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Old 04-28-2013, 01:20 PM
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Gears

I'm looking to swap gears on my 2013 jku sport. I bought it with 3.21s thinking that it would be my wife's everyday driver but I subsequently bought her a 2013 Yukon because I kept stealing the jeep. The problem is that I've got 35's on "big red" as my kids call the wrangler. I love the way it looks and rides but I want the benefits of taller gears eg I drive it as a daily driver in town and I occasionally pull a trailer or borrow my day's boat and i am underwhelmed by the get up and go with a load since i was driving a 2007 F-150 that could have towed a small tank with breaking a sweat. I need recommendations on ratios and places to purchase gears. Any thoughts on used versus new or even anybody near northeast Florida that might want to sell front and rear gears would be appreciated.

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Old 04-28-2013, 01:30 PM   #2
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(1) Either 4.10 or 4.56.

(2) Pretty sure you don't want used gears. I don't think anybody would recommend that.

(3) Use the Internet I price various brand of gears and master install kits, but you're going to want to buy them from the shop doing the install so as to minimize any warranty issues later where the shop blames any problems on your choice of gears.

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Old 04-28-2013, 01:33 PM   #3
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Gears

Since you are putting 35's on, I'd go with 4.10 gears like the Rubicons have. I'd stay away from used as well.
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Old 04-28-2013, 04:04 PM
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I'll be doing the swap myself. I've swapped rear end chunks many times on my 57 Chevy. I'm considering a locker on the rear end as well. I would Like to know if people have experience with particular brands. I had a Detroit locker in my Chevy but that was for straight lines from stop light to stop light. I sold that when swapped the whole rear for a narrowed ford 9".
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Old 04-28-2013, 04:08 PM   #5
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I have stock 4.10s on 35 GY MTRs. That would be perfect at sea level. Since I live at 6,000 feet, everything is mountainous and we travel over passes that are thousands of feet higher, I will eventually re-gear to 4.56. It isn't bad at 4.10 actually works pretty well in the city. As soon as I start getting above 8,000 feet, the power loss compared to 32s...pretty evident. Not sure where you live though.
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Old 04-28-2013, 04:45 PM   #6
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I have a 2012 6 speed manual with 35's and a 2.5" lift. I recently had 4.88 installed. i couldn't be more satisfied with it and if i had to do it all over i would do it again.
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Old 04-28-2013, 04:46 PM   #7
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@ HK - two words: forced induction =)

@ Michael (OP) - since the gears thing is covered, let me throw out one circumstance where used gears might be "OK" - find someone who is upgrading their entire axle and get the whole shebang. You could certainly throw the Rubicon axle and 4.10 gears up front, swap the gears/diff in the rear and figure out what to do with basically a leftover D30 front end and D44 rear. Not ideal, maybe - but an idea if you can get the axles, particularly the front, for cheap.
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Old 04-28-2013, 05:19 PM
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I like the axle swap idea. More work but less mess
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Old 04-28-2013, 05:21 PM
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I have stock 4.10s on 35 GY MTRs. That would be perfect at sea level. Since I live at 6,000 feet, everything is mountainous and we travel over passes that are thousands of feet higher, I will eventually re-gear to 4.56. It isn't bad at 4.10 actually works pretty well in the city. As soon as I start getting above 8,000 feet, the power loss compared to 32s...pretty evident. Not sure where you live though.
I'm in north Florida which is About as flat as possible and the highest point in town is 32' above sea level
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Old 04-28-2013, 05:27 PM   #10
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Are 35s safe to run on d30 front. How bad/slow is driving 35s on 3.21 and 3.73 temporarily
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Old 04-28-2013, 05:52 PM   #11
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I like the axle swap idea. More work but less mess
It would be less work and be way faster to swap axles that are the same then setting up a new R&P.
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Old 04-28-2013, 06:09 PM   #12
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Are 35s safe to run on d30 front. How bad/slow is driving 35s on 3.21 and 3.73 temporarily
Yes, keeping in mind of course that there's nothing you can't break if you beat it hard enough.

If you're a hard wheeler, there are simple reinforcements you can look at as well.

How 35s are on the stock gears depends on whether or not you have a 2012 or newer jeep, and whether you have an auto or manual transmission.
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Old 04-28-2013, 07:42 PM
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Yes, keeping in mind of course that there's nothing you can't break if you beat it hard enough.

If you're a hard wheeler, there are simple reinforcements you can look at as well.

How 35s are on the stock gears depends on whether or not you have a 2012 or newer jeep, and whether you have an auto or manual transmission.
Mine is a 2013 auto. If I stomp on the gas on the street and I'm all by myself it goes but with 2 other adults and 2 kids in it and some gear it feels overloaded. I pulled a 1400lb trailer to the dump about 3 weeks ago and I was wishing for a Fred Flintstone panel to add some foot power.
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Old 04-29-2013, 12:07 PM
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Ok so here is what I think I'm going to do. My local jeep dealer (not the one I bought from sadly and I won't ever go back) has a decent shop and reasonable staff. I'm going to go mild and put mopar 3.73 rings and pinions on front and back. I'm going to keep this jeep stockish and keep it for my kids to be their first vehicle as they have both claimed it. I'll be buying the "20th anniversary" rubicon when it comes out
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Old 04-29-2013, 12:26 PM   #15
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Ok so here is what I think I'm going to do. My local jeep dealer (not the one I bought from sadly and I won't ever go back) has a decent shop and reasonable staff. I'm going to go mild and put mopar 3.73 rings and pinions on front and back. I'm going to keep this jeep stockish and keep it for my kids to be their first vehicle as they have both claimed it. I'll be buying the "20th anniversary" rubicon when it comes out
No offense- but why would you spend all that $$$ for a stock gear ratio? Your gain will be MINIMAL with 3.73s and you're spending a ton to do it. Why not at least do 4.10s- an "upgrade" at least. Easy enough to find a Rubi. with 4.10s/35s to test drive. Tons of people here with that combination. I have 4.56s and LOVE it. I can't imagine 3.73s would make up for the change in tire size.
You also should talk to a local shop- not a dealer. My dealer specifically told me they don't do gear changes very often (when I was picking up parts for my swap)- and they only do stock gearing because its the only thing they know. I think with 3.73s they don't even need to swap the carrier/housing out- again- easier for them.
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Old 04-29-2013, 12:29 PM   #16
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Gees what is a dealership charging to set up a R&P?
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:01 PM
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Amazingly they quoted me $200 less than my mechanic (I'm to supply the parts but I've got a friend who has a wholesale parts business). I wouldn't mind swapping front ends. The problem is that this is a daily driver that I do want to keep forever and while many will say damn the torpedoes on warranty issues I don't want to waste so many miles of warranty. I also don't want to sell it and start over as my wife suggested I do last night. I want the beefier undercarriage but Im not sure that a trade for something else makes since either. Still working this out no guess I could get a Moab.l
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:17 PM   #18
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Amazingly they quoted me $200 less than my mechanic (I'm to supply the parts but I've got a friend who has a wholesale parts business). I wouldn't mind swapping front ends. The problem is that this is a daily driver that I do want to keep forever and while many will say damn the torpedoes on warranty issues I don't want to waste so many miles of warranty. I also don't want to sell it and start over as my wife suggested I do last night. I want the beefier undercarriage but Im not sure that a trade for something else makes since either. Still working this out no guess I could get a Moab.l
That's not how warranties work.

Getting your gears swapped--by anybody--means that the gears themselves aren't covered by your factory warranty, and means anything damaged by them or their install isn't covered by your factory warranty.

Otherwise, your factory warranty remains unchanged.

The gears themselves and/or their install may come with their own warranty, but that doesn't implicate Chrysler in any way and is untethered to your factory warranty.

The same is true for any mod.

Add a lift? The lift isn't covered by the factory warranty, nor is anything that is damaged by the lift. Bedline your door hinges? The hinges will no longer be covered by your factory warranty, nor will anything damaged by the bedlining. Etc.

Who installs it (e.g., a dealer or you in your driveway) and what brand it is (e.g., Mopar or TeraFlex) makes no difference whatsoever.

Dealers routinely exhibit a lot of confusion over this (or just lie about it), but the documents don't lie. Read your warranty manual--it's all in there.
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:23 PM   #19
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That's not how warranties work.

Getting your gears swapped--by anybody--means that the gears themselves aren't covered by your factory warranty, and means anything damaged by them or their install isn't covered by your factory warranty.

Otherwise, your factory warranty remains unchanged.

The gears themselves and/or their install may come with their own warranty, but that doesn't implicate Chrysler in any way and is untethered to your factory warranty.

The same is true for any mod.

Add a lift? The lift isn't covered by the factory warranty, nor is anything that is damaged by the lift. Bedline your door hinges? The hinges will no longer be covered by your factory warranty, nor will anything damaged by the bedlining. Etc.

Who installs it (e.g., a dealer or you in your driveway) and what brand it is (e.g., Mopar or TeraFlex) makes no difference whatsoever.

Dealers routinely exhibit a lot of confusion over this (or just lie about it), but the documents don't lie. Read your warranty manual--it's all in there.
Apparently my dealer is wrong then. They said a gear swap will completely wipe out my entire power train warranty. I could see it killing the axles, but I would think the rest of the power train should still be intact.
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:29 PM   #20
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Apparently my dealer is wrong then. They said a gear swap will completely wipe out my entire power train warranty. I could see it killing the axles, but I would think the rest of the power train should still be intact.
It is all up to your dealer. We have one within driving distance that will warranty anything. They have even replaced blown aftermarket gears. The guy just had to supply the parts.
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:31 PM   #21
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Apparently my dealer is wrong then. They said a gear swap will completely wipe out my entire power train warranty. I could see it killing the axles, but I would think the rest of the power train should still be intact.
Assuming he understands what he's talking about, what he's doing is taking a very broad view of potential damage.

In other words, he's saying that deeper gearing raises your RPMs, and, therefore, MAY work the engine and other power train components harder, and, therefore, he will conclude (and Chrysler may agree) that ANY problem you have with ANYTHING WHATSOEVER in the power train is due to your regearing.

He will, therefore, deny coverage. The regearing (in his opinion) "damaged" each and every other power train component.

That's a little ridiculous, but they could certainly say it. And unless you're going to order them to do warranty work at gunpoint, that puts the onus on you to appeal up the chain with Chrysler or perhaps to file a lawsuit.

For this reason, I would advise everybody NOT to get a regearing done at a dealer. Even if it's cheapest to do so. Chrysler will know forever that you've done that, and may try to blame just about anything on it.

By contrast, if you get a regearing at a 4x4 shop, it's incredibly unlikely that any dealer tech will notice. They'd have to take it out for a drive and consider your tire size versus the RPMs . . . which is unlikely.
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:43 PM   #22
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Amazingly they quoted me $200 less than my mechanic (I'm to supply the parts but I've got a friend who has a wholesale parts business). I wouldn't mind swapping front ends. The problem is that this is a daily driver that I do want to keep forever and while many will say damn the torpedoes on warranty issues I don't want to waste so many miles of warranty. I also don't want to sell it and start over as my wife suggested I do last night. I want the beefier undercarriage but Im not sure that a trade for something else makes since either. Still working this out no guess I could get a Moab.l
So your dealer is using your parts; and warranting it?
If warranty is a concern- make sure to clarify. Are they warranting their work on your gear swap? Or are they saying that your factory Jeep warranty won't be affected because 3.73 is stock? Two different "warranties".
Maybe I am mis-reading you but a DD JK with 35" tires and the D30 are just fine. No need to swap the axle. Just the carrier for the larger gears- not a big deal. Now if you want it "beef-ier"....I will eventually swap to a D44 but only because I wheel. And have a tendency to run into large rocks.
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Old 04-29-2013, 02:21 PM
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So your dealer is using your parts; and warranting it?
If warranty is a concern- make sure to clarify. Are they warranting their work on your gear swap? Or are they saying that your factory Jeep warranty won't be affected because 3.73 is stock? Two different "warranties".
Maybe I am mis-reading you but a DD JK with 35" tires and the D30 are just fine. No need to swap the axle. Just the carrier for the larger gears- not a big deal. Now if you want it "beef-ier"....I will eventually swap to a D44 but only because I wheel. And have a tendency to run into large rocks.
They said if I bring mopar parts and in theory I can get them from a secondary supplier for cheaper who is a friend (though I haven't seen actual prices yet) all of my warranty is valid. eg driveline and work. Also I want more towing than wheeling. I'm in Florida. We have mud not rocks. I was thinking D44 as well but I'm torn on price vs things I can do with it/to it before it has to be hardened. I read somewhere, " all parts will break if pushed hard enough"
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Old 04-29-2013, 02:29 PM   #24
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They said if I bring mopar parts and in theory I can get them from a secondary supplier for cheaper who is a friend (though I haven't seen actual prices yet) all of my warranty is valid. eg driveline and work.
This is a common line from dealers. It's most commonly trotted out to explain to customers why they should pay double for a dealer-installed Mopar lift.

It is however untrue. If you read your warranty manual, you'll learn that the only items that will be subsumed into the coverage of the factory warranty after the jeep leaves the factory are parts that are identical to what's being replaced. In other words, if your starter craps out after 200 miles and the dealer replaces it under warranty with an identical starter, then that starter will likewise be covered.

But changing a gear ratio? There's no basis under the warranty manual for that retaining factory warrranty coverage. I don't see any relevance to it being a stock ratio either. It's no different than swapping in a Rubicon front axle or transfer case--I wouldn't expect coverage on that either.

To the extent you get warranty coverage at the dealer after the swap is done, it will either be at the dealer's cost or at Chrysler's cost when the dealer "concludes" the gear swap had nothing to do with the issue. If you were to take the jeep to another dealer who concluded that the gear swap caused the problem, I'd expect coverage to be denied unless the original dealer was willing to eat the cost of reimbursing the second dealer.

If warranty is important to you, I would not change gear ratios at the dealer. Change it elsewhere, and never mention it to the dealer.

Anyway . . . up to you.
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Old 04-29-2013, 03:10 PM
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Sounds like I need to retain legal council and run a risk benefit spreadsheet analysis. I feel like Charlie Brown, "Good Grief!"
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Old 04-29-2013, 03:59 PM   #26
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Sounds like I need to retain legal council and run a risk benefit spreadsheet analysis. I feel like Charlie Brown, "Good Grief!"


Somewhere on the forum someone is writing their thesis on gear changes and factory warranty. Head spinning yet? I spent ages on gears...
https://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/3-2...st-209000.html
If you take warranty out of the equation and base it on performance- 3.73s don't get you much extra oomph. 4.10s would still keep you in the "green". With 4.56s I am out of the green but I knew I would be. City driving was more important and MPG was not an issue.
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Old 04-29-2013, 04:14 PM   #27
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If you take warranty out of the equation . . . .
That's the right thing to do honestly.

Too many "what ifs" and the like--things dealers "could" do and "could" say, how Chrysler "could" respond.

And don't forget of course that raising tire size in effect "regears" you to a numerically lower ratio, so there's an argument that regearing should SAVE your powertrain warranty after going to bigger tires.

You'll tie yourself in knots.

Just mod how you like and be done with it.
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Old 04-29-2013, 04:30 PM
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Much obliged to jerpherz
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Old 04-30-2013, 03:38 PM   #29
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Have a reputable shop do the install.. Then you'll have their warranty
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Old 04-30-2013, 04:11 PM
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Just got off the phone with a local off road shop. His warranty is lifetime for wear but won't cover improper use eg using the vehicle as a tractor to pull stumps. And yes he said it would be in writing.
He advocate 5.13's over 4.88's based on mixed use as a daily driver some towing and some off-roading.

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