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-   -   Drop Pitarm (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f282/drop-pitarm-2364.html)

BlueBoy 07-23-2006 01:39 PM

Drop Pitman arm
 
Will a new drop pitman arm help in curing my death wobble? I cant get over 35 with it happening. I already have an adjustable trackbar and steering stabilizer on their way. Thanks guys.

bluvikng 07-23-2006 01:51 PM

I am not sure why you are having so much trouble with your lift. Do you have risers for your front and rear track arms? The 4" lift kit that I got, had risers, and a different pitman arm. The geometry changes with any suspension lift. Even with the adjustable track arm, you are supposed to have a riser on the axle end, to compensate for the rise in suspension.

If you need, I can take some pictures of what I am talking about.

JeepCrawler98 07-23-2006 01:56 PM

Nope - in fact depending on your suspension setup it might make steering worse. You should only use drop pitman arms if you:

A) Triangulate the front suspension, eliminating the track bar, thus requiring steering angles as horizontal as possible

B) Have a dropped track-bar, in which case you need the dropped pitman arm to bring the drag link, and track-bar, back as close to parallel to each other as possible.

Without these conditions - you'll start getting bump steer with JUST a dropped pitman.

Have you tried setting your cast angles a little more aggressive in the negative direction? Sometimes that will help if the track bar doesnt fix it. Also make sure your toe in is between 1/16" to 1/8" - too much can cause death wobble, too little will make it track funny. Check to make sure your LCA bushings are also in good shape. Next you will want to check your ball joints and unit bearing - jack up the front axle, and hold the tire at the 12 and 6 o clock position. If you feel ANY play the unit bearings are bad. Then take off one of the tires and disconnect the drag link/tie rod. Check to make sure your knuckles pivot smoothly, and have a good bit of consistent drag on them.

JeepCrawler98 07-23-2006 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluvikng
I am not sure why you are having so much trouble with your lift. Do you have risers for your front and rear track arms? The 4" lift kit that I got, had risers, and a different pitman arm. The geometry changes with any suspension lift. Even with the adjustable track arm, you are supposed to have a riser on the axle end, to compensate for the rise in suspension.

If you need, I can take some pictures of what I am talking about.

?Que?

Risers? Track arms?

bluvikng 07-23-2006 02:17 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by JeepCrawler98
?Que?

Risers? Track arms?


Yes, risers for the trac bars, as seen on this photo. Risers are circled.

Attachment 444

Also comes with longer lower control arms, dropped pitman arm, and they all work great........have not had any wobble problems with this kit. The geometry is kept correct.

BlueBoy 07-23-2006 03:09 PM

My 3 inch Black Diamond kit came with the following:
-Front and Rear Coil Springs
-4 Shocks
-Front and Rear Bump Stops
-Front Sway Bar Links
-Rear Sway Bar Links
-Rear Track Bar Bracket
-Transfer Case Lowering Kit
-Installation Hardware

I am adding a steering stabilizer and adjustable trackbar. Other than that, it is a 2005 stock X. So no on the drop pitman arm?

JeepCrawler98 07-23-2006 03:46 PM

If it's just your average aftermarket that does not come with a drop bracket, then no, don't go with a drop pitman arm.

4Jeepn 07-23-2006 03:50 PM

Check alignment.. plus the fancy words castor camber etc...
Check wheel/tire balance
check all control arm bolts
check track-bar bolts
sway-bar bolts
check front driveshaft bolts

then if that does not work..I have no clue.. take it to a 4x4 shop...

bluvikng 07-23-2006 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeepCrawler98
?Que?

Risers? Track arms?


You are right, they are called, "drop brackets", guess I am more tired than I thought.

BlueBoy 07-23-2006 04:59 PM

Why would installing the drop pitman arm hurt me? Im better off without it? Sorry for all the questions. I am justing looking for a solution becasue it sucks driving a honda accord when a jeep is in the garage.

97TJAC 07-23-2006 05:42 PM

I have a 4" kit with a RE HD adjustable trac bar that i had to put on a drop bracket for it
and i never changed the pitman arm and i dont have a bit of problem driving mine until i get to around 70-80 then all i feel is slight vibration

JeepCrawler98 07-23-2006 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueBoy
Why would installing the drop pitman arm hurt me? Im better off without it? Sorry for all the questions. I am justing looking for a solution becasue it sucks driving a honda accord when a jeep is in the garage.

Because the track-bar you have causes your axle to pivot along it's axis created between the bolt that holds it on the axle, and the bolt on the frame. Geometrically, and ideally, you'll want the drag link to be equal in length to your track bar pivoting piints, and run exactly parallel to them - because in this situation, your steering control link pivots WITH the axle (which is controlled by the track bar). The further you deviate from this (shorter drag links, varying your angle between the drag link and your track bar, etc.) the further away your steering and suspension become from working together. THis means when you hit bumps - the wheels will start steering in one direction or another, bump steer, being the most common phenomenon of this problem.

True - yeah you can steer your Jeep just fine unless you're talking MAJOR differences between the track bar and drag link. But steerable, and perfection (as close as you can get to it anyways), are two different things.

If you want the benefit of less extreme angles (improved steering response, smoother ride, more steering 'strength', better road tracking, less vibrations/shimmies, slower wear and tear, better off-road performance/geometry in re-astablishing proper antisquat values and roll axis' [something that can NOT be done with any short arm sytem once it's lifted], etc.) then you need to adress the steering and suspension at the same time, and treat them as two systems that work as one.

BlueBoy 07-23-2006 08:28 PM

Ok, Drop Pitman Arm is out. Any other things you guys suggest doing in addition to the adjustable track bar, steering stabilizer, and of course the tightening of bolts, aligment, and re-balancing? Is there something that was missing from my kit or is the installer just worthless? I didnt think death wobble would occur eveytime I drove, which is what is happening to me.

JeepCrawler98 07-23-2006 08:29 PM

How many miles on your stock control arms? Oh and make sure that your front cam bolts on the lower control arms are so that the little circle in the washer is pointing straight forward - this puts your caster in a good place and helps with the wobble and overall highway handling quiet often

BlueBoy 07-23-2006 08:33 PM

8,000 miles

JeepCrawler98 07-23-2006 08:41 PM

They should still be good then if that's 8,000 original. Your track bar is a good start, if not - check your toe in and caster (make sure caster is about -7*, and that toe in is at 1/16 to 1/8" - do NOT have them set it to factory specs if you're not gonna do it yourself)

BlueBoy 07-23-2006 08:46 PM

Ok, thank you very much. Im going to print this and give it to him. lol. Anything else?

1BLKJP 07-24-2006 06:02 PM

If it continues you might want to drop your track bar from the axle end and see if the bolt hole is wallowed out. If so then no matter how much you tighten it the bolt will move in that hole and cause DW. Otherwise then tighten down everything in the front end. Don't just try to wiggle it by hand. Your jeep exerts much more force than you do. :D

bad00jeep 07-24-2006 07:56 PM

i had a serious problem with DW, then i bought a new currie front adjustable track bar and the problem went away.

My problem: The bolt on the track bar into the frame was worn down and allowed some play even when tightened down. This allowed the axle to move just enough to get it going, then it didn't want to stop.


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