Jeep Wrangler Forum

Jeep Wrangler Forum (http://www.wranglerforum.com/)
-   JK General Discussion Forum (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/)
-   -   Leaking doors and Freedom Top 2011 (http://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/leaking-doors-and-freedom-top-2011-a-94525.html)

jjca 05-19-2011 06:46 PM

Leaking doors and Freedom Top 2011
 
Bought a 2011 Sahara on 3/7 and it has been into the dealer 9 times for leaks.
They replaced both front pieces of Freedom Top - then rigged the seal with foam, now the top doesn't fit right.
They replaced the passenger side door seals - still leaks on both front doors.

We've been getting "the run around" by Chrysler and the dealership - any advice on how to get them to take care of it?

We heard there is a RRT on the 2011 tops - any one know if this is true and where I can find it?

goldensjeep 05-19-2011 07:02 PM

I was told they were "having issues" with the passenger side door seals when I called about the water in my 2011 jku passenger floorboard. not a happy camper. we shall see, when I bring it in next week, what they can do. the door seals "look" fine, and I've never even had the top off yet.

jjca 05-19-2011 07:13 PM

We've been very disappointed with the attitude of Chrysler. The first time we took it in, they actually told us that it's normal to leak when there is a heavy rain.

They are going to fix the doors (we hope)- but they continue to refuse to fix the top - even though it doesn't fit properly...

We don't know what to do - it's been a nightmare driving to the dealership over and over again... we bought a "new" car so we wouldn't have to deal with this.

9th time is a charm?

weakkneewillie 05-19-2011 07:39 PM

Had my 11 Wrangler Sport in for a leak between the rear window and tailgate. Only leaks under high pressure (car wash,rain NP) told dealer that. Dealer simulated rain (garden hose I guess) found no leak. Told them it only happens under high pressure(car wash). Was told "We only check for leaks under NORMAL driving conditions. We found no leaks." I guess I cant take my JEEP thru the car wash "Under normal driving conditions." Any help?

JeeperJake 05-19-2011 07:40 PM

research the local application of "lemon laws" and become familiar with the terms identified by federal statue on the matter. As a last effort mention casually you've tried to avoid discussing the problem with your attorney....until this point you had hoped they were actually going to resolve the issue.

"Lemon laws" is good stuff to know for such kinds of feigned indifference by the dealer.....

Dgdds91 05-19-2011 07:42 PM

My 2011 unlimited sahara is leaking from the bottom of the front passenger door as well. I can actually see the water drip in from under the door while I'm in the vehicle! The front carpet is soaked and it is happening with the freedom top as wells the soft top, which I just switched to. Waiting for the dealer to get me a loaner car so I can bring it back(3 rd time) for them to fix it( I hope). I have to keep the jeep in my garage so I don't have a flood in it! I am also missing the tranny skid plate, and my nav does not have the Sirius travel link software upgrade. I only have the jeep 2 weeks and I am pissed as hell at the customer service. I called Chrysler to complain, but have yet to get any substantial help! Sorry for the vent. Dan

jailguard 05-19-2011 07:56 PM

Taking my 2011 jku in the morn for the 3rd week in a row..replaced a soft top header passenger side clip last week..still a puddle on my slush matt.they're gonna do a water test in the morn..see how that goes..I owned a 98 so I no leaks happen..but its a puddle..shouldn't be a puddle

Fizzgiz 05-19-2011 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjca (Post 1250613)
We've been very disappointed with the attitude of Chrysler. The first time we took it in, they actually told us that it's normal to leak when there is a heavy rain.

They are going to fix the doors (we hope)- but they continue to refuse to fix the top - even though it doesn't fit properly...

We don't know what to do - it's been a nightmare driving to the dealership over and over again... we bought a "new" car so we wouldn't have to deal with this.

9th time is a charm?

Yeah, maybe if it's a CJ, but a 2011? C'mon now. I'd tell the guy that I'd give him a heavy rain, and it'll be his head leakin next, lol.

weakkneewillie 05-19-2011 08:06 PM

I need no heavy rain...Just fix my problem.

goldensjeep 05-19-2011 08:46 PM

No, I dont think leaks should be normal. I've never had another car or truck leak. And not with less than 500 miles on it. if it was a soft top, maybe, and I've not had the chance to take the top or doors off yet, so there should not be any leaks.

dave_b 05-20-2011 03:26 PM

New Mojave test drive..no leaks!
 
Drove a 2011 Mojave wrangler unlimited in serious rain and zero leaks anywhere FYI.

jk'n 05-20-2011 06:18 PM

When you pay $30K + for a vehicle...even if it is a Jeep, you expect it not to leak. I took delivery of mine in November of 07 and it leaked on the day of delivery during a downpour with the hard top on. I left that hard top on until I figured they would fix it. They made that top look like a patchwork quilt. Then, they finally bought it back. Massachusetts has a pretty tough lemon law. They tried to play the leak down. I never mentioned the lemon law to the service department but did to the sales department when a young man came out to ask me if I needed some help on one of my many visits to the dealer to have them work on the top. When I said that the dealer may have to buy the car back he laughed but I reminded him that one of the major functions of an automobile is to keep water out. I don't know if that got them started down the buyback road but they got it back. I can't talk about the actual details of the buyback because I promised in writing that I wouldn't so don't ask. But here is something that I'm sure that Chrysler would want me to say and that is that they made a satisfied customer out of me regarding my leaking jeep. I went from a Sahara Unlimited to a Rubicon Unlimited in the exchange. It leaked in the exact same place upon delivery in the first storm (you would think they would have verified the adjustment of the top before delivery). I brought it back twice and they adjusted it. Since the second time it leaked, and they adjusted it, it hasn't leaked since. That was almost three years ago. It is now out of warranty for that type of problem.

I would have expected less from my soft top. They are notorious for leaking. During the warranty, if I had the soft top on, I would expect them to take care of a chronic leak. Mine leaks from time to time. I adjust it and it stops leaking.

Just in case you are interested, try picking up some Turtle Wax Ice interior cleaner or some silicone lube (not silicone sealer). Clean the seals with interior cleaner and you will notice that it leaves the seal looking wet (must be some lubricant in the cleaner). Clean both surfaces of the seal. This has worked well for me and I was told to try this from another jeeper at a camp in Maine. So, I'm passing it along because it has worked pretty well. If the two surfaces compress with the seal, and the seal is clean and lubricated, it will seal well and no water will get in. I waited until after the leak was solved by the dealer though because for the price of the jeep, I thought they should get it to stop leaking before I started messing with it. The other thing that I was concerned about was that they would accuse me of doing something to it that caused it to leak and then refuse to cover it under warranty. Just some thoughts on leaking tops from someone that has been there.

Document, document, document. Best wishes for a good outcome....mine was.

DonnyJK 05-20-2011 06:58 PM

Just took a look at mine 5 min ago in a light rain and the water is running down the crack between the back of the hard top and the front passenger piece under the rubber piece in the corner of the door and down into the door sill into the cab. WTF still trying to think a way to stop it. nothing yet. will take a closer look when it stops raining

scj64 05-20-2011 09:25 PM

I noticed the bottom of my passenger stock floor mat was wet when I swapped them out for the rubber mats the same day I bought the Jeep. Wiped the carpet with a towel and thought maybe the water was tracked in since it has been nonstop raining here.
Read this thread yesterday and checked the carpet when I got home today; there’s a freaking pond in the right rear floor pan! It's one week old and 330 miles on it!

The doors are extremely difficult to close compared to other vehicles I own so how is the water getting in around the seal?
I do not see a difference between the left to the right.

I'm taking it to the dealer tomorrow but I'm going to flood the door to see if I can pin point the leak first.

jailguard 05-21-2011 05:41 AM

Took mine to dealer yesterday,they are replacing my header with the new updated version.bought my 2011 on April 12th.....UPDATED? so I will be spending my 4th Friday in a row at the dealership...I should ask if they are hiring and have Friday hrs.

scj64 05-21-2011 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jailguard (Post 1253147)
Took mine to dealer yesterday,they are replacing my header with the new updated version.bought my 2011 on April 12th.....UPDATED? so I will be spending my 4th Friday in a row at the dealership...I should ask if they are hiring and have Friday hrs.


What are you calling the header?

seelye 05-21-2011 07:14 AM

my 2011 leaked also..it was wierd,it didnt leak during rain and because my driveway is at an incline it also didnt leak during washes or anything,,but as soon as i drove down the road and applied the brakes,the water ran in right between the middle of freedom top onto the radio...i readjusted the freedom top making sure everything was lined up perfect,and also instaled them in the order mentioned in manual..since then no leaks and i spent 96hrs in rain last week in upstate ny..

not that its a definate fix for you but before wasting your breath with dealer,try re-adjusting a couple times and see what happens,,remember you want the freedom top to be as close to windshield as possible,,and make sure they line up in front.

a door leak could very well be a freedom top leak that has traveled..most likely the freedom top is the culprit.

jailguard 05-21-2011 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scj64 (Post 1253175)
What are you calling the header?


The bar that attatches to the soft top,clips to the windshield

jjca 05-21-2011 11:01 AM

If this is such a common problem - why isn't there a recall? Is it a design flaw with the new tops or is it a door issue? I'm terrified about what's going to happen this winter when snow actually sits in the top!

seelye 05-21-2011 11:15 AM

^^just remember,,everything is fixable,you just have to find a way!!

emseeman 05-21-2011 11:49 PM

Brand new rubi unlimited with freedom hard top. It has rained four nches today completely dry insid, knock wood. Had it for one week top has not been off yet.

jk'n 05-22-2011 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emseeman (Post 1254397)
Brand new rubi unlimited with freedom hard top. It has rained four nches today completely dry insid, knock wood. Had it for one week top has not been off yet.

emseeman,

Welcome to the Forum. :wavey:

I see this is your first post as well as having an new rubi. Congratulations! :punk:

On a jeep, leaking is a relative term. With all of the seals on it, it is just a matter of time before you get one. Solving them eventually falls to the owner from the warranty. After owning one for 4 years now I can say I am not worried about it. It involves care and time.

hbarkley 05-22-2011 07:10 AM

In April I bought a 2011 JKU Rubi in Hickory NC and drove it from Hickory to Raleigh (where I live) in a rainstorm with no leaks (thank goodness). I just put the soft top on it yesterday which I had to assemble myself with pretty worthless directions. What a job!! BTW... I purchased soft top using Mopar Bucks to lower my cost. I purchased OEM as I assume it will fit better since it is from the factory.

Anyway, I will update how the soft top holds up once I hit the first rain which should be later this week. Wish me luck!

jjca 05-22-2011 09:32 AM

A leak a few years down the line is understandable - but no brand new $35,000 vehicle should have puddles every time it rains...

jk'n 05-22-2011 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjca (Post 1254645)
A leak a few years down the line is understandable - but no brand new $35,000 vehicle should have puddles every time it rains...

Solving a leak under warranty is a tricky business at best. Especially if the leak is hidden deep enough. It requires a cooperative dealership and an honest rep from Chrysler, and if that doesn't work, a good lemon law from your state. If you ask me, lemon laws should be federal for companies that sell a product on a national scale. That can get pretty political.

In a perfect world you get your $35,000.00 vehicle water tight in warranty. For the majority of the rest of the leaking jeeps, it will require a talented owner or one who can solve them or put up with the leaks. If you are a true jeeper, the rugs will eventually get stripped out of it and the leaks will matter much less. Mine will have its rugs stripped and be bed lined. It doesn't leak too much now, except when I am not careful with the seals when manipulating the top.

My 92 is bed lined and has some leaks. It doesn't matter on this one.

If you (the collective you) tire of the jeep leaking, you will eventually sell it and not be a jeeper. The jeeper who buys it and can deal with the leaks will be so happy that he didn't pay show room price for it and will be willing to do what it takes to stop the leaks or learn how to put up with them. In the end, most owners figure out how to solve them.

jjca 05-24-2011 02:14 PM

:whistling:
We're getting a whole new freedom top installed tomorrow! They couldn't determine where the water is coming in, so they are just replacing it.

They'll re-test it for leaks and hopefully - find none!

Also having the soft top & hardware installed tomorrow - can't wait to be able to drive around with the top down!

jk'n 05-24-2011 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjca (Post 1259220)
:whistling:
We're getting a whole new freedom top installed tomorrow! They couldn't determine where the water is coming in, so they are just replacing it.

They'll re-test it for leaks and hopefully - find none!

Also having the soft top & hardware installed tomorrow - can't wait to be able to drive around with the top down!

I was un-willing to put my soft top on until the leaks on the hard top were proven fixed. Then I put the soft top on. I wanted to be sure that there was an uninterrupted effort on my part to get performance on the warranty.

LeftyStrat 05-24-2011 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seelye (Post 1253192)
my 2011 leaked also..it was wierd,it didnt leak during rain and because my driveway is at an incline it also didnt leak during washes or anything,,but as soon as i drove down the road and applied the brakes,the water ran in right between the middle of freedom top onto the radio...i readjusted the freedom top making sure everything was lined up perfect,and also instaled them in the order mentioned in manual..since then no leaks and i spent 96hrs in rain last week in upstate ny..

not that its a definate fix for you but before wasting your breath with dealer,try re-adjusting a couple times and see what happens,,remember you want the freedom top to be as close to windshield as possible,,and make sure they line up in front.

a door leak could very well be a freedom top leak that has traveled..most likely the freedom top is the culprit.

I had a similar experience with mine. Dripped down right above the radio. I reseated the tops and haven't had any problems since.

jk'n 05-24-2011 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeftyStrat (Post 1259258)
I had a similar experience with mine. Dripped down right above the radio. I reseated the tops and haven't had any problems since.

That is exactly where both of my jeeps leaked new off of the lot upon delivery. The second one they fixed by adjustment. After the experience with the first, I wanted them to solve the problem. They did.

Meatco1 05-24-2011 04:02 PM

This is from the Colorado Lemon Law:

42-10-103 Failure to conform vehicle to warranty - replacement or return of vehicle.
(1) If the manufacturer, its agent, or its authorized dealer is unable to conform the motor vehicle to the warranty by repairing or correcting the defect or condition which substantially impairs the use and market value of such motor vehicle after a reasonable number of attempts, the manufacturer shall, at its option, replace the motor vehicle with a comparable motor vehicle or accept return of the motor vehicle from the consumer and refund to the consumer the full purchase price, including the sales tax, license fees, and registration fees and any similar governmental charges, less a reasonable allowance for the consumer's use of the motor vehicle. Refunds shall be made to the consumer and lien holder, if any, as their interests may appear. A reasonable allowance for use shall be that amount directly attributable to use by the consumer and any previous consumer prior to the consumer's first written report of the nonconformity to the manufacturer, agent, or dealer and during any subsequent period when the vehicle is not out of service by reason of repair.
(2)
(a) It shall be presumed that a reasonable number of attempts have been undertaken to conform a motor vehicle to the warranty if:
(i) The same nonconformity has been subject to repair four or more times by the manufacturer, its agent, or its authorized dealer within the warranty term or during a period of one year following the date of the original delivery of the motor vehicle to the consumer, whichever is the earlier date, but such nonconformity continues to exist; or
(ii) The motor vehicle is out of service by reason of repair for a cumulative total of thirty or more business days of the repairer during the term specified in subparagraph (I) of this paragraph (a) or during the period specified in said subparagraph (I), whichever is the earlier date.
(b) For the purposes of this subsection (2), the term of a warranty, the one-year period, and the thirty-day period shall be extended by any period of time during which repair services are not available to the consumer because of war, invasion, strike, or fire, flood, or other natural disaster.
(c) In no event shall a presumption under paragraph (a) of this subsection (2) apply against a manufacturer unless the manufacturer has received prior written notification by certified mail from or on behalf of the consumer and has been provided an opportunity to cure the defect alleged. Such defect shall count as one nonconformity subject to repair under subparagraph (I) of paragraph (a) of this subsection (2).
(d) Every authorized motor vehicle dealer shall include a form, containing the manufacturer's name and business address, with each motor vehicle owner's manual on which the consumer may give written notification of any defect, as such notification is required by paragraph (c) of this subsection (2), and the form shall clearly and conspicuously disclose that written notification by certified mail of the nonconformity is required, in order for the consumer to obtain remedies under this article.
(3) The court shall award reasonable attorney fees to the prevailing side in any action brought to enforce the provisions of this article.
42-10-104 Affirmative defenses.
(1) It shall be an affirmative defense to any claim under this article that:
(a) An alleged nonconformity does not substantially impair the use and market value of a motor vehicle; or
(b) A nonconformity is the result of abuse, neglect, or unauthorized modifications or alterations of the motor vehicle by a consumer.

Respects,

Richard


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:39 PM.