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-   -   Rubicon or save the money? (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/rubicon-or-save-the-money-85432.html)

11Unlimited 03-19-2011 02:51 PM

Rubicon or save the money?
 
Hello everyone. I am still researching and weighing my options prior to my Unlimited purchase in June. I plan to install the TeraFlex 2.5" lift and replace the factory wheels with 17"-18", as well as the tires with 33"-35". My question at this point is... Do I spend the extra money on a Rubicon for the upgraded axle and shocks since it is being lifted, or save that money to put towards upgrades? I plan on using it as a daily driver with minimal heavy off-road use. I dont want to skimp on the costs and lose street performance after adding the extra weight and height of the tires and lift though:doh:... Any thoughts?!?!

Thanks Very Much!

Scottie

JeeperJake 03-19-2011 03:05 PM

re: "I plan on using it as a daily driver with minimal heavy off-road use. "

Why would you want the extra weight & expense of Rubi axle/suspension/etc in that case?

And when I was doing the numbers looking at my own ideas, after paying extra for 18" wheels on the Rubi, I couldn't justify paying to change them for ever-more spendy after market wheels.

I already liked the 18" Jeep wheels that came on my Sahara and have no plans to change them. The wheels are factored in to the basic cost of each vehicle.

Just wondering....everybody has their own idea of what a proper set up is on their Wrangler.

EdJonesJeeper 03-19-2011 03:10 PM

are you going with an unlimited rubicon?

Your LJ has a d44 in the back and d30 up front so you can handel up to about a 35" tire.

Rubi's are geared 4.10, with bigger tires you will def. want 4.10 + gears.
(there not that much heavier when you start adding your own aftermarket gear)

Thats a tough one. How much is the differance in $$?

GroundHawg 03-19-2011 03:10 PM

Get a Sport. It'll be cheaper to add a locker later, and a stock D30 front axle won't be required on a DD/minimal off-road use. I beat my D30 and other than u-joints, everything holds up. No bent shafts, C's, or tubes.

The lift will negate the Rubicon springs, and so will the wheels. So by buying a Rubicon, you're basically paying a shitload of cash for electric lockers, and a heavy front axle you don't really need, not to mention the sticker on the hood.

Get the Sport and buy a real locker. Only REAL advantage the Rubicon has is gearing. But once again, not worth the cost.

I'm not sure of the $$$ difference, but for $3k a Sport can be lifted, and get real tires. For another $1-2000 bucks, gears and a locker. So, a Sport with $3-$5k bucks in it, will be in better shape than a Rubicon.

Why buy a Rubicon if half the crap that makes it a Rubicon is just going to be swapped out, and another not really used?

Gears and a locker. That's all you need to add to that Sport to make it a Rubicon (after lift and tires which you're going to do anyway)

MMJ89586 03-19-2011 03:42 PM

I see no reason for you to buy a Rubicon.

kik 03-19-2011 03:56 PM

If you're primarily using it as a daily driver why don't you outfit it that way, possibly with some "luxury" options. Then, in order to accomodate some off roading you might want to look into a Sahara Unlimited. Might be the perfect combination for you. A lift, wheels and tires are definately going to cut into your gas mileage on a dd. Based upon how "you" indicated the use I wouldn't go that route, especially when gas will be going to $4 plus per gallon.

11Unlimited 03-19-2011 03:59 PM

$$$ Difference
 
Thanks everyone so far!! Internet pricing base MSRP is as follows;

Sport: $25,545
Sahara: $29,945
Rubicon: $32,745

As stated in the above posts, the major difference is in the Dana 44 front and rear in lieu of Dana 30 front and Dana 44 rear. 4:1 Rock-Trac and Tru-Lock locking F & R. Of course there will be minor differences in trim levels, etc. Not sure that there is $3000.00 - $7000.00 difference??? That is why I'm asking you, The Experts that have the knowledge and experience to help me avoid regretting a decision one way or the other w/o asking for advice. :banghead:

Thanks again!!!

11Unlimited 03-19-2011 04:05 PM

gas mileage
 
kik---
Thanks!!
You have a very valid point re: the fuel mileage with the lift and tires. I'm getting out of a Tundra and into the Unlimited, so I'm hoping that it will be a fairly even swap after the lift.?.? I am also looking into the AEV ProCal to help with recalibrating speedometer readings and shift points, etc.

11Unlimited 03-19-2011 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GroundHawg (Post 1126264)
Get a Sport. It'll be cheaper to add a locker later, and a stock D30 front axle won't be required on a DD/minimal off-road use. I beat my D30 and other than u-joints, everything holds up. No bent shafts, C's, or tubes.

The lift will negate the Rubicon springs, and so will the wheels. So by buying a Rubicon, you're basically paying a shitload of cash :rofl:for electric lockers, and a heavy front axle you don't really need, not to mention the sticker on the hood.

Get the Sport and buy a real locker. Only REAL advantage the Rubicon has is gearing. But once again, not worth the cost.

I'm not sure of the $$$ difference, but for $3k a Sport can be lifted, and get real tires. For another $1-2000 bucks, gears and a locker. So, a Sport with $3-$5k bucks in it, will be in better shape than a Rubicon.

Why buy a Rubicon if half the crap that makes it a Rubicon is just going to be swapped out, and another not really used?

Gears and a locker. That's all you need to add to that Sport to make it a Rubicon (after lift and tires which you're going to do anyway)

Point Taken!! Thanks!! Keep em' coming folks!!

JIMBOX 03-19-2011 04:11 PM

:D The 4/1 Xfer case/e-disco/e-lock front/rear, are the major diff's and If you're gonna do light off-roading--

Getta SAHARA-thats all you'll need

I've modified the bejesus out of my Rubi, but only additional things to what was already provided-

SAHARA, very off-road capable/ classy DD--

:dance::rofl: JIMBO

GroundHawg 03-19-2011 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 11Unlimited
Thanks everyone so far!! Internet pricing base MSRP is as follows;

Sport: $25,545
Sahara: $29,945
Rubicon: $32,745

As stated in the above posts, the major difference is in the Dana 44 front and rear in lieu of Dana 30 front and Dana 44 rear. 4:1 Rock-Trac and Tru-Lock locking F & R. Of course there will be minor differences in trim levels, etc. Not sure that there is $3000.00 - $7000.00 difference??? That is why I'm asking you, The Experts that have the knowledge and experience to help me avoid regretting a decision one way or the other w/o asking for advice. :banghead:

Thanks again!!!

Ok, so $7,000 difference. We can ignore the cost of lift and tires, since you plan on lifting either one.

Now, we need to justify 7 grand.

Gears are about $300 per set, you need a set for each axle. $600 plus another 500-600 labor, so we'll call it $1200. If you can install them (most can't) call it $600.

Lockers vary wildly. Let's give you a high end one. ARB air lockers are like $600 I think, install another 600 or so. You could get an Ox or some lunchbox locker much cheaper though.

We still have AT LEAST 3 grand to beef up the front D30. Shafts, gussets, and a sleeve will make that D30 equal to a D44. There's really not much difference between the 2.

Moral is that 7,000 extra buck you have can be used better if you decide where it goes instead of Jeep spending it for u on a front D44, electric lockers, and 4.11 gears.

GroundHawg 03-19-2011 04:27 PM

That's even if you want/need all that. DD's and mild wheelers don't even need lockers. Gears you'll want though as a Sport is very lousy. I was lucky and got an 07 X with 4.10's.

That front D30 and lockers though...I'm not not locked, and on a D30. With 35's, my front axle holds up pretty good. My "poor man's locker" gets me through stuff locked guys drive through.

With the exception of deeper gears, you'll be fine with a Sport. You don't need lots of bling to make these things great wheelers. It's tires and lift, the rest can be done with good driving, and a few tricks

superdavis78 03-19-2011 04:49 PM

Or you could just by my Rubi for $23k, and have $9k to spend, LOL....

My Rubi is a DD....I still haven't had it off road any at all....I must be sick or something....I think an intervention is in order....LMAO!!

DougHeffernan 03-19-2011 05:44 PM

Spend the extra money and buy a rubicon. I made the mistake and bought a sahara thinking it's going to be a daily driver but after getting involved with other jeepers and my interest changing into camping and going off road more I wished I had electric lockers and disconnect sway bars, mud terrain tires with heavy duty axles and 4:10 gears lol price all those things and you will see $3000 is nothing over 5 years.. So I drive a rubicon now and I'm loving it.
Ps. Rubicon's have a higher resale value

Rexacon 03-19-2011 05:47 PM

I have a 07 Rubicon 4door and have a 2.5 inch teraflex lift Skyjacker hydros shocks and 33s right now and also a Banks CAI and superchip. I said that's to say this I had 35s on it you don't much flex with that u really need a four inch for better results and also if drive on the road with any hills and the interstate u will lose you over drive with the 4:10 gears if u regear u will need 4:88 for manual trany or 5:13 with a auto so the 4:10 s will only be use full if only plan to run a 33s with is a great match up with the 2.5" lift and also u will need to replace ur steering shock and replace ur stock shocks because the stock shock r too short and will mess up ur tread wear on on ur tires. And this I learned by going though this. So sit bac and think about what ur goals are with the jeep before buying. If you ask me I would say a rubicon just cuz for light offroading and running 33s with that lift is prefect would have spend alot of money cuz it has lockers and for light off roading witch would u want and I do is great and if u do that u wont be spending money on all the other stuff for more serious off roading cuz the more money in upgrades u put in the more off roading u will do and more stuff u will break. Stay on 33s and u will be happy with the lift and every thing els about it.

Rexacon 03-19-2011 05:50 PM

1 Attachment(s)
This is a pic of my jeep on 35s

Rexacon 03-19-2011 05:56 PM

1 Attachment(s)
This is on 33s a big flex diff and big diff on the road btw I ran out of shock I didn't have new shocks on yet on this pic I had just put on the 33s and the shocks were put on the next day I will post a pic soon as i can with the shocks Changed out.

richie894 03-19-2011 06:22 PM

Get a Sport with power and convienience packages. Unless you are doing extensive off-roading and rock crawling.

Make sure you get the limited slip option as well. It is only like $280.

aelwero 03-19-2011 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GroundHawg (Post 1126368)
Ok, so $7,000 difference. We can ignore the cost of lift and tires, since you plan on lifting either one.

Now, we need to justify 7 grand.

Gears are about $300 per set, you need a set for each axle. $600 plus another 500-600 labor, so we'll call it $1200. If you can install them (most can't) call it $600.

Lockers vary wildly. Let's give you a high end one. ARB air lockers are like $600 I think, install another 600 or so. You could get an Ox or some lunchbox locker much cheaper though.

We still have AT LEAST 3 grand to beef up the front D30. Shafts, gussets, and a sleeve will make that D30 equal to a D44. There's really not much difference between the 2.

Moral is that 7,000 extra buck you have can be used better if you decide where it goes instead of Jeep spending it for u on a front D44, electric lockers, and 4.11 gears.

X2... not to mention that you might not need any of that.

everyone has different priorities for what they want on their jeep, and likely you won't be any different. get the sport and put the $7K in a piggy bank so that when you figure out what YOU want on it, you can add it on your own instead of having already spent the $7K on the goodies on a rubi that you might never even use...

Rexacon 03-19-2011 07:28 PM

2 Attachment(s)
This the kinda flex u will get with that lift and running 33s u were talking about. That is plenty and this set up will work just fine on any of the JK models

white rubi 10 03-19-2011 08:06 PM

How many Rubicon owners wish they had bought a Sport, compared to Sport owners that wish they had bought a Rubicon? I don't regret buying my Rubicon.

GroundHawg 03-19-2011 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by white rubi 10
How many Rubicon owners wish they had bought a Sport, compared to Sport owners that wish they had bought a Rubicon? I don't regret buying my Rubicon.

lol you prob won't find anyone. Nobody wants to admit they made a $30,000 mistake lol

I'm happy with my X

http://i896.photobucket.com/albums/a...g/860ab754.jpg

millfire517 03-19-2011 08:20 PM

I think Jeep would make a lot more money letting people order an X with a dana 44 lockers front and rear. Personally I don't need power windows and heated leather seats or pretty stickers on the exterior. I just want a basic wrangler with upgraded transfer case with dana44's with lockers and tow hooks fore and aft.

Rexacon 03-19-2011 08:31 PM

O agree with ya millfi that why I got a rubicon but I don't have leather seats and that stuff I bought mine used and they special ordered it so I have every thing i want in a jeep with my Rubicon but I got a steal of a deal on it to. Btw all the 07 4 dr wranglers have 4:10 gears I'm not sure about the axles though.

WatchThis! 03-19-2011 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GroundHawg (Post 1126264)
Only REAL advantage the Rubicon has is gearing. But once again, not worth the cost.

Gears and a locker. That's all you need to add to that Sport to make it a Rubicon (after lift and tires which you're going to do anyway)

Really.:rofl: what about the 4to1 crawl ratio. and the dana44. and the sway bar disco's. I know this thread is talking about a DD but if that was the case all you would need to "Make it a rubicon" is a sticker on the hood. I agree not every one needs a rubi but to the folks that do or think they do the extra money is well spent.

John412 03-19-2011 08:58 PM

I wheel with people with rubis. The e disco is junk and anyone that really wheels has already broken that and found out its 1700$ to replace and they than go with discos so it dont happen again. That said the transfer case and front dana 44 are where the value is and if you are really going to wheel those options mean alot. I keep up with Rubis all day with my sport and unless you are doing some really wild stuff a sport on 3.5 lift with 33's is just fine and than some. Lockers and transfer case along with the dana 44 in the front are great options and well worth the extra $$. Keep in mind the average wheeler will not need the extra "package" that a Rubicon provides. The OP needs a nice DD not a Wrangler from what is sounds like. There's plenty of trail worthy 4x4's that are much friendlier than a JK. Check out the new Grand Cherokee Now thats a sweet vehicle.

pokey 03-19-2011 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 11Unlimited (Post 1126219)
I plan on using it as a daily driver with minimal heavy off-road use. I dont want to skimp on the costs and lose street performance after adding the extra weight and height of the tires and lift though:doh:... Any thoughts?!?!

Scottie

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeeperJake (Post 1126251)
Why would you want the extra weight & expense of Rubi axle/suspension/etc in that case?
.

The lift and tires absolutely will affect street performance. The Rubicon upgrades have nothing to do with making it a better onroad vehicle. For "minimal heavy offroad use" it would be a complete waste of money. But it's your money and my 2 cents.

GroundHawg 03-19-2011 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WatchThis!

Really.:rofl: what about the 4to1 crawl ratio. and the dana44. and the sway bar disco's. I know this thread is talking about a DD but if that was the case all you would need to "Make it a rubicon" is a sticker on the hood. I agree not every one needs a rubi but to the folks that do or think they do the extra money is well spent.

All I'm saying is yeah, that shit is nice to have, but is it worth all that extra $$$? IMHO, no. A D44 isn't that far off from a 30 on the front, the crawl ratio gets messed up with the bigger tires, and the fancy electronic crap breaks.

The only real thing that would make a Rubicon desirable is the axle gearing and lockers. Now if they stick 1-tons on a Rubicon, let's talk :rofl:

It's just too much money I think, considering you can add an ARB, regear lower than 4.10, and gusset and buy better shafts for the D30 for under 7 big ones

11Unlimited 03-19-2011 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokey (Post 1126806)
The lift and tires absolutely will affect street performance. The Rubicon upgrades have nothing to do with making it a better onroad vehicle. For "minimal heavy offroad use" it would be a complete waste of money. But it's your money and my 2 cents.

Obviously the lift and tires will affect street performance regardless My point in that is; does the Rubicon gearing, etc. decrease the affect of this at all.

11Unlimited 03-19-2011 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John412 (Post 1126789)
The OP needs a nice DD not a Wrangler from what is sounds like. There's plenty of trail worthy 4x4's that are much friendlier than a JK. Check out the new Grand Cherokee Now thats a sweet vehicle.

Do they offer that in a soft top? Or with the dual top group?


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