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-   -   Chrysler files for Chapter 11 bankruptcy (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f6/chrysler-files-for-chapter-11-bankruptcy-29914.html)

iamagolfspaz 04-30-2009 01:55 PM

Chrysler files for Chapter 11 bankruptcy
 
Here we go.

N39-W120 04-30-2009 02:06 PM

cut and paste over Jeep logo

http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive...-Logo-2000.jpg

cherokee980 04-30-2009 02:08 PM

sweet...think we can get some killer deals on a Jeep now? Going out of business sale maybe?

thaduke2003 04-30-2009 03:04 PM

Going bankrupt does not mean going out of business. Your dealerships will still be there on the corner (or mid-block :)), Jeep sure as hell isn't going anywhere, and the '10 models won't be Italian. Chrysler and Fiat have merged, and to get their poo back in order, Chrysler filed under Chapter 11 to buy them time to re-structure. It's a crappy way out, but since a bunch of arse hole hedge funds that owned Chrysler's debt (a portion) wouldn't budge, everyone gets stuck.
In a month or so, you probably won't see any more Commanders, Compasses or Patriots. Wrangler won't be going ANYWHERE- it's the one model that keeps selling strong, regardless of any downturn/depression/whatever- Mark W.

4point 04-30-2009 03:43 PM

Sure beats throwing tax dollars at them. Mark, it could be worse............. you could be working for a GM dealership.

Scout 04-30-2009 03:49 PM

29 cents on the dollar sucks. I wouldn't have settled for that amount either. I say good for the hedge funds for sticking to their guns. :)

jpdocdave 04-30-2009 03:54 PM

ya, they aren't going anywhere, just everyone they owe money to gets screwed.

at least chrysler isn't publicly traded....when united air lines went bakrupt, all the debtors got screwed, and all the stock holders lost everything...your stock in a company that goes bankrupt disappears.....and you don't just get stock in the new structure. you are left with zilch.

united air lines then re-opened with a new symbol at $30/ share:eek:

thaduke2003 04-30-2009 04:10 PM

Actually, the hedge fund guys are morons- they weren't being smart, they were being greedy- because of them, they're getting a LOT less of their $ back, AND Chrysler's going bankrupt.
And yeah, I'm damn glad I don't work for GM :) Mark W.

Dare2BSquare 04-30-2009 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4point (Post 364285)
Sure beats throwing tax dollars at them.

You mean other than that $8 billion loan they get now to restructure.

4point 04-30-2009 06:12 PM

I take back my comment. I thought this was a standard BK.


Quote:

Meltdown 101: How Chrysler bankruptcy is different

By VINNEE TONG 1 hour ago

The U.S. government expects Chrysler to spend one to two months in bankruptcy under a plan announced on Thursday.

But how is that possible, considering that most companies end up in bankruptcy court for more than a year, and sometimes longer? Also, what role is the government taking in the case, and how might that change the process?

Here are some questions and answers about the Chrysler bankruptcy.

Q: Does the bankruptcy filing mean Chrysler is going out of business?

A: No. Many companies file for Chapter 11 to cut costs or restructure their operations while the court keeps creditors at bay. That is what Chrysler is attempting to do use the bankruptcy laws to get rid of some liabilities then exit court protection.

President Barack Obama said the bankruptcy will give Chrysler time to finalize a deal with the Italian carmaker Fiat Group SpA, in an effort to revive the nation's third-largest automaker.

Companies that are clearly going out of business normally file for a different type of bankruptcy known as Chapter 7.

Q: Is this the same type of bankruptcy that businesses usually file for?

A: Many businesses that enter bankruptcy do file for Chapter 11 so, yes, it's the same type.

On the other hand, some businesses will file a Chapter 11 even when they are liquidating assets which is to say, unloading all of their stuff, and going out of business. Doing so gives them more control over the liquidation. But that does not appear to be the case here, since Chrysler doesn't plan to liquidate.

Q: Why is Chrysler entering bankruptcy even though the government had pledged financial support?

A: Even with government loans, Chrysler needed its lenders on board in order to avoid bankruptcy.

But a small group of lenders, calling themselves the "Non-Tarp Lenders to Chrysler," refused to support the government's plan for the Auburn Hills, Mich.-based automaker. By filing for bankruptcy, the government in essence called the group's bluff since lenders are worse off in bankruptcy than outside of it.

"By filing for bankruptcy, they have significantly diminished the leverage the lenders have," said David Skeel of the University of Pennsylvania Law School.

Q: What does Chrysler need to do next, and what else will need to happen before the company can emerge from court protection?

A: First and quickly Chrysler needs to finalize the deal with Fiat and secure the court's approval of such a deal.

"I see the case proceeding very similarly to Lehman's," said Seton Hall Law School Professor Stephen Lubben. "The big hump is the sale hearing."

(Lehman finalized the sale of its U.S. broker-dealer business the first week after it entered court protection on Sept. 15, 2008. All of its most valuable assets have since been sold off while the case itself still drags on.)

Lubben said Chrysler's timeframe of 30 days to 60 days refers to the formation of a new Chrysler, probably incorporating its most valuable assets. The company's creditors will likely be wrangling over what's left for much longer.

Skeel said Chrysler would eventually need to decide which dealerships to shut down and how to deal with the lingering costs for pensions and health care. Some of these "legacy costs" have been negotiated already.

Q: What role is the government taking in the case?

A: The government's role in the case is unprecedented in bankruptcy history, according to Skeel.

Once Chrysler emerges, the government will hold a stake in the company and will also be one of its biggest lenders. Senior administration officials said Thursday that the government will offer up to $8 billion in loans to fund Chrysler's operations during bankruptcy and to help it emerge.

"We have had big bankruptcies before," Skeel said. "We've never had anything that looked like this, where the government is masterminding the bankruptcy."


Q: Why would the company file in New York when it is based in Michigan?

A: Chrysler chose to file in New York for one reason: predictability.

"Everybody wants to be comfortable that the process is going to go the way they expect," Lubben of Seton Hall said. The higher volume of corporate bankruptcies in New York and Delaware and the accompanying track records make those courts more attractive to petitioners.

Q: Will I still be able to buy a Chrysler? If I already own one, will the company honor my warranty?

A: Yes, the company is expected to operate as it did before, with Chrysler selling cars and existing warranties guaranteed through a government program. One thing to watch is the future of dealerships. Dealers could be subject to scrutiny in bankruptcy court, where the company can cancel contracts with them if they get a judge's approval.

Q: What might this mean for General Motors, which has also been teetering?

A: How Chrysler's case goes holds enormous significance for General Motors Corp., the nation's biggest automaker.

"It will tell us a lot about GM," Skeel said. "What happens in the next week or so will have a big effect on how GM files."

If Chrysler's case goes smoothly, he said, expect GM to follow pretty quickly with its own bankruptcy filing.

Lubben agreed GM could file within the next few weeks, and said Chrysler's case was a harbinger of things to come.

"This is kind of the mini version of GM," he said.

Copyright 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

jpdocdave 04-30-2009 06:42 PM

:eek:

2much 04-30-2009 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thaduke2003 (Post 364309)
Actually, the hedge fund guys are morons- they weren't being smart, they were being greedy- because of them, they're getting a LOT less of their $ back, AND Chrysler's going bankrupt.
And yeah, I'm damn glad I don't work for GM :) Mark W.

The company or hedge fun guys that owned a large portion of Chrysler didn't want to throw more money into a sinking ship, Sen. Bob Corker brought this up in the initial hearings when Chrysler was asking for money, his sentiment was basically "if the guys behind the curtains who have plenty of money they could release to you guys won't do it, why should the government."
basically they didn't Chrysler was a viable enough company, so they didn't want to throw more money down the drain.

mntnclmbr 04-30-2009 08:35 PM

Hey guys, just a little interjection - 4POINT what you Quoted up above I believe is just the beginning, this will probably turn into a larger mess....I would imagine Chrysler will turn to Chapter 7 and cut their losses, but in turn will be bought out by Fiat. Fiat has just been minding their minutes and standing back to take over at a lower market share (how smart to buy a company for nothing?) This in turn may be the best thing that ever happened to this company....Chrysler won't leave the face of this earth, not in our life time it would create even bigger problems for Obama Bin Laden! And by the way those bastards that started the hedge fund !@#$ should go down as well.

Scout 04-30-2009 09:18 PM

Man can you imagine the next time you guy buy a Jeep the salesperson will have to call the Oval Office to see if your offer is accepted? :eek:

4point 04-30-2009 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scout (Post 364467)
Man can you imagine the next time you guy buy a Jeep the salesperson will have to call the Oval Office to see if your offer is accepted? :eek:

That would be better than financing with the Senate or Congress. You could just drive it away and those dumb asses would never know.

4Jeepn 04-30-2009 10:38 PM

This is Fiats 4x4...

http://www.fiat.com/FIAT_COM/uploads...howroom_01.jpg

This is, well I am not sure what this is...
http://www.fiat.com/FIAT_COM/uploads...ic_x_big_1.jpg

Scout 04-30-2009 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Jeepn (Post 364506)

I'd wheel it. It does have a luggage rack after all...

njatrtljp 04-30-2009 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thaduke2003 (Post 364248)
In a month or so, you probably won't see any more Commanders, Compasses or Patriots. Wrangler won't be going ANYWHERE- it's the one model that keeps selling strong, regardless of any downturn/depression/whatever- Mark W.

Mark I understand not seeing the commander anymore but why do think there will not be any more compasses or patriots. Where I live I see tons of them and fiat makes small 4x4s like those. Plus they are good vehicle for Jeep to keep to maintain CAFE regulations.

mntnclmbr 04-30-2009 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Jeepn (Post 364506)

Think you could get a long arm on that?

mntnclmbr 04-30-2009 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by njatrtljp (Post 364517)
Mark I understand not seeing the commander anymore but why do think there will not be any more compasses or patriots. Where I live I see tons of them and fiat makes small 4x4s like those. Plus they are good vehicle for Jeep to keep to maintain CAFE regulations.

My wife and I test drove those two piles, the commander is by far a better 4x4 then those wined-up-toys..........your right though, there are alot of them on the road.:zap:um

njatrtljp 04-30-2009 11:18 PM

I think the hard thing to get use to on the compass is the CVT transmission. if you are not use to how it works it will drive you crazy. I drive a compass and really enjoy it, not as much as the Rubicon I traded in for my family. I also see them as a better value vehicle down the road compared to the commander when it comes to depreciation. But I also to to each thier own.

thaduke2003 05-01-2009 06:06 AM

While there are a lot of them on the road, they detract from Jeep's core principles of going anywhere and being dependable and tough as nails- the CVT's are traditionally tough as glass :)
^ As he said, the CVT is love-it-or-hate-it.
Also, the Commander doesn't sell worth a crap, and that's why it was already likely on its way to the chopping block. The 3rd row is a JOKE, and otherwise, there's nothing to justify the extra $ over a GC besides the looks and a FEW cubic inches of interior space- Mark W.

njatrtljp 05-01-2009 10:08 AM

I drive my Compass in the mountains of NC and think it is pretty tough compared to other vehicles in its class. It got me through a pretty wicked winter storm with no problems. not to say that it can hold its own to even a stock wrangler. I think it will stick around for fiat to revamp the engine some and give Jeep a fairly well rounded car style suv with great mileage.

Dare2BSquare 05-01-2009 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mntnclmbr (Post 364518)
Think you could get a long arm on that?

IDK, but the approach angles are gonna need a whole new bumper.

skeeter 05-01-2009 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4point (Post 364388)
I take back my comment. I thought this was a standard BK.

The article forgets to mention that the deal gives the union a 55% share in Chrysler. It's going to be interesting watching a company run by the union and government try to be efficient and turn a profit...:rolleyes:

4point 05-01-2009 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeeter (Post 364743)
The article forgets to mention that the deal gives the union a 55% share in Chrysler. It's going to be interesting watching a company run by the union and government try to be efficient and turn a profit...:rolleyes:

That merger alone will be a defining moment for the Union and the Govt. If I was Fiat I'd abandon that relationship before it started.

mntnclmbr 05-01-2009 12:16 PM

No !@#$, They should run fast!

skeeter 05-01-2009 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thaduke2003 (Post 364309)
Actually, the hedge fund guys are morons- they weren't being smart, they were being greedy- because of them, they're getting a LOT less of their $ back, AND Chrysler's going bankrupt.
And yeah, I'm damn glad I don't work for GM :) Mark W.

Those "morons" are responsible for the investments of private citizens who voluntarily loaned their money to Chrysler.
Why should the private investors be the only ones to lose their asses in the deal?

We won't know how much they get back till the courts get done. I'm not sure this will go as obama want's.

trbizwiz 05-01-2009 01:58 PM

Well is the Epp going away?? If they will make it 60 months 0% I'll help em move some inventory.

2much 05-02-2009 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeeter (Post 364743)
The article forgets to mention that the deal gives the union a 55% share in Chrysler. It's going to be interesting watching a company run by the union and government try to be efficient and turn a profit...:rolleyes:

chrysler is the tip of the iceberg, under GM's new plan for viability, 89% of the company will be owned by the UAW and the government. :doh:


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