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-   -   '04 rear main seal & clutch replacement questions (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f210/04-rear-main-seal-and-clutch-replacement-questions-349954.html)

IcarusLSC 10-20-2013 01:42 AM

'04 rear main seal & clutch replacement questions
 
I'm doing the rear main seal in my '04 TJ 4.0L/NV3550 and replacing the clutch while it's apart as it is chattering badly when cold and is noisy (though I think the noise is normal for these, the chattering is getting worse.)

I have been reading a lot about it and think I am fine to try this, but did have a couple hopefully minor questions first. This is my first manual I've dropped but have done a fair bit with auto's in different vehicles.


Is there any way to tell if the front bearing retainer on the NV3550 is leaking before I take it apart or will that just be a surprise if it is?! I'm pretty sure it is indeed the rear main seal leaking, but figured I'd ask to see if anyone had any more input.

The dealer and the FSM both say 1.98L of fluid, so I bought 2L from Mopar. Will this be fine, as I think it's got gold flake or something in it from the price I paid!? I also read in a few places that it takes a bit over 2L. I bought the Mopar stuff for the NV3550, and some Mobil ATF+4 for the transfer case.

I decided to get a Sachs clutch kit as I have read the newer Luk kits are coming with part plastic/metal throwout bearings. It is all metal in the Sachs kit I got. I also got a Sachs flywheel. Both good choices I hope?

In the Sachs clutch kit it came with the pilot bearing and another bearing that looks like it is the same as the bearing inside the sleeve of the pilot bearing. What is this for? Just an extra? I couldn't find any reference to any other bearing other than the pilot and throwout ones in the FSM or the forums.

Any tips or help would be appreciated,
Thanks :)

Water Dog 10-20-2013 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcarusLSC (Post 5505370)
I'm doing the rear main seal in my '04 TJ 4.0L/NV3550 and replacing the clutch while it's apart as it is chattering badly when cold and is noisy (though I think the noise is normal for these, the chattering is getting worse.)

I have been reading a lot about it and think I am fine to try this, but did have a couple hopefully minor questions first. This is my first manual I've dropped but have done a fair bit with auto's in different vehicles.


Is there any way to tell if the front bearing retainer on the NV3550 is leaking before I take it apart or will that just be a surprise if it is?! I'm pretty sure it is indeed the rear main seal leaking, but figured I'd ask to see if anyone had any more input.

The dealer and the FSM both say 1.98L of fluid, so I bought 2L from Mopar. Will this be fine, as I think it's got gold flake or something in it from the price I paid!? I also read in a few places that it takes a bit over 2L. I bought the Mopar stuff for the NV3550, and some Mobil ATF+4 for the transfer case.

I decided to get a Sachs clutch kit as I have read the newer Luk kits are coming with part plastic/metal throwout bearings. It is all metal in the Sachs kit I got. I also got a Sachs flywheel. Both good choices I hope?

In the Sachs clutch kit it came with the pilot bearing and another bearing that looks like it is the same as the bearing inside the sleeve of the pilot bearing. What is this for? Just an extra? I couldn't find any reference to any other bearing other than the pilot and throwout ones in the FSM or the forums.

Any tips or help would be appreciated,
Thanks :)

One piece of advice...go to a dealer and pick up a clutch return spring before you start. The old one will likely be rusty and will probably break when you take it off. Less than $5. Here's a pic.

MikalCarbine 10-20-2013 10:39 AM

I second that, might as well pick up a new pivot ball and fork if you don't mind spending another $40 to be worry free

IcarusLSC 10-20-2013 02:39 PM

Thanks, I was going to order a spring on Monday. I hope to start this next weekend as I have a few days off after that to screw this all up, lol ;)

Water Dog 10-20-2013 04:37 PM

You don't need to drain the transmission or transfer case to do the clutch, unless you're just planning on a fluid change anyway. You can remove transmission and transfer case as one unit, just make sure you have a jack to help you get them out. You can rent a transmission jack or buy an inexpensive one from Harbor Freight. One trick that I've learned is to do a little planning when I'm putting the Jeep on jackstands. Once you have the skid off and the back of the engine supported, the transmission is going to be at a downward angle. I try and put the back of the Jeep higher on jackstands than the front to keep the transmission closer to parallel with the floor. That allows you to slide the transmission off and back on the engine with a lot less jacking and trying to get the right angle/height on the transmission (especially going back in). Chances are good that the leak is the rear main seal rather than the transmission input shaft seal.

You might find it easier to complete either the clutch or the rear main seal before you tackle the other. Once you remove the pan, you won't really have much to hold the engine up to drop the transmission.-

IcarusLSC 10-20-2013 06:07 PM

I was planning a fluid change anyways. I do have a trans adapter for my jack, hopefully its sturdy enough for this. Thank you for the tip on the jack/positioning of the Jeep. That does sound like it would make it easier.

I hope I can figure out how to prop the engine as I was hoping to do the RMS at the same time...

Digger84 10-20-2013 07:33 PM

Unlike a auto you have to wiggle and slide the tranny forward with it aligned so that pilot and clutch splines can slide forward

To make this easier get a couple long bolts same thread as bell to engine bolts
Grind the heads off these bolts then grind them rounded off where you removed the heads
Finally grind a slot in the rounded head so a large flat blade screwdriver can be used to turn them

Use these as alignment pins to slide tranny along then after all the way forward and a couple other bell bolts are in you can remove them and replace with correct bolts

Finally never use bolts to tighten tranny forward, it has to wiggle slide home as screwing it home with bolts can do real damage

IcarusLSC 10-20-2013 10:15 PM

I'll see if I can dig up some bolts when I do this, ty :)

IcarusLSC 10-21-2013 04:45 PM

Ordered the return spring, pivot ball and some nut for it today. Ordered a seal for the front bearing retainer too in case it's needed. I hate being caught without stuff, though I always seem to end up this way, lol...

Still not sure if I should pick up another L of trans fluid. I read in a few places now it takes a bit more than 2L (which is what I bought and the dealer said it needed.) It's $36/L retail, though I can get bit cheaper it's still quite pricey if I don't need it...

I also noticed the Sachs clutch has a Valeo friction disc in it. I thought that was surprising?!

OlYellerTJ 10-21-2013 08:03 PM

Icarus,

IIRC it's 2.1 qts for the NV3550. Might that be the US equivalent to CN 1.98L? :D

I had bought the Chrysler fluid hoping to do it myself. Unfortunately, a burr, from a previous tranny service, on/in the fill plug foiled my attempt to remove it. (And this is why one removes the fill plug first. I am thankful I knew that before I drained my tranny).

YMMV, and invariably will...

IcarusLSC 10-21-2013 08:06 PM

Indeed 1.98L=2.1Q, but I've read many times on the forums that people use a lil more.

I'll make sure to take the fill plug out first too, good tip :)

IcarusLSC 10-22-2013 07:30 PM

Dang, the spring is back-ordered a few days, I hope I get it for the weekend :(

IcarusLSC 10-24-2013 02:47 AM

I got the return spring Water Dog mentioned in today, but it isn't what I was expecting (a spiral shaped spring!)
What are they supposed to look like? This look more like a clip than a spring... Dealer says its the right thing...?!

MikalCarbine 10-24-2013 07:58 AM

Yes its more like a clip with a circle end

Water Dog 10-24-2013 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcarusLSC (Post 5610330)
I got the return spring Water Dog mentioned in today, but it isn't what I was expecting (a spiral shaped spring!)
What are they supposed to look like? This look more like a clip than a spring... Dealer says its the right thing...?!

The two ends clip around the little ball joint shaft, and the round part clips over the top of the release arm. The purpose is to hold the arm against the ball joint. But you're right, I don't know why they call it a return spring...

IcarusLSC 10-24-2013 01:06 PM

Sweet thank you guys!! I'm glad I got the right thing then! Still afraid to start this all in my driveway thou, lol :D


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