Jeep Wrangler Forum

Jeep Wrangler Forum (http://www.wranglerforum.com/)
-   JK General Discussion Forum (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/)
-   -   Hesitation when starting off in first gear. (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/hesitation-when-starting-off-in-first-gear-205510.html)

GuruYaekob 12-15-2012 05:08 AM

Hesitation when starting off in first gear.
 
While driving my Jeep today I noticed my 2012 hesitates when I start from a stop. I know how to drive manual so I don't think its my doing. Soon as I touch the gas and start letting off the clutch the rpms dip for a second then I gotta mash the gas to get it going before it dies. Its as if there is a dead space for about a half an inch or so in my gas pedal. I've killed this Jeep more than any manual I have ever owned. The problem with mashing the gas is its starting to get winter time here and the last thing I need is my tires spinning out of control because I have this dead space. Is there any way to fix this? Does anyone else have this issue? Do I just suck at the JK clutch?:hide:

Farnham21 12-15-2012 05:18 AM

It's cold in Illinois isn't it? Did you let the car warm up?

DesertDozer 12-15-2012 05:21 AM

Get a sprint booster, or remove one spring from the pedal, I did the former and it helped a lot (night and day), Wrangler's gas pedal (at least mine) is the worst I have used, it's heavy and laggy and not very communicative.

GuruYaekob 12-15-2012 05:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Farnham21 (Post 3106095)
It's cold in Illinois isn't it? Did you let the car warm up?

Its actually seasonably warm. I pulled into my driveway after a 30 minute drive and tested it and it did the same thing. Its like 50 degrees here.

BRawk 12-15-2012 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuruYaekob (Post 3106084)
While driving my Jeep today I noticed my 2012 hesitates when I start from a stop. I know how to drive manual so I don't think its my doing. Soon as I touch the gas and start letting off the clutch the rpms dip for a second then I gotta mash the gas to get it going before it dies. Its as if there is a dead space for about a half an inch or so in my gas pedal. I've killed this Jeep more than any manual I have ever owned. The problem with mashing the gas is its starting to get winter time here and the last thing I need is my tires spinning out of control because I have this dead space. Is there any way to fix this? Does anyone else have this issue? Do I just suck at the JK clutch?:hide:

I'm experiencing the same issue, and I don't think it is my foot :whistling:

dirtybiketrash 12-15-2012 10:54 AM

Were you on a hill? The JK's with manual tranny's have hill assist, which keeps the brake engaged when you release the brake pedal, giving you time to transition to the gas pedal without the Jeep rolling. I can't remember at what angle it kicks in. I have played with mine, and it doesn't matter how hard I press the brake pedal in. Some on here have stated that it is proportional to how hard you are depressing the brake pedal, but in my experimentation that hasn't been the case. Drive to where you have the Jeep pointing uphill and come to a stop. Then just release the brake pedal and you will see there is a pause of a second or two before it will start to roll backwards. Play with it a little bit, and get a feel for how ling it takes to disengage the brake.

njskater59 12-15-2012 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirtybiketrash (Post 3106699)
Were you on a hill? The JK's with manual tranny's have hill assist, which keeps the brake engaged when you release the brake pedal, giving you time to transition to the gas pedal without the Jeep rolling. I can't remember at what angle it kicks in. I have played with mine, and it doesn't matter how hard I press the brake pedal in. Some on here have stated that it is proportional to how hard you are depressing the brake pedal, but in my experimentation that hasn't been the case. Drive to where you have the Jeep pointing uphill and come to a stop. Then just release the brake pedal and you will see there is a pause of a second or two before it will start to roll backwards. Play with it a little bit, and get a feel for how ling it takes to disengage the brake.

It kicks in at a 3% hill grade with standard and an 8% grade with auto. The brakes will stay engaged for about 3 seconds.

I'm going to take mine off when I get it back from the shop. After a week of driving I hated it. Feel like I'm wearing my brakes faster.

dirtybiketrash 12-15-2012 11:52 AM

If you play with it you can get a feel for the timing of when it will disengage the brake. Is there an easy way to shut-off the hill assist?

njskater59 12-15-2012 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirtybiketrash (Post 3106845)
If you play with it you can get a feel for the timing of when it will disengage the brake. Is there an easy way to shut-off the hill assist?

HSA Off

If you wish to turn off the HSA system, follow this procedure:
1. Start with the engine off and vehicle in PARK (auto- matic transmission) or NEUTRAL with clutch out (manual transmission) with wheels straight. Apply park- ing brake on manual transmission vehicle.
2. Start the engine.
3. With the engine running, the brake applied, and the clutch out, rotate the steering wheel 180° counterclock- wise from center.
4. Press the ESC OFF switch four times within twenty seconds.
5. Rotate the steering wheel 360° clockwise (180° clock- wise from center).
6. Cycle ignition switch OFF then ON.
7. If the sequence was completed properly, the “ESC Activation/Malfunction Indicator Light” will blink sev- eral times to confirm HSA is off.
Steps 1-7 must be completed within 90 seconds to turn off HSA. Repeat steps 1-7 to re-enable HSA functionality.

dirtybiketrash 12-15-2012 12:13 PM

Thanks for the info.

Cruise missile 12-15-2012 12:18 PM

My HSA is off and my Jeep does the same thing.

JKWrangler2012 12-15-2012 12:56 PM

while operating; release break pedal before engaging the clutch pedal.. proceed

gnarlyswine 12-16-2012 02:18 AM

Its not just you. Ive driven standard for 30 years. Started off in a land rover at all of 10 years old. This is the only vehicle ive had that frequently stalls. Hill start is disabled. Its left me hung out to dry a few times in a busy intersection. Quite a scary experience. Find it worse backing up. Especially on any incline. Oddly in reverse, if i dont touch the gas its no problem. Give it slight gas and it will stall easily. Its very weird. You can feel the engine start to struggle, put the clutch in immediately and it will still judder and die. Some fueling issue i guess. Or Hopefully an ignition timing upgrade will fix it at some point. Seems a bit useless that a jeep stalls easily at low speed. First time i wished id went auto.

GuruYaekob 12-16-2012 02:52 AM

I find my self hugging the clutch to keep it from dying. I'm sure it will burn out eventually and I can go rage at the dealer.

Con Artist 12-16-2012 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirtybiketrash (Post 3106845)
If you play with it you can get a feel for the timing of when it will disengage the brake. Is there an easy way to shut-off the hill assist?

Since you have the Rubicon, you should have a few buttons on the steering wheel you can press. You hit the "right arrow" button to go into your settings, then scroll through using the "down" arrow button. You'll come to an option to disengage the hill assist. :thumb:

JEEPDON 12-16-2012 06:07 AM

Take you foot completely off the gas until the clutch is fully engaged. Then give it a little gas.

The JK electronic throttle will attempt to keep the engine running at idle speed at whatever torque requirement as long as your foot is completely off the gas.
Then, when you step on the gas, the "drive by wire" feature takes over.
At that time, if you are in the "transition", your engine will hesitate.

I have killed mine I don't know how many times while wheeling when I am just letting the electronics do their thing, and then try to just "feather" the gas pedal to get a little more wheel speed while negotiating a steep climb.

Hope all this helps you guys and gals out.

Maybe someone better at typing and all can give a better description of what is going on with the JK "drive by wire" throttle.:thumb:

GuruYaekob 12-18-2012 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JEEPDON (Post 3109262)
Take you foot completely off the gas until the clutch is fully engaged. Then give it a little gas.

The JK electronic throttle will attempt to keep the engine running at idle speed at whatever torque requirement as long as your foot is completely off the gas.
Then, when you step on the gas, the "drive by wire" feature takes over.
At that time, if you are in the "transition", your engine will hesitate.

I have killed mine I don't know how many times while wheeling when I am just letting the electronics do their thing, and then try to just "feather" the gas pedal to get a little more wheel speed while negotiating a steep climb.

Hope all this helps you guys and gals out.

Maybe someone better at typing and all can give a better description of what is going on with the JK "drive by wire" throttle.:thumb:


I don't get what your saying?

Push clutch to floor
let it all the way out? (this would kill it)
then press gas?

I'm lost

mflint1513 12-18-2012 05:17 PM

Exact same thing here. Best I can figure is that the rpm dips to less than 1,000 where the torque and hp are low. If I cared enough, I'd do the math to figure out that torque applied at that time to the rear wheels was insufficient to overcome initial friction. I've learned that keeping the rpm up around 1200 works.
I'm hoping new rear gears keeps this from happening but we shall see.

JKWrangler2012 12-18-2012 08:16 PM

i noticed recently, i have a tendency to release the clutch ..fully, and then apply the gas; after initial acceleration. am i still getting accustom to the high release/engagement point on the pedal? i don't know.. but i caught myself doing it with a conscious mind lol

CampThree1982 12-18-2012 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnarlyswine (Post 3109082)
Its not just you. Ive driven standard for 30 years. Started off in a land rover at all of 10 years old. This is the only vehicle ive had that frequently stalls. Hill start is disabled. Its left me hung out to dry a few times in a busy intersection. Quite a scary experience. Find it worse backing up. Especially on any incline. Oddly in reverse, if i dont touch the gas its no problem. Give it slight gas and it will stall easily. Its very weird. You can feel the engine start to struggle, put the clutch in immediately and it will still judder and die. Some fueling issue i guess. Or Hopefully an ignition timing upgrade will fix it at some point. Seems a bit useless that a jeep stalls easily at low speed. First time i wished id went auto.

I too have driven a stick since the late 70's including 5 Harley's and large trucks. I've never stalled a vehicle more than with this one. Backing up my driveway is useless. I think I'll disengage the hill assist and see what that does. I've read on here some folks start off in Second gear not sure what difference that makes but I've tried it a few times and it seems to work. I've got a Rubicon so the lower gears may make that possible.

Con Artist 12-19-2012 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CampThree1982 (Post 3119936)
I too have driven a stick since the late 70's including 5 Harley's and large trucks. I've never stalled a vehicle more than with this one. Backing up my driveway is useless. I think I'll disengage the hill assist and see what that does. I've read on here some folks start off in Second gear not sure what difference that makes but I've tried it a few times and it seems to work. I've got a Rubicon so the lower gears may make that possible.

It's near impossible to "crawl" either forward ot backwards. I'm either launching off like I'm in the Cannonball Run or bogging up the road. "Reverse" is the worst; I can't even crawl my way out of the garage without riding the clutch, and then I wind up smelling clutch. The only way to avoid it is to shoot out of the garage, then slam on my brakes before I roll down a hill behind my driveway, backwards. There's no such thing as "feathering" the throttle in this damned thing. :banghead:

WatchThis! 12-19-2012 03:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mflint1513 (Post 3118866)
Exact same thing here. Best I can figure is that the rpm dips to less than 1,000 where the torque and hp are low. If I cared enough, I'd do the math to figure out that torque applied at that time to the rear wheels was insufficient to overcome initial friction. I've learned that keeping the rpm up around 1200 works.
I'm hoping new rear gears keeps this from happening but we shall see.

I dont make a habit of it but with 5:38's and 37's my 3.8 will lug along at 500 rpm

kjeeper10 12-19-2012 05:33 AM

With my superchips tune my 07 doesn't lug under under 2K even with 35's.
I can cruise at 1700 easily without lugging.
The sprintbooster/SC combo make drivability 10x better.

Driving a Tj for 10 years, the step up to a JK was a smack in the face.
First mod was the sprintbooster. The tune was more noticeable when I moved up to 35's.

I know the OP posted about his 12 but both the 3.8/3.6 suffer at lower rpms.

WatchThis! 12-19-2012 05:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjeeper10 (Post 3120864)

I know the OP posted about his 12 but both the 3.8/3.6 suffer at lower rpms.

That they do. The TJ guys look at me funny every time I stall, I just ask them if they have ever wheeled a stick shift JK before.

FDHog 12-19-2012 06:27 AM

I thought it was me. I've been driving stick for 40yrs, yeah I'm an old fart, and never had a problem. The clutch engages early enough, but it doesn't do it gradually. It goes from light engagement to full engagement very quickly. I stalled out more in the 1st 2 weeks than I have in 40 yrs. takes some getting used to, but I finally have it down. Still wouldn't want an auto.

Con Artist 12-19-2012 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FDHog (Post 3120934)
I thought it was me. I've been driving stick for 40yrs, yeah I'm an old fart, and never had a problem. The clutch engages early enough, but it doesn't do it gradually. It goes from light engagement to full engagement very quickly. I stalled out more in the 1st 2 weeks than I have in 40 yrs. takes some getting used to, but I finally have it down. Still wouldn't want an auto.

^ This.

Welcome to the forum. :thumb:

mflint1513 12-19-2012 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuruYaekob
While driving my Jeep today I noticed my 2012 hesitates when I start from a stop. I know how to drive manual so I don't think its my doing. Soon as I touch the gas and start letting off the clutch the rpms dip for a second then I gotta mash the gas to get it going before it dies. Its as if there is a dead space for about a half an inch or so in my gas pedal. I've killed this Jeep more than any manual I have ever owned. The problem with mashing the gas is its starting to get winter time here and the last thing I need is my tires spinning out of control because I have this dead space. Is there any way to fix this? Does anyone else have this issue? Do I just suck at the JK clutch?:hide:

What gears, tires, and transmission are you running?

gnarlyswine 01-01-2013 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CampThree1982 (Post 3119936)
I too have driven a stick since the late 70's including 5 Harley's and large trucks. I've never stalled a vehicle more than with this one. Backing up my driveway is useless. I think I'll disengage the hill assist and see what that does. I've read on here some folks start off in Second gear not sure what difference that makes but I've tried it a few times and it seems to work. I've got a Rubicon so the lower gears may make that possible.

Im a rubicon , with hill start disabled.
I agree with the suggestions that staying off the throttle seems to be the solution.
Im hoping that some kind of power control module will come out soon and that may help things.

97wrangler-242 01-01-2013 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuruYaekob

I don't get what your saying?

Push clutch to floor
let it all the way out? (this would kill it)
then press gas?

I'm lost

Take off with out giving it gas....

Z28Bryan 01-01-2013 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97wrangler-242 (Post 3168857)
Take off with out giving it gas....

I'd like more info on this as well!!! The drive by wire system in the wrangler is horrible. Definitely one of the more challenging manuals I've driven.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:52 AM.