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Old 02-26-2016, 09:41 PM
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K&N air intake.

Is this really worth 300$?

I'm already planning on adding Flowmaster American Thunder thought a cold air intake would be nice addition but wow 3c notes.

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Old 02-26-2016, 09:44 PM   #2
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You'll hear a huge difference in the amount of noise the engine makes. I didn't notice a difference in gas mileage.

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Old 02-26-2016, 11:20 PM   #3
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Is this really worth 300$?
Sure, if you want more dirt in your engine.
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Old 02-26-2016, 11:37 PM   #4
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Don't waste $300 on 16" of pipe and an inefficient air filter.
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Old 02-26-2016, 11:51 PM   #5
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I have it installed, sounds good and I have no complains. I have read many post about CAI and scared the hell out of me. I am taking it off next week and I will add a snorkel instead.
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Old 02-27-2016, 06:33 AM   #6
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When it comes to CAI, there are those who love 'em, and those who hate 'em. There are very few folks that will meet in the middle somewhere.

If you do a search, yes, you'll hear about some horror stories related to a CAI, but you'll also hear some stories where it's the best mod ever...

I think it comes down to what you do with your Jeep, and what you expect in the way of gains from a CAI. I seriously doubt that you'll notice any horsepower or performance gains... realistically you probably won't get more than 1 or 2 hp if that from a CAI.

If you're looking to dress up your engine bay while getting a filter that gets changed, rather than replaced then it's possible that it's worth the $300. That is something that you must decide.

As was said above, it'll increase the noise that your Jeep makes at WOT too.

I've gone with a drop in filter on my past few vehicles. Instead of paying $20-$30 to replace my air filter, I pay about $40-$50 once, then clean it as needed.

Good luck

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Old 02-27-2016, 12:14 PM
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Thank you, for 300 I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something didn't seem worth it.
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Old 02-27-2016, 12:35 PM   #8
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If you do some research on here it has almost no gains HP wise and WILL void your warranty. Not worth it.
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Old 02-27-2016, 02:42 PM
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I'm sold against it. I would rather spend 300 on another MOD.
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Old 02-27-2016, 05:55 PM   #10
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If you do some research on here it has almost no gains HP wise
Could you cite sources of this information? Aside from people spouting opinions and making things up.

Not the K&N brand, but another brand of CAI was tested independently on a dyno and showed a gain in peak numbers of 14 hp and 9 ft-lbs at the wheel. Follow the link for details and dyno charts: https://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/ba...ay-326377.html

While I agree it's not big gains, I wouldn't say it's "almost no gains". But that's probably subjective. It's about a 7% gain in power. Rather than tell someone your opinion that it has "almost no gains" as fact, it's better to share actual test results with them and let them decide for themselves.


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and WILL void your warranty.
This is absolutely incorrect. The mere presence of a CAI cannot void a vehicle warranty. Read up on the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act.

Short version of what is relevant here is that the vehicle's warranty cannot be voided because of modifications. The warranty will not cover the modified parts (in this case the CAI; but that likely has its own warranty from the CAI manufacturer). And if the modified part causes damage to another part that is under warranty, the warranty claim can be denied. A vehicle warranty can only be outright voided if the vehicle is totaled by insurance due to accident/damage, if there is tampering of the odometer, or if the vehicle is severely misused (might be some other situations, but installing a CAI definitely won't void the warranty).
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Old 02-27-2016, 08:38 PM   #11
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Could you cite sources of this information? Aside from people spouting opinions and making things up.

Not the K&N brand, but another brand of CAI was tested independently on a dyno and showed a gain in peak numbers of 14 hp and 9 ft-lbs at the wheel. Follow the link for details and dyno charts: https://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/ba...ay-326377.html

While I agree it's not big gains, I wouldn't say it's "almost no gains". But that's probably subjective. It's about a 7% gain in power. Rather than tell someone your opinion that it has "almost no gains" as fact, it's better to share actual test results with them and let them decide for themselves.



This is absolutely incorrect. The mere presence of a CAI cannot void a vehicle warranty. Read up on the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act.

Short version of what is relevant here is that the vehicle's warranty cannot be voided because of modifications. The warranty will not cover the modified parts (in this case the CAI; but that likely has its own warranty from the CAI manufacturer). And if the modified part causes damage to another part that is under warranty, the warranty claim can be denied. A vehicle warranty can only be outright voided if the vehicle is totaled by insurance due to accident/damage, if there is tampering of the odometer, or if the vehicle is severely misused (might be some other situations, but installing a CAI definitely won't void the warranty).
Ok useless since you asked here is a teaser. Much more to come. In case you didn't notice the OP was asking about K&N.



"In the chart above it’s important to note the different test durations for each filter. The AC Delco filter test ran for 60 minutes before exceeding the restriction limit while the AMSOIL and K&N tests each ran for 20 and 24 minutes respectively before reaching max restriction. In 60 minutes the AC Filter accumulated 574gms of dirt and passed only 0.4gms. After only 24 minutes the K&N had accumulated 221gms of dirt but passed 7.0gms. Compared to the AC, the K&N “plugged up” nearly 3 times faster, passed 18 times more dirt and captured 37% less dirt. "

It was a very complete and thorough test conducted, again, by an ISO certified lab. The complete test has probably 20+ charts and explanations but the K&N was consistently at the bottom of the test results where filtration was measured. The only thing the K&N did best in was allowing more air flow through it. Kind of like how a screen door keeps the dust out of the house during a Texas dust storm.
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Old 02-27-2016, 08:45 PM   #12
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Ok useless since you asked here is a teaser. Much more to come...
That's great, but it has absolutely nothing to do with your claims that it makes almost no gains and WILL void your warranty
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Old 02-27-2016, 08:53 PM   #13
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Could you cite sources of this information? Aside from people spouting opinions and making things up.

Not the K&N brand, but another brand of CAI was tested independently on a dyno and showed a gain in peak numbers of 14 hp and 9 ft-lbs at the wheel. Follow the link for details and dyno charts: https://www.wranglerforum.com/f274/ba...ay-326377.html

While I agree it's not big gains, I wouldn't say it's "almost no gains". But that's probably subjective. It's about a 7% gain in power. Rather than tell someone your opinion that it has "almost no gains" as fact, it's better to share actual test results with them and let them decide for themselves.




This is absolutely incorrect. The mere presence of a CAI cannot void a vehicle warranty. Read up on the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act.

Short version of what is relevant here is that the vehicle's warranty cannot be voided because of modifications. The warranty will not cover the modified parts (in this case the CAI; but that likely has its own warranty from the CAI manufacturer). And if the modified part causes damage to another part that is under warranty, the warranty claim can be denied. A vehicle warranty can only be outright voided if the vehicle is totaled by insurance due to accident/damage, if there is tampering of the odometer, or if the vehicle is severely misused (might be some other situations, but installing a CAI definitely won't void the warranty).
You WILL be out if you have an engine issue with a CAI. They will point to it and say no. There is no burden of proof and at that point your only real option is legal action and since many Chrysler dealers have been playing a bit dirty the past few years and sneaking arbitration clauses into the new vehicle paperwork, your options for litigation are severely limited.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:00 PM   #14
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This is absolutely incorrect. The mere presence of a CAI cannot void a vehicle warranty. Read up on the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act.
If we are going to go with that logic, I am just going to run a filter made out of chicken wire.

Lots of horsepower gains and with a warranty replacing the motor after the rings are shot, who cares right?
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:09 PM   #15
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Just replace the filter with the K&N and you will get the same results. Plus you can jus clean it. The only time I noticed it ever done a real significant change is on my Camaro and I installed long tube headers with a full system exhaust. I think it all works together and made all the difference. My jeep sounds better with the filter installed and programmer. No fuel mileage increase and not sure about power but I know it's a better filter than what I had bc it was falling apart between oil changes. My wife Cherokee broke apart and the dealer didn't have one and said they needed to order one and it could handle it till next oil change. I replace it with a K&N and it was deteriorating. I don't want that in the Engine either and it's a Diesel. Her Diesel get's 2 MPG's better now with just the filter.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:24 PM   #16
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If we are going to go with that logic, I am just going to run a filter made out of chicken wire.

Lots of horsepower gains and with a warranty replacing the motor after the rings are shot, who cares right?
No, you must not have understood. If your modification causes damage to the engine, then any attempt to have the engine repaired under warranty can be denied.

This is very different than having the warranty voided. A voided warranty means the entire vehicle warranty is cancelled/invalid. For example, a warranty claim to repair a differential, steering components, electrical systems, etc., can't be denied because you have a CAI installed.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:26 PM   #17
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You WILL be out if you have an engine issue with a CAI. They will point to it and say no.
Again... this is not "voiding the warranty". Voiding the warranty means that the ENTIRE vehicle warranty is null and void.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:27 PM   #18
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It also depends on what kind of engine issue. If it's an engine issue that can't be explained by excess dust consumption, then it can't be blamed on the CAI.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:31 PM   #19
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Again... this is not "voiding the warranty". Voiding the warranty means that the ENTIRE vehicle warranty is null and void.

Don't argue semantics. Obviously no one is talking about blanket warranty denial. Obviously a CAI won't void a warranty repair on your radio or say a U-Joint.


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It also depends on what kind of engine issue. If it's an engine issue that can't be explained by excess dust consumption, then it can't be blamed on the CAI.

Good luck with that. I'm not saying it's within the letter of the law but Chrysler especially has a bad reputation for looking for any reason to deny a claim. And your average consumer won't have the ability to successfully fight those sorts of things.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:33 PM   #20
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Another one.

A Duramax owner tired of the lack of scientific evidence pursued a path of testing that eventually ended with a lab performing the ISO 5011 procedure on a number of replacement air filters. The result was one that many might have concluded on their own - for a given size, a filter's ability to trap dust is inversely proportional to its flow rate. If keeping dust from your engine is the goal, a paper filter such as an AC Delco will provide far superior filtering performance, but you'll pay a price in airflow. If WOT performance is most important, the K&N filter used in this test provided about 50% less restriction to airflow, with the 1.6" of H20 difference in air pressure drop at 350 CFM making for a minimal difference (~0.5%) in power at this flow rate. The K&N and UNI filters were far less efficient at trapping dust, and note that they lose their flow advantage after filtering about 180 grams of dust. There's also the economics of washable cotton filters, with a K&N providing a savings of about $285 over 250,000 miles. All of my vehicles currently run K&N filters, but this test has me re-thinking the use of them on daily drivers.

According to K&N's website depending on which kit you get the HP increase is [email protected],600RPM - [email protected],500 RPM. According to my math relating to the 3.6 Penastar that's anywhere from 2%-5% gain @5.600 RPM. I don't know about you but I usually don't rev mine to 5,600 RPM and if I did with the filtering results I stated in the last two sources, I think I would be more worried about sucking the filter into the motor than the lousy minimal gains of 2%-5%. Like I said minimal gains.

That being said I think we all know that in order to gain actual HP on the intake side you will have to open up the exhaust side as well. What goes in must come out.

Im tired and don't feel like looking right now but, there is a thread on here regarding FCA denying engine warranty due to a dealer installed K&N Filter. The important point here is the filter itself does not void the warranty but if you do not follow the exact recommendations for maintenance of the filter it then voids your warranty. In order to follow them your word will simply not be enough.

So I guess if you want to roll the dice for that much$$$$ and that little gain with a chance you are up sh&t$ creak, Than be my guest.

Next time I will try to be more specific.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:34 PM   #21
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Again... this is not "voiding the warranty". Voiding the warranty means that the ENTIRE vehicle warranty is null and void.
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No, you must not have understood. If your modification causes damage to the engine, then any attempt to have the engine repaired under warranty can be denied.

This is very different than having the warranty voided. A voided warranty means the entire vehicle warranty is cancelled/invalid. For example, a warranty claim to repair a differential, steering components, electrical systems, etc., can't be denied because you have a CAI installed.
You are correct, I was generalizing the "warranty voided" thing. Good luck getting engine warranty work done.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:41 PM   #22
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Just want to make sure people have the correct info so they can make their own decision based on their preferences, level of risk they are willing to take, etc. If your Jeep is street-driven only in a region that is not dusty, then the K&N's reduced dust filtering capability probably isn't that big of a deal. You are only risking loss of warranty coverage on damages that could be caused by increased dust consumption of the engine. You'll still be covered by warranty when your power windows quit working, your water pump starts leaking, etc.

If you drive your Jeep in dusty conditions, then a K&N is a bad idea, unless you also add a an air filter wrap. But then you're losing the increased flow capabilities of the K&N, so what's the point? Might as well keep the stock intake/filter (unless you really want the increased intake sound of a CAI).

I happen to be in a situation where I pretty much have no option but to run a K&N or similar open cone filter because of my turbo. So to avoid the dust issue, I put an air filter wrap on when I'm going off road. It's also water repellent, so it blocks water splash/spray from entering the air filter.

I actually should do some data logging to see if the air filter wrap actually reduces airflow significantly. It's possible that the filter is sized large enough that the extra restriction of the wrap wouldn't even be noticeable (same could be true on a CAI kit on the stock engine; needs testing to find out).
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:44 PM   #23
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Don't argue semantics. Obviously no one is talking about blanket warranty denial. Obviously a CAI won't void a warranty repair on your radio or say a U-Joint.
You may know that's what you mean when you say "void the warranty", but other people reading the thread don't necessarily know that's what you meant. Semantics is actually quite important here.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:52 PM   #24
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That being said I think we all know that in order to gain actual HP on the intake side you will have to open up the exhaust side as well. What goes in must come out.
Not necessarily. Depends on the engine, intake, and exhaust you start with. It may be true on some vehicles, but just because a Duramax truck showed minimal gains, you can't assume that K&N filters will show minimal gains on all vehicles.

As shown in the thread I already linked to earlier, a Banks CAI intake on a Wrangler was shown by an independent party to cause a 7% gain in peak power without changing the exhaust.
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Old 02-27-2016, 09:53 PM   #25
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Just want to make sure people have the correct info so they can make their own decision based on their preferences, level of risk they are willing to take, etc. If your Jeep is street-driven only in a region that is not dusty, then the K&N's reduced dust filtering capability probably isn't that big of a deal. You are only risking loss of warranty coverage on damages that could be caused by increased dust consumption of the engine. You'll still be covered by warranty when your power windows quit working, your water pump starts leaking, etc.

If you drive your Jeep in dusty conditions, then a K&N is a bad idea, unless you also add a an air filter wrap. But then you're losing the increased flow capabilities of the K&N, so what's the point? Might as well keep the stock intake/filter (unless you really want the increased intake sound of a CAI).

I happen to be in a situation where I pretty much have no option but to run a K&N or similar open cone filter because of my turbo. So to avoid the dust issue, I put an air filter wrap on when I'm going off road. It's also water repellent, so it blocks water splash/spray from entering the air filter.

I actually should do some data logging to see if the air filter wrap actually reduces airflow significantly. It's possible that the filter is sized large enough that the extra restriction of the wrap wouldn't even be noticeable (same could be true on a CAI kit on the stock engine; needs testing to find out).
Hey I am just glad there are others that understand that K&N's are terrible. I always cringe when I see them on diesels. You just know those impellers are hurting.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:00 PM   #26
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Perhaps I should have been more specific in my original post regarding warranty. It just bothers me when I see people attempt doing things to their vehicle while under warranty and the manufacturers deny claims for stupid reasons. Best lesson learned here can be do only what FCA recommends with what they recommend while under warranty, or have the$$$$$$$$ to take the chance.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:12 PM   #27
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Not necessarily. Depends on the engine, intake, and exhaust you start with. It may be true on some vehicles, but just because a Duramax truck showed minimal gains, you can't assume that K&N filters will show minimal gains on all vehicles.

As shown in the thread I already linked to earlier, a Banks CAI intake on a Wrangler was shown by an independent party to cause a 7% gain in peak power without changing the exhaust.
Read the whole post and you will see I did the math on a Penastar 3.6
The gains are 2% - 5% @ 5,600 RPM. You may consider that good for you but I usually don't need to run WTFO to gain that little. I do realize more HP is a good thing and in my Duramax that is much needed. In my JK I am just fine with whats under the hood.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:20 PM   #28
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Read the whole post and you will see I did the math on a Penastar 3.6
The gains are 2% - 5% @ 5,600 RPM. You may consider that good for you but I usually don't need to run WTFO to gain that little. I do realize more HP is a good thing and in my Duramax that is much needed. In my JK I am just fine with whats under the hood.
OH YEA diesels are WAAAYYY different. We can get massive gains there at the expense of emissions and the occasional exploding part.

Now this is an air filter.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:29 PM   #29
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OH YEA diesels are WAAAYYY different. We can get massive gains there at the expense of emissions and the occasional exploding part.

Now this is an air filter.

Hey those Powerstrokes can run with no filters at all. I like it.
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Old 02-27-2016, 10:37 PM   #30
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Hey those Powerstrokes can run with no filters at all. I like it.
put oil in in the motor and it goes. you cant explain that!

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