bass is honestly almost as good as with the woofers in the soundbar working... the imaging is definitely better too.

bobthetj03 01-04-2013 01:51 PM

I did the same thing too. It did make a noticable improvement.
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/...b/100_0793.jpg

RayW 01-04-2013 11:37 PM

That is my next planned step with my front speakers, also. I will probably pick up some better coax speaks for the sound bar and figured I would piggyback the baffles on the order.

As far as being an audiophile, I guess I qualify with my home system but on the road I've always been a "good enough" kind of guy. As long as I can hear the music and bob my head I'm in good shape. :) My stock setup was about 3 steps below good enough.


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