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-   -   Which winch - need advice (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f282/which-winch-need-advice-7559.html)

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 06:23 PM

Which winch - need advice
 
hi,

last weekend i was out wheeling and it was very muddy. i often needed help from other offroaders.
now i want my own winch. but i don´t know anything about winches.
most of my buddies have heavy land rovers, jeep xj or mercedes G. so i think i would need a 12000 lb winch.
but what is the best for me? electric/hydraulic? which brand offers a good quality?
does a winch fit behind my bumper? is there a winch mount plate available for me?

thanks for your help.


here´s a pic of my bumper (i will replace the fog lights for the winch):

http://jeep.cfasp.de/upload/412667.jpg

i saw a winch behind such a bumper, but a warn winch is too expensive for me:

http://jeep.cfasp.de/upload/374673.jpg

debruins 04-23-2007 06:37 PM

you will only need an 8000# winch unless you plan on pulling your buddies out.

I would recommend this, Warn M8000 Self-Recovery Winch with Roller Fairlead - Quadratec

but if that is too expensive then,
Mile Marker PE 8000 Electric Winch - Quadratec

also you probably dont want to buy from quadratec, but i have found they have the best descriptions of products, once I know what I want i shop around,

also try to get synthetic rope if you can it is only 150 more and it could save your life, and it will wear better than cable.

jeeperx2 04-23-2007 06:43 PM

Ive got a cheap 8000lb winch from harbor freight $300.00 on sale. i know i know you get what you pay for! but so far i havent had any trouble with it. and it comes with a universal mounting plate and i bought a 5yr extended warranty for like $30. $$what do you have in your wallet$$:)

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 06:45 PM

thanks for your answer.

i saw on the mile marker website that a 8000 lbs winch only makes about 4000 lbs on the fifth cable layer. thats not enough for a 6000 lbs long mercedes G.
a 12000 lbs winch makes 6500 lbs on the fifth calbe layer. that will be enough. also for very deep mud.

does mile marker have a good quality? i thought about this one:
Mile Marker SI 12000 Winch - Quadratec

how do i mount such a winch? are there some pictures in the web?


i don´t want to pay more than 600 euros for the winch incl. shipping. that´s about 800 $$.

Jerry Bransford 04-23-2007 06:52 PM

An 8,000 to 9,500 lb. winch is all you need for a Wrangler. Not to mention a 12,000 lb. capacity winch just adds unnecessary weight.

To mount a winch, you need a winch mounting plate, they are all pretty much universal but the TJ really should have one designed for the TJ due to its front antiswaybar.

If you wheel deep mud a lot, you may want a hydraulic MileMarker... not to be confused with Milemarker's line of imported (from China) electric winches. Hydraulics are well suited for long pulls through deep thick mud.

But most of the time, an electric winch is simpler to install, reliable, and works when the engine can't be started. If you can afford a Warn, they're hard to beat. :)

debruins 04-23-2007 06:58 PM

you just hade to scroll down
Mile Marker Winch Mounting Kit for 87-06 Jeep Wrangler YJ, TJ & Unlimited - Quadratec

anyways, im not sure you want to put that much strain on your frame, and didn't you say most of them already had winches??

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 07:13 PM

yes, most of them have winches. but they have their winches at the front. in some situations they need to be winched at the rear and then they could need my help. just my thoughts...

i saw in a german jeep-forum that a 12000 lbs winch needs less Amps when it winches the same weight than a 8000 winch.
because of my stock battery that will be better for me. am i right?

a 8000 winch only makes less than 4000 lbs on the fifth cable layer. my tj weights about 4600 lbs without passengers and other load. would that be enough if i stuck in very deep mud?

a hydraulic winch is too expensive for me. and the installation is too difficult.

if it will be ok for me i would buy a 8000 or 9500 winch. on that way i can save some money for other modifications.
but i don´t want to buy a winch that´s too small for my car or my friends cars.

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by debruins (Post 74883)

"Recommended for use with factory style bumpers."

will that plate be ok for my bumper?

Jerry Bransford 04-23-2007 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nicolas-eric (Post 74887)
i saw in a german jeep-forum that a 12000 lbs winch needs less Amps when it winches the same weight than a 8000 winch.
because of my stock battery that will be better for me. am i right?

True but still, a 12K winch is excessive and you can gain much of that amperage benefit by just going to a 9,000 or 9,500 lb. winch. Let's not get into too much analysis paralysis, anything from 8,000 to 9,500 is entirely appropriate for a Wrangler size vehicle and a 12K winch is simply excessive and unnecessarily heavy. Don't forget too that pulls from the top one or two layers will be rare due to the usual distance involved between the winch and winching point.

upinar 04-23-2007 07:41 PM

ive have the exact bumper as u with a mile marker se 9500. mounted on a rough country x series winch plate. They sell them together on ebay for 460. fits perfect cause this plate humps over the first bar of the tube bumper. These are the only pics of the front end of my jeeps. Sorry i dont have any closer shots.
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1.../jeepswamp.jpg
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1.../jeepstuck.jpg
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...ding005zc4.jpg
this is the plate that i have that fits perfectly with my tube bumper
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...820/b2_1_b.jpg

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 07:43 PM

ok.
then i think a 9000 to 9500 lbs winch will be the best for me.

i looked at the price and found these mile marker winches at quadratec:
SE9500C, SE9500, SI9500
where is the difference?

i also found the ramsey rep. 9.5e. what´s about this one?

i still don´t know if i can use the winch plates with my stainless steel bumper.

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by upinar (Post 74916)
ive have the exact bumper as u with a mile marker se 9500. mounted on a rough country x series winch plate. They sell them together on ebay for 460. fits perfect cause this plate humps over the first bar of the tube bumper.

i think that´s the winch plate i need.
with all the others the winch would be not high enough for the bumper.

is the roller fairlead over the bumper or a bit before it?
that would be a problem because our laws say that nothing on a car is allowed to be before the bumper.

460 $ for the plate AND the winch at ebay? i couldn´t find that. do you have a link to it?

Jerry Bransford 04-23-2007 07:57 PM

Between the three MM winches, the SI9500 has an integrated solenoid pack so it'd be a lot easier to install and would be the one of those three I'd choose.

But throw the Ramsey into the mix, I'd choose it even though it would be a bit more difficult to install than the SI9500 due to it having a separate solenoid pack like the other two Milemarker winches.

Have you looked at the Tabor 9000 at Warn Tabor ? Made by Warn, that's another one in that price range I'd look at. :)

upinar 04-23-2007 08:16 PM

i dont know how to put a link on, im not computer smart. but the roller fairlead does not stick out further than the bumper. let me see if i can get the link

upinar 04-23-2007 08:19 PM

just go on ebay on type, winch plate tj and yj. 2 should come up, there both same. its actually 480 plus shipping. take a look. i thing thats ur best bet with ur bumper

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 08:26 PM

thanks for all your answers...!

why is the ramsey better than the mile marker?

i already heard that warn makes good winches but i thought they are very expensive. the price of the tabor 9000 would be ok for me.

can you please explain the difference between the mile maker si9500, the ramsey rep 9.5e and the warn tabor 9000?
i´m realy new to this stuff and don´t know anything about it.

what´s a solenoid pack...?

Jerry Bransford 04-23-2007 08:35 PM

Electric winches require solenoids (aka relays) so the small control switch can switch the large amount of amperes consumed by the winch on and off. The solenoids can either be in a small separate box that must be mounted separately (even though the photos make them look like they come attached to the winch), or they can be integrated into the top of the housing like the SI9500.

The Ramsey is made in the U.S. and the Milemarker electric winches are made in China... just a personal preference with me which is why I'd go with the Ramsey or the Warn which is also US made.

The real difference between a Warn and the Tabor which Warn makes is the Tabor has a more limited one year warranty vs. a more liberal warranty for the Warn. That's the main reason for the cost difference.

The biggest difference in any of them is the integrated vs. non-integrated solenoid housing. It's a lot (!) easier to install a winch where the solenoids are integrated onto the top of the winch like the SI9500 has and what Ramsey and Warn both have multiple models with integrated solenoid packs.

nicolas-eric 04-23-2007 08:46 PM

thanks a lot.
i don´t do things on cars for a long time. so i think a winch with an integrated solenoid pack will be the best for me.
the only one that has this is the mile marker SI9500. all others from other brands are much more expensive.

MOz 04-24-2007 06:41 AM

Guten Tag mein Deutch Jeep Kollegen,

Ich habe am Montag das Milemarker 9500SE winch gekauft fur mein '02 Wrangler TJ. Das kostet $449 mit vershiffen (kein plate). Das Platte kostet $75 mit vershiffen.

Das eBay kontact ist chrisp@ntwonline.com. Er hat zehn winchen. Schreiben Sie fur einzelteil.

Tschuss!

erickpl 04-24-2007 07:45 AM

Eric,

If you are needing to watch your $$ but want a heavier duty winch, you may want to consider the TMax winches as well. I've heard very good things about them and their performance specs are in line with the comparable Warn.

As for mounting, most winches use the same attachment pattern, so it is likely just a matter of finding/making a plate that will fit your bumpers. Harbor Freight (if you can get them over there), has a generic one, but I'm not sure if it is only for the stock bumper or not. Those tube bumpers make it a bit more difficult to find a good mount, but it IS possible.

If you want to confuse things a bit, you could also consider the hydraulic winches. There is a lot more plumbing to do for this one as it feeds of the power steering fluid, but it is another option you might want to consider. Not sure on how prices compare vs the electric ones.

Just more food to consider for your winch choice. :)

binaryking 04-24-2007 07:59 AM

Instead of spending the money on a winch, why not do a front locker and new tires?

MOz 04-24-2007 10:43 AM

I assumed if you were in Germany, you might speak the language.

nicolas-eric 04-25-2007 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by binaryking (Post 75124)
Instead of spending the money on a winch, why not do a front locker and new tires?

i´m actually looking for a not-so-expensive locker. perhaps an aussie front locker...?
but what´s about the rear?

i use the TJ as my daily driver. i don´t want to install MTs. perhaps i wil buy some other ATs, but don´t know which are the best.
at the moment i have yokohama geolandar ATs.

but a winch is importent. i don´t know many other offroaders and i´m often alone out for wheeling.

binaryking 04-26-2007 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nicolas-eric (Post 75784)
i´m actually looking for a not-so-expensive locker. perhaps an aussie front locker...?
but what´s about the rear?

i use the TJ as my daily driver. i don´t want to install MTs. perhaps i wil buy some other ATs, but don´t know which are the best.
at the moment i have yokohama geolandar ATs.

I run BFG MTs as a daily driver with no problems. I also like their ATs as well. I say lock the front because you would be amazed at how much more capable just locking the front axle will make your Jeep. Because it is a daily driver I would leave the rear unlocked. But that's just me. I like having a little give in the rear, especially with the D35.

The aussie locker is the one I would recommend. I only hear good things about it.

Also, instead of a winch, why not try a ratchet strap for those emergency situations. But if you go with tires and a locker, I doubt you will need it much.

debruins 04-26-2007 06:18 AM

yup I agree and in a pinch a hi lift can be used like a ratchet strap as well, athough it shouldn't be the main way of winching yourself out

nicolas-eric 04-28-2007 08:35 PM

what´s bad about that cheap winches you can find at ebay...?

binaryking 04-28-2007 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nicolas-eric (Post 77078)
what´s bad about that cheap winches you can find at ebay...?

If you are going to rely on it to get you out of an emergency situation, do you really wanna go cheap? Unless of course you find a name brand winch for cheap on ebay. I think he is talking about the generic brands you see for super cheap.

debruins 04-28-2007 09:38 PM

i agree,
they dont have warranties, were made in china w/ slave child labor, they overheat much easier, do not have as good gearing, have a different kind of motor planetary vs. magnetic or something, and overall if it is not ramsey or warn or tabor (made by warn, but w/out the lifetime warranty only 3 yr.) it probabaly is not top notch and if you are stuck alone in the middle of nowhere you want to be able to get out!!

blueJeeps 04-28-2007 09:49 PM

Just my $.02 here but I'd go with a Warn or Ramsey 8k or 9k if you need more pull use a snatch block.
Look around for a used Warn 8274, great winch and they have 150' of rope.
Mine is on it's 3rd Jeep.

nicolas-eric 04-29-2007 09:48 AM

i only wanted to askyou abouit the quality of the cheap china winches.

a warn is too expensive for me. i think i´ll buy a mile marker si9500.


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