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-   -   38s on a 4 banger (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f218/38s-on-a-4-banger-250585.html)

petercass88 06-20-2013 10:16 AM

38s on a 4 banger
 
I saw a nice set of 38x15.5x15 super swampers (5 tires) up for sale and trying to think if this could even work with my 4 banger... aside from having to do a SOA, should I be worried about having no power at all or possibly stressing the motor and tranny too much? I have dynatrac d60 axles with 4.88 gears and also terralow 4 to 1 transfer case gears for 4 lo. I have no concerns with 4 low considering I can walk next to it in 3rd gear at idle with 33s on it.

OverkillYJ 06-20-2013 10:18 AM

No

BCDonny 06-20-2013 10:26 AM

I would say that would be a total waste of money and time!!!!

JACK3D 06-20-2013 10:30 AM

Agreed. 38's would be way too much for the 4cyl to handle.

Cons_Table 06-20-2013 10:36 AM

I may be the outcast, but if you gear it down more, I think you'd be ok. Don't expect it to haul...but it would be manageable. If a trail rig only...even better.

SO many guys are running big tires on their yota 4 bangers. My buddy is running 37s on his yota with the 22r with 5.13 gears, and he's handling highway speeds fine. I also have another friend with a sami tube buggy who is running 40s on a 4banger. Offroad, both of them have twin tcases.

4.88 gears won't be too good for you, but since you have D60s, you can go much deeper. IMO.

schnutzy 06-20-2013 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cons_Table (Post 3881276)
I may be the outcast, but if you gear it down more, I think you'd be ok. Don't expect it to haul...but it would be manageable. If a trail rig only...even better.

SO many guys are running big tires on their yota 4 bangers. My buddy is running 37s on his yota with the 22r with 5.13 gears, and he's handling highway speeds fine. I also have another friend with a sami tube buggy who is running 40s on a 4banger. Offroad, both of them have twin tcases.

4.88 gears won't be too good for you, but since you have D60s, you can go much deeper. IMO.

x2
since youve already got the 60s, go deep and dont look back :thumb:

OverkillYJ 06-20-2013 10:45 AM

If you want to go bigger than 35's you should swap the engine, and the transmission. I am assuming you have a stick not an auto. AX5 will go pop over 35". Even with 4.88. If you want to go big you should drop in a new motor/trans combo.

Cons_Table 06-20-2013 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OverkillYJ (Post 3881310)
If you want to go bigger than 35's you should swap the engine, and the transmission. I am assuming you have a stick not an auto. AX5 will go pop over 35". Even with 4.88. If you want to go big you should drop in a new motor/trans combo.

I was actually going to mention the transmission... cuz I know the AX5 is not the best of options.

As far as the motor...why do you say? What is so different about the jeeps than all the other rigs out there that compensate for motor size with gearing?

Xpress 06-20-2013 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OverkillYJ (Post 3881310)
If you want to go bigger than 35's you should swap the engine, and the transmission. I am assuming you have a stick not an auto. AX5 will go pop over 35". Even with 4.88. If you want to go big you should drop in a new motor/trans combo.

It will be fine if he keeps his gearing in check. If the gears are done right it will be nearly like driving a stock driveline.

petercass88 06-20-2013 11:58 AM

Hmm this sounds like a long project that I dont want to deal with right now lol! I appreciate the thoughts all, I will let the temptation pass...
Just
Empty
Every
Pocket

Its an addiction

OverkillYJ 06-20-2013 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xpress (Post 3881348)

It will be fine if he keeps his gearing in check. If the gears are done right it will be nearly like driving a stock driveline.

Yeah so if you check the calculator what would you need for 38" to = the stock tires with 410? Not to mention you still have more weight.

Dixie fix 06-20-2013 01:21 PM

I think you would be fine, honestly I'd look for 5.13 gears or even 5.38 but not gonna hurt anything with that much gearing. It will be a turd though.

OverkillYJ 06-20-2013 01:53 PM

You would need somewhere around 5.71-6.17. I would say 6.17 just because of the weight. Bigger motor is still better way to go though.

petercass88 06-20-2013 01:54 PM

I dont wanna turn it into a turd :( I would be happy with swapping my 33s for 35s though.

petercass88 06-20-2013 01:55 PM

Swapping 4.88s for 5.38s would probably be the right way to go but then buying about 900 in tires turns into about 3000 in tires (or more)

Dixie fix 06-20-2013 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OverkillYJ (Post 3882045)
You would need somewhere around 5.71-6.17. I would say 6.17 just because of the weight. Bigger motor is still better way to go though.

I ran 44's 46's and military 49's with a 4.2l and 5.38's and I could spin them. The military tires were 300 pounds each. This was in a 99 f150.

Dixie fix 06-20-2013 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petercass88 (Post 3882051)
Swapping 4.88s for 5.38s would probably be the right way to go but then buying about 900 in tires turns into about 3000 in tires (or more)

Do you have any pictures of your d60 swap?

With 4.88's I'd just jump up to 35's or 36's an be done:punk:

forsaken82 06-20-2013 02:31 PM

i had a 4 banger with 5.13s and it would do 80 with 39.5s. i eventually blew the motor but that was do to a seemingly bottomless hole not the tires. i say do it!

OverkillYJ 06-20-2013 02:39 PM

I dont know. I got 33's with 410 and a 2.5. I couldnt imagine going to 35's without regearing which probably wouldn't be too far off 38's with 4.88. I know people do it, but it seems like spending money on other things to make it more driveable is the best way to go. Unless it is off road only.

petercass88 06-20-2013 03:07 PM

I do not have any pictures at the moment but I will take some :) previous owner did the swap - they are dynatrac D60s. I have had some people here on the forums discount them as NOT being D60s however considering how massive they are, the tubes are definitely far larger than 1.75 inches.

OverkillYJ 06-20-2013 03:58 PM

Yeah, that doesnt make much sense though. Who the hell would put those axles on a 2.5? All that money into a 4cyl. Seems like if it was going to be built like that it would not have the 2.5 in it any longer. Those axles would be worth more than the rest of the entire Jeep. I know for front and back Dynatrac D60's you are looking at a ballpark of $10k new.

BDK 06-20-2013 05:34 PM

With the proper gearing you can make it work. But is this your DD? If it is you don't want a bias ply swamper. They are loud as hell and have the manners of rosanne barr at a buffet.

When I first bought my YJ it had 36" Swamper TSLs on it and it was hell! Every little crack or dip in the road it felt like it wanted to lurch that direction! Oh not to mention bias ply are great offroad but wer like crap on pavement.

petercass88 06-20-2013 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OverkillYJ (Post 3882532)
Yeah, that doesnt make much sense though. Who the hell would put those axles on a 2.5? All that money into a 4cyl. Seems like if it was going to be built like that it would not have the 2.5 in it any longer. Those axles would be worth more than the rest of the entire Jeep. I know for front and back Dynatrac D60's you are looking at a ballpark of $10k new.

I thought the same thing when i saw those beefcakes underneath it when i went to buy it. The back story is that the guy i bought it off only did preventative maintenance to it while it was in his care. The TRUE PO was in the military and dumped it on the guy i bought it from when he was shipped overseas. He might have been caught just prior to doing an engine swap. I may never know...

Here are the axles though:
http://i.imgur.com/VEFkAaT.jpg
^^^ Rear

http://i.imgur.com/Yv3xMwR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/dBtyfia.jpg
^^^ Front

petercass88 06-20-2013 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BDK (Post 3882877)
With the proper gearing you can make it work. But is this your DD? If it is you don't want a bias ply swamper. They are loud as hell and have the manners of rosanne barr at a buffet.

When I first bought my YJ it had 36" Swamper TSLs on it and it was hell! Every little crack or dip in the road it felt like it wanted to lurch that direction! Oh not to mention bias ply are great offroad but wer like crap on pavement.

This definitely is NOT a daily driver. At least not when im done doing what im doing to it! However it is a really nice ride on the roads especially if you want to take it for a cruise to/on the beach with the ATs on it.

Good to know that swampers are crap on the road though... that definitely impacts my decision. These wheels this guy is selling has massive lugs, basically brand new swampers. :whistling:

It sounds like leaving the 4.88s in there would be a bad idea. I really dont want to regear it so i think i am going to hold off. I needed the reality check! :surrender::hide:

95YamJam 06-21-2013 09:19 AM

I run 36" tsl super swamper RADIALS on mine. Way quieter and better road manners than my old 32" bfg km2's. Bfgs were new. Super swampers were. Almost new. Btw 4cyl 5spd. Stock gear. Does fine as an in town dd. No highway stuff really. 55 is about max speed. Lol!

petercass88 06-21-2013 12:15 PM

Haha many of the good trails around here would require some highway driving to get to and from so sadly it would be up on the highway on occasion :(

95YamJam 06-22-2013 08:08 PM

I never drive to trails any more. Most are over 100 miles away. It is so much easier for me to trailer it to the trails. But i do Daily drive it in town without issues.

Norcal_Chris 06-22-2013 11:51 PM

Some pretty dumb replies here..


It doesnt matter what motor you have.

You better go tell all those toyota guys on 37-40s with stock 22r 4 bangers that it cant be done, or that it is a waste of money.

I had 42in Bias TSLs on my blazer and it was a little chunky untill i drove about 5 blocks down the road and they smoothed out and drove perfectly fine. A coworker Daily drives his Dodge with 42in pitbull rockers and he says they ride great.


4.88 with 38 will not be bad at all. Especially with those TSLs because I bet they are probably closer to 36 36 1/2 in tall. You wont be able to use 5th gear, but it should cruise in 4th on the freeway with out much issue.

When i had 35in TSLS and 4.10 gears I was able to hold 4th all day on the freeway and had no issues cruising up the mountain. 38s with 4.88s puts you at 2800rpms in 4th as opposed to 2500rpms in 4th like i had. This is a great rpm range for the 2.5.


And the ax5 will be fine. Dont drive it like a idiot and bang gears or drop the clutch all the time and you shouldnt have an issue. One of my friends with 40s still has his ax5 and has been wheeling with it for 6 years now on 40s. Other friend has 39 Bfg reds and no issues for a couple years. I have been wheeling mine for 2 years now and it still shifts just as good as it did before.

OverkillYJ 06-23-2013 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norcal_Chris (Post 3890242)
Some pretty dumb replies here

Oh thank you for your wisdom. I love the part where you say the AX5 will be fine the most.

Xpress 06-23-2013 09:16 AM

The ax5 will be fine if you keep your gears in check. The transmission doesn't know it's driving 38" tires, it will feel like 28's to it with the right gears.

Considering the millions of people with 2.5L/Ax5 Jeeps that don't have issues, and also considering the handful or so of people here complaining about 'issues' with them, you can imply that there isn't really a major issue. Keep in mind this website reaches around the world, not just your area of town, so while you may find a hundred or so people have had some form of problem with the Ax5, you will find that hundreds of thousands of others have not had any issue. I never had issues with my Ax5, and its new owner still hasn't had any issues.

-----

BTW, comparing the 22R engines to the 2.5L is like trying to compare Japanese vs American engineering. Japanese engineering is just infinitely better. That 22R is just a better built engine, even the carb'd version. Has a better torque range, and the aftermarket world has endless supplies of performance parts (I've seen a hotrod 22RE pushing almost 400hp) :punk::whistling:


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