Jeep Wrangler Forum

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-   -   2016 Wranglers (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/2016-wranglers-248871.html)

bbtj 06-12-2013 08:47 AM

2016 Wranglers
 
http://www.wranglerforum.com/newthre...newthread&f=33.

I know the wife likes the air suspension in her Grand Cherokee. I wonder how well it will work with a lift kit.

cmaggi2 06-12-2013 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbtj (Post 3852410)
http://www.wranglerforum.com/newthre...newthread&f=33.

I know the wife likes the air suspension in her Grand Cherokee. I wonder how well it will work with a lift kit.

Did you mean to link to a new thread? If so, nice troll...you got me.

How high above stock does the air suspension lift the GC?

panthermark 06-12-2013 09:31 AM

Is there supposed to be a link to an article? If not, this thread will be locked.

Texas_Jeep 06-12-2013 09:47 AM

I think he meant this
2016 Jeep Wrangler Details Hinted at in Job Postings | AutoGuide.com News

panthermark 06-12-2013 09:50 AM

:popcorn:

xcraftllc 06-12-2013 12:28 PM

I think it's way too early to be sure of anything but I think air suspension may be a bad move if it isn't built tough enough or severely limits an owners ability to lift.

R4D4R 06-12-2013 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xcraftllc (Post 3853160)
I think it's way too early to be sure of anything but I think air suspension may be a bad move if it isn't built tough enough or severely limits an owners ability to lift.

Even if there was some sort of air suspension, no doubt that it would only be an option and probably only available in a Sahara level trim.

DC Dennis 06-12-2013 01:05 PM

Lots of owners of late 90s Range Rovers have converted back to springs.

Bayouwolf 06-12-2013 01:48 PM

Giving yourself an additional 1-2" of lift by selecting a dial would be really appealing to a guy who bought the Wrangler as a 95% daily driver and only runs off road on the very rare occasion.Since we know there's a "Rubicon X" coming this year, maybe a "Sahara X" is in the works as well.

Or conversely, you could drop your stance down 1-2" to pick up a few extra MPG's while on the highway, then crank it back up when you get to the soccer field and there's a puddle in the grassy parking lot. :p

live_slow 06-12-2013 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayouwolf (Post 3853394)
and there's a puddle in the grassy parking lot. :p

assuming you have extended breathers and a snorkel of course :thumb:

mike1158 06-12-2013 01:56 PM

just as a side note...the way they broke up the paint on that Jeep pictured in the article REALLY plays tricks on your eyes...looks like a totally different shape....

Abnormal-JK 06-12-2013 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmaggi2 (Post 3852461)
How high above stock does the air suspension lift the GC?

On a 2013 GC I saw at an event, it was about 6" of travel...

SouthTJ 06-12-2013 02:20 PM

I'm sure the Jeep air suspension would be just as reliable as the ones in the Land Rovers. :rolleyes:

Rubi513 06-12-2013 02:42 PM

Just give me the diesel and I will be happy.

bbtj 06-13-2013 08:35 AM

Thanks
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas_Jeep (Post 3852610)

Yes, that is the link I tried to copy.

xcraftllc 06-13-2013 11:18 AM

What really bugs me about this new wrangler stuff is that Jeep doesn't really have any competitors, so why aren't they asking us what we want the new Wrangler to be? FJ sales are miserable, and GM killed any chance of Hummers being reputable offroad machines, and Land Rover is still much more focused on luxury than off-road performance now. So why not make a page on their website or even an entire independent website dedicated to Wrangler ideas? I wonder if Fiat just doesn't understand what they have...I wish some investors would get together with AM General and buy Jeep back.

Hokieneer 06-13-2013 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xcraftllc (Post 3856953)
What really bugs me about this new wrangler stuff is that Jeep doesn't really have any competitors, so why aren't they asking us what we want the new Wrangler to be? FJ sales are miserable, and GM killed any chance of Hummers being reputable offroad machines, and Land Rover is still much more focused on luxury than off-road performance now. So why not make a page on their website or even an entire independent website dedicated to Wrangler ideas? I wonder if Fiat just doesn't understand what they have...I wish some investors would get together with AM General and buy Jeep back.

I agree with you on that one I wish Jeep and other manufactures would use these forums more. but in reality if they asked us what we wanted the next Jeep to be it would have a bedlined interior, water-proofed electronics, Dana 60's front and rear, V8 and diesel option, truck option, a 7000lb towing capacity min, 35's from the factory with 37's as an option, sealed transmission, intakes built into the A pillars for a factory snorkle, oh and a cover in the back for cargo.... WAIT thats exactly what I want!!! Please build it! They would sell a bunch of those to us but unfortunately we are a small percentage of the people who buy wranglers. The AM General is an interesting idea but I'll throw out another lets find out who owns the kaiser name plate and start making M 715's again! competition breeds excellence!

xcraftllc 06-13-2013 11:46 AM

Lol yeah, they'd have to filter out a lot of the niche market stuff and specifics. Its funny that you mention the A-pillar snorkle cuz I was lookin at my jeep the other day thinking "well shit since the winsheild on a JK is practically unfoldable, and the a pillar is so thick, why didn't they just rout the intake through it"

I like to think that the "wrangler team" or whatever at Jeep really is a group of enthusiasts and pays attention to us, but with the new "cherokee" and crap like the compass out there, I can't help but get worried. Especially when my jeep weighs 4000lbs stock and has a windsheild like it does...

Hokieneer 06-13-2013 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xcraftllc (Post 3857028)
Lol yeah, they'd have to filter out a lot of the niche market stuff and specifics. Its funny that you mention the A-pillar snorkle cuz I was lookin at my jeep the other day thinking "well shit since the winsheild on a JK is practically unfoldable, and the a pillar is so thick, why didn't they just rout the intake through it"

I like to think that the "wrangler team" or whatever at Jeep really is a group of enthusiasts and pays attention to us, but with the new "cherokee" and crap like the compass out there, I can't help but get worried. Especially when my jeep weighs 4000lbs stock and has a windsheild like it does...

I think an A pillar snorkel would be sweet! Yeah I hope they are too and based on the concept jeeps built they are but corporate may stand in their way I just hope that isn't the case with the wrangler and corporate realizes how much of an icon the wrangler is

live_slow 06-13-2013 12:27 PM

It's a double edged sword -- and there are multiple examples of what the profit motive does to vehicle design in our shared history.

If Jeep "listened" to the majority of Wrangler JK owners, we don't know if it would remain the purpose built vehicle that it has always been or if it would morph into a more "comfortable" daily driver.

The way I see it, people who value the off road capability or the rolling anachronism of building up a mall crawler have one major ally, the aftermarket vendors.

In my opinion, Fiat has listened to us (meaning trail riders, the built mall crawler crowd and the aftermarket) at least for now. As evidence, the 10A and the built concepts they rolled out.

Now, if they listen to the people who only came over to the Jeep becuase the H3 died off or the FJ is limited production and about to die off, we may see some changes we don't liek. (IFS anyone? Doors that can't come off? A big ass motor driven drop top horror?)

The second factor is CAFE, and there's lots of reasons why we're OK. Sure the Jeeps will cost more, becuase they're going to have to get lighter. In fact, it's going to be more expensive to shave weight off the Jeep than the average passenger car. You can only do so much with weight and gears and fancy transmissions while keeping the price under 40K. So that's a big unknown.

I look for the JKU to get a tad bigger since the new CAFE is measured by footprint (how much physical space it takes up). The JKU is really in position to meet CAFE out to 2020 or so, perhaps with a small fine per unit sold, with only a bit of tweaking.

Unless I'm reading the new standards wrong - (footprint, physical space) - it's the JK that has to get the most work done.

Corporate Average Fuel Economy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

legitposter 06-13-2013 01:17 PM

Jeep will never listen to forums because the forums are filled with true Jeepers. That's a small percentage of the overall buyers.

Most buyers are like me... The Daily drivers. These people (me) would prefer thick non-removeable doors that help block sound more, a slanted non-foldable windshield that cuts down on costs and helps with gas mileage, and better aerodynamics. I'd also like the spare removed ,TASTEFULLY not ugly, with an inflation kit included instead. I'd also like some modernized headlights, like the Grand Cherokee's, with HID as an option.

So what's my point? True Jeepers have different tastes than the daily driver type, and the daily driver type makes up a considerably larger chunk of the sales. So don't expect Jeep/Fiat to take ideas from the forum.

panthermark 06-13-2013 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by legitposter (Post 3857320)
Jeep will never listen to forums because the forums are filled with true Jeepers. That's a small percentage of the overall buyers.

Most buyers are like me... The Daily drivers. These people (me) would prefer thick non-removeable doors that help block sound more, a slanted non-foldable windshield that cuts down on costs and helps with gas mileage, and better aerodynamics. I'd also like the spare removed ,TASTEFULLY not ugly, with an inflation kit included instead. I'd also like some modernized headlights, like the Grand Cherokee's, with HID as an option.

So what's my point? True Jeepers have different tastes than the daily driver type, and the daily driver type makes up a considerably larger chunk of the sales. So don't expect Jeep/Fiat to take ideas from the forum.

I'm a mall crawler/daily driver....and the only thing I want out of what you listed is better headlights. But, your overall point is something I agree with.

On a side note, Jeep does listen. Take a 2010 Wrangler and compare it to a 2014. New engine, new transmissions, new interior, new seats (twice). So many people have swapped for rbz's that Jeep made it an option on the Sport. So many people have painted/plasti-dipped their wheels black that Jeep will offer a black Rubi wheel option for Sports. So many people cut their pinch seams that Jeep now does it from the factory. They are listening....but they are also trying to make a buck selling stuff that a large (not minority) of people want.

DC Dennis 06-13-2013 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by legitposter (Post 3857320)
Jeep will never listen to forums because the forums are filled with true Jeepers. That's a small percentage of the overall buyers.

Most buyers are like me... The Daily drivers. These people (me) would prefer thick non-removeable doors that help block sound more, a slanted non-foldable windshield that cuts down on costs and helps with gas mileage, and better aerodynamics. I'd also like the spare removed ,TASTEFULLY not ugly, with an inflation kit included instead. I'd also like some modernized headlights, like the Grand Cherokee's, with HID as an option.

So what's my point? True Jeepers have different tastes than the daily driver type, and the daily driver type makes up a considerably larger chunk of the sales. So don't expect Jeep/Fiat to take ideas from the forum.

Sounds like you want the Liberty with the giant cloth sunroof, not a Wrangler.

JandS 06-13-2013 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayouwolf (Post 3853394)
Giving yourself an additional 1-2" of lift by selecting a dial would be really appealing to a guy who bought the Wrangler as a 95% daily driver and only runs off road on the very rare occasion.Since we know there's a "Rubicon X" coming this year, maybe a "Sahara X" is in the works as well.

Or conversely, you could drop your stance down 1-2" to pick up a few extra MPG's while on the highway, then crank it back up when you get to the soccer field and there's a puddle in the grassy parking lot. :p

CAFE requirements are the biggest problem the Wrangler has going forward. Keep in mind that the manufacturer's total gas mileage is consiered, so it isn't lke they'll stop making the Wrangler, they'd just have to compensate through other vehicles. This of course creates pressure to get more mpgs out of the Wrangler.

The engine and transmission are pretty efficient by modern standards and the addition of direct injection would probably add 1-2 mpgs. This leaves weight and aero as the primary problems with mpgs on the Wrangler.

An air suspension would go a LONG ways towards improving the mpgs in the Wrangler where the biggest obstacle involves the aero penalty associated with a tall vehicle having lots of ground clearance. If the body could be lowered 4-6 inches, you'd probably get 2-3mpg on the highway. If you then added "skid plating" across the entire bottom of the vehicle, to make it perfectly flat, you'd probably get another 1-1.5 mpgs.

Of course, as pointed out, you could also raise the body for off roading, although larger tires are still the only way to lift those pumpkins.

I also wonder if active shutters on the grill would be useful - I could see .25-.5mpgs on the highway with those.

Quote:

Originally Posted by legitposter (Post 3857320)
Jeep will never listen to forums because the forums are filled with true Jeepers. That's a small percentage of the overall buyers.

Most buyers are like me... The Daily drivers. These people (me) would prefer thick non-removeable doors that help block sound more, a slanted non-foldable windshield that cuts down on costs and helps with gas mileage, and better aerodynamics. I'd also like the spare removed ,TASTEFULLY not ugly, with an inflation kit included instead. I'd also like some modernized headlights, like the Grand Cherokee's, with HID as an option.

So what's my point? True Jeepers have different tastes than the daily driver type, and the daily driver type makes up a considerably larger chunk of the sales. So don't expect Jeep/Fiat to take ideas from the forum.

I disagree. Jeep needs to take ideas from the forum for the "halo" Wranglers such as the Rubicon and incorporate the mainstream ideas where possible. The Jeep's off road image must be preserved at all costs, even if some capacity is suffered on lower end Jeeps.

Fortunately, many of the things that off roaders want also provide benefits for cruisers such as yourself. Things like more efficient (power and mpg) drivetrains and lighter parts have benefits for everyone.

SRTie4k 06-13-2013 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by legitposter (Post 3857320)
Jeep will never listen to forums because the forums are filled with true Jeepers. That's a small percentage of the overall buyers.

Most buyers are like me... The Daily drivers. These people (me) would prefer thick non-removeable doors that help block sound more, a slanted non-foldable windshield that cuts down on costs and helps with gas mileage, and better aerodynamics. I'd also like the spare removed ,TASTEFULLY not ugly, with an inflation kit included instead. I'd also like some modernized headlights, like the Grand Cherokee's, with HID as an option.

So what's my point? True Jeepers have different tastes than the daily driver type, and the daily driver type makes up a considerably larger chunk of the sales. So don't expect Jeep/Fiat to take ideas from the forum.

I think this is what you are looking for:

2014 Nissan Crosscabriolet | Nissan USA

terrabit 06-13-2013 02:26 PM

I guarantee that Chrysler has people who scout forums for user feedback. But this only one source of high-value consumer demand driven input. All these sources get homogenized into cost/benefit analysis and processed through focus groups and tested thoroughly before being incorporated into anything coming down an assembly line. No manufacturer would be so foolish as to ignore this kind of data. I assure you that a brand such as Jeep does.

joeuncool 06-13-2013 02:40 PM

They are saying that the Stitch concept may give us an idea of the direction Mopar is moving with the Wrangler. They are saying that they want to reduce weight which will increase efficiency.

Then I look at details of the Stitch and read:

" To shave off the pounds, the audio system, heating and air conditioning, rear seats, doors, and sections of the body were all removed from the Wrangler Stitch."

Yup, that will get the prospective buyers lining up at the door. :rofl:

Shoot, I wondered how much I lightened up my JKUR when I take of my hard top and 4 doors.

live_slow 06-13-2013 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JandS (Post 3857478)
CAFE requirements are the biggest problem the Wrangler has going forward. Keep in mind that the manufacturer's total gas mileage is consiered, so it isn't lke they'll stop making the Wrangler, they'd just have to compensate through other vehicles. This of course creates pressure to get more mpgs out of the Wrangler.

I agree that if there is a redesign in 2016, and CAFE is any concern for Fiat, the Wrangler is going to have to leap some serious hurdles, especially the JK, the JKU may be ok a bit longer (figurative and literal, since it is longer). It depends on how they are classed and measured.

But the new standards aren't as forgiving on the "corporate average" part.

You can't throw in a 40 MPG baby Jeep to make a 2DR Rubi (with it's smaller than truck physical footprint) OK.

The way it'll probably go down is what you posted, a few tricks to keep it the same and get 2-3 MPG bump. Then after 2017, each model JK and JKU sold would get a fine, passed on to us. This is the "market pressure" everyone at the table agreed to follow.

I'd rather have more lightweight bits and a higher up-front cost than be part of the fine payin' myself.

Anyway, with 2020 supposedly being a big breakover year for CAFE out to whatever year we have flying cars, I see something really light and really small (JK) and something bigger than the current Jeep (JKU) to jump into "truck" MPGs.

Rubi513 06-13-2013 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by legitposter (Post 3857320)
Jeep will never listen to forums because the forums are filled with true Jeepers. That's a small percentage of the overall buyers.

Most buyers are like me... The Daily drivers. These people (me) would prefer thick non-removeable doors that help block sound more, a slanted non-foldable windshield that cuts down on costs and helps with gas mileage, and better aerodynamics. I'd also like the spare removed ,TASTEFULLY not ugly, with an inflation kit included instead. I'd also like some modernized headlights, like the Grand Cherokee's, with HID as an option.

So what's my point? True Jeepers have different tastes than the daily driver type, and the daily driver type makes up a considerably larger chunk of the sales. So don't expect Jeep/Fiat to take ideas from the forum.


The day they make the jeep you want will be the day I quit buying jeeps.

Hokieneer 06-13-2013 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeuncool (Post 3857575)
They are saying that the Stitch concept may give us an idea of the direction Mopar is moving with the Wrangler. They are saying that they want to reduce weight which will increase efficiency.

Then I look at details of the Stitch and read:

" To shave off the pounds, the audio system, heating and air conditioning, rear seats, doors, and sections of the body were all removed from the Wrangler Stitch."

Yup, that will get the prospective buyers lining up at the door. :rofl:

Shoot, I wondered how much I lightened up my JKUR when I take of my hard top and 4 doors.

The funny part about all the new materials etc they had to use to get to the 3k mark is that at that mark they still out weigh a stock CJ8. I wonder what kind of mpg a CJ8 could do with a pentastar? that sounds like a fun project!


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