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-   -   pondering a CAI thought.... (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f282/pondering-a-cai-thought-22751.html)

bubbadiddit 11-01-2008 12:43 AM

pondering a CAI thought....
 
So I was looking in my Quadratec catalog at the K&N FIPK intake. I had this intake on my last TJ along with a Flowmaster muffler welded into the factory exhaust. They definitely improved my overall mileage and performance. Anyway, I was looking at the dyno chart and between 2-3000 RPM you are only looking at a maximum gain of maybe 3 hp with the greatest gain at around 4700 RPM. Now you are heavy in the pedal at that high of RPM to recieve the full benefit. In my thinking (coming from a diesel) it would seem to make more sense for your power gain to be down low (2000+ RPM). I would think this would help better off road as well as on road in performance and economy. You should be more efficient in getting your "load" moving (bigger tires, stop and start, climbing, etc.) and then cruising under less power. The only off road needs for power in the upper RPM range that I can see are in mud or sand. Would this be a fairly accurate line of thought?

My second thought is this: If you wanted a snorkel system, you pretty much have two options- ARB and Volant. Now, the Volant only works with their intake so you must make two large purchases and would possibly have more cool air flow than the average person could realistically use on a 4.0. With the ARB, if I'm not mistaken, it attaches to the factory intake. With this system you could use something like a K&N flat panel filter (or similar make) to increase flow and still gain the benefits of cooler air from outside, but would be in alot cheaper. With either system you should recieve at least a marginal ram air type of benefit at highway speeds.

QTEC- K&N FIPK- total cost $275.99

Volant CAI - $309.99
Volant Periscoop- $349.99
total cost $659.98

ARB snorkel- $355.99
K&N flat filter- $45.99
total cost $401.98

Fire away people.....

tj1230 11-01-2008 06:26 AM

Bubba:
I notice mine power in the lower range. I didn't buy this CAI, I built this one. But very similar design to ones like AEM, and what not.

As far as the snorkel: You can use a OEM type K&N with it. There are a few other companies that make the snorkel setup for the TJ's and JKs. They do provide minimal difference. Rubiconmebaby has the snorkel setup and until he goes fording or we get it wet, he said no difference in power or MPG gain and somewhat of a pain.

bubbadiddit 11-01-2008 04:28 PM

I wasn't looking at the snorkel as a power adding part, just that it could possibly lead to minimal gains. I actually noticed no difference with the K&N FIPK only on my last TJ. When I added the Flowmaster is where I saw gains. I don't believe an intake alone will be of any benifit as you still have a bottleneck at the exhaust. If I had to choose between exhaust or intake only, I will always side with exhaust.

I want a snorkel kit on mine. However, with the benefits of a CAI being more on the top end, I don't see spending the money on the Volant system when you could still get cooler air and better flow (compared to OEM) from the ARB/K&N panel system. If someone wanted to get another 75-100hp, there are alot better options than spending $1500+ on bolt on parts that won't get close such as intakes, throttle bodies, throttle body spacers, electronics, headers, exhaust, etc. For that kind of money, you could do a basic V8 swap and probably be more satisfied not to mention the added cool factor. I was just wondering if anyone had ever thought along the same lines or had experiences to suggest otherwise. I'm going the less expensive route...... with the snorkel and will probably make modifications to the factory intake to increase flow rate.

Jerry Bransford 11-01-2008 05:27 PM

Personally, I don't think any of those so-called CAI intakes are worth the powder to blow them to hell. They can help with engines that came from the factory with restrictive air intakes but the 4.0L intake is already capable of flowing far more air than the engine can consume in any condition.

Plus, what's worse, is that K&N's air filters are well known for being one of the worst at actually filtering dirt out of the air. It passed more fine dirt and silica than any other filter tested in an ISO test of air filters published a few years ago. Even if the engine could utilize more air flow, which it truly can't, the last air filter I would run would be a K&N. I value my engine's longevity so you won't catch me running any more K&N air filters. I have the data and charts to back that up in case what I said is doubted.

In fact, I used to run a K&N until I noticed how grimy the air intake started getting once I installed the K&N. Before I junked it last year, I ended up installing not one, but TWO prefilters on it to get its air filtration to the point my air intake was staying clean again. What a POS filter the K&N is... their hype is so misleading!

Here's a photo of my old K&N with the two pre-filters pulled back to see them more clearly. The first layer was an Outerwears, the outside was a foam Unifilter.

flattietj 11-01-2008 09:46 PM

i have to agree that the kandn filter and their stats are a joke....i do run one however and it is bolted directly to my throttle body.....you need to have a big engine to really show any gains in air filters

bubbadiddit 11-01-2008 10:58 PM

Jerry, I believe I remember hearing something about that a while back. That's why I said "or similar make". I am a firm believer in foam filters for off road conditions. Alot of people I know run K&N in their ATV's while I have always run the UNI filters. K&N filters are probably great for someone on a dragstrip where there's not alot of dirt and dust. What do you guys think about the Fram or Tru-Flow replacements? My TJ will spend the majority of its life for the next 2 years on the street, so I'm not as worried about the filtration properties as much right now. However, I don't like doing things twice so this will be a one time modification. Anybody have any thoughts one way or the other on my "power down low" thinking? Am I correct in that for useable power and economy?

Jerry Bransford 11-02-2008 08:34 AM

I would have just gone back to a factory style paper air filter box bubbadiddit but I have a York air compressor in the way. So when I got rid of the K&N, I converted to a TrueFlow. It's far better than the K&N but still not as good as a paper element air filter.

A CAI, regardless of the air filter brand used, really isn't going to do anything noticeable aside from a likely placebo effect due to its louder air intake noise.

If it were me, I'd put that money into skid plates, rocker guards, lunchbox locker, or something that will actually be useful and provide a nice benefit for the $$$. :)


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